sonja415

I am planning a 6 or 7 week trip to europe. I have never been. I'm taking my daughter who'll be 11 when we go in June '07. This trip is pretty much her idea she's been begging since she was 3. I'm planning to go to Greece, Italy, London, France (Paris), Spain (Barcelona) and Morocco.

I'm trying to decide which country would be the best to fly into to start the trip and given the countries what would be the best way to plan the itinerary?

So far I know I'll use a eruorail pass and was thinking of taking a ferry or boat from Greece to Italy or vice versa. I'm also thinking of saving Barcelona for last and meeting up with my sister there and taking the ferry over to Morocco for a couple of days and flying home from Barcelona.

I haven't planned a trip this big before so I'm looking for any tips or suggestions. I'm also doing searches the forums here.

TIA,
M.

LindaL

Wow! I'm jealous. Most people agree that the best way to go if you have never been is to fly into London. Numero uno reason is the language is understandable!! Second reason - shorter flight. I would spend a week in London, then take the Chunnel to Paris and spend a week there. Do a search on these boards, buy some travel guides (or check them out of the library). You want to go to a lot of places and need to decide what your priorities are. The other situation is taking an 11 year old for a long period of time into unfamiliar territory. She needs to be a part of the planning process. Why has she been begging you from age 3 to go to Europe? What does she want to see? Italy is huge with lots to see. Limit your time there to a couple of weeks and don't overdo it. It's easy to do that - I did the first time I went!!

sonja415

LindaL thanks for the reply. My daughter has wanted to go to Europe ever since my brother came back telling her all about the great time he had, all the things he saw. She simply loves to travel. She loves to learn languages, even if it's just basic pleasantries. She actually picked most of the countries for our trip.
I am going to get some travel guides, and continue to search here. I'm trying to figure out the best way to make it happen. Is there a reasonable way to do it? My priorities for now are :
France, Paris
Italy, Venice and maybe Rome
UK, London
Spain, Barcelona
Greece and Morocco I'm not sure about yet.
Once again Thanks,
M.

janisj

6 weeks (or even 7) may sound like a long time - but it isn't when you are trying to visit 6 countries on 2 continents.

My very first question - you want to take an 11 year old to Morocco -- in the middle of summer? Why? It will be hot enough in Spain but in Morocco it will be <b>extremely</b> hot and Morocco really isn't a &quot;couple of days&quot; sort of place.

A typical Itinerary (1 week in the UK, 1 week in Paris, 2+ weeks in Italy) plus all the travel between places only leaves you about 1.5 - 2 total weeks for Greece and Spain. Unless Greece is a major reason for the trip, I'd drop it. and I'd drop Morocco too.

Think about open jaw into London and out of Barcelona (or Madrid) and something like 10 days in the UK (7 in London and 3 in the countryside somewhere), 7 days in Paris, 2.5 weeks in Italy (Rome/Venice/Florence and one add'l &quot;rural-ish&quot; place) and a week in Spain. When you include travel days this works out to about 6.5 weeks.

This is only one itinerary out of MANY options - just to get you started thinking . . . .

LoveItaly

Hi sonja, I can understand how your daughter has wanted to go to Europe since she was just a little one. So did I thanks to family members from Europe and so many close friends that were also. It is amazing what children pick up. Their minds are like sponges.

I would agree London would be a good city to fly to first for the reasons stated. I would suggest that if you have time for Rome I would think your daughter would really enjoy it. And the Borghese Gardens are a nice place to wander around in when one wants some greenery and serenity.

