LarryJ

Recently I had to send a deposit to hold an apartment for October in France. I had never sent an international money wire before and worse yet neither had my small town mid-western bank branch of Bank One. After studying the procedure the girl at the bank told me she could wire the money in euros as the real estate office in France requested for the required 241 euros ($296 USD) and I would have to pay my bank a fee of $20 USD.

I agreed to the terms and off went my wire. A few days later the real estate office in France informed me that they received my wire but it was 43 euros short ($53 USD). I checked with my bank who then traced the transaction and was informed that my bank (Bank One) did not handle the entire transaction but turned it over to a New York Bank who then charged a fee and the receiving bank in France charged a fee for a total of $53 USD plus my bank's fee of $20 for a grand total of $73 USD in fees to send a stinking $296 and I still owe the guy in France another 43 euros.
All this despite the fact that my bank assured me (kinda like the blind leading the blind) that the $20 fee was all that was involved.

The realator in France is a gentleman and he told me to forget about the other 43 euros until I arrive and pay the remainder of my deposit with my rental fee balance.

Next time I will send euro denominated traveler's cheques from the auto club. Much as I swore I would never use another traveler's cheque I have found something they are good for.

I felt pretty stupid at first and then I felt pretty angry so I gave my bank a sample of my bad side and to my surprise they accepted the blame and reimbursed me for their share of the fees.

Hope nobody else makes the same mistake.

Larry J

bob_brown

I have sent apartment deposits to a couple of different places in Europe. (Although none were to sent to Fance.) Both times I sent a personal check which was held until I arrived and paid the rent in euro notes.

The agreement was that my personal check would be cashed if I did not turn up. I thought the whole deal demonstrated a high degree of mutual trust, and I can understand why someone would be reluctant to do it that way. However, I have done it twice with total success. The check was held until I paid, and the owner handed me my check which received a decent burial.

Graziella5b

Great idea. Once more I have to thank Bob Brown for great advice.

francophile03

Some hotels ask for a personal check as deposit-not credit card.

It's more inconvenient to send a check deposit. Hotel d'Angleterre (St. Germain) in Paris asks for this. The check was returned when I arrived. Just that I spent $25 or so to FedEx it to them since they give you a deadline. The hotel wasn't worth it in the end but that's a different story.

SalB

We have always used personal checks, to reserve both hotels and campgrounds. They simply keep the check and when we are ready to check out, they return the check and we pay by credit card or in euros. It's never been a problem and no one has ever lost a check.

I guess it never occurred to us to do anything else. No one has ever complained and we've always had a room.

bob_brown

Well, the person at the other end first had to suggest my sending a personal check. I wanted the apartment and I would have done what I needed to do to reserve it. So I was lucky to have two experienced apartment owners to deal with.

My second choice would have been to do what Larry suggested with the traveler's checks.

Also, I should have expressed my understanding of Larry's problem. I have been in the same boat.

Larry, take it from me, you did the best you could under the circumstances. I don't know why it is but some huge banks are most provincial when it comes to the best way to accomplish an interntional transfer of funds.

I actually had teller at a local bank tell me to send a check to Canada in US dollars because Canadian dollars were the same. Groan. So, all of you who run into the problem, I know what you are up against: ignorance.

Singletail

Holding someone's "personal check" made out in a foreign currency is certain done as a courtesy to the writer as much as anything. It is not any easier for someone to negotiate a personal check in a foreign country than it would be for any of us to "cash'" someone else's check made out in, say, Euros, here without paying fees, much less the commotion it would cause in some banks.
Some would say requiring one is a "token" at best and finding someone/an agency who does so seems like a good thing and certainly more convenient for the writer than what the original poster had to go through.

Cobos

I really can't understand how a bank can charge you that much for an international transfer and you still don't switch banks ? My bank lets me send my own wire transfer to foreign accounts and as long as I get all the data correct so it can be handled by the computer system they don't charge me anything at all. The receiving bank might but that is out of my hands...

Anyway another option for transfering money to a foreign national I've used myself is PayPal (it's not very cheap) but it works and is especially easy for smaller amounts..

Cobos

dcespedes

Thanks sharing your experience--I hope it helps someone else from making the same error some day. Take care.

