Suggestions for our trip to SW Germany and the Alsace ???
Mar 25th, 2011, 07:17 PM
#1
Suggestions for our trip to SW Germany and the Alsace ???
My wife, a cousin, and I are planning a trip to SW Germany in September. After our enquiry to Fodors a couple of months ago we winnowed our plans, as follows. Comments? Suggestions? Things near our itinerary we shouldn’t miss?
The 3 of us are in our late 60’s but very fit and spry. Primary intended focuses: see some of the art masterpieces in the region (my cousin is a professional artist and printmaker); experience the regions our ancestors came from (including just a bit of carefully pre-planned research), catch a bit of music on the way, and seeing things we shouldn’t miss en route.
• Day 1: Fly into Frankfurt and train to Würzburg (Schönes-Wochenende-Ticket)
• Würzburg: 2 nights, 1 ½ days (highlights: The Residenz and the Marienberg Fortress, especially works of Tieoplo, Tilman)
• Train to Munich (Länder Ticket).
• Munich: 3 - 4 nights, 2 ½ - 3 ½ days (highlights: Alte Pinakothek, Bayerische Staatsbibliothek, amongst many others)
• Drive 2 days via Ottobeuren and Zweifalten (highlights: Baroque churches) to Egenhausen in Baden-Wüttemberg.
• Egenhausen and nearby Black Forest: 2 nights, 1 ½ days (highlight: the town where some of Ginny’s ancestors were from)
• Drive 1 day through Black Forest to Konstanz.
• Konstanz: 1 night, ½ day
• Train to Zurich
• Zurich: 2 nights, 1 ½ days (highlights: Grossmünster where some of my ancestors were pastors and theologians shortly after Zwingli, see Chagall windows, stay someplace on the lake)
• Train to Colmar
• Colmar: 2 nights, 1 ½ day (highlights:
• Train to Strasbourg
• Strasbourg: 2 nights, 1 ½ days
Question: Instead of staying in both Colmar and Strasbourg is there a small village between the 2 that we could reach by train and takes daytrips into Colmar and Strasbourg? If that alternative, then 3 nights, 2 ½days.
• Drive from Kehl (in Germany near Strasbourg to Leistadt (near Bad Durheim, Pfalz)
• Leistadt: 3 nights, 2 ½ days (daytrips to Kaiserlautern, Speyer, and Worms, highlight: see the town where some of my ancestors are from and go to the Institut für pfälzische Geschichte und Volkskunde in Kaiserlautern and the Pfalz Museum in Speyer)
• Drive to Bingen
• Bingen: 3 nights, 4 days (daytrip to Mainz to see the Gutenberg Museum & Chagall’s windows, see Hildegard von Bingen sites, a day cruise on the Rhein
• 1 of us flies home from Frankfurt, 2 of us fly to Dresden.
• Dresden: 3 nights, 2 days (our 2nd multi day trip to Dresden, daytrip to Meissen)
• Erzgebirge and Olbernhau: 4 nights, 3 days (where Ginny’s dad came from)
• Fly home from Dresden to Seattle via Frankfurt (overnight near Frankfurt airport)
The 3 of us are in our late 60’s but very fit and spry. Primary intended focuses: see some of the art masterpieces in the region (my cousin is a professional artist and printmaker); experience the regions our ancestors came from (including just a bit of carefully pre-planned research), catch a bit of music on the way, and seeing things we shouldn’t miss en route.
• Day 1: Fly into Frankfurt and train to Würzburg (Schönes-Wochenende-Ticket)
• Würzburg: 2 nights, 1 ½ days (highlights: The Residenz and the Marienberg Fortress, especially works of Tieoplo, Tilman)
• Train to Munich (Länder Ticket).
• Munich: 3 - 4 nights, 2 ½ - 3 ½ days (highlights: Alte Pinakothek, Bayerische Staatsbibliothek, amongst many others)
• Drive 2 days via Ottobeuren and Zweifalten (highlights: Baroque churches) to Egenhausen in Baden-Wüttemberg.
