"Day 5 Wimbeldon (anything on the way out there?), St. Paul's, Canary Wharf, Covent Garden ending at the London Eye on our last night."

I'm leaving just now so only time for a VERY brief comment. This day is utterly nuts. (meant in the nicest possible way )

Take a look at a map - you are literally crossing all of greater London three times. Plus you say the end of June . . . w/ the tournament starting on 25 June won't your dates conflict?? And Canary Wharf --is there some compelling reason?

Cannot even imagine a tour to Oxford and Stratford AFTER approx 1/2 a day at the Tower.

There are other 'issues' but I'm off to a wedding . . .

Day 5 is not in order of attendance, only that we will end up at the London Eye last. Oh yes, I know the tournament is going to be in full session, but I believe one can watch from the screens outside the stadium. At least it looks that way when I watch on TV. As for Canary Wharf, I will strike that from the list. Thanks for the advice, I will look for more when you return from the wedding!

but I believe one can watch from the screens outside the stadium. At least it looks that way when I watch on TV.

The screens are IN the "stadium" (ie the All England Lawn Tennis and Croquet Club). If you want to watch them then you queue for a very long time without a guarantee of entry.

As for the general itinerary - http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0064471/

any suggestions?

Forget about the coach tours and do your own thing - and Leicester is a town 100 miles from London. Unless you want to see a show or do some serious shopping then Leicester Square, Picadilly Circus and Oxford Street are a total waste of time. You are in London, do something that is distinctly London and couldn't be anywhere else in the world

Hello alanRow, we do want to see a show and having a 19 year old daughter we will do some shopping. Do you know anything about the Wimbeldon Museum? Great point about not getting in to see the large screens.

Very short trip. Are the sights you list a part of the tour or are you doing them on your own? What is the tour providing? Day 6 is a little busy. I would definitely skip Moulin Rouge.

Hello mamcalice, Thanks for the note, yes, it is a short trip, simply an introduction for our kids to Europe and all its spenders. The London tour includes only views of Kensington Palace, the Royal Albert Hall and Albert Memorial, Trafalgar Square, Whitehall, Downing Street, Big Ben, The Houses of Parliament, Westminster Abbey, Buckingham Palace and ends at Trafalgar Swuare.
The Paris tour includes: Notre Dame Cathedral, Louvre, Garnier's Opera House, Place de la Concorde, Champs Elyses, Arc De Triomphe and the Eiffel Tower.
The sights I listed are on our own....will keep in mind skipping Moulin to save energy for Monet's Garden which I am really looking forward to...

First of all, prices in the UK - in fact in most of europe - are considerably higher than most places in the US. $15 for lunch and $25 for dinner will provide extremely modest meals - assuming sandwiches from supermarkets etc. For perspective a look online at chain places - for instance McDonals or Hard Rock Cafe - and see how much higher prices are there. (We assume 25 pounds - not dollars - for a modest lunch and 50 pounds per person and up for dinner - assuming a glass of wine each. For a special meal we assume at lest 200 pounds per couple.

As for your itinerary - there is now way you can do most of it. What you have as day trips outside of London and Paris are full day trips - you can't do other sightseeing those days - you need to start out and be on trains or buses by 8 am or so and will, if you are quick, return in time for a latish dinner. Day 4, Day 7 and Day 8 are simply not possible.

Also - you need to get a map and group sites together. Some days you are bouncing around London like a ping pong ball - and, being a large city - those trips can each take an hour - not 10 minutes or so.

There is no way you can fully see the Tower of London and have a day trip to Oxford/Stratford on the same day. We spent 5 hours at the Tower of London alone and did not even see every nook and cranny.

Same goes for Versaille and the Louvre. Each deserves at least a half to one full day. You can spend an hour and a half just waiting on line to get into Versaille--(we did and we went early in the day). Choose either or but don't plan to do both on the same day.

Do you have atm cards with funds in a CHECKING account, not savings?

