FerrisFar

Hello,

As our trip approaches, my friend and I are investigating the different options for visiting the various places we want to see in London and surrounding areas economically and conveniently. We will be in London for 8 nights, which is 7 full days (We arrive one evening and have 7 full days and leave on the day after that.)

On the first night, I'd like some kind of evening sightseeing tour, and would welcome suggestions. (We'll be in the Kensington/Earl's Court area.)

For the next three days, we are now considering the London Pass and would like feedback on how long various things will take so we can decide if it would be a good deal.

The things we want to do that are covered by the London Pass are

The Tower
Wesminster Abbey
St Paul
Shakespeare's Globe (tour)
Churchill War Rooms.

The price of all of these adds up to just a little under 82 pounds. The 2 day pass is 64 pounds. The 3 day pass is 77 pounds.

So it would seem that the London pass is a good deal IF we can reasonable see all of these things in two or three days. Is this realistic?

I was thinking Tower, Westminster one day, St Paul's and museums (free) another day and the Globe and the War rooms a third day, with time in between going from one place to another for lunch and so forth.

If it could be done in two days, how would you do it? If it needs more than 3 days, why is that?

One thing I like about the London Pass is that it does avoid the lines at the Tower and Westminster Abbey. But I am unclear why one needs a ticket to Westminster Abbey and St. Paul's. Can't one just go into the churches without a ticket? (Aren't they still used for worship?)

Anyway, if we assume that we'll do the above in 3 days, the rest of our seven days would go like this:

A fourth day of our trip would be devoted to Greenwich and the Cutty Sark (my friend's big object) in the morning and museums in the afternoon. A fifth day would be some sort of day trip that would include Bath. I am torn between just getting on the train and doing the trip on our own and getting on one of the day tours with a motor coach and guide. (If we did, I'd want at least 3 hours in Bath.) I have been to Stonehenge twice but my friend has never been and I think he would enjoy it. Any thoughts?

We are still discussing what to do on the other two days. I think at least one should be for enjoying London and the museums with the other maybe being a day trip. There is a "package" that includes Oxford and Cambridge that might be good, or there is another that includes Dover, Canterbury, etc. Or we could just take the trains and explore.

Any thoughts?

I'd particularly like advice on the London Pass and also tours versus trains.

Also regarding public transportation, I keep reading conflicting views about the value of a travel card, an oyster card, etc. I've followed most of the links, but I'd like first hand experience/suggestions.

Thanks!

F

jamikins

Quick response - there is a charge to get into Westminster Abbey and St Paul's.

Check out www.daysoutguide.co.uk for 2 for 1 deals and do a search here for tonnes of info - will likely make the London pass seem like a waste of money.

PalenQ

I'd particularly like advice on the London Pass and also tours versus trains.>

Having done Bath as a day trip from London several times I can say it is really easy and most major sites are clustered in a compact eminently walkable area - a few like the Sham Castle are a bit out of town and are interesting so I would try to spend most of the day there. 3 hours would be touching the proverbial tip of the proverbial ice berg.

Head right to the Bath TIC Tourist Information Centre upon arrival - was by the cathedral and close to the train station last time I was there - pick up a walking tour map and see if there is any all-inclusive tickets, etc. They also offer walking tours led by elderly local residents (when I've taken them or seen them - a so-called Blue Badge volunteer - Blue Badge meaning they've passed some competency tests I guess.

For train info be sure to check www.nationalaril.co.uk way in advance and see if you can score discounted tickets though these usually come with restrictions on changes or refunds so give yourself enough time in Bath (though not too much!) - Full fare can be much much higher on a walk up basis. Trains leave from Paddington station I believe though currently some rail construction in the Reading area is altering train routes and stations.

For lots on British trains check out www.seat61`.com; www.ricksteves.com and www.budgeteuropetravel.com. If doing two longish day trips then look at the London Plus railpass which comes in various numbers of unlimited train travel over a longer period and also included is a round trip from Gatwick, Hethrow or Stansted airports on the dedicated Airport Express trains like Heathrow Express, Gatwick Express, etc.

ElendilPickle

I'll second jamikins' recommendation of the 2 for 1 deals at www.daysoutguide.co.uk, though I don't think Westminster Abbey is currently included.

