DreamOfItalia

My husband and I will be traveling to Italy end of June/beginning of July 2014. We are very excited and have done at lot of planning, taking many ideas from fodorites and other forums, books, etc. This will be the 6th visit for my DH and I. Friends have not been there before. Age range from 50's to 60's. All in good physical shape. Air arrangements: tried to fly into Florence and out of Naples - this was a no go related to frequent flyer miles. Also realize there are some tight timelines but we are ok with them. Our likes: honestly, we are open to all types of experiences. Following is the itinerary along with some questions that I know the experts will be able to answer or lead me to it.

Friday, June 27 Arrive Venice @ 9:15 am
Pick up at airport by Consorzio Motoscafi and taken to hotel - Hilton Molino Stucky. Cost - 100€ for 4 (I realize we could take the regular water taxi but I do not do well with time change and want to get to hotel as quick as possible).
Saturday, June 28 train to Florence @ 10:25 am arrive 12:30 pm. Pay for rental car (hertz) load luggage and walk around Florence (we did this a few years ago and all we needed to
do was pay for parking- made it easy). After lunch and walk, we head to Fattoria La
Loggia. (our 6th stay there- dh favorite place).
June 28- July 2 (4 nights) - during this time, we will take a day trip to Sant'Antimo Abbey -
monk chant, crypt (Pieta fresco carvings), and fresco by Giovanni di Asciano - this is on my
"must do" list as we have missed it on prior trips. Question: What else, if anything, do you
recommend we see along the way?
A few of the Tuscany towns we have visited in the past: pisa, lucca, greve, pienza,
montoriggioni (loved it), montepulicano, San giamano, siena.
Any other hidden gems you found?
July 2 - drop off car in Florence and train to Naples. One night in Naples. I know some of
you are going to frown at the one night. We were going to bypass Naples but I read many
good things about it on this forum so we decided to stay and see check it out for our next
visit
July 3 take local train to Herculaneum (been to Pompeii). I hired a driver (Lentino) that will
pick us up at Herculaneum and take us to our hotel in Praiano (200€ round trip - back to
Naples). Question: we would like to have lunch at the winery at the foot of Mt versuvius.
What is the best way to get there? I read somewhere that they started a new bus service.
Afterwards, we head to Praiano on the Amalfi Coast. For 3 nights (July 3 - 6). We are
staying at Villa Marggie. Any suggestions about the town from those who have stayed in
Praiano would be appreciated. I have read that there are ferries that can be taken directly
from Praiano? We were planning on visiting Laurito Beach (red fish boat).
July 6 we are headed Rome -with - 2pm pick up by the driver who will take us to Naples for
our 4:30 pm train to Rome.
Overnight Rome July 6 & 7 - dh and I have been here 6 times - we are going for the
convenience of the plane and for friends to visit Colosseo, forum and Vatican (or whatever
they want to do with the day)
Depart for US on July 8.

dulciusexasperis

All I can say is better you than me. Far too much time wasted moving around for my taste.

June 27 through July 8 including arrival and departure day is 12 days. You are going to move on the 28th, 2nd, 3rd and 6th. By my count that is 6 days out of your 12 on which you will not spend the day IN a place. Yes on some of those days you plan to squeeze a few hours in here or there but basically, they are lost days. Losing 50% of your total time like that is not best use of time in my opinion.

I can appreciate you are probably trying to give your friends a taste of much of what you are already familiar with. An enthusiasm and desire to share which many people have. But I think it will all end up just a blur for them.

Compare it to say spending 4 nights in Venice and then 6 nights in Rome with a day trip to Herculaneum or somewhere. That is a far more relaxed plan for your friends than what you are suggesting.

