Insurance for apartment rental in Paris
Jul 20th, 2015, 03:15 PM
#1
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Insurance for apartment rental in Paris
i want to rent an apartment in Paris next June. I have read all the caveats here and am sort of willing to take my chances, but would like to get insurance in case it doesn't work out. Does anyone know where I should buy this type of insurance. I don't need any other insurance, just for the apartment costs. I need to deposit half now and the rest 60 days before arrival.
Jul 20th, 2015, 06:59 PM
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<< but would like to get insurance in case it doesn't work out.>>
Much would depend on what you mean by that.
Any "insurance" you choose must cover your specific situation, as coverage is always limited to "covered reasons".
I have seen coverage that includes "accommodations have become uninhabitable" but it would be essential to understand the definition of that. Could cover dwellings affected by severe weather, or properties with plumbing/heating problems, a recent fire, or other situations. But, you would need to know whether it would cover potential "didn't work out" circumstances.
It would not likely cover property withdrawn at the last minute. But, then, whenever that has happened, no one (to my observation) has complained of not quickly receiving a full refund, so insurance would not be applicable in that situation.
Then, of course, you would be compelled to find alternate accommodations, perhaps last minute, and maybe far more costly for the best alternative you can find on short notice, if any, during busy periods.
Then, there's "cancel for any reason" coverage. With some, no questions asked, but with others, you do need a "reason" and there may be exclusions.
Whenever I've shopped "cancel for any reason coverage", the coverage is significantly limited and you're refund is almost exactly equivalent to the premium paid and your costs could be much higher.
The far better bet would be to select a property that is in compliance with the law.
Much would depend on what you mean by that.
Any "insurance" you choose must cover your specific situation, as coverage is always limited to "covered reasons".
I have seen coverage that includes "accommodations have become uninhabitable" but it would be essential to understand the definition of that. Could cover dwellings affected by severe weather, or properties with plumbing/heating problems, a recent fire, or other situations. But, you would need to know whether it would cover potential "didn't work out" circumstances.
It would not likely cover property withdrawn at the last minute. But, then, whenever that has happened, no one (to my observation) has complained of not quickly receiving a full refund, so insurance would not be applicable in that situation.
Then, of course, you would be compelled to find alternate accommodations, perhaps last minute, and maybe far more costly for the best alternative you can find on short notice, if any, during busy periods.
Then, there's "cancel for any reason" coverage. With some, no questions asked, but with others, you do need a "reason" and there may be exclusions.
Whenever I've shopped "cancel for any reason coverage", the coverage is significantly limited and you're refund is almost exactly equivalent to the premium paid and your costs could be much higher.
The far better bet would be to select a property that is in compliance with the law.
Jul 20th, 2015, 10:25 PM
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Everyone who has mentioned this is correct - insurance companies will not reimburse you if you have engaged in an illegal activity. Whether you have signed a contract or not, you have "engaged", once money has changed hands.
You can certainly purchase any insurance you desire, but you will only be wasting your money.
If you are willing to gamble, you have to be prepared to lose your investment.
If you desperately need a kitchen and the illusion of more space, you should rent a legal apart'hotel from one of the well-known chains like Citadines or Adagio.
You can certainly purchase any insurance you desire, but you will only be wasting your money.
If you are willing to gamble, you have to be prepared to lose your investment.
If you desperately need a kitchen and the illusion of more space, you should rent a legal apart'hotel from one of the well-known chains like Citadines or Adagio.
Jul 21st, 2015, 09:36 AM
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When I rented one in Paris, the agency required insurance in order to rent (the owners' insurance wouldn't cover it, I imagine, maybe it was just their rule). This agency had official legal contracts in French and also a tie-in to a French insurance company that would provide the insurance, they just sent me a link. It was very convenient and pretty cheap, I think it only cost me about 20 euro for a week. That was Lodgis.fr (the agency/website).
However, what you are asking is simply trip insurance, not homeowners/renters insurance, and for you to get paid if your activity turns out to be illegal and the apt is not available, I gather? Well, it seems to me if that were the case and the owner can't rent, they should refund your money, don't you? Why not just refuse to rent from anyone who doesn't put that into the contract, that if the apt is unavailable to you for any reason, you get a full refund. That would cover any situation, such as if there were a fire or all the plumbing went out, whatever.