Do you have adaptors for any and all electrical devices you will use--so that your plugs will fit into the sockets (I'm not talking about current converters--won't need those as a rule). The plugs in the UK are different from those on the continent so you need two different adaptors--you will need them for camera battery chargers, phone chargers, ipod chargers, etc.

If you are planning on taking photos, do you have plenty of memory? battery power/recharge ability?

Do you have plan for how to meet back up if you get separated?

Is your tour providing transport from the airport? If not, then don't plan on a taxi in London. You need a car service (have to pre-book) or a plan to use the Tube.

As said above, the Tower is a half day.
Oxford is AT LEAST one whole day.
Stratford is AT LEAST one whole day.
No way you can combine those. Well, maybe if you just rode a bus from daylight til dark and waved at stuff as you drove by. Not even sure that's doable.

I'd re-think your plans; London could keep you busy for weeks and weeks without any day trips, and the sites/sights in it are spread far apart in a huge city (that has a great public transport system, but it takes TIME). Does the tour thing last all day? If I were you, I'd plan at most one day trip (and I think I'd have to count Wimbledon as that) and pick 2-3 things to see IN London each of your other days and group those by area on the time left. And of course if the tour is over by mid-day, then you can plan something major or even two afterwards.

Whatever you end up doing,I'm sure you guys will have a blast, but I don't think your plan right now is making the maximum use of your limited time in London (I don't know Paris so can't comment.)

Your plan seems to be an over-reach. The transport systems in London and Paris are exceptional, but if this is you first visit, it will take extra time to get from one place to another.

One example of many I could give -- Day 8:

The train-bus combo to Giverny is great, but, as a newbie, you'll need extra time to get to Gare St. Lazare, and buy your ticket...you certainly will want to err on the side of extra time for these tasks. Making the 8:20 train that gets you to the bus that gets you to the gardens before 10:00 (opening time) may be difficult. The next train doesn't even reach Vernon (where you cathc the bus) till after 11:00.

The gardens open at 10:00. There is a return train that arrive in Paris at 1:40...but you probably won't want to leave the gardens in time to make that train. The next train arrives in Paris at 3:40.

By the time you eat lunch, and take transport, you won't reach the d'Orsay till nearly 5 pm.

There will likely be a long line there, and it closes at 6:00 (except Thursdays). If you are a lover of impressionsim, that is not enough time.

I know this sounds pessimistic. That day CAN be done, but it's a real long shot...and no fun. Paris is a beautiful city -- don't rush through it...ditto for London.


SS

...more thoughts...

With only 2-and-a-half days in Paris, I would limit myself to one "day-trip." I suggest Versailles, and leave Giverny for your next trip. These, IMHO, are the essentials for a first-timer:

-- Notre Dame
-- Louvre and/or Orsay (depending on your art taste)
-- River Cruise (1 hr "Vedettes de Pont Neuf")
-- Eiffel Tower - if pressed for time, no need to go all the way up.
-- Take at least 1 morning or afternoon to take a self-guided walking tour of the historic core.

You can increase your options by checking on which days the attraction are open late.

(I probably forgot something...)

SS

THe Wimbledon Tennis Museum is NOT open to the general public during the Wimbledon Tournement. Only ticket holders for the tennis can access the museum during this time. To be honest, unless you have a burning desire to see some tennis - and have an entire day free to queue for ground passes - do not even think about going out there during the tournament.

Here are the Wimbledon closing and limited admission dates from

http://www.wimbledon.com/en_GB/museum_and_tours/201205091336561036163.html

•18 June - 23 June: Museum open, no Centre Court viewing. No Tours.

•25 June - 8 July: Museum open to Championships ticket-holders only from 9.30am to 8pm.

•9 July - 27 July: Museum and Tours closed.

•28 July - 6 August: Museum open to Olympics ticket-holders only.

•7-14 August: Museum and Tours closed.


