ekscrunchy

I've received much valuable assistance on my two previous related threads about a proposed trip to Spain.

http://www.fodors.com/community/euro...ro-burgos-.cfm


http://www.fodors.com/community/euro...squestions.cfm

Now that I have a vague semblance of a plan, I wanted to post it here and ask for comments and suggestions. (Forgive the repetition; I know I've already asked a few of these questions on other threads)

Since restaurants play an important role in this trip, let me know if you are aware of any weekly or annual closing periods (I've tried to determine these but have not double-checked all of them).
I have flexibility with dates but am planning to leave sometime during the second half of October and to be away approximately two weeks. I can add extra days where necessary or desirable.

We plan to rent an (automatic) car at the airport in Madrid and to drive, after the overnight flight, about an hour and a half to our first stop. The rest of the plan looks like this:



Depart JFK on a Monday in October, flying overnight to Madrid.


Day 1: arrive MAD Tuesday morning; rent automatic car through a broker, and drive 1.5 hours to Roa. Check into Hotel/Restaurant Raiz in Roa.
http://www.posadasdecastilla.com/pos...Prov=2&cPos=93

Lunch at Asados Nazareno in Roa: http://www.asadosnazareno.es/


Day 2; Wednesday: Explore Roa, then set off for 40-minute drive to Campaspero, stopping to visit Penafiel either before of after lunch. Lunch at Mannix in Campaspero:

http://restaurantemannix.com/

Return to Roa for second overnight.

Day 3: Thursday: Drive to Burgos and check into either Landa Palace just outside city; easy parking and taxi to city. Or stay in city center. Advantage of Landa is that parking is free and we do not have to negotiate unfamilar with streets to reach hotel. But we would have to travel back and forth from hotel to center by taxi or bus; is anyone familiar with bus routes? Taxi prices?

Spend two nights in Burgos; dine at both Azofra and Restaurante Ojeda during our stay; please offer comments if you have dined at either restaurant.

http://www.hotelazofra.com/en/restaurante-casa-azofra/

http://restauranteojeda.com/ (open lunch and dinner; closed Sunday dinner)


Sightseeing in Burgos to include Cathedral.

Any recommended food shops or markets apart from this one, which sounds great:

http://www.laviejacastilla.com/

And one connected to Casa Ojeda: http://grupojeda.com/delicatessen/

Landa Palace has a reportedly spectacular pool, open Fridays through Sundays in October.


Day 4, Friday. Explore Burgos and drive 35 minutes to Covarrubias. Perhaps include Lerma in driving route. Return to Burgos for dinner at Casa Ojeda if we have not lunched there the previous day.

Day 5, Saturday; Drive from Burgos to Axpe (about 2 hours); Where would you recommend that we stop en route to take a break and look around?

Check into Mendi Golkoa in Axpe, where we will spend the night.

Lunch at Asador Extebarri.

Since this is a Saturday, how far in advance should I think about booking both the hotel and the restaurant? If the hotel is full, what are my closest alternatives?

After lunch, walk around countryside and soak up scenery.

Day 6, Sunday. Drive from Axpe to Getaria takes about one hour or less. Which route should we consider?

Once in Getaria, check into Hotel Saiaz for two-night stay; request sea view room.

http://saiazgetaria.com/#image-2

Arrive in time for lunch at Elkano; after lunch visit Cristobal Balenciaga Museum (open until 7 in October; until 5 in November) . (Adjust dining time to be able to visit museum either before or after lunch).

http://www.restauranteelkano.com/

Overnight Getaria.

Day 7, Monday. Explore Getaria; driving tour through nearby countryside. (Looking for ideas here!!)

Day 8, Tuesday. (Tentative). Drive to San Sebastian and drop car at rental agency. (OR: Make short driving tour, perhaps foray into Pays Basque for a day or two before returning car to San Sebastian.) Check into hotel inSan Sebastian if Pays Basque idea is dropped. Spend 5 nights in San Sebastian at either Maria Cristina or de Londres y de Inglaterra, or other. (Please comment if you have stayed at either of these two hotels. Prefer to be close to tapas bars of Gros if possible.

Day 8, Wednesday:
(Refine restaurant plans to include one or two big ticket restaurants and lots of tapas; will begin discussion of restaurants once I refine the general plan, but comments most welcome; for those of you who have dined at the big names in the area, please let me know your thoughts! Ibai sounds good)

Day 9, Thursday. San Sebastian

Day 10, Friday San Sebastian

Day 11, SAturday. Train or bus early in morning to Tolosa weekly market.