NYCFoodSnob

LarryJ offers an excellent example of what happens in banks these days, especially if you deal with or trust the word of low-level employees on any transaction involving foreign money exchange. <b>It is vital for your protection that every discussion with a bank representative be done with a supervisor from the appropriate area and the name and extension of that person recorded for future reference.</b>

LarryJ, I would revisit your bank and speak to the manager and insist on getting those unknown fees reimbursed. If you weren't told of those fees, you should not be responsible for them, and any bank deserving of your loyalty will do the right thing.

ira

Good of you to post your warning, Larry.

mclaurie

It continues to amaze me that despite globalization of corporations AND computers, the money thing has still not been solved. We recently received a check in GBP &amp; our bank (a big one) told us we'd have to pay $75 to deposit it to our account as all foreign checks have to go to some main clearing place in Washington.

On this subject, some questions. Bob, are your personal checks in dollars??(I presume yes) If you send a travelers cheque, do you sign it twice before sending? Where/how do you use pay pal &amp; how much does it cost? (I've seen it on ebay etc. but wouldn't know how to use it persoanlly).

Joelleinitaly04

I had to wire a deposit to my apt in Rome and I also used my smalltown bank and it was the first time for them as well and I also feel I got hosed but I don't know what else I could have done.

At least I knew they were using a middle bank. Anyway, my deposit was supposed to be 300 Euro. I sent $490, between the fees on both sides and exchange rate, the rental agency ended up with 276 Euro. What a deal.

Joelle

marcy_

This is a situation where it would help to use a travel agent. I have reserved at places where they want a deposit check, and I just write a check to the travel agency and they take care of it.

Any good travel agency does this frequently, and has a system set up to deal with it. I don't know what means they use to change it to Euros and get it delivered, but I don't have to worry about it.

Of course when reserving somewhere that doesn't pay a commision to the travel agent, you will still pay the travel agent a fee, but it really saves a lot of hassle.

I like to do my own research and planning, but I still have my travel agent do all my booking for me (except flights).

Surfergirl

I bought a few things from a shop in Copenhagen that I had visited while I was there using email after I returned home. Since there was some snafu where they couldn't use my credit card, they provided me with their bank account number and routing number. I passed on the bank info to my bank (all by phone) and my bank (BofA) wire transferred the amount from my account to the shop's account. It was a very easy transaction, and didn't cost very much at all in bank charges, not more than $15 anyway. Larry, did you have the routing number and bank account?

LarryJ

To Surfergirl

Yes, I had all the necessary information including bank code number, guichet code number, realator's bank account number, key RIB number,and the swift number.

To Cobos,

Don't confuse an electronic bank transfer which is done in USD with an international wire. I use electronic transfers every month to pay credit card and a couple other bills with no fees involved. When you are sending money internationally in other than USD currency you must use an international wire not a free computer generated electronic transfer.


I realize that in many cases the apartment owner or real estate agency my accept a credit card number or your personal check in USD and then return it to you later. I did not have that option as the realator insisted on payment in euros. As I said before I could have sent euro denominated traveler's cheques at nearly no cost as I am a AAA auto club member but I wanted to settle the transaction quickly and did not feel $20 in fees was too much. I made the mistake of thinking my small town bank knew what they were doing. In my little town the bank people know how to cash checks and milk cows and not much else. Of course I know better now and will mail TCs in the future.

Cobos

Ahh I see were you get confused, whenever I transfer money in USD to someone in the US I'm doing an international wire transfer from my Norwegian bank which has my account balance in Norwegian kroner to a certain amount in USD (either a fixed USD amount or a fixed NOK amount exchanged for dollars). The fact that I for free pay my Norwegian bills to my Norwegian contacts is pretty normal so I didn't even mention that

I checked my banks international transfer rules and they only provide transfers to certian countries, mostly European and other &quot;western&quot; countries it seems. But it's still free and it takes about a week for the money to arrive in the recipients account.

About paypal their service is pretty simple and it's thoroughly explained on their website, but they do have fees as well so read the fine print. I've used them a few times to transfer money in the below $50 range and for that at least they work pretty good.

Cobos

Marilyn

Bottom line is that most smaller banks (local or regional) are very inexperienced with international transactions and cannot tell you what the costs will be. Most people do not realize this.

LeslieC

I only recall needing to do this once and I used an international money order successfully.

I would hesitate to use a travelers check since this would have to be signed twice, right?...thus is would be comparable to sending cash as far as lack of security if lost or stolen.

I'm curious to know if anyone has used Western Union. Their website describes International Money Transfer Service that you can do online for a fee of approx 10% of the amount being sent. You can charge it to your credit card, so I'm guessing the credit card bank might add a currency conversion fee but that's not likely to be any different than the normal fee for credit card use in a foreign country, right?

Surfergirl

If that's the case, Larry, you were robbed. If it were me, I'd be ragging so hard to the bank, they'd refund me all the charges incurred just to shut me up.