We have dropped a car from Avis in Orvieto. But that was four years ago.

Maybe too many people have been doing this, and there is a glut of cars there?

I must be missing something. Are you being told that a car rental outfit in FLORENCE can't guarantee an automatic? First off, I've never dealt with a car rental agency anywhere in Europe that can absolutely guarantee an automatic (I don't drive automatics, but I do read the fine print on the agreements), but surely your chances of getting one in Florence are decent, as it's a fairly large place. And assuming you get one in Florence, what does Orvieto not guaranteeing automatics have to do with anything - you're just dropping the car off; what does it matter whether you're dropping off an automatic or a manual?

http://www.economycarrentals.com/ allows you to specify an automatic and has one-way rentals from Florence to Orvieto--I tried it by using next month as a rental date.

StCirq

The searches are leaving me with messages saying that I cannot drop a car off in Orvieto, unless I go through Hertz which does not have any automatics to offer when picking up in Florence AND dropping off in Orvieto. Other companies offer automatic for pickup in Florence, however they will not let me drop the car off in Orvieto.

Well, I've never heard of anything like that before (and have done a load of Italian car rentals). I use AutoEurope (call them and speak to a rep instead of relying on the website to answer all your questions). Good luck.

I read a good amount of bad reviews for autoeurope, so I am trying to avoid them. Though they did have what I needed.

Well, that's interesting. They're by far the favorite car rental outfit of folks here on Fodors. I've rented from them more than 100 times and have never had a single problem. Their customer service is exemplary, IME.

We always use AutoEurope and have never had a bad experience. We have rented in Florence and dropped the car in Orvieto twice in the past 5 years. Not sure what bad things you have heard but many on this forum use AutoEurope.

I read the reviews here:

www.reviewcentre.com/reviews76712.html

Which now appears to be a different website. Are those reviews for a different website?

Those are reviews of the UK AutoEurope. Try this:

http://www.trustpilot.com/review/www.autoeurope.com

We've used AutoEurope for years and never had a bad experience with them. Most recent experience was renting a car for 21 days last Fall, picking it up in Orvieto an returning it in Milan. When you drop off a car in Orvieto, you will be within walking distance of the train station. It is a piece of cake. While we don't rent automatics in Europe, I don't know why you shouldn't be able to do so through AutoEurope. Sometimes you will end up with a car from Hertz or Avis, or more likely EuropeCar. But they make it easy for you to get what you need.

While I'm not in the same league as StCirq, I have done at least 20 European rentals through AutoEurope and Kemwel.

Here's why I like to arrange car rental through AutoEurope (US):

- Helpful, knowledgeable people in Portland, ME at 1-800-223-5555 who will gladly answer all my questions

- Very clear information as to what is covered by prepayment to AE and what will need to be paid locally when picking up the car

- Guaranteed best rate (I used this once successfully)

- Reasonable cancellation policy

- Toll-free telephone number 24/7 from most places in Europe

- Great support from AE if any problem or misunderstanding with local provider in Europe

(The last two points were important when we disputed additional charges. In one case (Avis in England), a charge to our credit card was refunded immediately. In the other (Europcar in France), a call by the agent to the AE toll-free number resolved the problem on the spot. For me, this service is worth a great deal.)

Now Kemwel is owned by AE, and my most recent rental was arranged with them.

I'm sure someone has had some kind of negative experience with AE, but I'll stick with them based on years of positive experience.

Call them---you are just too far out. Do not try it online--it is tricky---call 1800-223-5555

It also could have to do with the time of day you enter in the return information. If you have entered a time when the office is closed (after lunch, for instance) they may show that service is not available, but not tell you why.

Doesn't sound like you really need a car given the places you are going.

There are some bad reviews out there on Auto Europa, which many people confuse with Auto Europe. As other have mentioned, Auto Europe has great service as does there sister company, Kemwel. I usually find better prices with Kemwel. Be sure to look at the deductibles offered when making your choices.

<<It also could have to do with the time of day you enter in the return information. If you have entered a time when the office is closed (after lunch, for instance) they may show that service is not available, but not tell you why.>>

Many rental offices close between noonish and 4ish, and then re-open until 8ish. Be sure to enter the time of drop off during a time the office will be open.