However, what you are asking is simply trip insurance, not homeowners/renters insurance, and for you to get paid if your activity turns out to be illegal and the apt is not available, I gather? Well, it seems to me if that were the case and the owner can't rent, they should refund your money, don't you? Why not just refuse to rent from anyone who doesn't put that into the contract, that if the apt is unavailable to you for any reason, you get a full refund. That would cover any situation, such as if there were a fire or all the plumbing went out, whatever.
Jul 21st, 2015, 09:50 AM
#11
An advantage to using Airbnb is that if you arrive to find your apartment not available for any reason, they promise to find you another. You will have paid the company with a credit card and the owners aren't paid until after your first night. Your credit card, if you're paying with a credit card, will refund your money for goods & services not received but they won't find you another place to stay.
Jul 21st, 2015, 10:40 AM
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What Lodgis did was not really kosher, since the property owner is bound by law to provide his own property/casualty insurance and keep it current. Since this insurance also covers anyone visiting the property, it seems that someone was getting paid double.
I don't know how rental agencies get away with passing this fee on to clients, and don't really think whatever paperwork Lodgis provided you would hold up in court, in the event something happened.
I don't know how rental agencies get away with passing this fee on to clients, and don't really think whatever paperwork Lodgis provided you would hold up in court, in the event something happened.
Jul 21st, 2015, 12:38 PM
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I don't really recall what it covered, it wasn't much money so it didn't bother me. Maybe because I wasn't just a "visitor" but renting it, perhaps that's why it was required. It wasn't just Lodgis doing this, it was a French insurance company, also, they were selling the policy and knew what it covered and that it was coming through Lodgis. I sort of remember reading some legal issues about how the homeowners' insurance wouldn't cover it if it were being used for business and rented out (not just for Lodgis, but France in general), but it's been a few years so perhaps I forget. The Lodgis contract was not regarding the insurance, but the rental contract.
If I were renting out my home, I'd like it if the renter had their own insurance to cover anything that might happen to them there or their belongings, also. Or if they started a fire. I wouldn't want to make a claim on my own insurance for someone like that. It's not just a visitor, in that case.
I think this was the company http://abritel.europ-assistance.com/...nsurance-guide
But I don't think this is what the OP is referring to, anyway.
If I were renting out my home, I'd like it if the renter had their own insurance to cover anything that might happen to them there or their belongings, also. Or if they started a fire. I wouldn't want to make a claim on my own insurance for someone like that. It's not just a visitor, in that case.
I think this was the company http://abritel.europ-assistance.com/...nsurance-guide
But I don't think this is what the OP is referring to, anyway.
Jul 21st, 2015, 12:40 PM
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<<If you desperately need a kitchen and the illusion of more space, you should rent a legal apart'hotel from one of the well-known chains like Citadines or Adagio.>>
Either you've never been in a rental apartment, or your sense of proportion is really bad. I've done two hotel stays and one short term rental in a 2 BR apartment in the 7th. Believe me, there was more than an "illusion" of more space in the rental. And, the place we stayed was a lot different from a Citadines. It's a different experience that is valued by folks around the world. If Paris want to lock out that experience within Paris, so be it. But don't try to pretend that what you are suggesting is the same experience.
As to the OP, I agree with the others that you aren't likely to collect on trip insurance for an apartment rental that doesn't happen because of legal reasons. If you pay the landlord directly with a credit card, that might give you some scope for recovering your cost, but I wouldn't count on that, either.
Either you've never been in a rental apartment, or your sense of proportion is really bad. I've done two hotel stays and one short term rental in a 2 BR apartment in the 7th. Believe me, there was more than an "illusion" of more space in the rental. And, the place we stayed was a lot different from a Citadines. It's a different experience that is valued by folks around the world. If Paris want to lock out that experience within Paris, so be it. But don't try to pretend that what you are suggesting is the same experience.
