Non Rev Stand by Nightmares?!
May 15th, 2005, 06:55 AM
#1
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Non Rev Stand by Nightmares?!
For those of you that are an airline employee or a friend or family member that have experienced difficulties getting to your destination you will appreciate this.
My boyfriend and I have been planning a trip to Turkey for months on a Delta F&F pass. Originally we were flying from Portland to Istanbul via Atlanta on May 20th. Everything looked good until 2 weeks ago! Now all the flights are oversold by 30+1!! As you know, you don't even attempt to fly stand-by when flights are this oversold.
We decided to fly to JFK and THAT looked good until a week ago. Check out our new revised plan to get to istanbul:
Flying out a day on May 18th on another airline due to full flights getting to JFK on May 19th.
May 18th depart Portland, OR at 3:30 on Southwest Airlines and arrive in Salt Lake City that evening.
May 18th Delta to JFK on the red eye arriving at 5:30 a.m. 13 hour layover in New York.
JFK to Amsterdam on Delta arriving at 8:30 a.m. 8 1/2 hour layover in AMS.
Corendon Air to Istanbul arriving at 9:40 at night, May 20th,two days after our departure from Portland!
Due to the fact that Corendon Air does not fly every day from Istanbul we are leaving Turkey 4 days early and staying in amsterdam for several days.
Obviously we are determined to get to Istanbul!
If you have similar nightmare stories please post them!
We will see if it is as much fun trying to get back!
My boyfriend and I have been planning a trip to Turkey for months on a Delta F&F pass. Originally we were flying from Portland to Istanbul via Atlanta on May 20th. Everything looked good until 2 weeks ago! Now all the flights are oversold by 30+1!! As you know, you don't even attempt to fly stand-by when flights are this oversold.
We decided to fly to JFK and THAT looked good until a week ago. Check out our new revised plan to get to istanbul:
Flying out a day on May 18th on another airline due to full flights getting to JFK on May 19th.
May 18th depart Portland, OR at 3:30 on Southwest Airlines and arrive in Salt Lake City that evening.
May 18th Delta to JFK on the red eye arriving at 5:30 a.m. 13 hour layover in New York.
JFK to Amsterdam on Delta arriving at 8:30 a.m. 8 1/2 hour layover in AMS.
Corendon Air to Istanbul arriving at 9:40 at night, May 20th,two days after our departure from Portland!
Due to the fact that Corendon Air does not fly every day from Istanbul we are leaving Turkey 4 days early and staying in amsterdam for several days.
Obviously we are determined to get to Istanbul!
If you have similar nightmare stories please post them!
We will see if it is as much fun trying to get back!
May 15th, 2005, 09:34 AM
#2
Not meaning to sound flip, because I am truly curious... what would a plane ticket for your trip cost with a normal and civilized itinerary?
They couldn't pay me enough to do all those flights and long airport layovers you describe.
They couldn't pay me enough to do all those flights and long airport layovers you describe.
May 15th, 2005, 09:43 AM
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I agree with you on this one, suze. Must be a student or someone with a lot of time on their hands to spare. I can't imagine losing two days of vacation just to try to get somewhere - with no idea when and how I'll be able to get back. You'd have to PAY ME to do this.
May 15th, 2005, 09:49 AM
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Call it temporary insanity, Suze!
The flight from PDX to Istanbul is about $390 round trip AND we would have flown first class if there were seats open. When we bought the tickets the flights were wide open. A week later they were completely oversold. We had considered buying a ticket but then realized we could get to JFK and then on to Amsterdam and puchace a cheap ticket from AMS to Istanbul because those flights looked good. Amsterdam was an appealing place to spend a few days because I have friends and relatives there.
During our 8 1/2 hr Amsterdam layover my friend is picking me up and we will hang out with him for the day.
Now, 3 days before we leave, the flights from PDX to JFK have filled up so we leave a day early on the red eye.
After doing some further research this morning I have found a Delta red eye from Portland to JFK via SLC so we now only fly on 2 airlines to get to Istanbul.
The trade off with the difficulty in getting there is that we fly first class. I hate flying coach all the way to Europe and 80% of the time I get bumped to 1st class.
Believe me, next year we will do it differently by flying off season rather than on the shoulder.
When we bought the Delta Friends and Family pass we were not told that Delta discontinued the code sharing on other airlines when flying on a pass. That really limits our choices.
I worked for an airline for 5 years so I know the ins and outs of space available travel. That helps a bit.
Cheers!