As I see it, your desire to show them places is one factor. Your prior trips which mean for example that you don't want to spend a week in Rome again perhaps is in conflict with your friends being first time visitors, is another factor. What you want to see and do that is new to you is a third factor. They are all conflicting factors.

sandralist

I am having a hard time knowing who is the "we" that you refer to in your posts when you say things like "there are some tight timelines but we are ok with them" because you also write things like "I realize we could take the regular water taxi but I do not do well with time change". Likewise you write "this is on my "must do" list as we have missed it on prior trips" and also write "We were going to bypass Naples but I read many good things about it on this forum so we decided to stay and see check it out for our next visit."

How was it decided that your friends would be okay with these tight timelines if they have never been to Venice and Florence before? Did they decide they wanted to see Naples so they could check it out for their next trip?

You know your friends better than strangers on the internet do and there are indeed people who join their friends for a foreign country tour on the basis of: "We want you to show us YOUR italy and anything you decide and any way you want to do it is fine with us. We are just thrilled to be going." If your friends have said that and you know they mean that -- or if you have shown them this itinerary and they have said "Perfect! The less time in cities sightseeing and the more time in your favorite Tuscan villa and the Amalfi coast -- hooray!" then don't change a thing.

But if you have not had many detailed discussions with them about what they would like to see in Rome or "whatever they want to do that day" then you are running a risk that your lovely friends might be very disappointed in their first Italian experience.

HappyTrvlr

Why only one jet lagged night in Venice?

DreamOfItalia

Dul - the conflicts you mention are real ones that I need to re-evaluate. I knew we were moving more than I like to but when you broke it down, I realized how much.

Dh and I wanted to see certain things, not spend time re-visiting places we had been to (in some cases more than once/twice) while at the same time hitting places our lovely friends wanted to see.
However, i have to ask myself - what type of experience are we lending them (and dh & I) to if it is too much in too little time? Maybe, even after seeing the schedule, our friends also didn't realize the amount of moving around we are doing in order to see certain sites.

Sand - my lovely friends wanted to join dh and I on our next trip to Italy and we (dh and I) were happy to have them join us. they have been involved in the plans all the way. Original plan for dh and i was Tuscany and amalfi coast. In 2011 when we were in Sorrento dh became I'll so we weren't able to continue with AC as planned.

I had provided everyone (dh and friends) with a detailed itinerary for review and it was even posted as a shared document.The lovely friends have reviewed and made comment, additions, etc. I am checking with them via email to see what cities they would be willing to drop (friends live in Houston and we are outside of philadelphia).

That being said, I am still very interested in hearing from anyone that has stayed in Praiano as this is everyone's first time there.

mamcalice

I really can't imagine going to Italy for the first time (your friends) and spending less than a day in Venice and Florence and 2 days in Rome. While Naples is definitely worth a visit, maybe not for less than a day.

But if you friends feel that this is your trip and they are just tagging along, maybe this will work for them. I would try, however, to eliminate one or two of the quick stops in favor of a more manageable trip.

jamikins

So great that you are open to feedback!

I think it's hard to understand how much time you lose to logistics if you have never been to Europe. Everything seems so close but it still takes time to get from one place to another!

cathies

Jamikins, this is their sixth trip to Italy! They should be very aware of logistics by now.

I think it worth considering skipping either Venice or Florence and give the one you decide on a bit more time. Less than 24 jetlagged hours in Venice might not be much fun and Florence seems to getting short shrift. There's no mention of going to see anything, just a walk around.

I don't really understand this trip, there's very little consideration for the fact that it's your friends first trip. They just get to tag long behind you for the most part and are welcome to see the highlights of Rome on the last day if they wish. They miss out on Pompeii because you've already been there. It seems a bit selfish to me.

Dayle

Dream,

I've stayed in Praiano on 2 trips. My first and my 3rd. No you cannot take ferries from Praiano. Their tiny, rocky beach is fishermen only (no dock)and it's over 300 stairs down - we counted.

You can only get the SITA bus, local buses that run all over the coast, or the samll orange bus that shuttles between Positano and Praiano.