SS

NHgirl,
“will keep in mind skipping Moulin to save energy for Monet's Garden which I am really looking forward to...”

Excellent idea. The Moulin Rouge with dinner is now about 174 euros each – so you would be paying at least $870 not counting what fee would be added by using a credit card.

As others have said above, your plans are extremely ambitious so slow down little and enjoy. I have been to London three times (loved it) but have avoided the Tower because it is so time consuming although I have seen the outside from bus excursions and from the river.

Sorry I missed the Crown Jewels, but someone told me recently that when they went, the crowds were such that they could hardly see the jewels. They had to walk around the display cases quickly in single file.

Also, if you do a museum in Paris, my choice would be the Musee D’Orsay (impressionists) over the Louvre. Was at the Louvre a few days ago – I had forgotten what a zoo the place is. The new Carousel entrance is basically a gigantic shopping center.

In any case, enjoy London and Paris – it will be an adventure…

...do NOT enter the Louvre through the front entrance. Enter from the Metro #1 line station...much, much shorter lines.

SS

Even if you can hop into and out of all those places as with magic want, you would be spending most of time getting from to the places. As you mentioned is a short trip, concentrate your objectives in what you and others want see and experience the most. Check in the forum, maybe you can post it and see which attractions the others would pick, and then maybe you can visit again and go to the other ones. Between the Tower and Oxfor, I would choose Oxford, but then it is a full day trip. And yes I agree with latedaytraveler, I am with the Musee D'Orsay. Versailles is a must. As for the airport transportation, it is so easy. RER in Paris and cannot remember but there is direct tube to London from Heathrow. Also depends in which are the hotels you are staying in. About the tours, if this si the first time, a bus tour might help you to locate the attractions and at least you can see the exteriors. In London I just love so much the museums, if you are in Covent Garden, the National Gallery is a must, and Soho. I lived in London and Paris back in the 80's and 90's and will be back January 2013, so cannot comment on the London Eye. It is definitely in my list.

latedaytraveler: "Sorry I missed the Crown Jewels, but someone told me recently that when they went, the crowds were such that they could hardly see the jewels. They had to walk around the display cases quickly in single file."

Unfortunately your friend gave you a bum steer.

1) if one arrives early, there is literally no one else in the Crown Jewels vault. That is why we advise arriving at opening time, heading straight to the Jewel House, and only afterwards returning to the entrance to hook up w/ a Yeoman Warder tour

2) One does not 'quickly walk' - it is moving sidewalk so one travels up one side of the display cases and back down the other.

3) While it is true one must travel at a set speed around the cases, after that you can merely go up a couple of steps to a raised walkway and can spend as long as you'd like (w/i reason) looking at each individual crown/orb/scepter . . .

So - next time do set aside time for the Tower.

Janisj, thank you for the information. Not sure when "next time" will be though....

Personally - in Paris - I don't think Versailles is a "must." We didn't visit Versailles until our third trip to Paris, and frankly, I was underwhelmed. We did a daytrip to Giverny on our first trip to Paris (in 1995) and it was wonderful. However, it does take up nearly an entire day, and our stay was for a week. As a "consolation" you will want to visit L'Orangerie, so you can see Monet's fantastic gigantic waterlillies canvases. There is also a very nice collection of other artists, which I enjoyed very much. If your whole family isn't really in to spending a lot of "museum time" -- I would make it your first visit, because it is so manageable...and because, well, you really have expressed YOUR affection for Monet!

I also don't think you need to shop along the Champs Elysees (and you will see it on your tour), but with a 17yo daughter, you might very much enjoy checking out Le Printemps - one the the grand department stores of Paris. We had lunch in their brasserie, under the fabulous stained glass dome (although I just checked the menu and it has gotten fairly pricy) -- but you can also zip up to the roof where they serve snacks with a wonderful view 360degree view of the city.

As others have recommended, the Vedettes de Pont Neuf are absolutely a Don't Miss. You get to see Paris from the river, passing under all the bridges -- it is stunning at any time of day or night.