The flight from PDX to Istanbul is about $390 round trip AND we would have flown first class if there were seats open. When we bought the tickets the flights were wide open. A week later they were completely oversold. We had considered buying a ticket but then realized we could get to JFK and then on to Amsterdam and puchace a cheap ticket from AMS to Istanbul because those flights looked good. Amsterdam was an appealing place to spend a few days because I have friends and relatives there.
During our 8 1/2 hr Amsterdam layover my friend is picking me up and we will hang out with him for the day.
Now, 3 days before we leave, the flights from PDX to JFK have filled up so we leave a day early on the red eye.
After doing some further research this morning I have found a Delta red eye from Portland to JFK via SLC so we now only fly on 2 airlines to get to Istanbul.
The trade off with the difficulty in getting there is that we fly first class. I hate flying coach all the way to Europe and 80% of the time I get bumped to 1st class.
Believe me, next year we will do it differently by flying off season rather than on the shoulder.
When we bought the Delta Friends and Family pass we were not told that Delta discontinued the code sharing on other airlines when flying on a pass. That really limits our choices.
I worked for an airline for 5 years so I know the ins and outs of space available travel. That helps a bit.
Cheers!
May 15th, 2005, 09:58 AM
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Starrsville, given these two options which would you take:
1. Fly first class from Portland, OR to Amsterdam for less than $400, leaving at 4:55 on May 18th as opposed to leaving at 6:30 a.m. on May 19th (losing only the one night and 1/2 day in Istanbul on the other end.
2. Fly coach from Portland to Istanbul packed elbow to elbow with your knees crammed into the back of the seat in front of you for $2000 (I checked fares yesterday to see if that was an option).
If I had known two weeks ago that the flights would fill up at the last minute I wouldn't have done it this way. Given our options we have opted for the much more comfortable option.
Cheers!
1. Fly first class from Portland, OR to Amsterdam for less than $400, leaving at 4:55 on May 18th as opposed to leaving at 6:30 a.m. on May 19th (losing only the one night and 1/2 day in Istanbul on the other end.
2. Fly coach from Portland to Istanbul packed elbow to elbow with your knees crammed into the back of the seat in front of you for $2000 (I checked fares yesterday to see if that was an option).
If I had known two weeks ago that the flights would fill up at the last minute I wouldn't have done it this way. Given our options we have opted for the much more comfortable option.
Cheers!
May 15th, 2005, 10:05 AM
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So I don't understand....
Are there no seats AT ALL or no seats in First Class? For the rest of us, first class is a luxury we can only dream of. (No, wait, I once got a chance to use upgrade certifficates from Winnipeg to Vancouver. Ooh!)
This is the point at which some would make a sarcastic comment about no sympathy for people who get a (relatively (pun!)) free ride. However, in light of the recent United pension decision, and other trends in the airline employment industry... Go for it! Get what you can while you can! God knows it probably won't be there in a few years. You have my support and sympathy.
Air Canada is doing something similar to it's frequent flyers. They introduced "Avenue Rewards" - if the regular seats aren't available, there are a few more for 50% more points. Since either seat quantity is secret, I suspect it is a way to ease into a higher cost for reward travel; with the unfortunate side effect of making us all more cynical and less inclined to want or appreciate bonus travel.
Along with tricks like eliminating code-share, I have to wonder what else Delta is doing? Is it a case of airline passenger counts suddenly picking up dramatically - Is business looking up? Or, are the reduced seat numbers/overbooking a result of reducing the number flights (reducing costs)? If so, what did they plan to do with the 30+ people if most showed up, having paid full fare? If the next flights are full too, then I forsee a PR problem.
Are there no seats AT ALL or no seats in First Class? For the rest of us, first class is a luxury we can only dream of. (No, wait, I once got a chance to use upgrade certifficates from Winnipeg to Vancouver. Ooh!)
This is the point at which some would make a sarcastic comment about no sympathy for people who get a (relatively (pun!)) free ride. However, in light of the recent United pension decision, and other trends in the airline employment industry... Go for it! Get what you can while you can! God knows it probably won't be there in a few years. You have my support and sympathy.
Air Canada is doing something similar to it's frequent flyers. They introduced "Avenue Rewards" - if the regular seats aren't available, there are a few more for 50% more points. Since either seat quantity is secret, I suspect it is a way to ease into a higher cost for reward travel; with the unfortunate side effect of making us all more cynical and less inclined to want or appreciate bonus travel.