• Egenhausen and nearby Black Forest: 2 nights, 1 ½ days (highlight: the town where some of Ginny’s ancestors were from)
• Drive 1 day through Black Forest to Konstanz.
• Konstanz: 1 night, ½ day
• Train to Zurich
• Zurich: 2 nights, 1 ½ days (highlights: Grossmünster where some of my ancestors were pastors and theologians shortly after Zwingli, see Chagall windows, stay someplace on the lake)
• Train to Colmar
• Colmar: 2 nights, 1 ½ day (highlights:
• Train to Strasbourg
• Strasbourg: 2 nights, 1 ½ days
Question: Instead of staying in both Colmar and Strasbourg is there a small village between the 2 that we could reach by train and takes daytrips into Colmar and Strasbourg? If that alternative, then 3 nights, 2 ½days.
• Drive from Kehl (in Germany near Strasbourg to Leistadt (near Bad Durheim, Pfalz)
• Leistadt: 3 nights, 2 ½ days (daytrips to Kaiserlautern, Speyer, and Worms, highlight: see the town where some of my ancestors are from and go to the Institut für pfälzische Geschichte und Volkskunde in Kaiserlautern and the Pfalz Museum in Speyer)
• Drive to Bingen
• Bingen: 3 nights, 4 days (daytrip to Mainz to see the Gutenberg Museum & Chagall’s windows, see Hildegard von Bingen sites, a day cruise on the Rhein
• 1 of us flies home from Frankfurt, 2 of us fly to Dresden.
• Dresden: 3 nights, 2 days (our 2nd multi day trip to Dresden, daytrip to Meissen)
• Erzgebirge and Olbernhau: 4 nights, 3 days (where Ginny’s dad came from)
• Fly home from Dresden to Seattle via Frankfurt (overnight near Frankfurt airport)
Mar 25th, 2011, 07:54 PM
#2
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 12,009
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I would suggest Meersburg instead of Konstanz.
Maybe you could stop in Mainz on the way to the Rhein since it's only about an hour away and then proceed to the Rhein?
Also, IMO Bingen is not the best place to stay. There are other towns along the Rhine that are much nicer IMO (Assmannshausen, Bacharach, St. Goar, even Boppard).
Just my 2 cents.
Maybe you could stop in Mainz on the way to the Rhein since it's only about an hour away and then proceed to the Rhein?
Also, IMO Bingen is not the best place to stay. There are other towns along the Rhine that are much nicer IMO (Assmannshausen, Bacharach, St. Goar, even Boppard).
Just my 2 cents.
Mar 25th, 2011, 11:17 PM
#3
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 40
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I don't know if you can get to this place by train but when you travel to Strasbourg I would highly recommend staying in OBERNAI, www.obernai.fr/fr/Alsace-as-you-like-256.html
It's a very small and quaint town, you'll get a much more authentic Alsacien feel than in Colmar or Strasbourg.
We recently travelled there with our kids and got a great deal for a family room (2 rooms) at the Gouverneur Hotel, 2 stars but definitely very nice!
Have a great trip!
It's a very small and quaint town, you'll get a much more authentic Alsacien feel than in Colmar or Strasbourg.
We recently travelled there with our kids and got a great deal for a family room (2 rooms) at the Gouverneur Hotel, 2 stars but definitely very nice!
Have a great trip!
Mar 25th, 2011, 11:24 PM
#4
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 1,226
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
It is so much easier and more pleasant to stay in Frankfurt rather than at the airport, unless you have a super early flight, like at 06:00. The train from Frankfurt to the airport only takes 11-17 min. and they start running at 04:15.
Since you seem to like older artworks, you might want to go see the Jörg Ratgeb wall paintings in the Karmeliter Cloister. Painted between 1513-1519, these are the largest religious wall paintings North of the Alps. The mural that surrounds the choir area in the Kaiserdom is also interesting. Painted in the early 1400's, it features the life of St. Bartholomew.
