kristine1234

My friend and I are traveling to the alps of Switzerland and the lakes in northern Italy in early September for 2 weeks. Here's our rough itinerary.
1. Lucerne
2. Bernese Oberland
3. Thun / Brienz
4. Bern
5. Ticino region
6. Lake Como / Lake Maggiore / Lake Lugano

We love hiking, relaxing, sunbathing, yummy food, seeing beautiful nature and picturesque towns... We'd love to hear recommendations on the following.

Car vs Train. We love the freedom to get out and take pictures and go at our own pace without crowds and are very comfortable driving in foreign countries but seems like we don't really need a car in most of these areas. Perhaps just getting from Bern to Ticino and the lakes? Would it be nice to keep the car to drive between the lake towns but is parking hard?

Bernese Oberland. What city is best to stay in for the Bernese Oberland. We're looking at visiting Murren, Wengen, Grindelwald, Grimmelwald, and Lauterbrunnen.

Bern to Ticino. Any highlight spots we should hit on our drive between Bern to Ticino? We'll already be stopping in OB and Lucerne previously.

Italian Lakes. We're spending 2-3 days here. Is it easy or recommended to hop between the 3 lakes (Maggiore, Lugano, Como) or should stick with one or two? Might depend on if we have a car.

Trip Planning. Anyone have other good blog or magazine articles and forum recommendations to help plan more details of our itinerary like places to see, sleep, eat?

kja

If you haven't already seen it, you might find some useful information in my trip report:
http://www.fodors.com/community/euro...any-thanks.cfm
I visited all of the locations except Lake Como, and did it by public transportation.

Traveling by train in Switzerland is incredibly easy, comfortable, and convenient. AND it frees the driver to actually enjoy the scenery! There are VERY few places in Switzerland that can't be reached by public transportation -- check the Swiss Rail website:
http://www.fodors.com/community/euro...any-thanks.cfm
You can certainly get from Bern to the Ticino. Switching into Italy is a bit trickier, but not impossible. And yes, in many areas, a car will be a PITA.

For the Bernese Oberland, I would stay in Wengen if I could afford a room with a really good view. Many people enjoy Murren, but I found it a bit inconvenient and a bit too touristy. I enjoyed the convenience and valley / waterfalls of Lauterbrunnen, but it doesn't have the majestic views of either Wengen or Murren....

Again, I'd take the train to the Ticino, stopping, if you want, in Bellinzona.

You can easily visit lakes Maggiore and Lugano without a car.

I would very strongly encourage you to get copies of the Michelin Green Guide and Rough Guides. In comparison to the cost of your trip, the cost of these guidebooks will be nugatory. They cover all sorts of information, including things you don't even realize you need to ask.

Hope that helps!

swandav2000

Hi kristine1234,

I agree with kja (as I usually do!) that you don't need a car in Switzerland; a car can actually be a hassle. Parking is usually expensive, unless you're staying in a hotel in the countryside, and gas is expensive. And most places you'll want to go in the Jungfrau area are car-free, so you'll be on the trains anyway. Also, I think it's easier to go hiking without a car so that you don't have to backtrack, or hike a circle, to pick up the car again.

Early September is still pretty high season for the area. Since Grindelwald is the only mountain town that allows vehicle traffic, it gets very crowded in the summertime, including with tour busses and the off-loaded day-tripping passengers. For that reason, I recommend Wengen as a base -- it's quieter and more peaceful than is Grindelwald, and it's not as isolated as is Mürren (be careful about spelling that town -- if you can't do the umlaut, then it should be "Muerren" for your internet and transportation searches). Both Wengen and Mürren are car-free, so even at the height of the tourist season, they retain their peaceful atmosphere.

I've only been through the town of Lauterbrunnen on the train and never stepped off to wander the street/s. It sits at the base of some over-hanging cliffs, so it has never appealed to me an iota. But some people love its views down the valley.

It may be helpful to look at some google images of each of these towns so you can see if any one of them appeals to you more than the other (this, in addition to reading about them in guidebooks to get a clear characterization).