Along with tricks like eliminating code-share, I have to wonder what else Delta is doing? Is it a case of airline passenger counts suddenly picking up dramatically - Is business looking up? Or, are the reduced seat numbers/overbooking a result of reducing the number flights (reducing costs)? If so, what did they plan to do with the 30+ people if most showed up, having paid full fare? If the next flights are full too, then I forsee a PR problem.
May 15th, 2005, 10:15 AM
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eurotraveller, none of the above at this point because evidently this is too weird for me to follow.
Are you saying that YOU PAID $390 for tickets (or passes or whatever) that at present time will take two days to travel to your destination and you have no idea what the return arrangements might be?
You PAID money?
If so, I'll have to bow out of this conversation. You don't want to know my opinion.
Are you saying that YOU PAID $390 for tickets (or passes or whatever) that at present time will take two days to travel to your destination and you have no idea what the return arrangements might be?
You PAID money?
If so, I'll have to bow out of this conversation. You don't want to know my opinion.
May 15th, 2005, 10:21 AM
#9
Nevermind... I think I'm lost too. But I know it has something to do with how good it is to travel 1st class (of which I have no doubt!!).
I thought it was that for $390 you could have had a normal itinerary at some point in the process, but maybe that's not it either.
I thought it was that for $390 you could have had a normal itinerary at some point in the process, but maybe that's not it either.
May 15th, 2005, 10:36 AM
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I suspect it might help, mentally, to think of this as a relaxed trip to Istanbul, stopping along the way. Given the current state of airline finances I'm suprised that they are even selling those passes at all.
Have a wonderful trip. Istanbul is worth the effort IMO.
Have a wonderful trip. Istanbul is worth the effort IMO.
May 15th, 2005, 10:55 AM
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Starrville, It takes us a day and a half to get there no matter WHAT we do since we travel from the west coast.
As I said in the original post and as the title states, this is directed to other stand-by travellers that are pass riding.
We have never had trouble heading west bound and we are not terribly worried about what day we come back. I can think of worse things than staying a day or two longer in Amsterdam!
MD, there are no seats on the flights we had originally intended to fly, hence the reason we are flying the redy eye the night before we were scheduled to leave. On the flights we are now booked on there are lots of seats in coach and 1st class. Ahhh, Can't wait!
Cheers!
As I said in the original post and as the title states, this is directed to other stand-by travellers that are pass riding.
We have never had trouble heading west bound and we are not terribly worried about what day we come back. I can think of worse things than staying a day or two longer in Amsterdam!
MD, there are no seats on the flights we had originally intended to fly, hence the reason we are flying the redy eye the night before we were scheduled to leave. On the flights we are now booked on there are lots of seats in coach and 1st class. Ahhh, Can't wait!
Cheers!
May 15th, 2005, 11:07 AM
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Wow! At 10:55 you called it a "nightmare". Now, it appears I am being chastised for not understanding it's not a big deal after all.
Hmmm...guess this feeble mind really can't follow.
By the way, my feeble mind can't also find the reference that you find so clear - >> As I said in the original post and as the title states, this is directed to other stand-by travellers that are pass riding <<
Happy travels. If Intrepid1 says it's worth the effort, I'm sure it is. Enjoy Istanbul.
But, I am usually not this dense. Did you not say you are leaving a day earlier than plan and leaving Turkey 4 days earlier too?
I have had experience matching up my flight plans with someone traveling on free passes (taxes paid) so have some experience but never anything like this. Best of luck.
Hmmm...guess this feeble mind really can't follow.
By the way, my feeble mind can't also find the reference that you find so clear - >> As I said in the original post and as the title states, this is directed to other stand-by travellers that are pass riding <<
Happy travels. If Intrepid1 says it's worth the effort, I'm sure it is. Enjoy Istanbul.
But, I am usually not this dense. Did you not say you are leaving a day earlier than plan and leaving Turkey 4 days earlier too?
I have had experience matching up my flight plans with someone traveling on free passes (taxes paid) so have some experience but never anything like this. Best of luck.
May 15th, 2005, 12:07 PM
#14
When did Delta stop accepting code-shares? Even though I confess that I have started buying nearly all of my tickets due to standby nightmares of the sort (although a flight being oversold has never stopped me from trying and it very often works), I have often made a point of showing up for AF flights with DL flight numbers, because DL has atrocious service -- but good passes. Last time I took AF with a DL pass was about 2 years ago.
May 15th, 2005, 12:28 PM
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Delta lets its employees SELL passes? Used to work for United they fired people who tried that.
If you worked for an airline, you should be aware this is high season for any travel. And if you're not an employee now, you will be very far down on the stand-by list. And since 9/11, there are barely any seats empty on any plane. I think you or the person who supplied the passes have your heads up where the sun don't shine.