Have fun planning this trip. And if your daughter is like most youngsters she is no doubt very computer savy. You could have her start doing some research regarding this trip. I would imagine that would be fun for her and this project would add to the excitment. Best regards.

travelerjan

Sonja this is a wonderful adventure you are embarking on. My Basic advice is -- don't stint on guidebooks. To start with the &quot;Eyewitness Guides&quot; are VERY good for visuals &amp; first overview... Eyewitness guides to London, Paris, Rome, Greek Isles. You don't take those along... load up on guides at the library and find which ones suit you best; right amount of history/culture/sightseeing guidance plus lodging/meals tips. Those are what you buy... it always baffles me that some people are willing to spend $10,000 on a trip but begrudge spending $25-$50 for valuable guidebooks. When you've read a bit about your target destinations, you will know better question to ask -- and we'll try to answer them. There are really expert folks on this forum... I'm just the greek geek. It's refreshing to hear someone planning a year ahead instead of the &quot;We leave next week, what shall we see?&quot; We look forward to your questions;

LindaL

I agree with janisj. I would skip Morocco. I would tend to spend a few more days in France visiting the Loire Valley and the beautiful chateaus. I think an 11 year old young lady would love to see them, particularly Chenonceau. If your daughter likes Harry Potter she may want to visit some of the places in England where the movies were filmed.

nessundorma

If you can keep to northern Italy (no Rome) and skip Greece and Morocco, you've got a doable trip.

It would be better to go to Spain first, because that is the hottest spot on your itinerary and June is cooler than August.

Fly to Barcelona, train through France and Italy to Venice (with stops along the way), train to Paris (tour Switzerland en route to Paris?), train to London (stop in Belgium on the way?), fly home.

Or do it backwards if your sister can't meet you until the end.

In France, it might be more fun to go part of the way along the southern coast from Spain, but then head up to Lyon and take a train from there to Torino, and then on to Venice. In between, stop in Milan and/or Verona, or one of the Italian lakes. (Does your daughter like amusement parks? Try Lago di Garda. Or she might like the Borromeo Islands in Lago Maggiore).

You could also go from France to Genova and then down to the Cinque Terre, across to Pisa, then up to Venice -- but it will be hot and crowded in summer, and that's an awful lot of Mediterranean scenery if you start in Barcelona.

ira

Hi S,

DO NOT buy a railpass until you have entered your itinerary at www.railsaver.com and clicked &quot;only if it saves money&quot;.

Also note that children until 12 ride at reduced fare.

There are also discount fares from the French (www.voyages-sncf.com) and Italian (www.trenitalia.com) rail companies.

&gt;My priorities for now are :
France, Paris
Italy, Venice and maybe Rome
UK, London
Spain, Barcelona...&lt;

Much improved.

&gt;I'm taking my daughter who'll be 11 ...&lt;

You might want to think about being on the road for 6 weeks with a child. It will be very wearing for her (and you).

I suggest:

Fly into London - 1 week

Take the Eurostar to Paris - 1 week
(The cheapest fares are 1-day RT tickets)

There are overnight trains from Paris to both Venice and Rome.

You can also fly www.myair.com from Paris ORY to Venice VCE.

You can split 14 days in Italy among Venice, Florence and Rome.

If you want to extend your visit, you might want to continue to (or start from) Spain.

I'm not sure that I would suggest renting a car for a week in Tuscany, the Dordogne or Provence to a first-time visitor.

Some helpful threads:

Helpful Information: Italy 2
http://www.fodors.com/forums/threads...p;tid=34568596

Paris Superthread
http://www.fodors.com/forums/threads...p;tid=34519236

100 Great Things to Do in Paris
http://fodors.com/forums/threadselec...mp;tid=1277898

Degas’s Paris Walks
http://fodors.com/forums/threadselec...p;tid=34712768

Ira Does France
http://fodors.com/forums/threadselec...p;tid=34676645

Ira’s Trip Report (Italy)
http://www.fodors.com/forums/threads...p;tid=34451044

Have fun planning your visit.

rex

For my contrarian view - - of why <i><b>not</b></i> to spend six weeks on your first trip ever to Europe... see http://www.fodors.com/forums/threads...p;tid=34667484

Best wishes,

Rex

nessundorma

ira's plan is a good one because it would allow you to rent apartments, which would not only be a money saver but would allow for some meals in and doing laundry.

But I saw go for the whole six weeks. The time will fly! One week London, one week Paris, one week Venice, one week Siena, one week Rome and one week Barcelona. (Or vice versa.)