You should be able to find an automatic in Florence that you can drop in Orvieto. The Florence Airport will have the best selection.

Thanks everyone, i feel very foolish for my mistake.

Star-We want to drive around Tuscany and Umbria so that is why we want a car.

Don't feel foolish. Most of the time, if we have an answer it's because we've made the same mistake - at least for me that's the case. Have a great trip!

Unless you are planning to sightsee on your way to Siena, I would take the bus and pick up the car there (if you are spending nights in town).

When trying to search on AutoEurope, you must match locations (Hertz address in Florence with Hertz drop-off address in Orvieto)or it will say not available. AutoEurope just lists all possible pick-ups which can be either Hertz/Avis/EuropCar. Not only are most locations closed outside of big cities between 1-4, they are also closed after 1 on Saturday and all day Sunday.

We almost always use Hertz - since we have a special corporate rate with them - and have never h ad a problem getting an automatic. But - we usually get a mid size or larger (which have larger percentage of automatics) and always pick up at a major office (Preferably large airport - which has a much larger selection of cars.)

Would the bus be OK with two large suitcases? Does anyone else recommend waiting till Siena to pick up the car? Kybourbon, why do you recommend doing that? I would guess the car rentals in Florence would have a larger Selection of cars on hand.

Does anyone else share kybourbons suggestion?

Two large suitcases? No. I don't see why you need to take a bus when you can easily drive. Especially if you pick up your car at the airport..

Actually, yes I do agree if you plan to spend the nite in Siena, the bus is easier---and saves you a day of car rental. Siena is not an easy place to drive into.

"We are looking for May of next year. If they cannot guarantee an automatic given 9 months advance, I am assuming they will not have one closer to our travel date."

It seems you are beyond that discussion now . . . But honestly, your reasoning makes no sense. No rental agency can 'guarantee' an automatic months and months ahead. Heck -- the cars in their fleet now and 9 months from now will be entirely different. How could it be easier to guarantee any specific car nearly a year from now? After all, they aren't going to hold a car for you from now til then.

But in any case, there are NO 100% guarantees re automatics. Unless they only have automatics in the fleet. What if they have 2 automatics on inventory on your date, and one has mechanical issues and the other is returned late? If so, you ain't goin' to get an automatic.

We took the bus to Sienna from Florence and picked up a car there. Very easy! You DON'T want to drive in Florence!

I took the advice of the Board some years ago, and took the bus from Florence. The luggage went down below in the cargo hold of the bus. I did this because I did not want to drive the car in/out of any complicated area. In fact, I did not want a car until after I left Siena. When I left Siena, I took a taxi to the car rental place.

I used Autoeurope and I was able to get an automatic transmission at Siena ultimately dropping off at the Florence airport. Calling Autoeurope is easier because of the frustration you are finding with the website when you picking up and dropping off in different locations.

I just called them yesterday, for the trip I am currently planning, because it was so frustrating using the website with the different address options. A real live person answers the phone - and no phone trees! Then they e-mail you the quote. This will be my third time using them.

If only I could learn to drive a manual transmission here in the states, I would save a bundle in Europe over the next few years. In fact, I was going to look for a driving school that might teach me - I did drive a manual transmission once in my early 20's.

Good luck deciding and planning!

Janis ha nailed it, as usual.

>>>If only I could learn to drive a manual transmission here in the states,<<<

I'm sure there are videos on youtube. It's really not hard and most people learn the basics in a few minutes from a friend (pre-youtube days). I will admit hill towns will be tricky if you have to stop on one when you aren't used to it.

As for the bus(7€), your luggage goes under (your job to put it there, not the bus driver). If you have two large suitcases and rent a small car, your luggage won't fit. Most small cars won't hold two large cases.

Kybourbon - the first time was Tuscany and I didn't want to do it then. The second time was Ireland and no way could I try it then! For my upcoming Rome/Umbria trip my husband has agreed to drive - in prior trips he preferred not to drive. He can drive manual somewhat and he did it a little bit in a huge van in Portugal last year. I explained the price difference and the difficulty of getting automatic transmissions in smaller towns and he agreed. YAY! But, seriously it is so worth learning - the cost differential is huge.