Day 12, Sunday:
Sunday morning walk around San Sebastian and have early lunch before moving on by bus or train to Bilbao. Bilbao quiet on Sundays with many places closed, so perhaps just walk around and relax after visit to Guggenheim.

Day 13: Monday in Bilbao: City also quiet, but will fit in lunch or dinner at Extanobe, one of few top eateries on Mondays. Open to recommendations!!

Day 14: Tuesday: Open to recommendations; Explore Casco Viejo for tapas. Lunch at Vina del Ensanche??? (I've not done much reading on Bilbao and have only been there once on a one-day visit which happened to be on a Sunday so saw not much more than the Guggenheim and El Globo.)

Are four nights too many to allot to Bilbao? Which easy side trips by public transport should we consider?

My fellow traveler and aficionado of Spain, JELopez, likes the Carlton Hotel in Bilbao; any comments or other suggestions? We would love to be close to the Casco Viejo for easy tapas strolling.

http://hotelcarlton.es/en/



Sorry this is so sketchy and incomplete; I've just posted my musings in the hope that you all will comment and offer suggestions. I should say that I have been to Spain many, many times but am not all that familiar with the Basque areas outside San Sebastian which I last visited about 8 years ago on a stay of about 5 days.

Thanks for taking time to read this!!

cova

Ekscrunchy, I don´t feel your stay in Bilbao is too long.

The good thing about Bilbao is that nothing is too far away to get there walking, and if not, you can always jump in the metro. I like the pintxos in the Casco Viejo, but you shouldn´t dismiss places in Abando, at the other side of the river. Ledesma and Jardines de Albia has a few interesting places, and you cannot forget places like Bitoque or the bars in Garcia Rivero, such as "el huevo frito". http://elhuevofrito.com/

I was going to recommend the lunch time free jazz concert at the Cafe La Ribera, in the market, but you are planning on having an early lunch in SS on Sunday, so you won´t get there. http://www.lariberabilbao.com/en/ The place is quite nice, specially the views on the river.

If the weather is nice, I would get the metro to Algorta, walk down to Ereaga and walk along the beach there (you can stop for a refreshment at the Puerto Viejo, or further along at Tamarises or Igeretxe). You can walk up to the Puente Colgante and return on the metro from the other side of the river.
http://www.puente-colgante.com/index.php/en/

And I am sure that Mikel will jump with more ideas.

Bye, Cova

ira

Hey ek,

We were quite pleased with the Meson del cid in Burgos.
They have moderately priced, covered parking available.
See http://tinyurl.com/pf8vd6s

We also found the the Museo de la Evolución Humana quite interesting.

> how far in advance should I think about booking both the hotel and the restaurant

I'd call Etxebarri now.

> Spend 5 nights in San Sebastian at .. Maria Cristina .. (Please comment ..

The MC is way above my wage grade.

Do you wish to pay less that $550 per nite?

>.... visit to Guggenheim.

The puppy is very nice. Otherwise, you have to be a great fan of contemporary art.

You will find an installation that is made up of two walls of steel. You can walk between them. If you go "Whoo, Whoo" while walking through, at some point you will hear an echo.

I don't know if it was planned that way.

We much preferred the Fine Arts Museum

>Are four nights too many to allot to Bilbao?

I think that it is one too many.

We stayed at the Sercotel Coliseo. Very Modern. Quite nice.

We were very pleased with : Zortziko

Enjoy your visit.


No time for Club Allard in Madrid?

annhig

eck - do make sure that you have proper covered parking in Burgos. one of the few times that we have encountered crime on our travels was when our car was broken into when we were staying in a Hostel in Burgos.

We heard a car alarm going and by the time we'd work out that it was ours, and got down from the 4th floor of our building to the street below, our car radio was long gone, and the passenger door lock didn't work for the rest of the trip, which was quite inconvenient.

This was getting on for 30 years ago, so that thief is probably a respectable grandfather by now, but I would still go for covered parking if at all possible.

Robert2533

"But we would have to travel back and forth from hotel to center by taxi or bus; is anyone familiar with bus routes? Taxi prices?"

