Live 8 Concerts
Jul 1st, 2005, 12:36 AM
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Live 8 Concerts
Just wondering if anybody has tickets to any of the Live 8 concerts - and if so, where?
I'm kicking myself for not applying for any now, although am consoling myself that I'll probably get a better view at home on the tv...!
Also, are the concerts getting much coverage where you are? And what's the feeling as to whether they will achieve anything?
I'm kicking myself for not applying for any now, although am consoling myself that I'll probably get a better view at home on the tv...!
Also, are the concerts getting much coverage where you are? And what's the feeling as to whether they will achieve anything?
Jul 1st, 2005, 02:17 AM
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I live near Philadelphia where they are predicting more people than they have room for. It sounds like it will be very crowded and hot. You will definitely get a better view on TV and you'll also be more comfortable.
Jul 1st, 2005, 04:05 AM
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What a waste of time, effort, money, etc. etc. etc.
I'm dreading this event in London tomorrow. It will clog everything up, and for what? If people really think throwing money into corruptly governed African countries is going to benefit the "ordinary" African, they're sadly misguided.
The dictator Robert Mugabe has the same number of people forcibly evicted from their homes in ONE MONTH as Sadaam Hussein did in Iraq during his WHOLE REIGN. Tony Blair cited Hussein's evictions as the reason for the war on Iraq, yet seems quite content to let Mugabe commit far worse atrocities. If anywhere needs regime change, it's Zimbabwe.
Live8 serves no purpose other than providing publicity to artists, and presenting them in a "charitable" light. Africa will, unfortunately, always be Africa, in a decade, ten decades, ad infinitum!
I'm dreading this event in London tomorrow. It will clog everything up, and for what? If people really think throwing money into corruptly governed African countries is going to benefit the "ordinary" African, they're sadly misguided.
The dictator Robert Mugabe has the same number of people forcibly evicted from their homes in ONE MONTH as Sadaam Hussein did in Iraq during his WHOLE REIGN. Tony Blair cited Hussein's evictions as the reason for the war on Iraq, yet seems quite content to let Mugabe commit far worse atrocities. If anywhere needs regime change, it's Zimbabwe.
Live8 serves no purpose other than providing publicity to artists, and presenting them in a "charitable" light. Africa will, unfortunately, always be Africa, in a decade, ten decades, ad infinitum!
Jul 1st, 2005, 05:04 AM
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M-kingdom - disagree absolutely about the relevance of Live8. Sure it will be an ego trip for some on the stage, and some in the audience. BUT it's better to tap into the usually non-engaged populace once every so often than not to tap in at all. Money apart - events like this concentrate our attention for a little while. We in the west are mainly a fickle lot, and have to be reminded every so often. Governments can spout and manoeuve and try.
Personally, I was against the Iraq war and so would be against any similar excursion in Zimbabwe - although I can see the connection you are making. Iraq of course, has oil. Perhaps Zim should be glad that it hasn't. However bad things are, dropping a pile of bombs on them wouldn't help.
I honestly don't know what should be done. I honestly also believe that your comments re:
"Africa will, unfortunately, always be Africa, in a decade, ten decades, ad
infinitum"
are pure arrogance. I assume you have a thorough knowledge of the continent. If you do, perhaps you might care to give us all a considered argument rather than a sweeping statement.
Personally, I was against the Iraq war and so would be against any similar excursion in Zimbabwe - although I can see the connection you are making. Iraq of course, has oil. Perhaps Zim should be glad that it hasn't. However bad things are, dropping a pile of bombs on them wouldn't help.
I honestly don't know what should be done. I honestly also believe that your comments re:
"Africa will, unfortunately, always be Africa, in a decade, ten decades, ad
infinitum"
are pure arrogance. I assume you have a thorough knowledge of the continent. If you do, perhaps you might care to give us all a considered argument rather than a sweeping statement.
Jul 1st, 2005, 06:22 AM
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Will Self wrote an article in The Times a couple of weeks ago (sadly I can't find a link for this) and without being too explicit, it would appear that eductation, education (to quote Tony) is required in Africa to reduce the problem caused by AIDS/HIV.
But all this self-righteous nonsense spouted by Bob Geldof is sickening. I don't think 100bn GBP or USD would change things in Africa, the rich would get richer, and the poor would stay just as poor.
