Hi Surfergirl,

When you try the fare for the trip to Paris, do you input a day that's 90 days from today? That's the way to find out what the best discount fares are. And, yup, be ready to buy when your own trip is about 90 days out. You should find fares as low as, like, 29 Euro or so.

When you find discounted fares like that, you may not need the Swiss Pass to the border.

I've been travelling to Switzerland once or twice a year since 1995, and I've always found the Half Fare Card to be the best bargain. It costs 110 chf and gives you half off practically everything that moves for one month.

Have fun as you plan!

s

In case of Switzerland-Paris travel, imho, it makes sense just purchase international discount ticket (http://www.sbb.ch/en/leisure-holidays/europe-worldwide/europe-by-train/france/price-tips.html) instead of combination Swiss pass for Swiss segment (and no, you don't pay extra by using TGV withing Switzerland) + full fare for French segment, first one will be definitely cheaper (you can buy it here - https://www.sbb.ch/ticketshop/b2c/pipSchritt_1.do), but at the same time it's for the fixed date and train, so kind of limits your spontaneity.
Regarding Swiss pass, there is a simple way to determine whether it's worth it's price or not, just spend a bit of time and calculate the sum of all point-to-point tickets for journeys you plan to take and then compare it the pass fare
Also you might consider potential promo campaigns by SBB, for instance rather popular lately SuperSaver offer, which allows you to travel all over Switzerland for a bargain fare. It's not available all year round, but still a great way to safe in case it happen to be on your dates of travel

Yes, swandav, I did that -- so I could have a sense of the fare at its least expensive. I'll run the math on the half fare card -- I looked into that, but didn't see one for a month or less. Thanks.

ETGC -- I did the calculations on point to point vs. pass -- that's how I arrived at the pass is better. I will check your other links, thanks!

Surfegirl, try also to check out SuperSaver tickets? http://www.sbb.ch/en/travelcards-and-tickets/tickets-for-switzerland/supersaver-tickets.html
Those are much cheaper than usual point-to-point. For instance, Geneve-Montreux from 11,2 CHF instead of full fare 28 CHF etc.

EuropeTrainsGuide - Are there only two SuperSaver tickets available right now? They seem to both expire May 14th which I'm super bummed about because we'll be travling from Zurich to Lauterbrunnen May 16th! Was the Geneve-Montreux just an example or do you see that ticket somewhere?

GillsinEurope, no Geneve-Montreux for 11,2 CHF SuperSaver ticket was just an example, SBB offers such promo fares (-->up to 60% off regular fare) for almost any route within Switzerland (some limits are only on private railways). SuperSavers will be sold up to August 20, so not sure what you mean by 'expire May 14th'
Also more info and FAQ regarding SuperSaver tickets you can find in a link to SBB page from my previous post.
But regarding your route (Zurich-Lauterbrunnen), now the last day it's possible to buy SuperSaver is April 18 and cheapest ticket Zurich-Lauterbrunnen for 18/04 at the moment cost 29 CHF (instead of 72,2 CHF regular fare). If you need it for May 16, then just visit SBB website 14 days before the date and easily buy your SuperSaver ticket.

regarding the pass - I always do more once I am there if I have a pass than if I have to pay for each ticket - like on Lake Geneva you may want to take a late afternoon boat ride over to Evian-les-Bains for the evening in that swank French resort and spa and casino town - 100% covered by Swiss Pass, even to France. Or if you are visiting any museums - over 400 free entry with Swiss Pass - also covers city buses and trams and postal buses - best value per day is a consecutive-day pass but since they are only 4-, 8- 15- and longer consecutive days they have to comport to your time there - otherwise the flexipass comes into play - 3-day usually better than a 4-day since in between first and last day you get 50% off practically everything that moves except cows! Once the third day is used the pass terminates so you have to leave the third day to your last day of significant travel.

So if pass even approaches what the regular fares are go for the pass IMO - and when checking Swiss Pass prices as I did recently I found they were now significantly cheaper if bought in the U S than for the same exact pass bought in Switzerland - has often been the case for several years but not always so compare before buying. And if your c card imposes 3% on foreign transactions calculate that as well. And of course a pass negates waiting in ticket lines - you just hop on the train, boat, postal bus, tram, etc.

