b_in_d

Well I finally pulled the trigger and scheduled my first trip to Europe. First time out of North America really. 40th birthday present to myself. Going solo.

On BA to LHR on Sept 13, out of CDG on the 23rd. Eurostar to Paris.

My first thought was 6 nights London, 4 nights Paris, but I'm also considering 3 nights London, 1 night Dublin, 3(or 2) nights London, 3(or 4) nights Paris. I'd really like to tour the Guinness factory and have the real stuff in a real Irish pub. But I'm not sold on the idea. Those would be my 2 possibles. Any thoughts?

Haven't done hotels yet. Priceline this weekend. I'm thinking the first 3 nights in London I'd try something in Mayfair or Soho. Paris probably Opera East or Latin Quarters. Thoughts? Not too worried about getting around, but would like to walk as much as possible.

Anyway, first time in London and Paris, traveling solo, want to see the bigger tourist things, but also get off the track and do a little exploring. Wine, food, museums, music especially jazz, people watching and soaking it all in. Not so much shopping or sitting on a tour bus.

Thanks for any help!!

janisj

Just a few short comments:

I don't think a jaunt over to Ireland makes any sense. You only have time for a brief overview of London - and even less in Paris. Going to Dublin and back will eat up two full days (you can get Guinness anywhere). I'd either doo 6 LONDON/4 PARIS OR 5/5.

Priceline is brilliant for London. I'd try the Westminster or Mayfair-Soho zones first.

But for Paris - not so much. No great bargains and the best PL hotels are waaaay outside of the central tourist areas. PL is useful for CDG hotels though - so if you wanted to stay out there for your last night, PL might be an option.

But hotels tend to be cheaper in Paris than in London for the same quality. So I'd book a Paris hotel directly.

speckles

I did the Guinness Tour in Dublin. While it was interesting enough, you don't see the actual factory. What you walk through is a big tourist set-up which includes the history of the product some former vats etc. You get a free pint at the end, but I can't say I like the stuff in any country. So, like I said, while the tour was fine, I felt a touch cheated because it wasn't the real deal. I had been expecting something a bit more like the intro from Laverne & Shirley - bottles going around on conveyor belts in the actual factory etc. But it depends on what you're expecting from the tour.
http://www.guinness-storehouse.com/discovermore.asp

I agree with janisj that going to Dublin will eat into your short holiday. I spent 1.5 days in Dublin but saw very little. I also spent 8 days in London and didn't see half of what I wanted to. This time I'm going back for another 5 in London plus 3.5 in Paris and it won't be enough. I think spending 5 or six days in London and 4 or 5 in Paris will probably allow you to see more than adding Dublin into the mix. If you really want to go to Dublin could you fly direct to Paris instead of going back through London? It would save some travel time.

Also remember that travel time to and from airports, along with customs etc on the 13th and 23rd will eat into your time. I think you also lose an hour going from London to Paris due to a change in timezones so consider this when booking a time for the Eurostar if you're planning on going places in Paris that afternoon.

I'm not sure what the flight times and jetlag are like from North America, but from Australia it's at least 20 hours in flight with a change of planes on the way. Last time I arrived in London at 6.30am, but the jetlag knocked me so much that I was in bed by 4pm and didn't do anything very interesting that day. After a long sleep I was fine the next day. I would plan your least important activities for the first day just in case.

walkinaround

speckles is correct. the guinness "factory" tour is just a contrived museum rather than a real factory tour. the company does well in marketing the "pint at the factory" experience as something of a required pilgrimage for anyone who likes guinness.

in fact, however, the bar is an overcrowded, modern room and the pints are hastily poured by a group of teenagers. when i was there, they were just pouring and pouring and you leaving the pints on the counter for people to just grab as they came through. they were even mixing up the traditional with the extra-cold. so much for the experience of ordering a pint and waiting and watching it settle. even the most lout filled club/pub in london will serve guinness with more love and care than the factory. finally, most of the people on the tour apparently don't actually like guinness so they just grabbed their pint took a few sips and abandoned it...there were nearly full pints littered all over the place.

i am not particularly attached to guinness but i had to laugh at how the reality of a "pint at the guinness factory" does not at all measure up to the pilgrimage that they sell it as. anyone expecting a special experience with this will be greatly disappointed.

a big thumbs down for the guinness factory tour.

b_in_d

OK, then. I guess I'll do Dublin on another trip and will settle for a Guinness in London. I am a fan. Laverne and Shirley! That's kind of what I was hoping for.