Have fun as you plan!

s

bvlenci

It might be a bit much for two weeks, but the general idea is fine. You won't need a car. I would narrow down the lakes to two. I've never been to Lake Maggiore, so I can't really help make the choice. Of Lake Lugano and Lake Como, I would probably choose Lugano, but Lake Come does have some very nice scenery. After Switzerland, it may not seem spectacular.

frencharmoire

I think you need to be careful on this site about how many responses you get and how representative they are. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder, in many cases, and I must say the poster above me seems to have made it a personal project to discourage people from going to "Lake Come" because she was unable to find a cafe or a nice lunch and it ruined her experience.

Simply put, Lago di Como is one of the most beautful vistas in Europe. It is totally different in feeling and visual harmony than Alpine Switzerland, In my view, Lugano is great for luxury shopping and of course is a pleasant perch -- but I reiterate: Most queries on this forum get about six responses, often the majority from a handful of people who dominate the conversation. It's useful to be sure, but the world of travel encompasses millions of people, and the tones of "authority" some people adopt on this board, and claims of having credentials because they live in Europe or say they have traveled more than others, are somewhat specious when it comes to pronouncing what your eyeballs will appreciate. Some of them seem very dogmatic about travel, and want to lecture rather than share practical tips. Hope you have friends you can talk to as well.

End of rant.

Sassafrass

Bookmarking

bvlenci

I thought I made it plain that it was my personal opinion when I said "I would probably choose Lugano". I'm not into shopping at all, but I think Bellagio is more a shopping destination than Lugano, which was a real town, where the residents outnumbered the tourists.

As for lecturing and hectoring, reread your own post.

Edward2005

"Bernese Oberland. What city is best to stay in for the Bernese Oberland. We're looking at visiting Murren, Wengen, Grindelwald, Grimmelwald, and Lauterbrunnen."

Gimmelwald is tiny, car-free, remote, and has few amenities. This is why few people recommend it but it's also why it's my personal favorite. More cows than people.

Otherwise, I'd stay in Wengen or Murren. Also car-free and beautiful, but with more people and amenities. Lauterbrunnen is also beautiful and has even more amenities. It's convenient in terms of transportation. But it also has traffic and can be fairly busy. Grindlewald is a resort, which is good or bad depending on what you like.

Bern, Thun, and Brienz can all be visited as day-trips from the towns above, so there's no need to pack up and relocate. If these are must-sees for you, then staying in Lauterbrunnen would be the best choice as it will save time on such day-trips.

neckervd

Public transport in Switzerland and around all 3 mentioned lakes is extremely easy:

Trains between Zurich, Bern, Thun, Interlaken/Grindelwald/Lauterbrunnen/Brienz about every 30 min from early morning until 11pm or so.
Only Lucerne - Brienz is every 60 min only.

Berne - Ticino:
scenic itinerary via Brig - Domodossola - Locarno (3 1/2 hrs journey), trains about every hr
slightly faster itinerary via Zurich - Bellinzona (2 3/4 hrs journey), trains every 60 min.

Lake Lugano - Lage Maggiore:
trains Lugano - Locarno about every 30 min
train and bus Lugano - Luino about every hr

Lake Lugano - Lake Como:
trains Lugano - Como about every 30 min
bus Lugano - Menaggio about every hr (connecting ferries Menaggio - Bellagio - Varenna)

Swiss part of Lake Maggiore - Italian Part of Lake Maggiore:
trains Bellinzona - Luino - Malpensa airport about every 2 hrs
bus Locarno - Brissago - Intra - Verbania railway station - Omegna/Lake Orta: about every hr
boats Locarno - Luino - Stresa (- Arona): twice daily

Lake Maggiore - Lake Como:
via Lugano, see above
Verbania Intra - ferry - Laveno - train - Saronno - Como: every hr
Luino - bus - Varese - train - Saronno - Como: every hr
Stresa - Milan - Lecco - Varenna - Bellano - Colico: trains every 2 hrs