As TrainsGuide says it is best to nab a low fare from www.voyages-sncf.com for the Lausanne or Geneva TGV trains but if you cannot there is a Pass 2 discount on those trains if you have a railpass valid in Switzerland.

Great sources of info on Swiss trains IMO - http://www.budgeteuropetravel.com/id3.html; www.swisstravelsystem.com; www.ricksteves.com and www.seat61.com.

I'm no rocket scientist, but I do consider myself to be a somewhat intelligent woman. However, I'm at a loss for this Swiss pass nonsense! If the last day to buy these SuperSaver tickets is April 18th then how can I wait until two weeks before my travel date? Fourteen days before May 16 is May 2. Will there be a new bunch of SuperSaver tickets then?

Also, if I do decide to go for the pass about how long does it take to ship? Or do I pick it up at the train station once we get to Zurich? I like the idea of the pass better because of the ability to just hop on and off, 50% off of mountain cables, the use of buses, etc. but if buying SuperSaver tickets saves me a lot of money, I'd much rather do that!

Yes, there will be a new bunch. The thing with SuperSaver tickets is that they basically being 'released' each day, thus on May 1 there will be tickets for May 15th available, May 2 - May 16, May 3 - May 17 etc., so each new day the final date for which you can purchase ticket also moves. So to say 'window' of sale is 14 days in advance.
And all those 'released' tickets are available until either they are all sold out (it can happen on the first day for some connections or it can be that for tomorrow or even today some are still left).
To simplify, today you can check out the last date for which SBB sells SuperSavers and pretty much expect to see the same picture on May 2.
Regarding the pass - http://www.swisstravelsystem.ch/en/content/tickets/faq

GillsinEurope -- if it helps any, I feel the same way!

But ETG Com, even as a new poster, has been pretty helpful trying to explain the serious idiocyncracies of the swiss pass that makes me feel like my name should be Alice and I just fell down the rabbit hole . . . .

Surfgirl, I'm not against passes completely, but anybody planning to buy it just should understand all the pros and cons of it
Yes, they give a good deal of flexibility and freedom to change plans, allowing you not to think about any bookings, 'catching' discounted ticket etc., but at the same time passes aren't always the cheapest solution, especially in countries like Switzerland with the whole bunch of other possibilities. But in any case the final choice is yours

don't blindly judge passes by price alone - with a pass I always find I travel more than if I had to buy tickets - even at half-price and also have to stand in ticket lines, etc. If the savings are not much escdhew the restricted hard to change or refund tickets IMO and enjoy the sponteniety and flexibility of a Swiss Pass - which also gives free entry to over 400 Swiss museums and is good on city trams, buses and lakes boats and postal buses - consecutive-day passes are the best deal if they comport to your 4- and 8-day periods they are offered in (and longer time periods as well).

sometimes folks seem to want to spend hours looking for saver fares that come and go and are not in great supply - hours and hours - one thing about a pass is that it is so so easy and in Switzerland one would rarely lose much money with a pass over these limited in supply and not guaranteed mini fares - but that seems to be the Fodor's mantra - save a nickel even if it takes hours to research and try to book, etc.

ETG -- I was paying you a compliment. I like having the choices explained, the confusion lifted and you do it well.

I tend to follow the same path as PalenQ on rail passes -- I more often go for them than not. Because, like PalenQ, I like to be a little more spontaneous on day trips, whether they be to Bern or Zurich, or wherever. It usually depends on the weather and in this case, it will also depend on what music group is playing on a particular night. So I need a lot of flexibility.

But I will certainly look into these options and possibilities. I just wish the Swiss rail was as user friendly as the French counterpart!

ETG and PalenQ are so helpful!

I want to buy the 2=1 pass because I know it will be easier (and it may be the same price or even cheaper than buying individual tickets, but I also know we'll be doing a lot of "it's easier" on our vacation because we have our kids with us. All those "it's easier" situations definitely add up!

So I'm leaning towards the 2=1 Swiss pass where we would get 4 days within 1 month. How does it work using those 4 days? I want to make sure our last day (the train from Lauterbrunnen to Zurich) is covered. We'll be in Switzerland for 7 days and probably on at least one train, mountain lift, gondola, etc. every day. Do we just pay full price on the days when we don't want to use our pass? Am I making any sense? It sounds right in my head.