The hotels NH Palacio de Burgos and AC Burgos are easy to reach by car and both have parking available, but in October, you should be able to park on the street. The NH Palacio de Burgos is on the N-120, making it very easy to reach. The AC Burgos is on the other side of the river off Paseo Espolón. Not as easy to reach, but not difficult once you look at the map.

Taking a taxi back and forth isn't that expensive, but much more then paying for parking at the AC.

You will enjoy your time more staying in the city, since you only have to walk around and not commute.

We've had lunch at Azofra in Burgos, but havent't been to Restaurante Ojeda as yet, but did have lunch at their restaurant in Lerma, before they closed it down and concentrated on the one in Burgos. I consider both to be excellent grill houses.

There are a number of decent restaurants in Vitoria-Gastiz, El Portalón being the classic. It's located in a 15 century building with heavy wood timbers. But you would have to drive into Vitoria-Gastiz to reach any of the restaurants I could recommend, which could be a problem if you don't like driving in cities. Vitoria-Gastiz can be a bear, but there are several parking garages where you could park and walk into the old quarter.

For something a little easier, and with good food, check out La Casa Del Patrón in Murgia. You can have lunch there and skip going into Vitoria-Gastiz. You take the E-804/Ap-68 north from the turnoff at Miranda de Ebro to the N-622. The restaurant is listed in the Academia Vasca de Gastronomia, which is much better then the Michelin Guide.
http://academiavascadegastronomia.co...en-murguia/49/

Extebarri should be booked as soon as possible in order to secure a table. Remember, this is a big (and expensive) meal, so be prepared.

There are a number of country homes, Casa Rurals near by, but none quite the same as Mendi Golkoa in the immediate area (www.nekatur.net).

The Carlton Hotel Bilbao is an excellent choice, and I could easily spend the week in Bilbao.

ekscrunchy

Just to answer Ira while I have a moment. We are not traveling in to Madrid on this trip; I have been many times. I had booked at Club Allard years ago but was sick that night and had to cancel. Have not heard reports of the new chef. In any case, no Madrid this time.

I have been to the Guggenheim before and thought the exterior was superb, as well as the permanent installation by Serra, who is a neighbor of ours. My partner has not been to Bilbao and would probably like to visit the museum.

There are a number of places I'd like to eat in Bilbao and I also hope to read more about recommended day trips from the city; I am actually considering extending our stay to five nights, giving us time for leisurely walking and exploration. (Hopefully can fit in a meal at Azurmendi!!)

I will take a look at your recommended hotels. Thank you for your response.


You guys are the best...keep the ideas coming and I will keep reading and asking questions. I'm just about ready to phone Extebarri, now that I've got the general plan in place. Are there are tables nicer than others?



Robert: The NH looks the better of the two (AC being the other in play here); would you give NH the edge?

Robert2533

Typically, we stay at AC hotels when possible, but we're also preferred customers of the NH hotels. For you, on this trip, I think you will like the NH more. It's much easier for you to drive to.

ekscrunchy

Robert thank you. I will look into the NH in Burgos.

I read again the comments above by Ira and laughed when I noticed that the metal installation by Richard Serra that drew his wrath was one of the works that I liked very much on my last visit to the Guggenheim. To each his own, eh?

For those interested in the Maria Cristina, there are rooms for the equivalent of about US$330 in October. Anyone who has stayed there, or at the Londres....please comment! Once I have my dates finalized, I will take a closer look at the options in that city.

Robert that is all super helpful. I will call Extebarri this week. More concerning that usual because my plan calls for me to be there on a Saturday afternoon.

ekscrunchy

Success. Phoned Extebarri and booked the table for a Saturday lunch in late October. The reservation desk must be in the midst of the kitchen, as I could hear orders for chuletas coming in rat-tat-tat.


I've written Mendi Golkoa to book a room for that evening; hope to hear soon. Very exciting.

The Nekatur site lists some beautiful properties.

kimhe

I recommd you to stay for lunch in Getaria on your second day there as well. Many brilliant, no fuss and much more affordable places than Elkano (it's of course fabulous) down in the harbour area. Outside open grills, outside tables and outstanding seafood.