I'm not saying that Africa should say like this, but I'm saying that it's inevitable that it will do. Africa continues to be an exploited continent, both of its people, and its minerals. Tin ore miners are virtually slaves, yet the west continues to buy ore mined by them. So perhaps instead of giving aid, reducing trade with disreputable companies might be a better idea.
But all this self-righteous nonsense spouted by Bob Geldof is sickening. I don't think 100bn GBP or USD would change things in Africa, the rich would get richer, and the poor would stay just as poor.
I'm not saying that Africa should say like this, but I'm saying that it's inevitable that it will do. Africa continues to be an exploited continent, both of its people, and its minerals. Tin ore miners are virtually slaves, yet the west continues to buy ore mined by them. So perhaps instead of giving aid, reducing trade with disreputable companies might be a better idea.
Jul 1st, 2005, 06:57 AM
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To be honest I think that the intention is honourable but I rather think that the 'event' has overshadowed the meaning. Sure they'll all stand on stage and sound terribly worthy but people just want to hear the music.
What I do find funny though is that apparently Bill Gates is to introduce The Who!! And how on earth is uber-diva Mariah Carey going to cope without 10-star treatment? I just hope that 'Saint' Bob overhears her having a hissy-fit about the dressing room conditions and the fact that the temperature of her water is 2 degrees out...!!
What I do find funny though is that apparently Bill Gates is to introduce The Who!! And how on earth is uber-diva Mariah Carey going to cope without 10-star treatment? I just hope that 'Saint' Bob overhears her having a hissy-fit about the dressing room conditions and the fact that the temperature of her water is 2 degrees out...!!
Jul 1st, 2005, 08:45 AM
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My husband and I are abandoning Philly for the Poconos tomorrow. Philly will be unbearable. It is bad enough that we are having a heat wave--now this concert. I wouldn't go near Philly tomorrow, not even to drive on the Skill. Expressway. My best friend has flown to Las Vegas to get away, and she lives all the way out in King of Prussia.
Jul 2nd, 2005, 03:19 AM
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M_k - It's interesting that you quote Will Self to back up your position. I assume therefore, that you don't have any personal knowledge of the continent in question. But I do agree with you about trade. All the countries that make up "Africa" have been worked over by the west, and are still being exploited and used. Time to give something back.
As for some of the other cynics - leaving the city because of the concert. I just wonder where they take their holidays and whether they ever venture beyond their 5 star hotel unless it is in the company of a 5 star guide.
Sickened.
Tunbridge Wells
As for some of the other cynics - leaving the city because of the concert. I just wonder where they take their holidays and whether they ever venture beyond their 5 star hotel unless it is in the company of a 5 star guide.
Sickened.
Tunbridge Wells
Jul 2nd, 2005, 04:05 AM
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i'm also out of london today. the only clear message of the event's purpose is to stroke Bob's ego. all the negative press and criticism is deserved in my opinion. at least the first go at this had a more focused purpose and message...famine relief and the raising of money in its pursuit. this one is all over the place.
Jul 2nd, 2005, 08:26 AM
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Live8 will send a clear message to world leaders.
Millions of people around the world are willing to give their time and energy to suffer through hours of listening to music. The depth of this sacrifice will show how much these people care about poverty in Africa.
Millions of people around the world are willing to give their time and energy to suffer through hours of listening to music. The depth of this sacrifice will show how much these people care about poverty in Africa.
Jul 2nd, 2005, 04:08 PM
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The concert was pretty good overall and it was worth it just to see Pink Floyd reunite. Their set was great and Wish You Were Here was enough by itself but they also played Breathe, Money, and Comfortably Numb.
John
John
Jul 2nd, 2005, 07:58 PM
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fuzzylogic, you had made a statement that the west has worked over Africa and continues to do so,the apparent unjustice to the Africans occured over 400 years ago, and was aided by their leaders at the time,and by the European nations that profited from slave trade.Please further enlighten us .
Jul 2nd, 2005, 08:11 PM
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I thought the concerts were great. In 1985, we were working in a forest in France and listened to Live Aid on BBC 4 on our radio in our Combi - Oh the nostaglia.
Returning to July 2005 - the amount of publicity about Africa has increased exponentially over the past 2 weeks. Before it just didn't seem to exist. As terrible as the Tsunami was, the deaths and devastation didn't go anywhere near what is the norm in Africa yet African disasters don't normally hit the press except back on page 10.
