Netherlands, Spain, France, Italy....realistic food budget?
Dec 27th, 2013, 11:38 AM
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Netherlands, Spain, France, Italy....realistic food budget?
So, it's close to a month away...but my boyfriend and I are traveling to Europe for two months. We leave February 1st and return home March 31st. Thankfully, all of the really difficult planning is over! All of our lodging accommodations are set and paid for. While in France, we are staying with family friends for two weeks. The rest of the trip we are staying in apartments that all have full kitchens.
So my question is, what do you think is a realistic food budget for while we are there?
We got the apartments so that we could save money by cooking our own meals, but we obviously want to be able to go out and have dinner and try some of the local cuisines. I've done some research on how much we should spend on food and such, but every one tells me something vastly different from the other. Now that it's only a month away, we just want to see how much extra money we should be striving to put into our bank accounts!
We're traveling to Amsterdam (one week), Paris (one week), Beaune (one week), Barcelona (one week), Venice (3 nights), Bologna (4 nights), Cinque Terre (3 nights), Florence (one week), Rome (one week), and Amalfi Coast (5 nights).
Thank you for your help!
So my question is, what do you think is a realistic food budget for while we are there?
We got the apartments so that we could save money by cooking our own meals, but we obviously want to be able to go out and have dinner and try some of the local cuisines. I've done some research on how much we should spend on food and such, but every one tells me something vastly different from the other. Now that it's only a month away, we just want to see how much extra money we should be striving to put into our bank accounts!
We're traveling to Amsterdam (one week), Paris (one week), Beaune (one week), Barcelona (one week), Venice (3 nights), Bologna (4 nights), Cinque Terre (3 nights), Florence (one week), Rome (one week), and Amalfi Coast (5 nights).
Thank you for your help!
Dec 27th, 2013, 12:07 PM
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It really depends on what you want to eat and how much you can afford to pay.
For example, I've seen signs outside small restaurants, offering breakfast for somewhere between 8 and 12 Euros each in Paris. But you could easily have breakfast in your apartment for under 5 Euro total for both of you.
Lunch can be as cheap as a pre-made sandwich for under 5 Euro each. Or you could go to a restaurant and pay between 10 and 30 Euro each.
Dinner can be something you bought cheap in a supermarket and cooked in the apartment, for under 10 Euro. Or a sit-down dinner in a higher-class restaurant could cost over a 100 Euro.
These prices don't include alcohol, because I have no idea what that would cost, since I almost never drink any.
Fortunately, most restaurants (as far as I can remember from my trips to those countries) will have menues with prices outside.
For two persons, eating breakfast in the apartment and a cheap lunch, I'd say budget for an absolute minimum of 50 Euro each day, that's for both of you, without alcohol.
For example, I've seen signs outside small restaurants, offering breakfast for somewhere between 8 and 12 Euros each in Paris. But you could easily have breakfast in your apartment for under 5 Euro total for both of you.
Lunch can be as cheap as a pre-made sandwich for under 5 Euro each. Or you could go to a restaurant and pay between 10 and 30 Euro each.
Dinner can be something you bought cheap in a supermarket and cooked in the apartment, for under 10 Euro. Or a sit-down dinner in a higher-class restaurant could cost over a 100 Euro.
These prices don't include alcohol, because I have no idea what that would cost, since I almost never drink any.
Fortunately, most restaurants (as far as I can remember from my trips to those countries) will have menues with prices outside.
For two persons, eating breakfast in the apartment and a cheap lunch, I'd say budget for an absolute minimum of 50 Euro each day, that's for both of you, without alcohol.
Dec 27th, 2013, 03:30 PM
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@anyegr is spot on with the pricing for food. In the morning, you could have an espresso and a light snack in a cafe, which would rarely be more than 5 Euro. And you can easily get a light lunch for under 10 Euro. For dinner, if you're eating in a nice, but not high-end, local restaurant expect to pay 70-80 Euros including wine. In Spain, where tapas is the norm, dinners can be much cheaper.
Wine can be purchased at almost any price point in Europe -- but for quality wine expect to pay around of 12-22 Euros in a shop, or 20-34 Euros in a restaurant. You can of course pay more, but you should be able to find a good, quality wine in that range.
Have a great trip!