Thanks everyone for your replies

Janis: they offer a car OR ONE SIMILAR. I am guessing they could figure out a way to guarentee an automatic 9 months from now. It would not be the exact car but one similar as their disclaimer suggests.
By that logiv I should just forget about driving in general as you are suggesting there is no guarentee regardless of when I book. If a company cannot guarentee a car per your contract with them then they have a terrible business model. If they cannot guarentee a suitable car they should mot accept my payment. If this is a possibility then I will have to rethink our trip.

I was planning on using Siena as a hub to explorethe area at the suggestion of many on this site. That is why I would want to have a car. We are planning on spending 5ish nights in Siena.

The suitcases are not huge, just not carry on size. They are the larger onesvthat came in a set of two, hard to explain but if need be i could get the dimensions.

As for learning manual. All my friends drive automatics leaving me with the option of buying a clunker or destroying the transmission in my fathers Audi (not going to happen).

Worm -- I hear you on learning on someone else's car- unless it was a total junker -- there is no way I could ask. I tried to see if I could rent one here and but when I looked into it that didn't seem possible from the major car rental places. My next step was to look up a driving school- which I haven't done yet.

I will also doing an Orvieto drop off - maybe I will see you there!

Or similar means another car that also automatic. But janis is right; there's always a chance that they don't have an automatic, especially in a smaller town. You can increase your chances by picking up at Florence's airport, which is easy to get to by bus and out of the city near the autostrada.

I so often wonder why people don't learnto drive a stick shift. It's fun! More importantly it's a good skill tohave in life, obviously. Yu have many months to learn and practice. Think of the money and hassle youwillsave on your future trips.

Buon viaggio!

WorminRome: Put your listening ears on. Just because you only drive an automatic doesn't mean rental agencies in Europe have a terrible business model.

In Europe the majority of cars are stick shift and probably 90% of renters can drive them. Americans who have never driven a stick make up a relatively small portion of their customer base.

In the States almost all rental cars cars are automatics, so of course they can 'guarantee' an automatic.

If you MUST have an automatic, you need to collect the car at a major location like an international airport, not in a small town. Major airports will have larger inventory and you are almost guaranteed to get what you want.

(Someone wanting a stick in the States would have the same problem only more so)

I'm curious. How do the rental agencies adjust the rental price if an automatic (usually more expensive) is not available? Do they offer a refund? Does the new rate for the standard shift car reflect the walk-in rate or the possible discount for what may have been an early rental?

janisj: First, there is absolutely no reason to be that obnoxious.

Secondly, I wholeheartedly disagree with you. If a company takes money as a payment for a future service that they cannot guarantee, then yes, that is a terrible business model. If they offer an automatic to you, they are contractually obligated to provide that car or one like it (as their website states). If they cannot do this, then they should not take my money, because even a refund on the premisses would leave me "stranded" in a foreign country.

So yes, under almost any circumstance this would be considered a bad business model.

Finally, I thought I made it clear that I wanted to pick the car up in Florence, if I merely insinuated Florence as my pick-up location then I apologize.

WorminRome, have you rented many cars? We have and a number of times, they haven't had the car we ordered. It's just a fact of the car renting business. People are unpredictable. Usually the car rental agency upgrades us, give us a bigger, more expensive car, not always a desireable thing if you will be driving in small hilltowns.

One time, in Hawaii, they gave us a car so big I couldn't reach the gas pedal. (I'm 5'2".)

WorminRome, you are clearly a novice at the business of renting a car in Europe. Hardly anyone there drives an automatic. Cars are picked up from Place X and dropped off in Place Y, including different countries, all the time. People don't show up. People drop cars off earlier and later than expected in places they didn't contract to drop them off in. There is no way a car rental agency can absolutely guarantee you anything, especially if you're in the vast minority of people who can't handle a manual transmission. It isn't a bad business model - it's commonsense. Why don't you just take the time to learn to drive a stick shift; it's not rocket science. Even if you do, if you read the fine print of ANY rental contract in Europe, it will say they absolutely cannot guarantee you a particular car on a particular day (because they can't, which means they understand how their business works); they usually say they can guarantee a SIMILAR car. Like Mimar, I almost always end up with a bigger, better car than the one I paid for. At any rate, it doesn't matter a whit what you think of their business models; if you want to drive there, you're going to have to deal with the realities of their contracts, which will almost assuredly NOT guarantee you an automatic or anything else but a car that's similar to the size you need, or find a way to get around that doesn't involve driving.

sorry -- I wasn't being obnoxious. (though I certainly can be if I put in the effort)

I was 100% trying to get you to understand . . . No rental company anywhere can guarantee any specific type of car UNLESS they only have one type of car in the entire fleet.