Thank you everyone for your thoughts, I have revised my schedule, so read and comment please. All comments have been very helpful and my husband is very grateful as I do try to do everything.
Day 1 fly to London
Day 2 drop luggage at Hotel, walk up Oxford St. eventually getting on the Tube to Temple, walk along the Thames, buy 2/1 train tickets at Charring Cross. Get on a bus to Trafalgar Square, return to Hotel. (get meals along the way from suggested restaurants in the forum).
Day 3 Half day bus sighteeing tour (already part of package) ending at Trafalgar Square, Tour Westminster Abbey and MAYBE War Rooms.
Day 4 Tower of London, St. Paul's
Day 5 One of the following: Oxford, Cambridge, Eton
Please give me your thoughts.

oops - sorry about the daughter's age - 19! Obviously she no longer likes to shop.

One of our favorite museums in Paris is the Carnavalet. It provides a wonderful history of the city of Paris, and I like the feeling of "connection" it gives you -- some of those places you visit are very much the same as they were hundreds of years ago. It is located in the Marais, near the lovely park Place des Vosges. A super place for a picnic.

Hello uhoh, I do believe she was born to shop, she better study hard in school to support her love of shopping. Will keep the department store and museum in mind. Thank you for your help.
Working on the revision of Paris..

Day 2 seems a little light, as you said you arrive at 6:40? So you'd be, even on a bad morning, ready to see something by 10 at the latest. And you must keep moving--no naps! I don't really know what you are trying to get done on this Day 2---I'm assuming this is day of arrival? Just getting your bearings? I think (I'm no on-site expert) you'd do better from Oxford Street on the Tube to Embankment unless there was some specific reason to change lines and go to Temple? You MIGHT, depending on weather, how you feel, where your hotel is, etc., be able to do something else like stroll a park or something. But a stroll along the Thames is just about my favorite first thing to do in London. Good to not OVERPLAN this first day, though.

Days 3 and 4 sound much better.

Oh Oxford for sure! I haven't been to the other two, so don't have comparison facts, but I LOVE Oxford and its beauty, history, architecture, and so so many literary/media connections. If you want to read Trip Reports and if you want to hear about the two different terrific days we had in Oxford as day trips (well, one was a true day trip via bus from London, the other included driving from LHR and a night's stay, but what we did could again have been as a day trip from London)--here are the links to my adventures.
http://www.fodors.com/community/europe/oh-to-be-in-england--and-we-were-trip-report-of-2-weeks-in-london-and-day-trips.cfm

http://www.fodors.com/community/europe/keep-calm-and-carry-on-trip-report-of-13-days-in-england-and-wales.cfm

uhoh_busted...

Thank you for adding the Carnavalet Museum. We've been to Paris four times in the last ten years and have always stopped in.

I have to admit, however, that I am a history buff and love to learn about the history of whatever city I am visiting (the Museum of London is similarly a must-see for me personally).

However, I'd only recommend those two sights to someone with similar interests given the short time allotted to their trip. If NHGirle3G fits the profile, then they should not be missed.

Both meseums are fantastic!!!...and both a free!

SS

Definitely Oxford, there is so much more, and love the Bodleian Library, and also is not only University, which is of a bit different system from the university in other places. There are different colleges each with its own specialty and administration.
In Paris, yes Place des Vosges, For shopping Printemps and Les Galleries Lafayette a block apart, and why not Rue Mouffetard for their wonderful market. In the 2nd arrondisement, there is the famous Galerie Viviene and being Paris, you can walk in about 30 minutes to the Opera. And of course there are the little shops in the Left Bank, including the oldest Department Store in Paris Le Bon Marche and its fabulous food department.

Oh, I want to be there like right now!!!!

" . . . you arrive at 6:40? So you'd be, even on a bad morning, ready to see something by 10 at the latest."