Yes, there are major problems with corrupt governments etc. But it is now being raised, discussed and debated. No, I don't think it will be a cure but it may create some action, which I hope will help.
IMHO
Returning to July 2005 - the amount of publicity about Africa has increased exponentially over the past 2 weeks. Before it just didn't seem to exist. As terrible as the Tsunami was, the deaths and devastation didn't go anywhere near what is the norm in Africa yet African disasters don't normally hit the press except back on page 10.
Yes, there are major problems with corrupt governments etc. But it is now being raised, discussed and debated. No, I don't think it will be a cure but it may create some action, which I hope will help.
IMHO
Jul 2nd, 2005, 08:33 PM
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I agree - was great to see Pink Floyd again. I'd have loved to have been in Hyde Park today.
lilmonkey, since you asked for enlightenment (not sure if it is an "us" that requests it). may I add a few thoughts? I suppose that's more of a rhetorical questions, as I do plan to anyway.
I'm not clear where your "400 years" figure came from, so some counter-enlightenment would be useful for myself as well.
As far as I was aware, importation of slaves was taking place up until only 140 years ago here in the US.
Still, that's ancient history compared to the European colonization of almost every African country right up through World War 2 and even into the 60's in some places. During this period, these countries were used as a free resource for natural resources and labor to extract those resources. There was no training the locals on how to govern themselves. When Europe did extract themselves, they left huge vacuums to be filled and those with the guns and will to grab this power took it. In many cases, the West itself installed these thugs.
If you look at Rwanda, you have a classic example. The Congo is another.
This has been within the last 50 to 60 years amd many, many of these countries are much further along that one would think, and have moved closer to democracy. Still, Western expectations of instant results while washing hands of the causes leaves me wondering if Africa is better at change than the West is.
Were you thinking of other circumstances than these?
lilmonkey, since you asked for enlightenment (not sure if it is an "us" that requests it). may I add a few thoughts? I suppose that's more of a rhetorical questions, as I do plan to anyway.
I'm not clear where your "400 years" figure came from, so some counter-enlightenment would be useful for myself as well.
As far as I was aware, importation of slaves was taking place up until only 140 years ago here in the US.Still, that's ancient history compared to the European colonization of almost every African country right up through World War 2 and even into the 60's in some places. During this period, these countries were used as a free resource for natural resources and labor to extract those resources. There was no training the locals on how to govern themselves. When Europe did extract themselves, they left huge vacuums to be filled and those with the guns and will to grab this power took it. In many cases, the West itself installed these thugs.
If you look at Rwanda, you have a classic example. The Congo is another.
This has been within the last 50 to 60 years amd many, many of these countries are much further along that one would think, and have moved closer to democracy. Still, Western expectations of instant results while washing hands of the causes leaves me wondering if Africa is better at change than the West is.
Were you thinking of other circumstances than these?
Jul 3rd, 2005, 12:03 AM
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This morning's papers in the UK are wal to wall Live 8 (with a bit about the G8 march too).
But the BBC said that there was virtually no covereage in the US of the 1m+ people in Philadelphia. Is that right?
But the BBC said that there was virtually no covereage in the US of the 1m+ people in Philadelphia. Is that right?
Jul 3rd, 2005, 02:19 AM
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Well I thought that it was a great day and I got quite emotional at times (but that's not so unusual for me!)
I do find it quite surprising that people are still of the opinion that Bob Geldof takes on these causes and actions to promote himself. Why would he bother if he wasn't truly committed?
Personally I'm proud that the movement has been led by the British (yes, I'm fully aware that Geldof is Irish but he's lived here all his adult life) and I'm keeping my fingers crossed that the other G8 leaders take action - sadly I believe that only Britain and Canada are 100% behind the motion to wipe out African debt....
I do find it quite surprising that people are still of the opinion that Bob Geldof takes on these causes and actions to promote himself. Why would he bother if he wasn't truly committed?
Personally I'm proud that the movement has been led by the British (yes, I'm fully aware that Geldof is Irish but he's lived here all his adult life) and I'm keeping my fingers crossed that the other G8 leaders take action - sadly I believe that only Britain and Canada are 100% behind the motion to wipe out African debt....