OK -- so say you do get an automatic at Florence. What happens if you have car trouble and have to switch out cars? The rental company will bring you a new vehicle . . . But you can pretty much bet it won't be an automatic.

When I read the word "similar" I assumed it would have a similar transmission as that, to me, is an essential aspect of what would make one car similar to another.

There is a difference between not having the car when I show up and not being able to replace it if broken as janis pointed out. My only point was that it is bad business to accept money for a service it cannot guarentee. If they cared enough, a car would be ready when scheduled. Though its slightly different I have had to rent UHauls many times and they operate on a similar bases and they have always had the exact size truck I requested. But again that is slightly similar.


As both st cirq and janis have pointed out it seems my only reasonable options are to learn to drive stick or figure out an alternative mode of transportation/change of plans as you suggest.

I do not mean to be argumentative, and I do very much appreciate the advice. As both my wife and I would like to explore Italy's countryside I am going to have to learn apparently.

What you might spend on lessons you will probably save on rentals.

<<My only point was that it is bad business to accept money for a service it cannot guarentee.>>

NO. What would be bad business would be to accept your money without telling you they can't guarantee the exact car you want. Trust me, they know more about running their own businesses and what they can and can't do than any of us.

<<As both st cirq and janis have pointed out it seems my only reasonable options are to learn to drive stick or figure out an alternative mode of transportation/change of plans as you suggest.>>

I still suggest picking your car up at the Florence airport. They have the best inventory of automatic cars. The airport is a 10-15 minute 25E taxi ride from the city center.

Is there a reason you do not want to do this?

Obviously we have differing views on proper business practices. But that doesn't change the fact that it is what it is.

If I am unable to learn stick is it safe to base our trip on the premise that there should be an automatic available if we pick up at Florence's airport?

<<If I am unable to learn stick is it safe to base our trip on the premise that there should be an automatic available if we pick up at Florence's airport?>>

In my opinion, yes. Here's why-

There are lots of rental cars available at the airport. They have the space and the consumer need to have plenty of cars on hand.

At most city center locations, the number of cars available is very limited because they do not have the space to store the cars. There are no rental car lots in the city center of Florence. They use garages and the space is very limited. Therefor, your car selection is very limited.

Just reserve an automatic at the airport from kemwel.com and don't worry about it. Your car will be there waiting for you.

"is it safe to base our trip on the premise that there should be an automatic available if we pick up at Florence's airport?"

At least 5 of us have advised . . . If you MUST have an automatic, collect your car at the airport. Instead of fixating on 'business models', note what everyone is saying. Rent from the airport - 99.9% they'll have what you want.

Janis: i am pretty sure I mentioned picking it up in Florence and you said it would not be guarenteed. That is what got us into that discussion. Contrary to your claim I am not fixated on business models but on getting a damn car. That is he reason why I made the original post. Instead of jumping all over me, you should read what I have written.

Thanks everyone for the help.

Worm: I did indeed read what you posted. You didn't mention getting your car at the airport - you talked about taking the train to Florence and getting the car there. Picking up a car IN Florence is not the same as picking one up at FLR.

Worm

How about taking on the airlines' "business model" next? We could all have a very lively discussion on that topic

And I still think you should learn to drive a stick.....

Dayle: I've asked my father to teach me on his car, and hopefully I won't destroy his transmission as thought would mean they need a new car.

If all goes well, all issues discussed will be moot.

That said I would hate to be in the airplane industry!

worm...haven't posted to you since you had some questions on whether or not to spend your money in Hungary. I gave you a ton of information at that time including several phone numbers....and you've never responded. Seems you ARE changing plans for your 2013 trip as fast as we can respond to you.