Wine can be purchased at almost any price point in Europe -- but for quality wine expect to pay around of 12-22 Euros in a shop, or 20-34 Euros in a restaurant. You can of course pay more, but you should be able to find a good, quality wine in that range.
Have a great trip!
Dec 27th, 2013, 04:26 PM
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If you're from the US (not NYC), then as a rule of thumb, multiply by 1.5 what you would spend at home for food that you take to your lodgings, and multiply by 2 when you eat out.
Also note that taking restaurant left-overs home ("doggie bag") is not happening, and diner-style restaurants with huge portions at very low prices are not happening either, nor are the round-the-clock diners you may be used to. But you will save a lot on tipping, it is just about non-existent in Europe.
Also note that taking restaurant left-overs home ("doggie bag") is not happening, and diner-style restaurants with huge portions at very low prices are not happening either, nor are the round-the-clock diners you may be used to. But you will save a lot on tipping, it is just about non-existent in Europe.
Dec 27th, 2013, 04:28 PM
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In Barcelona, do as most locals and have a bargain three course meal at lunchtime. Plenty of places outside the most touristy areas offer a three course today's "menu del día" with drinks included for some 8-12€.
I can highly recommend l'Aribau in Carrer d'Aribau, 3. On a corner close to the university from 1450. Here businesspeople, academics and all kinds of locals drop in for a three course lunch for 8,60€ (before 14, 9,60€ after 14h). Salad or today's soup, grilled meat or fish with poatatoes/vegetables and dessert. Excellent place with lots of Catalan specialities. http://barcelona.salir.com/laribau
http://www.tripadvisor.com/ShowUserR...Catalonia.html
I can highly recommend l'Aribau in Carrer d'Aribau, 3. On a corner close to the university from 1450. Here businesspeople, academics and all kinds of locals drop in for a three course lunch for 8,60€ (before 14, 9,60€ after 14h). Salad or today's soup, grilled meat or fish with poatatoes/vegetables and dessert. Excellent place with lots of Catalan specialities. http://barcelona.salir.com/laribau
http://www.tripadvisor.com/ShowUserR...Catalonia.html
Dec 28th, 2013, 12:31 AM
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It will vary considerably. To give an example.
Coffee in a bar, in Amsterdam will be around 4€ and in Spain will be around 1.5€
France somewhere in between and I cannot remember what it was in Venice the last time I was there, but it is more expensive than here in Spain.
Coffee in a bar, in Amsterdam will be around 4€ and in Spain will be around 1.5€
France somewhere in between and I cannot remember what it was in Venice the last time I was there, but it is more expensive than here in Spain.
Dec 28th, 2013, 04:54 AM
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Just about double what you'd pay in restaurants back home - not only is there a sky-high VAT usually - 20% or more added on restaurant workers get paid a decent wage with benefits - all boosts the cost of a meal - McDonalds cost about twice as much for that reason - ditto other restaurants and do not tip if it says Service Included! - that means 15% or so is automatically added on to your bill for a mandatory service charge - Europeans may leave a few small chain but never tip in ordinary restaurants.
Supermarket prices are also higher but not so much - you can eat cheaply - supermarkets also have deli take out fare if you do not want to cook but eat nice prepared foods.
Supermarket prices are also higher but not so much - you can eat cheaply - supermarkets also have deli take out fare if you do not want to cook but eat nice prepared foods.
Dec 28th, 2013, 06:23 AM
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<do not tip if it says Service Included!>
Very normal to leave a tip at restaurants in Spain, not the US way, but some 5-10% is not uncommon. http://www.tripadvisor.com/Travel-g1...Etiquette.html
http://www.studybarcelona.com/spain-...al-customs.php
Very normal to leave a tip at restaurants in Spain, not the US way, but some 5-10% is not uncommon. http://www.tripadvisor.com/Travel-g1...Etiquette.html
http://www.studybarcelona.com/spain-...al-customs.php
Dec 28th, 2013, 07:38 AM
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But tipping in not required as it is in the U.s. as wait people do not depend on it for their wages - I admit to mot being as familiar with Spain and Spanish customs as the other three countries so I'll take what kimhe says over what I don't know - about Spain but other countries perhaps a few coins - my French in-laws even refuse that often - not refuse but they just say no need to - 'why waste your money' - not sure that they represent everyone however.