2 for 1 pass? Is that the Saverpass for two people traveling together - if so not really 2 for 1 - or referring to the recently expired actual 2 for the price of 1 pass thru RailEurope in the US? In any case be sure to compare prices in US dollars to the exact same pass sold in Switzerland - currently I checked and there appear to be significant savings for buying the exact same pass here, if an American than in Switzerland - and if I were you I would consider the 8-consecutive day pass over the 4-day flexipass - and in any case the 3-day flexi is almost always a better deal than the 4-day flexi. Gotta run now but will answer your other questions if someone else does not.

It's $288 (total price for two people) for 4 (flexi?) days within a one month period. I guess it is the Saverpass for two people traveling together between April 1 and May 31. It said it was a special deal on Rick Steves and on BudgetEuropetravel.com It says includes all museums, boat rides, postal buses, and scenic train rides. It also gives 50% off for mountain rails, cable cars, etc. We will be in Switzerland 7 days so we can use our 4 "travel days" any of those 7 days we want right?

http://www.raileurope.com/rail-tickets-passes/swiss2-for-1/index.html?WT.mc_id=CJ.swiss+2+for+1.affiliates

http://www.budgeteuropetravel.com/id3.html

Yes indeedy I was wrong about the cut-off date - have to buy before May 25 according to Budget Europe site link above.

We will be in Switzerland 7 days so we can use our 4 "travel days" any of those 7 days we want right?>

Yes except you want to leave the last of the four days for you final trip as after you use the 4 days the pass expires - in between the 1st and last day of use you get 50% off everything that moves practically in Switzerland but not after the fourth and final day of 100% travel is used.

Some aerial cable ways are 100% covered - if they do to an actual town - like from Lauterbrunnen-Grutschalp and mountain train to Murren - 100$ covered because it links Lauterbrunnen and Murren - ones just to mountain tops are 50% off.

It also gives 50% off for mountain rails, cable cars, etc.>

One exception - between Wengen or Grindelwald and Kliene Scheidegg and the Jungfraujoch Swiss Passes now get 25% discount rather than 50 % previously a few years ago - only exception I know of of the 50% rule on everything that moos in Switzerland - I meant moves, except cows!

Great! Thanks PalenQ. That's probably what we'll get then.

Here's another questions for ya! Can my husband use one of his 4 days to go from Switzerland to Vienna on an overnight train? He'd probably fly back so he'd only need to use 1 of his days. But I wasn't sure of international travel and I wasn't sure if we are able to travel separately. I think I read that we have to travel together on the first of the 4 days. Is that correct?

The Swiss Pass passes only to the Austrian border - you would have to buy a supplemental ticket from Buchs SG, border point I believe in Switzerland, to Vienna. Normally on a Saverpass you need not be on the same train but you cannot use one of your fourth days separately - I am not sure if this 2 for 1 offer is a Saverpass or two individual passes, which I suspect as 2 for 1 on solo passes fetches Swiss Rail more than 2 for 1 on cheaper Saaverpasses. Call Byron at www.budgeteuropetravel.com for a definitive answer IME as to what type of pass is actually issued on the 2 for 1 offer.

Again to be clear you hubby could use the 4th day of his pass to reach the Austrian border and if both passes are individual passes you can use the 4th day elsewhere - but if it is a Saverpass then for him to use the 4th day by himself - perfectly possible under the rules you could not unless you say traveled part way with him, like to Zurich. Whether or not the special is a Saverpass or two solo passes sold 2 for 1 is the key to find out.

Oh I see on the BudgetEuropeTravel site the 2 for 1 special is definitely only on Saverpasses - two names on one actual pass.

So he could use it by himself to get to Austrian border, but then i wouldn't be able to use it to get back to Zurich from Lauterbrunnen. I think I got it. Thanks!

Yup I see no way other than that. But at least fare from Lauterbrunnen to Zurich is not too much.

Sorry to keep hounding you with questions. I really should call Byron...and I may tomorrow. Anyway, do we always have to travel together with this 2 for 1 Saverpass? I'm assuming if we can't travel separately on the last day then we can't travel separately on the first day of use either right?

Only one person on the Saverpass need travel with the pass - the other person does not have to be on board - thus if you want to take separate trains both on that first day at separate times it would be fine - if that is your question? But it seems one of the person's will not be able to have the pass - there is just one pass with two names on it so the same situation I guess.

Tant pis!