Take a look at a map and group your daily activities so that you don't have to travel all over London. For instance, you could visit the Churchill Museum/Cabinet War Rooms on the same day you see Westminster Abbey.

It costs a bit more, but the verger's tour of Westminster Abbey is worth the extra price.

Lee Ann

alanRow

<i> (Aren't they still used for worship?) </i>

Yes they are and if all you want to do is worship you can do that for free either at the main services or in a side chapel.

But given that neither Cathedral receives state support do you think that the millions of tourists each year shouldn't pay something towards the upkeep of the buildings?

alanRow

As for the London Pass - it's for mugs. It is expensive and encourages you to go to many second-rate attractions and to rush around like a loon in order to "get value" from the pass.

as there are at least 2 of you then the offers on daysoutguide.com are a better option - you'll need to buy Travelcards AT A NATIONAL RAIL TICKET OFFICE, not a Tube station to qualify for them but you will need some form of card to get around London so effectively the discounts cost you nothing - and you don't have to do them if you don't want to

PalenQ

ttt

suec1

Have you stumbled onto the web site for London Tool Kit yet? lots of info there. Also IMO the 2 4 1 deals that come with a travel card are a better deal than London Pass, unless you want to dash around cramming in many sights in a day or two. Check out London Walks for some fun, inexpensive walking tours - they also do some daytrips, including one to Bath I think. Some are in the evening or maybe do an evening cruise on the Thames - a good way to get an overview of the city.

FerrisFar

Thanks for the links and suggestions. We might do Bath by train. We might also take the train to Cambridge since my friend has an interest. In that case the London Plus railticket, with the added benefit of the airport train might be a good deal. I suppose one can't use them for the 2 for 1?

My main hesitation about the travelcard and 2 for 1 combo is that it sounds as if it is sometimes hard to find the right place to get it. Also, if we end up using less than the full seven days of transport, is it still a good deal?

As far as admission to Westminster and St Paul, I am just surprised that the museums are free but the churches don't get the same sort of government support. It's not like in the US where separation of church and state would prevent it.

I'm thinking we will probably do the tour of Westminster but shoot for a church service at St Paul's.

jamikins

It is easy to find the right place to get them. Any National Rail Train Station. Off the top of my head in central London this includes:

Charing Cross
Waterloo
London Bridge
Marylebone
Victoria
Euston
Kings Cross/St Pancras
Paddington
Cannon Street
Farringdon
Moorgate

If you look at the tube map you can buy them at any that have the National Rail symbol (2 red lines with what look like chicken feet crossing...) http://www.tfl.gov.uk/assets/downloa...d-tube-map.pdf

Note that for a 7 day pass (which is what I always recommend if you are staying more than 5 days) you need a passport sized photo to get the pass.

Here are some FAQs. http://www.daysoutguide.co.uk/faq.aspx
You just print out as many as you want for the dates you want before you come over (you can do the same one for multiple days if you dont know your schedule) and bring the coupon to the site you want. Easy.

FerrisFar

I think that what is confusing is that there seem to be more than one type of travel card. Besides the paper travel card which is supposed to be okay with the 2 for 1, and the travel card that can/is loaded on an Oyster Card (which is not good for the 2 for 1) there is also an offer at Rail Europe for a travel card that must be purchased from outside the UK. I assume that wouldn't work with the 2 for 1 deal either?

The other question is which travel card to get. We'll be there seven days, but two of the days we will be taking day trips outside of London. Also, what areas do we want the travelcard for?

We'll be staying in Kensington. We want to visit

The Tower (maybe)
Westminster Abbey
St Paul (more to worship than to sightsee)
Shakespeare's Globe (tour and also see a play)
Churchill War Rooms
Greenwich/Cutty Sark
British Museum
Museums in Kensington as time permits
and a few other obvious places that are in Central London.

Would we need the six zone card or just the central london card? My feeling is the central zone card would do, but maybe I am overlooking something?

Thanks.

Nhgirl3G

Our family visited London last June. We used the two for one pass and got oyster cards when coming off the plane. We loved the Churchill War Rooms and spent an afternoon. It is really well set up, very informative and all presented in a great way. We also spent one day out in Oxford, taking the bus which was cheaper than the train and very easy to find and got us out there almost as fast. We loved Oxford, there was so much to see and do.
Have fun.

janisj

>>We used the two for one pass and got oyster cards when coming off the plane.<<

This may confuse folks. The 2for1's are not related to Oyster cards at all.

