latedaytraveler

Have you ever been to either destination? I am thinking of visiting one when I go to London in early June. I would take the train from Charing Cross to SEVENOAKS on a weekday- from there it is a one and a half mile taxi ride to Knowl or a six mile fare to Chartwell.

Of course, I love all things Churchill and have always wanted to see Chartwell. But then I am reading the bio of Vita Sackville-West (she of Sissinghurst fame) who grew up at Knowl, but could not inherit the estate being a female (something like the opening part of Downton Abbey). Both are National Historic Trust properties, of course.

I enjoy gardens, but am more interested in the houses.

Could I do Chartwell in the morning and then saunter through Knowl before getting the train back to London? Do I have the energy? LOL

Going in June, I hope that I could gain entry to either without too much hassle.
Your thoughts appreciated.

PalenQ

Could I do Chartwell in the morning and then saunter through Knowl before getting the train back to London?>

I only took the train to the Knole and felt it was for most a 3-4 hours tops visit = plenty of time to taxi over to Chartwell IMO but not sure how long that place would take. I don't recall a lot of walking involved once at the Knole.

janisj

>>from there it is a one and a half mile taxi ride to Knowl or a six mile fare to Chartwell. <<

It is Knole

I'd try very hard to do both. Head to Chartwell first. It is a much smaller property but is really beautiful. Then call a taxi and head back to Knole. Be sure to travel on a Tuesday - AFAIK that is the only day of the week Knole's gardens are open.

latedaytraveler

PALENQ,
"I don't recall a lot of walking involved once at the Knole." Sounds good. Gracias

JANISJ,
Thanks for the spelling correction. I would head to Chartwell first. I am sure it is impressive...

europeannovice

HI Laredaytraveler

I know you are a Churchill fan and I highly recommend Chartwell. The house and grounds are beautiful. We didn't go into Knole only Sissinghurst but we passed outside Knole and it looks sprawling. Chartwell is charming inside and outside.

janisj

>>"I don't recall a lot of walking involved once at the Knole." Sounds good. Gracias<<

PQ must have visited a different Knole than I did. It really is enormous.

But you may not be able to see everything there because the NT is doing some long range refurbishment/restoration work in various parts. Don't know if it will affect which rooms you can visit in teh main house.

hetismij2

Check on the NT (www.nationaltrust.org.uk) website for opening times of both and details of what work is being done. Knole is effectively closed on Mondays, and the private gardens are only open on Tuesdays for instance.
At Chartwell entrance to the house is by timed ticket, with limited spaces. You should get there as soon as the visitor centre opens to get a ticket for the house.

annhig

Hi lateday,

I used to live in the same parish as Chartwell and walked there once or twice, though we normally drove as it was quite a hike!

Definitely go there first - you wouldn't want to get there after you'd done Knole and discover that there weren't any tickets left! it's lovely, and you must see the lake with the swans as well as the garden, and the famous wall supposedly built by Churchill, though local rumour has it that the builders that were working at Chartwell at the time used to tidy it up a bit! You can also draw your own conclusions about whether he was any good as an artist!

anyway, loads to see, and a very good cafe and shop as you'd expect from the National trust.

whether you go to Knole or just back to Sevenoaks, do get the taxi driver to take you to Ide Hill on the way back - an absolutely beautiful little Kent village - if you stop, you can walk up by the church to a seat where you get a wonderful view over the Weald of Kent. There used to be a little tea and gift shop there too as well as a nice village pub.

I don't remember Knole very well - I think that the house is probably quite interesting and the grounds are vast; I'm not sure that I ever saw the garden.

June in Kent should be gorgeous.

latedaytraveler

Hi EUROPEANTRAVELER, HETISMIJ2,

Thanks for your suggestions. I am an early bird and will get to Chartwell first thing in the morning.

Hi ANNHIG,

"whether you go to Knole or just back to Sevenoaks, do get the taxi driver to take you to Ide Hill on the way back - an absolutely beautiful little Kent village..." Sounds delightful.

I remember that you know Kent well when we discussed Leeds Castle on my 2014 trip. June is my favorite month in England...

annhig

i feel quite jealous, lateday - it's a while since I've been back to Kent now, probably a couple of years, and ages since I went to Chartwell.

PalenQ

Knole enormous? well maybe to janis but see the photos - the house itself does not require a lot of walking as I recall and the photos seem to confirm - but who knows what enormous means to one and to another. 2 hours max for the house IMO for the average traveler who does not want to look in every nook and cranny. But it has been a while and my memory is fading...fading...fading...gone! Report back on what you think. You can walk forever around the park and grounds perhaps if inclined.

https://www.google.com/search?q=the+...w=1920&bih=955

annhig

it's the grounds that are big, Pal - the park is enormous and goes round most of the back of Sevenoaks. That's all I meant [and what I suspect JJ meant too].