Ok. No need to split up our train travel anymore. He's going to Vienna via plane. So we are now flying into Geneva so I'm trying to see if there is a Super saver ticket from Geneva to Lauterbrunnen but I'm not seeing any great steals. I think I'm going to get the pass.

If there were super saver fares Geneva to Lauterbrunnen then it would probably be by the express fastest route via Lausanne and Bern and not via the much much more scenic Golden Pass route which does not really take that much longer.

what's the deal with the Geneva snafu - you and spouse arriving at separate times or what? Wonder if you could buy a half-price train ticket with the pass for one and have the other use the pass?

curious?

We just came back from Switzerland. We got the Swiss saver pass for 8 days. It was expensive ($700 U.S. including delivery charge), but when I figured out where we would use it, it came to about the same as if we had bought the tickets individually. So for convenience sake, we bought the Saver Pass. (No need to wait on lines for tickets - just hop on the bus, train, boat, etc. that you want).

When we got home I sat down to figure out just how much we would have spent on individual transit tickets considering the REAL use we made of the Saver Pass on our trip. (Examples: Took advantage of 3 museums - no extra cost and didn't really think before hand that we would go to these; hopped on trams all the time; decided to take two extra boat rides not initially considered, etc ., etc.)

Result: Individual tickets would have cost us close to $1100 U.S.!! Thus, $700 was well spent.

Hm. Never thought of that. You may be right...probably could buy a half price for one of us and have the other use the pass. Oh well. We worked it out. He needed to go to Vienna for a quick business thing, but we worked it at the beginning of our trip so we could use the pass together when he returns.

We now will be using the pass from Geneva-Lauterbrunnen and again from Lauterbrunnen to Zurich when we depart. We have more than two days in between those two journeys so we'll just try to do most of our sightseeing on two of the remaining five days of our vacation and just pay half fare for the days when we don't use it.

Our flight out of Zurich is at 1pm. Would you recommend doing a scenic route from Lauterbrunnen to Zurich? I heard it's not that much more time, but I'm not sure it's worth it. Also, is it going to warm up there any time soon!?! Hoping for some nice picnic weather by the time we get there!

like kenav says I always end up using my pass more times than I dreamed I would - not only for museums that I was just passing by and would not have paid to enter but once in I may have found delightful but also on a whim to just hop on a lake boat in Interlaken, etc. I would only eschew a pass if I knew exactly what I was going to do - like go hiking in some remote area - otherwise the pass is for the average traveler visiting more than one region almost always a bargain IMO.

kenav,

I am curious about the figures you quote. It seems you got the point-point fares from Raileurope -- since you use a $ figure rather than chf, which Swiss rail would give you. You may know that Raileurope inflates their point-point rail prices.

I also wonder if you compared the fares with the Half Fare Card? Using your $1100 figure, you could have purchased those tickets for $550, plus the cost of the Half Fare Card (110 chf) for a total of $671. So the HFC would have been a competetive value for your trip.

Just adding this information so future travellers can compare --

s

If you have a Swiss Pass then the stupendously awesome IMO loop from Lauterbrunnen up to Grutschalp via awesome aerial cable car and the cliff-side train to Murren overlooking the deep Lauterbrunnen Valley far below and the cable way from Murren to Gimmelwald and stunning aerial gondola plunge back to the valley floor at Stechleberg and postal bus back to Lauterbrunnen - all of that would be 100% covered by a Swiss Pass - so if doing that totally awesome loop (IMO) use one of your 100% covered days if you have a flexipass.

Hi swandav - I got all my prices from sbb.ch. They were in Swiss francs (CHF) and I converted them into U.S. dollars to help those reading this make more sense of the real dollar amounts. As for the Half Fare Cards: We would have had to purchase two Half Fare Cards (110 CHF x 2) as it was for two of us.

It cost $25 U.S. ( I believe) for the mailing of the tickets to me. I included that fee in the overall price of $700 U.S. total for the Swiss Saver Card which covers 2 people traveling together.

I don't know if the Half Fare card would have helped more than the Swiss Saver Pass, but again, the ease of using the Swiss Pass is a bonus. No waiting on lines or having to purchase tickets each time you need to; just run onto the trams, buses, boats, trains.

Again, I know that we used transportation more than we would have if we had to continually pay for individual tickets. We thought nothing of jumping on as many trams as we wanted or taking extra boat rides. Also great for the free museum visits. The three we visited would have cost 20-25 Swiss francs per person ($22-27 U.S.) without the Swiss Pass.