By the way, MD, when I worked for United I traveled first class a lot..standby. I don't think I would have attempted, even as an employee, what this person is trying. And believe me, employees do earn these perks. Each employee is given so many passes for friends. These people pay so much per mile (at United). Usually it's about what a coach ticket would cost. I have two passes a friend gave me but I would rather pay and have a confirmed seat. And I would never try to use these passes for Europe during high season!
If you worked for an airline, you should be aware this is high season for any travel. And if you're not an employee now, you will be very far down on the stand-by list. And since 9/11, there are barely any seats empty on any plane. I think you or the person who supplied the passes have your heads up where the sun don't shine.
By the way, MD, when I worked for United I traveled first class a lot..standby. I don't think I would have attempted, even as an employee, what this person is trying. And believe me, employees do earn these perks. Each employee is given so many passes for friends. These people pay so much per mile (at United). Usually it's about what a coach ticket would cost. I have two passes a friend gave me but I would rather pay and have a confirmed seat. And I would never try to use these passes for Europe during high season!
May 15th, 2005, 01:27 PM
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Hi Kerouak,
Apparently Delta stopped accepting code share in January. Prior to that, you could fly to Europe and hop on a few other carriers to get to your final destination. That isn't the case now, unfortunately.
HB, the employee didn't sell me the pass, Delta did and it is completely legal. I have flown every year in May to Europe and always gotten where I wanted to go. This year is more difficult because of the lack of code sharing.
I didn't start this thread to get flamed. I wanted to hear of creative routes from other pass riders.
As it stands, I am quite happy with my route and and if I can get bumped to 1st class it makes it all worth it! I don't mind going to plan b, c or d to get to my destination. I am a flexible traveller and I keep an open mind.
It is getting to hot in this thread so I am signing off.
Happy Trails!
Apparently Delta stopped accepting code share in January. Prior to that, you could fly to Europe and hop on a few other carriers to get to your final destination. That isn't the case now, unfortunately.
HB, the employee didn't sell me the pass, Delta did and it is completely legal. I have flown every year in May to Europe and always gotten where I wanted to go. This year is more difficult because of the lack of code sharing.
I didn't start this thread to get flamed. I wanted to hear of creative routes from other pass riders.
As it stands, I am quite happy with my route and and if I can get bumped to 1st class it makes it all worth it! I don't mind going to plan b, c or d to get to my destination. I am a flexible traveller and I keep an open mind.
It is getting to hot in this thread so I am signing off.
Happy Trails!
May 15th, 2005, 02:17 PM
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The passes are called "Friends" and family LOL. DL employees can give them to anyone and then you pay for the flight.
I have used them, but only domestically (I don't have the flexiblity for International travel)
DL does have guranteed space tickets, but you have to be pretty senior to have one (and maybe they don't even give them anymore, my source is retired)
I have used them, but only domestically (I don't have the flexiblity for International travel)
DL does have guranteed space tickets, but you have to be pretty senior to have one (and maybe they don't even give them anymore, my source is retired)
May 16th, 2005, 06:30 PM
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Whoever the Delta Employee was to get you a Family and Friends ticket will probably be sorry he or she did. You are putting that person's job in jeopardy. The first thing one learns about traveling on a pass or reduced rate ticket is keep a low profile, keep your mouth shut, and don't make waves. What you received is a privilege not a right. Also you don't plan a trip during high travel periods. If you don't like the rules and inconviences that may arise, buy a regular ticket and not embarrass the people who appreciate the pass benefits. Also, if you have not read the rules concerning pass riding, you should do so. The employee will be held responsible for the actions and behavior of the "guest pass rider" and non-compliance with Delta's non revenue policy and procedures can adversely affect the status of the employee. So, don't look a gift horse in the mouth and keep a low profile.
May 17th, 2005, 05:06 PM
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"HB, the employee didn't sell me the pass, Delta did and it is completely legal"
I still don't think I understand. Did the Friend and Family pass come from an employee's ration or can "civilians" (don't know a better word) buy a F&F pass directly from Delta?
If so, how does one do that?
My experiences were with someone flying on American family passes years ago. Things were tight then. I would imagine things would be more difficult now in these very lean (unprofitable) years.
I still don't think I understand. Did the Friend and Family pass come from an employee's ration or can "civilians" (don't know a better word) buy a F&F pass directly from Delta?
If so, how does one do that?
My experiences were with someone flying on American family passes years ago. Things were tight then. I would imagine things would be more difficult now in these very lean (unprofitable) years.
