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Sitting at a cafe watching the world go by - hmmm...

Sitting at a cafe watching the world go by - hmmm...

Old Jun 26th, 2017, 07:00 PM
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Sitting at a cafe watching the world go by - hmmm...

So I'd like to sit at a cafe in France or Italy watching the world go by as much as anyone else. However, I don't drink alcohol, coffee, tea, or fizzy water - just tap water and Coke (and hot chocolate, but I try to stay away from that). Can I order a Coke and sit there for an hour with it, or do I need to order something to eat so I don't get dirty looks from the waitstaff?
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Old Jun 26th, 2017, 07:05 PM
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I don't see why not...what difference does your beverage choice make?
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Old Jun 26th, 2017, 07:50 PM
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You can order anything you want, though I don't know about taking up café space for an hour or two with just tap water. Just order a still mineral water or at least something you actually have to pay for.
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Old Jun 26th, 2017, 08:04 PM
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>>> Can I order a Coke and sit there for an hour with it.

Depending on a cafe, you will be stunned by just how much a glass of coke costs. I have traveled with a party who got thirsty and wanted to drink coke at a cafe at Galleria Vittorio Emmanuele II in Milano. I have never seen a coke that expensive.
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Old Jun 26th, 2017, 08:53 PM
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Most cafés set absolutely no time limit for how long you can stay. But in some extremely touristy or extremely immigrant neighborhoods, you will sometimes see a notice that "beverages must be renewed every 45 minutes" or so.
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Old Jun 26th, 2017, 09:26 PM
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Do you drink fruit juice? Most bars in Italy serve fruit juice plain or in more elaborate mixtures (although those often have some sparkling water in them). You can order plain water but it needs to bottled water (naturale) and I think if you want to sit in a cafe in the most historic spots of Florence or Venice, or maybe even in touristic Sienna, there might be an expectation you should be ordering more. But at the working class corner bar in a small town? No.

I assume you know that consuming any beverage sitting down at a bar in Italy will cost you more than if you drink it standing up at the counter. And that you are not naive that many places in Italy's most famous tourist destinations or historic cafes charge inflated prices. Prices are posted at the cash register, so you can look before sitting down.

Just in general I would say that a lot of tourists have left a bad impression at some bars and restaurants in Italy's most picturesque corners for nabbing a prized table and then ordering the absolute minimum, even less, at peak busy hours. But if are sensitive you can sort out which places to avoid if you don't want to get frowned upon or even refused service (as I saw one couple refused at a beachside terrace restaurant in Sardegna when they wanted to share a pizza and one bottle of water).
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Old Jun 26th, 2017, 09:37 PM
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To feel better about paying a high price for a beverage at a cafe terrasse, think of part of the amount as being table rental, since, in most cafes in Paris, one can sit for a long period of time with one beverage.
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Old Jun 26th, 2017, 11:37 PM
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We always check with the cafe staff during meal times to see if it is ok to take up a seat for drinks only. They will let you know. Sometimes they will point you to a certain area they have saved for drinks only, or they will tell you you need to order food.

A good rule of thumb is if there are napkins and cutlery on the table you are expected to eat. After the meal service the tables will be cleared and they are generally open for people to sit and have drinks.

Yes, a coke is likely to cost you more than a beer or a glass of wine so it shouldn't make a difference.
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Old Jun 27th, 2017, 01:28 AM
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By French law, every café and bar is obliged to physically display a minimum of 7 non-alcoholic cold beverages that they sell. You can usually see these lined up on top of the bar where they keep the stock of coffee cups.
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Old Jun 27th, 2017, 02:32 AM
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Order coffee and don't drink it.
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Old Jun 27th, 2017, 05:41 AM
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I like vicenzo32951's answer! You can always ask for a glass of plain water with a coffee. If you really only want if from the tap, not bottled, it's "rubinetto".

Also, if you ask for tea in Italy, in my experience it always arrives with the teabag and the hot water separately. Pour yourself a cup of hot water and sit there while it gets cold.

Most bars in Italy with outdoor tables don't leave cutlery or tablecloths/placemats on the tables. I think a better rule of thumb for Italy is to not to pick a bar that is plainly a tourist attraction or facing one, or that is an historic bar. I've sat nursing "solo acqua naturale' on a hot day in Italy, but in nondescript bars with no particular view of anything other than the passing parade.

By the way, if your preference for plain tap water is concern that bottled water has too many minerals for your system, you might want to look in supermarkets at the bottled water. I've noticed many kinds specifically labeled as appropriate for infant formula or people with kidney issues. If you know some brand names you could try asking for them specifically in cafes.
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Old Jun 27th, 2017, 07:59 AM
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YOu can't sit on a cafe terrass and just order tap water, you have to buy something.