So now I need to decide 6/4 or 5/5. I don't have a long list of things specifically that I want to see in either, just the major tourist places and then a lot of exploring.

My boss has 2 free passes on Eurostar, but he's not sure about transferability and/or if I need to reserve a trip or if I can just walk up. How far in advance do I need to decide/reserve?

This has all been very great help! Thank you all!

janisj

If you end up having to pay for the Eurostar, book it as soon as your dates are firm. The farther ahead you purchase the cheaper the tix - walk-up fares are REALLY high.

As for the 6/4 vs 5/5 decision -- Many will recommend 5/5 or even 4/6 because Paris is so terrific. (London is terrific too but there seem to be a few more Paris-fanatic than London-fanatic posters here)

But I would recommend 6/4. Mainly because London is so huge and the sites are spread over very wide area. It just takes longer to get places and see the major sites. Paris on the other hand is compact - at least the tourist-site concentration is. Except for Sacre Coeur and Versailles - everything else is basically walking distance from any central location.

So, simply for logistics reasons I'd do 6/4.

b_in_d

Thanks janisj!

I'll press my boss to find out about his passes. He's a good guy and I don't want to demand it, but if he's willing to help.

Since it was mentioned not to use PL for Paris, does anyone know about the best(being relative) location to stay for a first timer? Is it possible to get a hotel on Ile St Louis? Money not a huge deal. $200-ish/night. Could go higher for a really great place.

A few more questions:

Best guide book(s) for London and for Paris?

Cell phone? Usefulness? I don't own one, don't want one, but might feel more "secure" having one. Which is weird as I work in technology and am surrounded by gadgets all day.

I also tend not to like taking photos when I vacation, as I find it most unrelaxing and spend too much time trying to get the right photo rather than experiencing where I'm at. Not sure though.

Anyway, thanks again! Much appreciated!

speckles

There's currently another thread on cell phones in Europe which you may wish to tap into for advice. I didn't take my phone last time nor am I planning to this time: it requires set-up for international roaming; the costs through my current network are expensive when o/s; I can't be bothered looking into getting a European simcard; and you have to keep recharging the thing which means you not only take the phone you also take the recharger (assuming the voltage is compatible) and then an adaptor plug for the charger.. it all just adds up in the suitcase.

As for photography: if you're not into photos, don't take photos. You have to do what's best for you to enjoy your trip. Some like photos, others buy postcards to keep, others keep a written journal and some just keep their memories.

b_in_d

Thanks speckles!

Since I don't really want a cell phone, I'd hate to buy one just for the trip and then have it sit in a drawer when I got back. I guess I'll have the excitement of using payphones? I'm feeling kind of Dr. Who-ish!

I like to write in a journal and postcards will be fine with me, so I won't get a camera either. Unless I can borrow a friend or family member's.

I just got one hotel down, thanks to the advice on staying near CDG my final night. Got the Hilton for $95, which I guess is right at the airport. I tend to be a time-phobe on travel days, so this should help me relax.

Anyway, thanks again! Off to try London hotels.

b_in_d

Has anyone used parishotels.com to actually book a room? I found one that I'd like to reserve but have only found that site to do it online and the hotel itself doesn't seem to have it's own site. The one web address for the hotel redirects to parishotels.com.

Am I OK booking with this site?

curmudgeon

I haven't used parishotels, but I (and others here) have used www.venere.com multiple time with good results. Often there will be one central service behind a number of sites. I like the venere maps which give me a better feel for locations. Many central Paris (and London) hotels will be quite a bit smaller than equivalent US ones, and so may not have quite the web presence you would expect.

noe847

I have used Venere (not for Paris though) and really liked it. As for London, I agree that Mayfair would be a good location in London.

b_in_d

Thanks curmudgeon!

I've done OK with priceline.com for London, but am not seeing a lot for Paris so I was trying a different approach.

I did send an "email" booking request through parishotels but I'm going to check your site as well. I think I've settled on 4e or 5e to begin.

jpie

Since you haven't gotten any thoughts on neighborhoods in Paris-I thought I would just add my 2 cents. I think you will find that most of the Paris fanatics here will recommend the following neighborhoods,particulalry for a first time vist:

On the Left Bank: The Latin Quarter-which is the 6th and 5th. Pretty touristy, but lots to do and lively. The 7th is nearer the Eiffel Tower and a bit quieter.