If you want tourist oriented shopping (expensive clothes, jewelry, art), some nightlife, more restaurant selection,ferry service, LOTS of other visitors, and the postcard views you have always seen of the Amalfi - stay in Positano.

If you want quiet, very few visitors, more genuine local experience, and a couple good restaurants - choose Praiano.

My first trip I stayed at Albergo Fiori right on the main highway (boyfriend's family friends owners). Second trip I stayed at Le Sirene, down a few stairs from the church. Some rooms have great views. Lovely owners, good breakfasts.

I enjoyed dinners at La Brace, excellent food, friendly service, incredible views, right on the main road.

Regarding balancing your trip with new things for you, highlights for your first timer friends - you don't have to be joined at the hip the entire trip. You and your husband can go see new sights while your friends hit the main tourist sights - if that's what they want. It's easier to do this in cities, yes, but your city visits are only long enough for a walk around! No time to really see or do anything!

Personally, I would hate to arrive in Venice (one of the most unique cities in the world) in a jet lagged fog and have to leave in less than 24 hours. What frustration. A wasted stop. I understand you are trying to "hit" the major cities for your friends' sake, but in trying to do it all, you will all end up unhappy IMO.

Maybe take a new view of this trip - your friend's first trip to Italy will NOT be the typical!

First, skip Naples this time. Add that day to Venice.

Second, skip Florence, pick up your car and go straight to Tuscany for 4 nts. Your friends won't have time to see the highlights except from the outside. Again, very frustrating and a wasted day. Drop car in Chuisi or Orvieto depending on your hilltown visits. Don't backtrack to Florence.

Take the high speed train from Rome to Naples and visit the Amalfi Coast. Perhaps arrange for your driver to wait for you at Herculaneum either on the way to Praiano or on the return.

Spend 3 days in Rome. You and your husband could do a day trip while your friends see the typical highlights. Have you already been to Tivoli, Ostia Antica? Surely you can search out some very intersting new experiences in Rome. Much to see and do in Rome! I have a long list for my 3rd visit.....

The new strategy would be that your friends will fall in love with Italy, just like everyone does, and will return to do their own trip with the typical big 3, plus more.

Just my opinion. Maybe it gives you something to consider.

jamikins

Cathies I was referring to their friends reviewing the itinerary

yestravel

Too many one nighters -- can't imagine what you could possibly enjoy in just one night in a town like Naples or Venice - a walk around Florence is silly. As others have suggested, I would cut back - drop Naples and add to Venice.
Skip florence as its not worth just a walk around.

NYCFoodSnob

One night in Venice (a Friday, no less) to deal with jet lag? Then you have your friends, ages 50's and 60's, catching a 10:30 AM train to Florence (on a Sat in June) the following morning? I haven't even packed and I'm already assessing the friendship.

Has the Stucky guaranteed early check-in? You are aware that the word "guarantee" takes on a different meaning in other languages? What do you do if something goes wrong and you're stuck playing cheerleader, forcing your guests to juggle luggage in frustrating circumstances? What happens if one of your "friends" has an awful first-night's sleep, and she/he falls off the train's steps while trying to load luggage and breaks or sprains an ankle? (Been there, done that.) Are you prepared to take responsibility, because the "experienced" traveler did not build precautions into the itinerary?

I've experienced a 100º heat day in Venice in June. Are your friends ready to deal with heat and high humidity, in a jet-lagged fog, running to the train station to catch the 10:30?

I would find a new trip planner or seriously re-think this itinerary, especially if I wanted to keep these friends.

annhig

Sorry, Dream, I find myself agreeing with everything said by those up-thread.

The worst bit, IMO, is the first day. If I'd just arrived in Venice and found out that I was expected to leave the next day, just as i was getting over my jetlag, i think I'd probably kill you. No good you saying I'd agreed to it, I had no idea what I was agreeing to whereas you did. so i think you need a minimum of 2 nights in Venice, preferably 3, or what's the point of going there?

I also agree about omitting Florence - i would simply pick up the car and go to the agriturismo, perhaps doing a day trip to Florence while you are there.