The idea of drinking a lukewarm Coke over an hour makes me want to gag, but you can do it. I really don't understand how someone can drink Coke and refuse to drink any kind of sparkling water, though. I don't recall noticing it in my last trip but you'd think cafes would start offering all of those flavored sparkling waters, not just plain, I think those would be a big hit as I really like the lemon/lime ones.

A lot of people say that about how Coke will cost you more than beer or wine but in Paris, that is generally not true in any place I go. They are all about the same in price. And sparkling water (Perrier is really expensive and Badoit in Paris). For example, I stay in Montparnasse and at the Select (not a cheap place), a Coke and Orangina and limonade and fruit juice and mineral water all cost 6.3 euro. Cafe au lait costs the same amount, also. A glass of wine usually costs 10-15 euro (with a name you order by) although if you don't order a particular type, that is also about 6 euro, as well as a draft beer. The very cheapest beer, 1664 Kronenberg, costs about .50 euro less.

Maybe it's different in Italy, but there isn't any big price difference in drinks in Paris at all the places I go (except cocktails, of course, stuff like that). Of course, drinking 33 cl of Coke versus the same amt of wine isn't very comparable to me because you can nurse a glass of wine a long time--Coke, not so much.
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Old Jun 27th, 2017, 08:15 AM
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Sitting at cafe and watching the world go by, is one the most under rated tourist activities.

I too do not drink and I will order a coke or some bottled water. My wife who does drink, may have a coffee or some wine and we may share a pastry or something small. The price of tranquility and observation.
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Old Jun 27th, 2017, 08:17 AM
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yes, it's different in Italy.

Here is a menu at a typical Italian bar (this one happens to be in Tarquinia). Use the drop down menu button in the upper right corner to see drinks other than non-alcoholic drinks

http://oldstationpubtarquinia.it/menu/drink/analcolici/
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Old Jun 27th, 2017, 08:31 AM
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Yes the old tradition in France of ordering one drink or whatever and being able to sit there all day is a hallowed tradition I think. But for someone to sit at a packed cafe taking up a table dawdling for a long time over a coke would be IMO rather autistic -if there are empty tables who cares.
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Old Jun 27th, 2017, 09:13 AM
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But for someone to sit at a packed cafe taking up a table dawdling for a long time over a coke would be IMO rather autistic -if there are empty tables who cares.

huh?
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Old Jun 27th, 2017, 09:41 AM
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There are always park benches:

http://www.fodors.com/community/euro...rk-benches.cfm
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Old Jun 27th, 2017, 10:22 AM
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Not many park benches in Italy. Not all that many parks. If you can find a bench, great, but please be aware that it is poor form to sit on walls, church steps, the bases of statues, fountain rims in Italy.

In recent months the city of Florence has taken to sending out street cleaners to wash down the church steps at the Duomo and at other famous areas of of the city right at lunch time -- a not so subtle attempt to deter tourists from using the monuments and churches as park benches.

The nicer thing to do if you want to sit in a cafe in a historic city and comfortably enjoy the surroundings is to order something. Whether you consuume it on the spot, tuck it your bag or walk away from it untouched is nobody's business but yours.
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Old Jun 27th, 2017, 11:26 AM
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I remember the sticker shock of orange juice at Deux Magots. It was like the equivalent of $7 in the early '90s for a 4 or 5 ounce serving.

I didn't want to go there but I had biked with a group from the 16th arrondissement into the center and that's where they wanted to get a drink.

We didn't even take up a table for long, if at all.

In Italy, you pay more at a table than at the counter (banco), like 3 times more for an espresso or cappuccino. And it's not like the table is that impressive. In one case, it was on the main drag going through Cannaregio but it wasn't really that interesting a place to be.

In Florence, on a cold morning, I saw the prices in Piazza Signoria vs. going a block or two to a side street where this little bakery had a few narrow tables inside.

Big savings but obviously if you want to watch the world go by, you have to pay for that table on a high-traffic area.
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Old Jun 27th, 2017, 11:39 AM
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Paying extra to sit down anywhere in Italy is not about having a better view. It is about the fact that it costs the owners more to offer table service and that no one is going to chase you out once you sit down.

In some places in Italy, of course, the value of the real estate is so high, and taxed accordingly, the owners need to charge more to stay in business, just like in NYC. And yes -- France and Italy are capitalist societies! They capitalize on your desires for once-in-a-lifetime experiences or convenience of location.

It's a "splurge" to sit in the piazza Signoria & drink whatever. If you're just thirsty and don't need to sit down, definitely keep walking if you're on a budget.

By the way, "the world goes by" in a lot of non-descript corners of Paris and Florence, and in any town in these countries. It can be more interesting to sit down in a plastic molded chair near the bike rack and watch the local life unfold around you than sitting in a world famous spot watching swarms of fellow tourists amble by clutching maps and taking selfies.
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