It's far too long since I went to the house [probably 30+ years] for me to remember it well or at all - except that it was quite dark. I'm not even sure that it was NT then; it may still have been in private hands. [I tried to find out when it was transferred to the NT but no-one, not even the NT website, wants to tell me!]

but the house is ++ big too - one of the 5 biggest in England according to what I was reading when trying to find out the answer to the question above.

Lateday - the NT website also reminded me that Toys Hill [next door to Ide Hill] is also very lovely, and there is a walk to the spot which first inspired Octavia Hill to start the NT which she did along with 2 other enthusiasts. She's buried in the parish church at Crockham Hill where we used to live, in a marble tomb inside the church, should anyone be interested.

latedaytraveler

Hi again PALENQ and ANNHIG,

Thanks for your observations of KNOLE and the link to the pics. Although I will head directly from the train station in Sevenoaks to Chartwell, I might get a glimpse of Knole before returning to London.

I am currently reading BEHIND THE MASK, the Life of Vita Sackville-West by Matthew Dennison. Vita, an only child, grew up at Knole and was totally captivated by the property and the painful awareness that it would eventually pass into the hands of a male cousin.

She married the diplomat/writer Harold Nicolson and together they later developed Sissinghurst, the most visited garden in Britain. Annhig, have you been there? There's more - they had rather an unconventional marriage - let's leave it at that. But her story is fascinating.

Interesting about Octavia Hill and the National Trust. Really looking forward to returning to London.

annhig

lateday - the "unusual" relationship between Vita, Harold, and Violet Trefusis is well known in the UK to the extent that there is a "comedy" radio series about it!

here's the link to Gloomsbury, staring the wonderful Miriam Margolyes and Alison Steadman:

http://www.comedy.co.uk/guide/radio/gloomsbury/press/

When we lived in Kent we visited Sissinghurst a couple of times but it was overrun by tourists [ie people like us] even then. Goodness knows what it's like now. The white garden has been very influential, to the extent that even I tried one! it's harder than you might think.

janisj

>>Annhig, have you been there?<<

I've been to Sissinghurst several times -- not always overrun but it often is. There is a beautiful B&B in the grounds -- I really want to stay there sometime.

annhig

jj - there was a fodorite who did just that and did a trip report which I have managed to find:

http://www.fodors.com/community/euro...ns-in-kent.cfm

lateday - if you scroll down to June 4th, you'll see that she goes to Knole [which she didn't like much] and to Chartwell, which she did.

latedaytraveler

Hi ANNHIG,

"the "unusual" relationship between Vita, Harold, and Violet Trefusis is well known in the UK to the extent that there is a "comedy" radio series about it!"

Interesting. Vita had a series of lesbian affairs which her husband tolerated (he called them "muddles") because he was doing his own thing in a manner of speaking. Yet they had two sons and a very close relationship in their own way. Both were devoted to writing and gardening.

Thanks so much for that wonderful link to VICKIEBYPASS'S trip report about her jaunt to various NT properties around Kent. Excellent, informative report. Now Knole is on back burner until I see Chartwell. Loved Vicky's description of her accomodations at Sissignhurst.

JANISJ, you wrote regarding Sissinghurst "I really want to stay there sometime." Well, the above report referenced by ANNHIG will give you a good sense of that experience.

janisj

>>JANISJ, you wrote regarding Sissinghurst "I really want to stay there sometime." Well, the above report referenced by ANNHIG will give you a good sense of that experience.<<

Yes -- I think vickeybypass' TR was the first time I had heard about the B&B accommodations.

northie

I visited Sissinghurst last year - it had been on my list for over 20 years . I did like the white garden and the veggie garden and orchard but was disappointed in the house . Crowds weren't too bad in May .
Saw the play Virginia and Vita years ago in New York with Vanessa Redgrave and Eillen Atkins - learnt a lot from it.!!!
Like the sound of Chartwell except my London friend wouldn't go - has unkind things to say about Churchill !!!
Another great place to visit in Kent is Hever Castle -beautiful grounds and buildings of Boleyn fame . There's a bnb there too.

latedaytraveler

Hi NORTHIE,

Thanks for weighing in. From reading the description of Vita's "house" at Sissinghurst in the above bio, her main interest was the tower with other buildings scattered around.

I believe that her grandson Adam Nicolson has written a book about Sissinghurst.