don82

We will be in London for 4-days in May.
Arriving LHR mid-day.
We will take the Piccadilly line to a hotel near Turnham Green tube station in zone 3.
Same day continue on to central London(zone 1) and later return to hotel(zone3).
Next two days travel from zone 3 to zone 1 and return one time each day.
Final day return to LHR before 9AM .
Question: What would be the most economical way to travel?

Back in'99 we were able to purchase a weekly travel-card but this oyster system is a bit confusing. The Oyster seems to be just a card you preload.
Where is the savings,if any?
I have read some of PatrickLondon and xyz's most helpful responses but I'm still unsure as to what is available.

sashh

Yes Oyster is a card that you preload BUT your journeys are logged and you are only charged the cheapest fare for the day, which could be a day travel card, or an offpeak cap plus a single if that's cheaper.

jent103

You can still purchase a 7-day travelcard, which may be the best deal for you if you're using the Tube four days. The Travelcard is just loaded on your Oyster. Your other logical option is pay as you go (PAYG) credit. Think of this like using a debit card - you have a certain amount of "cash" on your Oyster, and you use a little each ride. As sashh said, the total amount taken from your account on any given day is capped.

If you're not sure which would be the better option for you, personally I wouldn't stress out about it beforehand. The agents at the ticket windows have been very helpful in my experience, and are able to tell you quickly what would be best for your particular situation.

ssachida

when you go to the counter to buy your oyster card ask for it to be loaded with a '7 day zone1-3' travel card. The travel card costs £30.20. You will also need to get an extra 4.80 loaded for you trips from and to heathrow. The 7 day card is economical only if you use public transport extensively.

Alternatively, you just load pay-as-you-go cash onto your oyster and top up as needed. The fares for single trips and travel cards are listed here:
http://www.tfl.gov.uk/tickets/14416.aspx

don82

ssachida and jent103
Thanks for the info.
I printed the www.tfl.gov.uk/ticket schedule. That web-site answered all my questions as to price of trips.
Now I only have to worry about the Iceland volcano. I see on the LHR web-site that all flights are cancelled and I am scheduled to fly to Heathrow next week.

xyz123

Four days of use is very close...you will probably do a little bit better by going with PAYG.....at Heathrow you get an oyster card (there will be a £3 deposit no matter what) and ask they put £30 on it....you can monitor that each morning at one of the machines...if it runs too low, you can put an extra couple of quid on it.....you don't need to worry about anything else....each day the amount you spend will cap at the same price you would pay for a 1 day travelcard using the zones you use....it is a tad cheaper if you start out each weekday after 0930 but the tfl computer will keep track of it....again if you absolutely know that each day you will be using public transportation extensively, you might do a tad better with a 7 day zone 1-3 card with extensions and it might be a bit easier just to do tha along with the extension fare as noted but the difference is just not worth fretting over.

DancingBearMD

We've pretty much decided that it's worthwhile for us to buy 7-day paper travelcards (from a train ticket office, not from a Tube station) because the 2-for-1 vouchers will easily make up for any underuse of the Travelcard for purely transportation. And we'll know that we are able to jump on and off public transport whenever we want.

xyz123

While not disagreeing in the slightest with the above, just be aware that the paper 7 day card must be issued by a national rail ticket office, not a tube station, and there is no national rail ticket office at Heathrow; if you're coming in on a train, then that's not a problem. Also extension tickets on paper travelcards are much much more expensive than using oyster but yes the savings might be very significant.

ssander

There is a lot to be said for the convenience of having the 7-day card loaded onto your Oyster card, even if it costs a pound or two extra (and it probably won't, because hopping on and off the buses becomes a habit - 5 trips a days is not uncommon if you go a lot of places). Two examples:

(a) We often change our plans during the day -- resulting in an extra bus/tube trip or two.

(b) On several occasions, we had to run back to our hotel for something we forgot.

...and BTW...kudos to DancingBearMD for using the 2-for-1 vouchers with the train...we've always used them (Gatwick Airport to Victoria Station on Southern Railways) and saved over a hundred dollars each trip.

SS

xyz123

Let's do the math....

A 7 day zone 1-3 travelcard, whether loaded onto an oyster card or not, is £30.20...the extension fare from and to Heathrow would be £2.20 peak (before 0930 weekdays and between 1600 and 1900 weekdays) and £1.30 non peak (other times)....

Now, assuming your first trip is after 0930 on a weekday, if you remain within zones 1 to 3, your total outlay with an oyster card each day would cap at £6.30 again extensions on oyster would add a tad more but by my math, perhaps yours is differentr 6.30 x 4 is £25.20 and on a day you only used buses, the cap for that day would be £3.90....

If the 2 for 1's are a factor, I believe what the best thing to do on the day before you want to use a 2 for 1 is hit a national rail office, buy an off peak 1 day paper travelcard for that day (again it'll run £6.30 and I believe but wouldn't swear you can buy these a day in advance) and on that day use the paper 1 day travelcard to bop around to the attractions.

The problem with a 7 day paper travelcard remains the extension fares....I believe you have to pay a cash fare for the supplement and hence going from zone 4 to zone 6 (assuming you have a paper 7 day card) would be a cash outlay of £3.50 as opposed to the extension fares above...I'll stick with what I said...4 days doesn't pay to get a 7 day zone 1-3 pass....your best bet is oyster PAYG and a little bit of advanced planning to pick up a paper one day travelcard for those days you want to do a 2 for 1 bearing in mind that for the 2 for 1's, you need a paper travelcard issued by a national rail ticket office not a tfl ticket office.