The Schirn may have some exhibits you might enjoy too, but I don't know what will be there in Sept.
The Rhinegau Winefest will be held in Frankfurt on the Fressgasse the first 2 weeks of Sept. Come enjoy the Rieslings of the Rhine!
Since you seem to like older artworks, you might want to go see the Jörg Ratgeb wall paintings in the Karmeliter Cloister. Painted between 1513-1519, these are the largest religious wall paintings North of the Alps. The mural that surrounds the choir area in the Kaiserdom is also interesting. Painted in the early 1400's, it features the life of St. Bartholomew.
The Schirn may have some exhibits you might enjoy too, but I don't know what will be there in Sept.
The Rhinegau Winefest will be held in Frankfurt on the Fressgasse the first 2 weeks of Sept. Come enjoy the Rieslings of the Rhine!
Mar 26th, 2011, 01:46 AM
#5
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,906
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
That's a lot of moving around. Too many one-nighters or two-nighters for my taste. You'll be *way* too busy checking in/out, packing/unpacking etc.
I am wondering about the Zürich part. Staying somewhere by the lake will add more travel time. Considering that Zürich is extremely expensive and you really want to see only two or three things there I suggest you stay longer in Konstanz and do a day trip to Zürich. The train ride from Konstanz is quick. And you could travel on the Baden-Württemberg-Ticket almost all the way to Colmar (via Freiburg). Btw, Konstanz is quite much underrated - and for your art friend a visit to Reichenau island is a *must* (see my virtualtourist pages on Konstanz and Reichenau!)
Same with Colmar and Strasbourg - why not staying in one of them and do a day trip to the other? Sorry, no idea about a place inbetween, but yes, that sounds like a good option, too.
See you in Dresden ;-)
I.
I am wondering about the Zürich part. Staying somewhere by the lake will add more travel time. Considering that Zürich is extremely expensive and you really want to see only two or three things there I suggest you stay longer in Konstanz and do a day trip to Zürich. The train ride from Konstanz is quick. And you could travel on the Baden-Württemberg-Ticket almost all the way to Colmar (via Freiburg). Btw, Konstanz is quite much underrated - and for your art friend a visit to Reichenau island is a *must* (see my virtualtourist pages on Konstanz and Reichenau!)
Same with Colmar and Strasbourg - why not staying in one of them and do a day trip to the other? Sorry, no idea about a place inbetween, but yes, that sounds like a good option, too.
See you in Dresden ;-)
I.
Mar 26th, 2011, 12:05 PM
#6
The 3 of us will need to discuss how to consolidate more. The absolute “must do” things that we’ve agreed on are (1) Würzberg (art), (2) Munich (museums, art, etc), (3) Egenhausen (part of Ginny’s family roots), (4) Colmar (the Issenheim Alterpiece at the Unterlinden Museum), (5) the Bad Dürkheim, Leistadt, Kaiserslautern area (my and my cousin’s roots), and somewhere near to Bingen or Mainz.
A couple of possibilities that could be eliminated in order concentrate our time are as follows – we’ll need to discuss and consider:
1. Definitely: combine Strasbourg and Colmar with day trip to Strasbourg from Colmar (or day trips to both from one of the Alsatian villages)
2. Possibly but probably not: eliminate Würzberg (fly open jaws to Munich, then return via Frankfurt) …but we'd like to see some of the art there – the Residenz and Marienberg and especially Tiepolo and Tilman’s work) (very hard to give this up)
3. Possibly eliminate Konstanz (but my cousin shares some of the art interests of Döflinger in Konstanz) and/or Zürich (but we have some roots in Zürich back to Zwingli’s church). Ingo's idea re Reichenau is very tempting. It may work using Konstanz as a base and do days trips from there to Zürich and Reicheneau Isl., or we could eliminate both and drive from Munich, via Ottobeuren and Zweifalten to Egenhausen to Colmar …. More to think about.
We’re still in the consolidating phase ... goal: identify a few longs "hubs" and day trip from there.