On the Right Bank-the 4th is very popular-it is the Marais and lots of little boutiques, and again a nice lively area. The 1st is the centerl of river and also part of the right Bank, it includes the Ile St. Louis, which is a bit quieter and great for walking to Notre Dame and very central. The 1st also includes the Louvre, so some folks prefer to stay nearby in that area. In general, neighborhoods near the center of Paris near the river have the best access and most to do for first time visitors-so hence the reason that the 1st, 4th, 5th, 6th and 7th are the most popular. In terms of hotel suggestions-there are tons on the forum if you start to search.

Have a great trip!

b_in_d

Thanks jpie!

I only have 2 things currently that I "have" to do in Paris. The Louvre(may spend a day) and the Eiffel Tower. I'm still researching other things. Still open, but mostly want to wander and see what happens. Don't know if I'll need to go to Montmartre for live jazz.

Have decided on 6/4. I'm still searching but hoping the first 3 nights in Mayfair/Soho. Then I already have reservations for 3 nights in Westminster, Jolly St Ermins. This puts me a bit closer to Waterloo for the trip to Paris on Eurostar.

2 days ago they showed no openings on the train, now tonight they do. Any thoughts on Standard vs Leisure on the Eurostar?

Still searching for the first 3 nights in Paris. Not too worried yet. Last night will be at the CDG Hilton. May have to break out my DVD of Jet Lag to see where they stayed. Would not complain about meeting Juliet Binoche.

I was out walking today and had a guy with a thick British accent ask me for directions. Should have asked him for the name of a pub.

Still 4 months away and I'm feeling ready to go tomorrow. Hopefully I can finish up the hotel and train bookings and then focus on work. It's been difficult to think of anything else.

Thanks again for everyone's help! Keep it coming!

b_in_d

There must be something going on in Paris the 3 days that I'm planning to be there(19-22). I've checked rates and some of the bigger places seem to go up 20-40 euros for those 3 days as compared to the same days the week before and the week after. Lots of smaller places have no rooms. Might also be that Paris is just busy always.

I was thinking of reserving a room at one of the bigger hotels and then keep shopping. If I can't find anything more interesting then at least I have a room in an "unexciting" hotel. Sound like a good plan? Are there problems in cancelling at the last minute? Any bigger names that are generally OK? I was thinking Novotel Les Halles and then things like Best Western and Holiday Inn. Thoughts?

Thanks again for the great help!

GBbabe

When you start planning your days, just remember to put the popular stuff with long lines first. Leave cathedrals and museums for later in the day. Be at the Tower in London just before opening time and then head straight for the Jewels. It doesn't take long for a line to form to see the Jewels. Same for Eiffel Tower in Paris. I got there 15 minutes before opening and still had to wait almost a half hour to get on the elevator (if you want to walk up, that line is a lot shorter).

b_in_d

Thanks GBbabe! Great help!

Well, something is most certainly going on in Paris while I'm there. I have found it nearly impossible to find a room in any of the big chain places nor the smaller ones mentioned here. A week before and a week after and most have rooms.

I finally got a reservation made at the Hilton Arc De Triomphe and I think I'm just going to go with it for now. Was just above my budget per night, but I've saved a lot in London so it's all a wash. The hotel gets pretty good reviews everywhere, other than being too much in a touristy area. But hey, I have a room!

Now I've got to start thinking about things to do. Thanks again!

Robespierre

You can also get a better room at half the price if you're willing to ride the train for 10 or 20 minutes to get to the sights in and around the city center. We have stayed in a four-star two-bedroom <i>suite</i> in Antony, 15 minutes south of Notre Dame, for 135 &euro;.

For an idea how &quot;compact&quot; Paris is, refer to mappy.com and you will find that it takes an hour to walk from the Arc de Triomphe to the Louvre, and <u>over</u> an hour to walk from Notre Dame to the Eiffel Tower - hardly the best use of your limited time.

<i>p.s.</i> If you take the last Eurostar leaving London in the evening, you won't sacrifice any of your prime time sightseeing to traveling.

b_in_d

Thanks Robespierre!

I'm willing to ride the metro a bit, and an hour walk is not a big deal. But I will keep looking for something closer. As I said, I'm only really finding suites at big chains available in this time frame, but maybe I'm not trying enough places.

The advice about the Eurostar is awesome! I will keep that in mind. Thoughts on Standard vs Leisure?