JMHO

ssander

xyz123...

Is there a train from Heathrow (not the express) they can use instead of the tube? They only need tickets to show for the 2-for-1...at least that's the wasy it has been on Southern from Gatwick (I'm not at all familiar with Heathrow). The Gatwick was about 9 or 10 GBP each way. Not sure how that plays into your math...maybe not at all.

SS

BigRuss

SSander: Heathrow Connect. Kind of the local from Heathrow to Paddington.

janisj

But Heathrow Connect tickets aren't valid for the 2-for-1's -- at least they weren't last year. And I found this posting on TA that seems to agree . . . though it is also year-old info.

http://www.tripadvisor.com/ShowTopic...n_England.html

When flying through LHR, I don't believe there is any way to get a 7-paper travel card. I'd personally just get Oysters loaded w/ a modest PAYG amount. Then on a day when one wants to use 2-for-1's -- during your wandering pop into a train station and buy a one-day paper travel card to use w/ the vouchers.

ssander

I also assumed that Heathrow Connect did not honor 2-for-1 vouchers, since the Gatwick Express did not. We've always taken Southern from Gatwick for that reason (takes about 5-8 minutes longer, but well worth it).

There is something called Heathrow Express, also to Paddington -- maybe that train honors 2-for-1...I couldn't tell from the website.

If there is no regular train service that honors 2-for-1, you could just buy any cheap round-trip ticket to London from nearby (for about 12-15 GPB most likely) to show at the admission gate of each 2-for-1 attraction...still worth it.

Also, the regular trains have a Group Save fare that will issue 3 or 4 tickets for the price of 2 for people traveling together. We did this last time traveling with another couple. The four tickets were all honored at 2-for-1 even though we only paid the price of two rail fares.

SS

DancingBearMD

I think the language of saying "train service that honors 2-for-1" is a bit confusing. The question is really whether a particular train ticket is be acceptable for the 2-for-1 vouchers to be honored at a particular attraction.

The TripAdvisor link in JanisJ's post on April 18 is not really definitive. That post does not say that Heathrow Connect or Heathrow Express tickets do not qualify to be used with the 2-for-1 vouchers; rather, it says that 7-day travelcards purchased at Heathrow do not qualify. That may be because the National Rail ticket office at Heathrow apparently does not sell the 7-day travelcards--rather, the National Rail website directs folks at to London Transport at Heathrow to buy the travelcards:

"London Underground tickets and Travelcards can be purchased from the Underground station ticket office."
http://www.nationalrail.co.uk/stations/hxx/details.html (Click on "Ticket buying and collection")

So, I think the first question is whether Heathrow Connect and Heathrow Express tickets themselves qualify to be used with the 2-for-1 vouchers. That is a little bit hard to pin down. The National Rail page on the 2-for-1s is not very helpful:
http://www.nationalrail.co.uk/times_...ne-london.html

It sends you over to the Days Out Guide website for more info:http://www.daysoutguide.co.uk/

The FAQ page there says:

"What kinds of train tickets are valid for this promotion?

2FOR1 and special offers/admission vouchers are available with almost ANY type of train tickets issued to London (or to the Attraction Destination) on normal 'paper' ticket stock (i.e. not electronic or 'smartcard' but for exceptions see below) and valid on the day you wish to the visit the attraction, theatre, or restaurant, e.g. National Rail issued tickets include Off-Peak, Super Off-Peak, Travelcard, Advance, Anytime, Season Tickets and various promotional travel tickets that may be issued from time to time, etc...

By way of recognition most 'paper' rail travel tickets show the Double-Arrow (or 'crows-foot') National Rail logo, then you're safe to assume it is valid. If you are unsure in any way please ask at your local staffed National Rail station.

London Underground issued tickets (including Travelcards issued by London Underground ticket offices and agents) are NOT valid and will not be accepted at any attraction."

http://www.daysoutguide.co.uk/faq.aspx#1

So, do Heathrow Connect or Heathrow Express tickets meet that description? I dunno. But, to be clear, both Heathrow Express and Heathrow Connect appear to be within the National Rail system.

http://www.nationalrail.co.uk/tocs_m...c/details.html
http://www.nationalrail.co.uk/tocs_m...x/details.html

DancingBearMD

I forgot to add that I assume the other strategy is to take the Heathrow service to Paddington and buy your National Rail-issued travelcards there.

Michel_Paris

When I was there in May, I purchased an Oyster Card for £3, loaded it with £40. I arrived on a Friday, and left on a Wednesday. Used it everyday, swiped on entry and exit of Tube (also walked quite a bit). I left with a balance of £9. Furthest I went was Hampstead.

I was at Gatwick, so used Gatwick Express for that portion.

ssander

I would suggest using the contact link on the Heathrow Connect and/or Express and ask directly.

I remember that when I was not sure whether the Group Save (4 train tickets for the price of 2) discount would also allow the four of us to use our (half-price) tickets (paper) for 2-for-1, I contacted Southern (our train carrier from Gatwick).

They were very prompt with the reply that we could, indeed, use our little orange ticket-stubs with our 2-for-1 web-printed vouchers, even though we had got them for half-price. It was a tremendous savings for the four of us, since both couples could use our sets of printed 2-for-1 vouchers -- AND -- our train tickets were half price...saving a bundle.

When in doubt...ask!

SS

DancingBearMD

no, it's much better to speculate wildly on internet chat boards!

avalon

I have used my Heathrow and Gatwick Express return tickets for the 2 for 1 offers.Any trip over 4 days I load a 7 day travelcard on my Oyster