In so doing you seem to have developed a knack for bringing down the house upon yourself. Please write me at my email address which you have or at the alternate I've listed below.. I have a little friendly tutorial to offer you which may prove helpful...if you ever DO take another trip to Europe...any trip.

stuartftower@aol.com

In 2009 we hired a VW Golf Plus Automatic from Avis in Siena. We drove through various parts of Tuscany and Umbria, then dropped off in Orvieto after we dropped our bags to the hotel in the middle of town.

As you probably know there is little point in having a car inside the confines of the main part of the township of Orvieto. It is a town for walking.

The Avis drop off location in Orvieto was a small office front, not a garage and very close to the train station from near where the escalator and the local bus will take you back into the main part of town.

Thanks for the reassurance goodwill.

WorminRome. Last year we rented a car at the Rome Airport(an automatic) and stayed in Orvieto for two days. We stayed in the middle of town.
It is a little tricky because there are certain zones that you cannot drive through at certain times. You may notice doing so immediately after. That is what happened to us.
Our hotel kindly gave us a copy of the fax they sent to the local police informing them we were hotel guests.
I haven't heard anything yet about a violation although I underatand it could take many months to do so.

I have rented cars many times in Europe, three times in Italy, all automatics. I guess I have been lucky. Two in Florence in town and once in Rome at the airport.
A tip is to rent at an airport or large rental office and another thing is not to begin a rental on the weekend. I do not know if that is blind luck. My brother always begins his vacations on a Saturday and he gets shut out more times than not. But he can drive a stick, a lucky tool to have. Alas I never will. I don't believe it matters which office of the car company you make the drop. It is the pickup office that is important.

I never understand the word "similar" to mean that another substitute would not be an automatic. To me it means that if they do not have and automatic in a Ford Focus they will have an automatic in a Opel Corsa.

I never start my vacation with the thought that I will not have a car waiting, although there are many other things I worry about. Just give it your best shot and good luck.

Interesting thread since I will probably soon be looking for a rental car somewhere in Tuscany for April. Never thought of not being able to pick up or return during "siesta" time or whatever it is in Italian. Am somewhat traumatized about the zones you can't drive through at given times and how you figure that out, though.

We haven't driven much in Europe but when we rented a car at Heathrow some years ago, we had to go through 3 upgrades after we got there to get an automatic. Naively thought we were getting a great deal - leather seats and all kinds of luxury for 200 pounds. That's until we got to our first old town with narrow streets, people parked half on the curb and half in the street, and a lorry coming at us from the other direction. Not something we'd want to do again. Luckily we didn't have to take a huge car in Cork to get automatic a couple of years ago because driving on the left and shifting gears with the "wrong" hand is a combination neither DH nor I want to try. And we didn't have any trouble getting automatics in Greece, once Athens airport and once in Iraklio downtown.

Driving stick is a useful skill to have but "fun"? I don't think so. DH and I parted with our last manual transmission over 30 years ago and good riddance we both say. I'm not sure I want to practice my rusty shifting skills on hills in Italy and I certainly wouldn't want hilly terrain to be where I first drove after learning the basics. A lot of it comes with experience. Also, you lose a lot if you don't do it for a few decades. I did drive stick around Rhodes a couple of days several years ago, but it wasn't any fun at all. DH drove something tiny (a Punto?) on Santorini the year before that and his size 12 feet didn't fit on the 3 wee pedals on the small floor. (Probably why he made me drive on Rhodes the next year.)

What I really wonder is why, after over 50 years, automatics don't seem to be catching on in Europe. The excuse used to be better gas mileage but that's no longer the case. And especially if your shifting skills are not up to par. Also, I read in car reviews from time to time that automatic transmissions are more reliable than manual on this car or that. And sometimes cheaper. Maybe I can kinda understand why young or even middle-aged guys like shifting gears with muscle cars, but otherwise, I just don't get it. What is with the Europeans? (I'm cranky because I have to pay more for automatics there.)

Well polly, my Dad taught me how to drive a stick when I got my license. It was an unsynchronized 3 speed in a 1964 1/2 Mustang one of the original 200000 that were made. The transmission survived and I still say driving a stick though the countryside is a blast. Now that some people would call me a middle aged LADY, I am still a very good stick driver.