It DOES take time to figure out which offer would work best for one's trip. I definitely looked at the numbers over and over before we made our decision. But I do advise everyone that the amount of transportation you may really end up using may be more than what you figured you would use.

PalenQ - Ah, that trip to Grutschalp sounds wonderful. Next time...

PalenQ - will do!

Half-fare cards are great for folks like Swandav who I believe settles into one area mainly and does not travel around Switzerland as a tourist is want to do - you have to know exactly what you will and will not do with a Half-Fare Card - again I and many folks often end up, with a pass, doing a lot more than previsioned - this can be especially true if funky weather sets in in Alpine regions like the Jungfrau - not unusual even in the dead of summer - then you can take day trips to places like Bern, Lucerne or even Lausanne - high-priced fares normally without batting an eyelash - consecutive-day pass are the best bargains and even the few Swiss francs here and there to hop a city tram or bus (100% covered) or go into a pricey museum - often $20 in Switzerland, etc. - so Half-Fare Cards can be great deals for someone basically going to one spot and not traveling around that much (though a Swiss Card (not pass) can be even better as it includes 50% off everything as well as two train trips from airports or border points to any place in Switzerland and back to any other airport or border point - everything a Half-Fare Card has and for some cheaper figuring in long transfers, etc.

another great day with a Swiss Pass in the Interlaken/Jungfrau region IME is to take a boat ride on Lake Brienz - from Lauterbrunnen train down to Interlaken-Ost station - hop the boat right from the station and get off at Geissbach Falls boat dock - take the antique funicular up to the famous gushing falls and famous as well hotel/restaurant there - re-board another boat - about hourly or so service in season - and get off in Brienz - a town known for wood-cutting - check out the intricately cut wooden chalet-style house facades! - then take the train to nearby Meiringen and bus to Reichenbach Falls - and another funicular up the famous falls where Sherlock Holmes and Moriarity tangled to the latter' death by falling into the falls - return to Meiringen and then take the train from there back to Interlaken-Ost and up to Lauterbrunnen - all transport fully covered by a Swiss Pass save the funiculars which are 50% off (and you can also walk up both falls on footpaths).

Does the Swiss pass work for, say, a day trip from Montreux to Zermatt? Obviously would like to go on the train up the mountain!

Thanks.

Yes indeedy the Swiss Pass passes 100% for fare to Zermatt and back and once there if you want to take the train up to near the Matterhorn summit it would be 50% off for that portion. But hop any train Montreux to Visp then change to trains to Zermatt.

On the day trip to Brienz (which sounds amazing by the way), would it be too long of a day for two young kids? How long are the boat rides? I don't mind being out all day, but don't want to push my luck with them. I cannot wait to be there! We leave in a couple days! How is the weather shaping up?!

The boat ride to Brienz, without getting off at the falls, takes about 75 minutes I believe and kids can of course run around the fairly large boats - young kids could also enjoy the funicular up to the falls and back - breaking up the boat trip.

But from Brienz you can quickly return to Interlaken by rail if by that time you think it's time to go back - or from Brienz you could also take a postal bus to the famous Ballenberg Open-Air Museum - a great great family place - lots of old traditional Swiss farms buildings and houses and old mills, etc have been brought here and assembled in a lovely setting overlooking Lake Brienz - lots of hands on things for kids and demos of old techniques in farming, milling, etc.

This may be much better with kids than going to Meiringen, etc.

PS - I quickly checked above and did not readily see how old your kids are - would make a difference in my comments.

They are 3 and 1. Babies. Open air museum seems like a great idea and I think we'll plan on it. 75 minutes for a boat ride seems doable too since they can run around and we can stop to see waterfalls. You have been so helpful in the planning of my trip PalenQ. Thank you!.

http://ballenberg.ch/en/Info/Portrait

thanks for the nice comments - see the video on Ballenberg - lots of farm animals to see and pet (I would think, not sure!) - easy to get around - great for kids and a benefit of a Swiss Pass the $20 or so adult entry fee would be covered by the pass - kids that age go free on everything in Switzerland I believe.

Thanks PQ -- would you happen to know in general the cost for the train up the Matterhorn?

Ended up getting the 4 consecutive day Swiss Saver Pass, since the extra day was about $11 more and the train (albeit a short ride) from the Geneva airport to Montreux would have cost close to 30 CHF.