<B>FerrisFarr:</B> For this discussion a 'Travel card' is a 7-day, zone 1 and 2 travel ticket for all transport in London. It can either be loaded on an Oyster (a plastic card) or on a paper card. Both get you all travel IN the center of London - bus/tube/trains/DLR. The two versions are exactly the same for travel purposes. But ONLY the <u>paper</u> version is valid for the 2for1 discounts.

A Paper Travel card must be bought in a <u>train</u> station . . . But it will still be good for tube and bus travel IN London.

For any stay in London over about 4.5 or 5 days it still makes sense to get a 7-day travel card because the break even point is about 4.5 days.

If you are only visiting 2for1 sites on a couple of days, what you could do is get pay-as-you-go ££ loaded on Oysters and just pop into a train station and buy one-day paper travel cards on those days. You'd use the paper travel cards those days and the PAYG Oyster every other day.

indy_dad

Not disagreeing with the above (which was generic as well as specific advise), but let's not make this too complicated for the OP as many can suffer death by analysis.

You are there for a week, get the 7-day paper travel card and print off the 2for1's and not worry about Tube travel for the week. So what if you might save a &pound; or two with PAYG + daily tickets (and you probably won't). Life's too short.

PatrickLondon

With a 7-day travelcard, you're in profit after 10-12 journeys - or at least it did when I last calculated. Most visitors will only need zones 1-2 (which also covers buses in all the zones - you can buy add-on tickets if you need to take the tube into other zones).

jamikins

Thank you Indy!!!!!

minx

First off I am not a newbie traveller.But the Oyster vs Travel cards, the Passes and 2for1 'deals' have left me stymied and frustrated.I very much welcomed this particular Post. We are in London 4 days...have decided to buy a loaded Oyster card here (Canada) before our departure. We have driver transport arranged from Heathrow and our ticket purchased for the English Tunnel to France after 4 days in London. HOW can we take advantage of this 2for1 that we keep hearing about without now having to buy a paper ticket?And if I am correct, having the 2for1 ticket does not allow queue jumping at the Eye or the Tower??? I'm wondering if I should just purchase tickets here for these particular sites and suckup the extra pounds spent?

indy_dad

<i>HOW can we take advantage of this 2for1 that we keep hearing about without now having to buy a paper ticket?And if I am correct, having the 2for1 ticket does not allow queue jumping at the Eye or the Tower??? I'm wondering if I should just purchase tickets here for these particular sites and suckup the extra pounds spent?</i>

To get the 2for1's, you need a train ticket. It's meant to entice folks to come into the city but there is a back-door by getting a 1-day or 7-day paper travel card.

So, if it is worth the hassle for you, you could buy a 1-day travel card on the day you do the Tower (and Eye) for each person. You'll save your PAYG on that day (i.e. use the paper card).

The Tower and Eye are each in the &pound;20 range so you will certainly save if you want to hassle with it.

Correct on the assumption that you will still have to queue (and in fact I don't think you can do the Eye Fast Pass or whatever it's called with the 2for1s -- it's best to wait to check weather anyway).

Hope that helps.

minx

Clarified it all perfectly...Thankyou very much

janisj

>><i>have decided to buy a loaded Oyster card here (Canada) before our departure. . . . HOW can we take advantage of this 2for1 that we keep hearing about without now having to buy a paper ticket?</i><<

Absolutely NO reason to pre-purchase the Oysters. And since you want to use 2for1's that makes even LESS sense.

Simple answer is you cannot take advantage of the 2for1's unless you have paper travel cards.

And queue jumping really isn't an advantage. W/ a paper travelcard, if you get to the Tower at opening time you'd get in for half price and have a very short line. As indydad says, you don't want to pre-purchase Eye tickets.

>>Not disagreeing with the above (which was generic as well as specific advise), but let's not make this too complicated for the OP as many can suffer death by analysis. <<

I agree - I seldom go into that sort of detail (that seems to be xyz's job ) but the OP was confusing 3 different types of travel cards/passes and seemed ti need a bit of <i>gentle</i> hand holding.