Zoom, zoom!

polly229. Automatics are getting easier to find. They just do not have as many of them as they do stick shift cars. And they are more expensive.

I let go the irritation of having to pay for an automatic a long time ago. It is just something that I factor into the cost of a great vacation.

One just has to be be smart about where to rent and maybe when to rent. And I loved the tale about the narrow street. On our very first trip to Europe we were thrilled when we received a huge automatic. Those guys are still laughing at the stupid Americans. I remember trying to navigate those narrow streets in Spain. Oh well, I guess I can laugh about it now having to back out of that street!

Actually, our worst European driving experience was picking up the car in town in Iraklio and it occurred before the driving even started. But it gave us a bonding experience with the locals. The Avis lady walked across the street to a parking lot and began inspecting a new-looking car with a magnifying glass. Including - I kid you not - wiping off some smudges or maybe barely visible dust here and there with her hand. (Turns out the car had about 150 miles on it.) This set the stage for what was to come.

She handed DH the key and walked back to our office while we both surveyed the car and wondered how we were going to get it out of there. DH was able to squeeze in the 10-12" gap when I held the door open as far as it would go without touching the adjacent car. The cars were so crammed in that I served as driving director and stood by every car as DH pulled forwards or backwards, cutting and sawing his way out. "Ten inches. Six inches. Three inches, stop!" A couple of guys sitting in the steps at a nearby building came over and started making suggestions (in Greek). Then a couple more guys came in off the street and gave more suggestions. DH cut the wheels and moved a few inches, cut and moved a few more inches for what was probably 5 minutes (and seemed like an hour). By the time it was over there were about 6 or 7 streetside drivers offering advice. Finally got the pristine car out, still unscathed, and managed to get onto the street. (Okay, I lied about the Avis lady's magnifying glass but the rest was true.) We also turned in the car unblemished a few days later but worried the whole time, especially driving in Hania and trying to park in a slot about a foot longer than the car. Am thankful it was an automatic and we didn't have to worry about a stall and the accompanying little lurch (into a vehicle 2" away).

Oh, I believe you, Dayle, when you say you enjoy driving stick through the countryside. I just don't understand. I don't so much mind driving one on open roads, but open roads are such a small part of my driving and driving stick in town is such a pain. Thus, I was happy to dump the Mazda with stick in about 1980 - a car I never bought anyway, got with my marriage; somehow DH appropriated my automatic Falcon and I got stuck with shifting for the next five years.

Avis Italy usually have an automatic in the garage.

Sometimes it is also a way to an upgrade. Make the request and if confirmed hold them to it and dont backoff

Just take the insurance and feel assured that you have no problems.

No point in arguing with the credit card company that provides free part insurance if you have a small ding. They will probably want you to pay an excess anyway.

Formula 1 drivers dont play with stick shifts anymore and neither do I

I know they don't. I work with a guy who has a "side" business of selling "exotic" cars. Last time he had a Ferrari on hand, I begged to drive it. When he told me they now have the paddle shifters I was completely disillusioned!!! I didn't even want to drive it anymore. That's just WRONG.

Delighted for all of you who have used Auto Europe with no problems. We used them once and lost out on $700 in spite of the fact that we had pictures proving there was no damage when we dropped off the car.

Lady: >> We used them once and lost out on $700 in spite of the fact that we had pictures proving there was no damage when we dropped off the car.<<

Who did you actually get the car from? Autoeurope is simply a broker not a rental agency - so the car drop off/inspection was w/ some agency (Hertz/Avis/??), not @ Autoeurope.

Maybe, but the sign where we turned it in said Auto Europe so I pretty much hold them responsible. Sorry.

Lady: "Maybe, but the sign where we turned it in said Auto Europe so I pretty much hold them responsible. Sorry."

I very seriously doubt any sign said 'Autoeurope'. Autoeurope does not have any rental offices in Europe (or anywhere else for that matter)

Could it have been EuropeCar or AutoEuropa or something like that? It wasn't Autoeurope.

Maybe. It's been 8 years.

<<the sign where we turned it in said Auto Europe>>

No it didn't.

Lady: It is unfortunate you blamed Autoeurope for something they had nothing to do with . . .