That takes you up to 4th July, leaving you just time for 3 nights in Rome.

If you are determined to keep to your itinerary as posted, I would drop the night in Naples and go straight to your base south of Rome. I've not been to Priano, but it doesn't sound as if it's a great base for touring the area. Somewhere like Sorrento would be much better - lots of day trip opportunities, and relatively easy access to Herculaneum.

dulciusexasperis

Dream, I'm glad you are re-evaluating your plans. I read one comment in your response that strikes me as signifigant.

"my lovely friends wanted to join dh and I on our next trip to Italy and we (dh and I) were happy to have them join us."

I think that could be the way to cut the conflicting desires. I would suggest doing just what that says. Plan the trip YOU want to take and let your friends enjoy that part of Italy. Do NOT do anything that YOU do not want to do. I know that can sound selfish but I am going by what you wrote. They are joining you on YOUR trip.

If you do that, it sounds like you would eliminate a lot. As I read it, where you want to go to first is "Fattoria La
Loggia". So go there on the FIRST day. You'll suffer the jeg lag regardless of whether you go to a Venice hotel or make your way to Fattoria La Loggia. The advantage is that once you are there, you're there. Take the train to Florence, pick up the car and drive to your destination. No time in Venice, no time in Florence.

Stay 4 nights (27 through 30)and on the 1st return the car to Florence and take the train to Naples. Check it out as you say you want to do and spend the night.

On the 2nd do the trip to Herculaneum as planned and on to Praiano. Stay FOUR nights (2 through 5th).

On the 6th return to Naples and take the train to Rome. That gets you back to 2 nights in Rome (6th and 7th) before your flight on the 8th to home.

You will have one full day in Rome which is nowhere near enough for your friends but enough to whet their appetite to return. Spend that day with them, showing them the highlights as you will be quicker at getting around them and therefore packing the most in to that day than they would be on their own. Share your favourite places in Rome with them. That day is devoted to them.

I would discuss this plan with them obviously and tell them why it is as it is. You are conflicted by trying to please too many masters. Your wishes for yourself, your wish to share Venice and Florence a little, your expectations of what their wishes would be as first timers. You cannot serve 3 masters. So you must pick one.

I think if everyone understands clearly what the conflicts are, it shouldn't be hard for them to say, OK, let's do what you want to do, we'll go back another time on our own to do the 'big 3'.

mama_mia

Dream,
You must have a deep love of Italy if you are returning for your 6th visit. And, I would expect that your dear friends will also fall in love.

Meaning...there will be opportunity for return visits. Consider cutting back, as suggested by the above posts, and make this trip more enjoyable.

Also, if you want additional suggestions for hidden gems near the Fattoria La Loggia, you might post that as a separate question (it is kind of lost amid your itinerary notes). I suppose you have been to Montefioralle, although it is probably not "hidden." Same for Volterra.

cathies

Sorry jamikins, I misunderstood your comment.

jamikins

RonZ

The worst part of traveling is traveling, relocating from one place to another. Every move chews up half a day or more, no matter how far away it is.

One way to lessening the impact, in some cases, is to travel in the afternoon, having the hotels store your luggage after checkout in the AM. Then first thing next AM you can hit the ground running.

cathies

Oh, and I think you owe it to your friends to take them to Siena and to san Gimignano which are both fantastic and will be thoroughly enjoyed by a first time visitor.

DreamOfItalia

Appreciate some of the comments.

Dul- As you and others have suggested, I have taken out Naples, eliminating one overnight and adding a fourth night in praiano. We will visit Herculaneum on our way back from Praiano via driver. This week I will be in Houston on business (staying at my friends) and again review the itinerary.

Mama Mia - good idea. I will post separately for hidden gems. Yes. We have been to volterra but not montefiorelle. I will check it out.

Cathies- yes. We have been to sienna and SG but may be worth another visit.

Thank you for the suggestions.