Get air conditioning wherever you go.

chicagolori

My only comment is that you have focused mainly on big cities and are missing the smaller towns and countryside. Maybe because I live in downtown Chicago, but I get tired of too much big city and prefer to stay in more countryside charming village type places. And you might want to include seaside locations for some down time and general relaxation.

nessundorma

chicagolori,

It's possible to do day trips to the beach from Venice (Lido), Rome (Fregene) and of course Barcelona is on the sea. With a one week stay in each place, it is easy to make time for day trips to the countryside by train or bus from all these cities.

Also, unlike most American cities, European cities have magnificent parks and retain quaint and historic quarters. I realize that is not the same as a charming country village, but a trip up Hampstead for a picnic (with a swim in the pond and tea at Kenwood?) could be a pretty nifty way to spend an afternoon in London; likewise a boat trip down the Thames to Hampton Court.

GBC

You will be gifting your daughter with a marvelous travel experience - especially since you have an entire year to research and plan it. I'm thinking that if I were taking someone 11 years old on her first trip to Europe I might start with a plan like this:

Barcelona - begin here. The family connection will make it comfortable and, as has been pointed out above, it is the warmest place on your itinerary.

Greece - fly here and work westward. I would think of three days in Athens (the Acropolis will be unforgetable for anyone, especially an 11 year old.) The remaining four days fly to Santorini. Another unique experience.

Italy - two weeks. Four or five days in Rome, four or five days in Tuscany or Umbria with an auto or bus trip into the countryside, four days in Venice.

Paris - one week which will fly by. If you can, consider a guide to help you get the most from this wonderful city.

London - one week. You'll both be tired and the comfort with the language will be appreciated. Be sure to include the V &amp; A.

That totals to about six weeks. Add on some travel time and you've got seven weeks. Have a great trip.

sonja415

Thank you, thank you, thank you for the replies. The only places I picked were Greece and Morocco. I thought to spend a night or two in Morocco, but that's what planning is all about.
Thanks once again for all the info. I'm going to see what guide books my library has.

M.

PalQ

For such questions i like to refer folks to a free publication, the European Planning &amp; Rail Guide that will be very helpful to you and it's free (www.budgeteuropetravel.com and request it on their home page) - it has a chapter on each country, rail maps on each country, fare charts, packing advice, etc. - a wealth of info. I also like www.ricksteves.com for his rail info and advice and www.euraide.com.

sandper

Sonja
You've received several suggestions about first to London and taking the Eurostar to Paris-I agree!!that's 2 weeks-but then I would go someplace for one week-lyon,Provence-a swiss village-away from a big city-get your bearings-wash your clothes-go to markets-have picnics-relax and try to meet people.Then Italy and spain-even Portugal-I would not include Greece in this trip-it is vast-and islands are wonderful but Greece requires more than a week or 10 days-just to get around.Italy and Spain-Florence-Venice,Sorrento-Rome is lovely and so much to see-I know you will have a great trip.This is a good sight to check things out. sandper

sonja415

Once again thanks everyone, I'm getting a lot of feed back to drop Greece for this trip. I posted here and on another site. Flying into London sounds good and probably what I'll do.
Also the suggestion of going to Switzerland, since I'll already be on the train to Paris, makes more sense then trying to figure out a way to Greece.
Maybe Greece will be a trip by itself.

Thanks,
M.

kmh7

sonja415, I do not have as much experience as most of the responders, however we went to Europe last year with 4 young adults ages 14, 16, 17 and 21. We only had the pleasure of 4 weeks. The things we were anticipating they would love were not the things that were their favorites. Lets face it even the most sophisticated kids don't think like we do!! Their very most favorite was Switzerland which was a 2 day only afterthought. They loved our &quot;down time &quot; at the beach. (Cinque Terra) They loved Venice and Rome. We had a villa in Tuscany for a week and that was a little boring for them. You can not move them too fast or too far in any one day. I think it is important to get your daughter involved in the planning. We gave each kid a city and they were so excited when it was their turn to share. Good luck with your journey, I wish we could re-do ours. This is precious time with your child. kmh7