Maybe so, but probably not. MANY transatlantic flights arrive in the early morning hours and just immigration can easily take an hour or more. That is plus the looooooong walk at arrivals and luggage retrieval. Then an hour average to central London. I'd plan on arriving at the hotel by 9:30 or 10:00 at the earliest. If everything works like clockwork, it might take less time,but I wouldn't count on it.

So after checking in (assuming your room is ready) count on being out and about by around 11AM. If your room isn't ready, you can drop the luggag end head out

Not quite sure what you mean by 2/1 train tickets. Are you talking about the Days Out 2for1 discounts? If so, the train tix aren't 2for1, it is the admission charges for the sites that are reduced.

Eton is nice- but It would really be an add on to a day trip to Windsor. Eton is a nice walk across the river from the center of Windsor/the Castle.

Oxford Street is just a street of very crowded department stores and shops - it is very congested and not very attractive. OK for shopping but IMO sort of a waste on such a short time in London.

Instead of Temple -- you can take the Jubilee line from Bond Street tube station (if you stick to your Oxford St plan) to Westminster, walk across the bridge and along the south bank. (Big Ben, Parliament, the Eye, terrific views, Tate Modern, the Globe) and if the time works out -walk across the millennium bridge to St Pauls.

janisj is, as ever, correct--I mis-typed in my post and meant "ready to see something by 11 at the latest" not 10. The point is that it's wise to not plan to be someplace crucial at a certain time after arrival at LHR as it takes awhile to get to rooms in London. (My 4 arrivals have been fairly painless, being out of LHR in under an hour each time and 3 times in rooms in London about 2 hours after arrival, BUT this is not necessarily the norm. Better to be on the safe side and assume it could take closer to 4.)

...one thing I forgot...

The British Library, for me at least, is a must-see. In my four visits to London, I've never missed it. It definitely qualifies as a place to see things you just cannot see anywhere else without a lot of travelling. Once again, that speaks to my interest in history.

We like it better than the British Museum...but that may be because we live on the east coast of the US and can see many similar things within a few hours' drive.

SS

Eton's a waste of time for most people as a specific trip: it takes up an hour or two as part of a trip to Windsor.

Lots of people prefer Cambridge to Oxford for sheer aesthetics. But Oxford's near-stranglehold over power in England for the past half-millennium and its bizarre explosion in populist culture in the past 150 years (from Alice, through CS Lewis, Brideshead and Tolkien to Morse, his prequels and sequels) mean there are about a million times more things to see. The Oxphiliacs on this forum have also been a lot more forthcoming about what they enjoyed in their trips, so searching here will give you about three years' worth of stuff to see.

The Champs Elysees are pretty crap for shops. For actually buying things, the Grands Boulevards round Printemps. For window shopping, though, the Rue du Faubourg St Honore (esp, I'd say, the kilometre east of Rue La Boetie) isn't just prettier, but the prices are so stratospheric you're unlikely to be tempted to fork out any dosh.

Wherever you got the absurd idea of wasting time walking round Leicester Square and Piccadilly Circus from - don't trust the source again (if it was from your grandad, it's understandable, if more revealing of what he got up to in the war than he'd like your grandma to know about. But times change, the girls are long retired and they're now devoid of any interest).

Hello Everyone, I really appreciate all your comments and have been getting very manic about reading,printing maps, and tours. With only 10 days to go before we leave I'm getting very excited for sure!!
I have decided to go to Oxford and will look at the forum for ideas as there seems so much to do....am thinking of a bike tour for this excursion.
@texasbookwork, loved reading about your last trip to London, and have headed many of your suggestions; we are also staying near the Marble Arch so the Picadilly Line from Heathrow was a great suggestion. Also, the comments about Oxford bus from London will be followed.
@janisj, your suggestions will also be followed for our first day, thanks.
Will post Paris plans tomorrow.

@ssander; will follow your tips for Paris
@:texasbookwork; looking to buy adapters tomorrow
To everyone: do we need to bring a computer? Or i-pad?