Dec 28th, 2013, 08:38 AM
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I travel for longish periods in Europe and generally I budget about 40 euros per day (just for me) for food and drink. In Paris this means eating in a lot - but you can get fantastic cheese, pate, veggies etc at the outdoor markets and easily stay within budget. In Italy, you can eat a really great meal in a local osteria for 25 euros if you order the house wine and if you do pizza it is even less. Then on a splurge day, you can spend 40-50 euros per person for a blow out meal.
What you should do is, figure out what you have to spend on food and drink per day, then make a budget and stick to it. If one day you only spend 10 euros eating your meals in then the next day you can splurge and go out.
As for VAT it is not 20% for restaurants in many countries but since it is included in the price you aren't in for any hidden surprises in that regard. If a restaurant is adding a 15% service charge, it should be apparent on the menu.
I find eating out in Europe a much better value than in my home town of San Diego, but I am a wine drinker and that is a big factor in the equation! Depending on where you are from you may be pleasantly surprised, cost-wise.
What you should do is, figure out what you have to spend on food and drink per day, then make a budget and stick to it. If one day you only spend 10 euros eating your meals in then the next day you can splurge and go out.
As for VAT it is not 20% for restaurants in many countries but since it is included in the price you aren't in for any hidden surprises in that regard. If a restaurant is adding a 15% service charge, it should be apparent on the menu.
I find eating out in Europe a much better value than in my home town of San Diego, but I am a wine drinker and that is a big factor in the equation! Depending on where you are from you may be pleasantly surprised, cost-wise.
Dec 28th, 2013, 09:51 PM
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michael wrote: "note that taking restaurant left-overs home ("doggie bag") is not happening"
I have a tangential question regarding left-overs. I have a lap band (a device that makes my stomach smaller, so I am full much sooner than others). I eat 1/2-1 cup of food at a sitting. I'm wondering if the "doggie bag" thing in France and England, particularly (since that's where I'm going), is simply about packaging (ie., the restaurant doesn't want and/or have the resources to package leftovers) or if it is seen as unmannerly.
I had thought of bringing a small tiffin (1-2 cup container) in case I was served too much for my particular needs (I would *hate* to leave duck breast sitting on a plate - I could eat it for breakfast, lunch, and dinner!), but I don't want to do so if it is considered to be poor etiquette.
I'm traveling with three other people who have typical appetites.
I have a tangential question regarding left-overs. I have a lap band (a device that makes my stomach smaller, so I am full much sooner than others). I eat 1/2-1 cup of food at a sitting. I'm wondering if the "doggie bag" thing in France and England, particularly (since that's where I'm going), is simply about packaging (ie., the restaurant doesn't want and/or have the resources to package leftovers) or if it is seen as unmannerly.
I had thought of bringing a small tiffin (1-2 cup container) in case I was served too much for my particular needs (I would *hate* to leave duck breast sitting on a plate - I could eat it for breakfast, lunch, and dinner!), but I don't want to do so if it is considered to be poor etiquette.
I'm traveling with three other people who have typical appetites.
Dec 28th, 2013, 11:45 PM
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In places like curry houses or pizza places in London you can ask them to package it up - basically these places have the containers to do it.
I dont think regular type restaurants would have anything for you to take the items home in - doggy bags are just not done here frequently. Some places it's a hygiene thing I have been told.
Bringing your own container would certainly be a strange thing to do. Could you do it - probably but be sure you are discreet as you may get some very odd looks. In higher end places I would feel awkward about it. It is definitely not the norm and some might say poor etiquette.
I dont think regular type restaurants would have anything for you to take the items home in - doggy bags are just not done here frequently. Some places it's a hygiene thing I have been told.
Bringing your own container would certainly be a strange thing to do. Could you do it - probably but be sure you are discreet as you may get some very odd looks. In higher end places I would feel awkward about it. It is definitely not the norm and some might say poor etiquette.
Dec 29th, 2013, 01:38 AM
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Unfortunately food thrown out in restaurants doesn't feed the pigs any more. They are not allowed to be fed food waste. Such a shame!
I think if you take your own container you could surreptitiously move some of your food into it. Alternatively ask for a small portion, or go for a starter as a main.
As for tipping a 10% tip is common in the Netherlands, not essential, but common. The same in Spain, and we also tip in France, at around that figure, for a restaurant meal. In cafés generally just round up the price to a convenient number of whole euro.
Buying food from supermarkets is cheaper of course, but it depends on the supermarket to some extent.