Mainhatten girl: How long should one allow at the Frankfurt airport to catch flights to the US? I know the subway and train station is in the airport (been there). Our flights would leave apx. 9:30 AM
A couple of possibilities that could be eliminated in order concentrate our time are as follows – we’ll need to discuss and consider:
1. Definitely: combine Strasbourg and Colmar with day trip to Strasbourg from Colmar (or day trips to both from one of the Alsatian villages)
2. Possibly but probably not: eliminate Würzberg (fly open jaws to Munich, then return via Frankfurt) …but we'd like to see some of the art there – the Residenz and Marienberg and especially Tiepolo and Tilman’s work) (very hard to give this up)
3. Possibly eliminate Konstanz (but my cousin shares some of the art interests of Döflinger in Konstanz) and/or Zürich (but we have some roots in Zürich back to Zwingli’s church). Ingo's idea re Reichenau is very tempting. It may work using Konstanz as a base and do days trips from there to Zürich and Reicheneau Isl., or we could eliminate both and drive from Munich, via Ottobeuren and Zweifalten to Egenhausen to Colmar …. More to think about.
We’re still in the consolidating phase ... goal: identify a few longs "hubs" and day trip from there.
Mainhatten girl: How long should one allow at the Frankfurt airport to catch flights to the US? I know the subway and train station is in the airport (been there). Our flights would leave apx. 9:30 AM
Mar 26th, 2011, 01:36 PM
#7
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 1,294
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Blending a couple ideas from above: consider staying in Mainz before your return flight from FRA. It has a very nice Altstadt & is a great place for a farewell meal, there are frequent trains directly to the Frankfurt airport from Mainz Hbf. (21 min. by RE or 27 min. by S-Bahn), and there are decent & very reasonable hotels near the Mainz Hbf (try: www.hotels.de ).
Mar 28th, 2011, 05:37 PM
#9
Thank you all for the ideas ... the assistance here on Fodors is absolutely fantastic; I think I dare speak for everyone who posts on Fodors ... we all highly appreciate the communication and exchange of thoughts. If only the rest of the world were as collarorative.
The idea re Mainz is great ... we could spend 4 nights there, with a day in Mainz, a day in Bingen and Rudesheim, and a day on the Rhein, then easily get to the airport. Since most of the time we'll be commuting to nearby places, we'll see if there's a place near the hauptbahnhof.
Ingo ... we did get your email ... thanks
I had agreed to do some "gentlemanly" post-retirement consulting, but I'm finding out that it is hard to mainain a reasonable level ... the work is piling up and time disipates. So I'll try responding on the weekend.
Just today I got in the post a letter and information from the Institut für Pfälzische Geschichte und Volkkunde in Kaiserslautern ... they do have info on an ancestor from the 1700's that we had douts about ... and it seems like it may be worth it to spend one more day in the Kaiserslautern, Speyer, Leistadt, Bad Dürkheim area. (hmmm, genealogy is such a strange and wierd pastime ... much more enjoyable "just" enjoying being a tourist.)
The idea re Mainz is great ... we could spend 4 nights there, with a day in Mainz, a day in Bingen and Rudesheim, and a day on the Rhein, then easily get to the airport. Since most of the time we'll be commuting to nearby places, we'll see if there's a place near the hauptbahnhof.
Ingo ... we did get your email ... thanks
I had agreed to do some "gentlemanly" post-retirement consulting, but I'm finding out that it is hard to mainain a reasonable level ... the work is piling up and time disipates. So I'll try responding on the weekend.
Just today I got in the post a letter and information from the Institut für Pfälzische Geschichte und Volkkunde in Kaiserslautern ... they do have info on an ancestor from the 1700's that we had douts about ... and it seems like it may be worth it to spend one more day in the Kaiserslautern, Speyer, Leistadt, Bad Dürkheim area. (hmmm, genealogy is such a strange and wierd pastime ... much more enjoyable "just" enjoying being a tourist.)