2 questions:

I was wondering if anyone knows where I go to validate the pass at Geneva's airport train station. My recollection on getting the stamp is that you go to the ticket office -- sometimes you stand in any old line and they'll do it; in other places, there's a special line you need to get into. If anyone knows the specifics, please let me know. We'll have been on 2 plane rides and will be pretty tired.

Second question is if you have 3 on a saver pass, can you still use the pass if only 2 are traveling one day? I seem to recall you CAN do this, so if one person is sick and wants to stay at the hotel all day while the other 2 are checking out the sights, that's ok.

you can validate the pass IME at any ticket window - no special window - just like buying a train ticket.

yes all 3 folks whose names are on the pass need not be present for the pass to be valid, even for one person using it - makes sense since the railways should not object if someone who has already paid for a seat with the pass does not show up it only benefits them.

If you have any questions about Swiss Passes, trains, etc call Byron at www.budgeteuropetravel.com - even though you already have bought a pass IME he, whom I have bought passes from for years, will patiently answer all questions whether you buy anything or not.

Thanks PQ -- would you happen to know in general the cost for the train up the Matterhorn?

sorry been gone away for a while and did not see this but the official site of the Jungfrau Railways will have the pricing - there is an early bird special at significantly cheaper price if you want to go when the sun rises - Swiss Pass pass 100% up to either Wengen or Grindelwald but from there they get only a 25% discount from those stations to the Jungfraujoch summit station - pricey no matter how you look at it!

http://www.jungfrau.ch/en

I (have read only the message above by PalQ and) got confused on a couple of accounts :

> cost for the train up the Matterhorn?

There is no train that goes up the Matterhorn. You can clarify your question.

And PalQ provided the site for Jungfrau trains (in Berner Oberland) while the question was about Matterhorn. So not only me but everybody seems to be confused here.

Wow - I were so so confused - dazed and confused - I read Jungfraujoch but had a brain fart in so doing. Swiss pass covers in full trains to Zermatt - then the conveyance up to the Matterhorn itself would be 50% off of whatever they charge. Sorry about mistake.

Well, thank you again for answering my last 2 questions -- glad my memory isn't as poor or stale as I thought!

As for the Matterhorn, kappa thanks for enlightening me. I went by an old (like 40 years ago) comment made by my friend when she was a kid living in Switzerland telling me how her mom got scared on the ride straight up the Matterhorn.

I followed up your comment with a little research, and found that my friend must have been referring to the Gornergrat Bahn. There's also the cable cars (Klein Matterhorn), which wouldn't have been built when they were there in the early '60's.

Always hate to ask the question "which is better" so maybe I should ask what did you like about the one you did!

In any case a Swiss Pass covers 50% of the fare of either conveyance - aerial cableways are always more thrilling to me than on the ground trains but for some the gondolas may be too thrilling and scary, especially if they stop en route and leave you dangling for a few minutes at times.

Thanks again! PQ, have you done one over the other?

Well I took the train because I am a train nut but no I would not recommend one over the other - take one conveyance up and another down perhaps.

I started writing this last night, but after a flight from LA to Paris, a second flight to Geneva, then two trains to La Tour-de-Peilz just outside of Montreux, followed by an evening with Van Morrison at the Montreux Jazz Festival, pushing through the throngs of revelers along the waterfront for a late night crepe, then a completely sardine-packed bus ride back to the hotel -- all with a sprained ankle, mind you, it was time to sleep.

Now duly refreshed, I now have the information on where to get the Swiss Pass validated at the train station under the Geneva Airport and thought I'd pass it on.

The Geneva Airport train station is small and essentially serves a primary purpose of getting people from the airport to the train station in Geneva although, in our case, the train continued to Lausanne and Montreux. However, the ticket "office" is not really an office -- mostly little kiosks where one can purchase tickets.

There is, however, at the top of the escalator before heading downstairs to the trains, next to the ticket kiosks, a travel agency and an office that says "Western Union" on it. It's the Western Union office that serves a dual purpose as a train station office, and that's where you get your pass validated. You can also get train schedules there, although you have to ask.

There are also relatively new "S" trains -- quiet, what appears to be commuter or light rail regional trains -- that run along the north shore of Lac Leman, with stops at Cully, Pully, Vevey, etc -- local stops.