You will not find many deli take out meals in Dutch supermarkets. You need to budget more for food in the Netherlands than the other countries you are visiting.
VAT, at around 20%, sometimes more, sometimes less is always included in the price quoted. There is no nasty surprises in that regard, what you see is what you pay, unlike in the US where you get quoted a price and then get assorted sales taxes, local and state added on.
I think if you take your own container you could surreptitiously move some of your food into it. Alternatively ask for a small portion, or go for a starter as a main.
As for tipping a 10% tip is common in the Netherlands, not essential, but common. The same in Spain, and we also tip in France, at around that figure, for a restaurant meal. In cafés generally just round up the price to a convenient number of whole euro.
Buying food from supermarkets is cheaper of course, but it depends on the supermarket to some extent.
You will not find many deli take out meals in Dutch supermarkets. You need to budget more for food in the Netherlands than the other countries you are visiting.
VAT, at around 20%, sometimes more, sometimes less is always included in the price quoted. There is no nasty surprises in that regard, what you see is what you pay, unlike in the US where you get quoted a price and then get assorted sales taxes, local and state added on.
Dec 29th, 2013, 04:49 AM
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The same in Spain, and we also tip in France, at around that figure, for a restaurant meal>
this would be anathema to my French in-laws and many French and they IMe frown on it - why give an extra 10% to wait people already getting a decent wage - do you tip the train conductor, museum attendants, tourist office clerks, etc.
Not sure about other countries but an sure that only clueless foreigners tip 10% above the service charge of 15-20% in France - I guess if you got money to throw away...
this would be anathema to my French in-laws and many French and they IMe frown on it - why give an extra 10% to wait people already getting a decent wage - do you tip the train conductor, museum attendants, tourist office clerks, etc.
Not sure about other countries but an sure that only clueless foreigners tip 10% above the service charge of 15-20% in France - I guess if you got money to throw away...
Dec 29th, 2013, 05:25 AM
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It depends very much on the restaurant Pal. In France we probably tip less it's true - rounding the bill to a convenient figure. We rarely eat out in France though.
Just because staff get a living wage doesn't mean you can't show your appreciation for good food and good service. At least it is voluntary unlike the compulsory tip in the US, regardless of how awful food and service are, or how fast they force you to eat so they can get another bum on the seat, and another huge tip.
Just because staff get a living wage doesn't mean you can't show your appreciation for good food and good service. At least it is voluntary unlike the compulsory tip in the US, regardless of how awful food and service are, or how fast they force you to eat so they can get another bum on the seat, and another huge tip.
Dec 29th, 2013, 05:50 AM
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I think humanness and good sense should always trump "good manners" so if your eating issues make it otherwise necessary for you to leave 3/4 of what you are served on your plate and you can find a way to discreetly take all or some of it with you without requiring the restaurant to go "out of its way" to accommodate you or embarrassing your fellow diners to death, you should surely do so.
We were privileged to know Maurice Naughton, a delightful fellow from Flint, Michigan, who posted here and especially on Chowhound and who chose to live out his later years as much as possible in Paris. Whenever we visited we made a point to look him up and take him to a nice lunch. He traveled with a back pack from which he would take out his baggies at the end of a meal and scoop up his leftovers to take with him. Living as well as possible on a pension required such actions and he simply said without apology or fanfare "It's not that I'm cheap, I'm poor." No reason to forego whatever reasonable pleasures you can obtain from life to "keep up appearances." Take that duck with you. Enjoy it all.
We were privileged to know Maurice Naughton, a delightful fellow from Flint, Michigan, who posted here and especially on Chowhound and who chose to live out his later years as much as possible in Paris. Whenever we visited we made a point to look him up and take him to a nice lunch. He traveled with a back pack from which he would take out his baggies at the end of a meal and scoop up his leftovers to take with him. Living as well as possible on a pension required such actions and he simply said without apology or fanfare "It's not that I'm cheap, I'm poor." No reason to forego whatever reasonable pleasures you can obtain from life to "keep up appearances." Take that duck with you. Enjoy it all.
Dec 29th, 2013, 07:41 AM
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hetismij - do you tip when you get a take out at FEBO and such - just curious as it seems you should and maybe I should and have been not doing so by mistake?
Or is it only 'good' food service that deserves a tip?
Or is it only 'good' food service that deserves a tip?