Maria Cristina is pure luxcury, visited some friends who stayed in a suite here some years ago, and it's hard to top this. And a little closer to the Gros district, just across the bridge over the city river Urumea. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7_iatRnVM5Q

But the new attic suites in Londres are also quite stunning, and just four more minutes walking to Gros. https://www.hlondres.com/en/accommodation/attic

And see if you can get a table at Ibai: http://www.andyhayler.com/restaurant/ibai

Robert2533

The MC was totally renovated two years ago and it shows. It's quite the place, but we like the Londres sea view rooms more. And as noted, the new attic suites on the top floor, which use to be the roof, are well worth the price for some.

ekscrunchy

Thanks to both of you. I took a look at that excellent Academia Vasca website that Robert linked above. There seem to be quite a few great places to sample fish and seafood in Getaria and, no doubt, all along that coast. Don't you wonder why Elkano gets al the praise..is their turbot so superior to that of the other fish houses in town (??)

Some information online leads me to believe that the B&B in Axpe does not always take bookings for one night only. I have written to them (waiting for response) but if I cannot book a spot there, I am looking at other options including in Durango (Gran Hotel de..) and at the Castillo de Arteaga, recommended by a poster on Chowhound as a good place to overnight after Exteberri.

My booking at Exteberri is for 13:30. Maybe it makes sense to just head for Getaria after lunch; not sure when sunsets in October but one of us will not drink much wine and so will be able to drive an hour or so......

Maria Cristina would be a splurge for us but we are willing to go for one of the less pricey rooms......I will have to take a further look at the various rooms and at the Londres options..

Robert2533

One of our favorites is the Villa Soro, which is about a 20-minute walk from the beach and the Kursaal Convention Center, and close the Arzak.

If you wanted a guide, then the best in Donostia is our friend Gabriella. She was the one mentioned in the NY Times' Travel Section, taking the writer around in the Pays Basque. She knows every chef in the Basque Country on a first name basis.

Castillo de Arteaga is located just outside of Gernika in the Urdaibai Biosphere Reserve, and is very nice. A good place to spurge.

Our favorite restaurant in Getaria is Zallo Berri, but then we've known the brothers, Inigo (chef) and Groka for several years. Gorka is the Sumiller and really knows his wines (www.zallobarri.com).

Elkano is well known because it has been around for a long time (1964) and the family is very accommodating. The first time we had lunch there, which was several years ago, they where completely booked, but set up a table for us anyway.

It also has two Repsol suns, which, in my option, is far better then a Michelin star.

ekscrunchy

Mendi Goikoa is not an option for sleeping after a meal at Extebarri, as they open only to groups that will occupy 5 or more rooms, except for August and Semana Santa.

So now looking into the best option for that Saturday night after lunch at Extebarri: Gran Hotel in Durango? Press on to Getaria? The Castillo de Arteaga? I will do further reading....maybe since we will head on to gEtaria anyway, we ought to arrive a day earlier than planned and do some day trips from there.....I'd love to read thoughts on this (fairly minor) decision! Thank you.

Robert2533

The drive to Getaria doesn't take that long. Durango isn't my favorite stop, but doable.

It apperas the Mendi Goikoa has switched to a different format through most of the year, bussiness meeting, weddings and groups Too bad. It's no longer listed in Alastair Saweay's Special Palaces. Such is life!

Robert2533

Two places to consider, near Gernika. Both are available on booking.com

Hotel Rural Urune Goikoa (www.urunehotela.com) recommend on i-escape
Aldori Landetxea (www.aldori.es) a member of Rustcae

yorkshire

It is an hour in the opposite direction, but I have had this hotel bookmarked for years, as I am an avid hiker and the surroundings look beautiful:
http://www.ellaurihotela.com/the_hotel/

Robert2533

Hotel Elluri is nice, but definitely in the wrong direction. It's on the other side of the Parque Natural Urkiola.

ekscrunchy

Thanks, Robert. Let me know if you happen to think of another inviting overnight spot within an hour or so drive after a Saturday lunch in Axpe...if not, I will consider arriving a day early in Getaria.

It would be great to find a very comfy and handsome guesthouse in pretty countryside..I took at look at the Nekatur listings but when I typed in Axpe in the search box, I was led to a different region of the area.....

I love that Basque restaurant site...I can see that once other things settle down here and I have time to research this trip, I will be spending lots of time with these excellent resources.. And then there is the decision about which of the uber-exalted restaurants in the area we should concentrate on....I do not want to dash from one "great" to another with nary a stop to savor tapas/pintxos and casual foods..

I will put together a list of places that sound great and solicit comments. For now, I guess Casa Nicolas in Tolosa is "the" place for lunch on market day, no?

Robert2533

Casa Nicolas works for us!