As to the OP, I agree with the others that you aren't likely to collect on trip insurance for an apartment rental that doesn't happen because of legal reasons. If you pay the landlord directly with a credit card, that might give you some scope for recovering your cost, but I wouldn't count on that, either.
Jul 21st, 2015, 10:54 PM
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We were serial renters in Paris for 5 years before purchasing our own apartment - a grand total of 32 apartments - all of them were different, but most of them were not wonderful, comfortable or spacious at all! We have also placed family and friends in Citadines and Adagio, so yes - I know more of what I'm talking about than you do after one apartment stay in the 7th.
A lot has to do with budget - if someone has big bucks, it's pretty easy to find "typical Parisian apartments" (which are actually far from that actuality) but are designed to suit the Anglophone notion of a nice hotel room with an American-style kitchen. We stayed in exactly two of these, and they were very nice indeed, but the rest of the time, we had to budget more modestly and had a more typical experience.
What the average person on a moderate budget gets is a 30m2 space, which includes all the measurable centimeters in the bathroom, kitchen, closet, hallway and any unusable space under the eaves or stairs. Add a 2 ring hotplate and a small microwave and a dorm fridge, and there's your kitchen. Granted, there's usually an upholstered chair and a teeny table somewhere, but it's all crammed together.
So yes - there is an illusion of space, comfort etc. It all has to do with how long you can sustain your fantasy.
The first time we stayed in a "real" typical Parisian apartment, we thought it was quaint. After that, it became much less so and was frankly just a place to sleep - even making coffee in the crappy coffeepot that hadn't been cleaned since the Dawn of Time was not appetizing.
What is amusing - and sad, really - is all these people who report marvellous stays in fabulous apartments. You never hear from the others who weren't so lucky - and they are in the majority.
A lot has to do with budget - if someone has big bucks, it's pretty easy to find "typical Parisian apartments" (which are actually far from that actuality) but are designed to suit the Anglophone notion of a nice hotel room with an American-style kitchen. We stayed in exactly two of these, and they were very nice indeed, but the rest of the time, we had to budget more modestly and had a more typical experience.
What the average person on a moderate budget gets is a 30m2 space, which includes all the measurable centimeters in the bathroom, kitchen, closet, hallway and any unusable space under the eaves or stairs. Add a 2 ring hotplate and a small microwave and a dorm fridge, and there's your kitchen. Granted, there's usually an upholstered chair and a teeny table somewhere, but it's all crammed together.
So yes - there is an illusion of space, comfort etc. It all has to do with how long you can sustain your fantasy.
The first time we stayed in a "real" typical Parisian apartment, we thought it was quaint. After that, it became much less so and was frankly just a place to sleep - even making coffee in the crappy coffeepot that hadn't been cleaned since the Dawn of Time was not appetizing.
What is amusing - and sad, really - is all these people who report marvellous stays in fabulous apartments. You never hear from the others who weren't so lucky - and they are in the majority.
Jul 22nd, 2015, 07:12 AM
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manouche: The rental rate a reasonable person would pay for a vacation property, and what one would pay for day to day living, are obviously not going to be the same. They are different markets. Intelligent folks looking to rent for a vacation stay aren't going to be stuck with the kinds of apartments you are imagining.
Jul 22nd, 2015, 07:26 AM
#17
"Intelligent folks looking to rent for a vacation stay aren't going to be stuck with the kinds of apartments you are imagining."
I think you're confusing intelligence with budget. I agree with manouche and my experience has been of places such as she describes, except no room for the chair.
Money has a way of encouraging ignorance of the real world and the people who vacation in it, and I think twk's comment above falls into that category.
I think you're confusing intelligence with budget. I agree with manouche and my experience has been of places such as she describes, except no room for the chair.
Money has a way of encouraging ignorance of the real world and the people who vacation in it, and I think twk's comment above falls into that category.
Jul 22nd, 2015, 08:25 AM
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An awful lot of really questionable and impertinent information, some of it from the usual suspects who have an antiapartment agenda.
To the OP: You really don't need insurance at all. If you want to reduce your risk, you should book through an agency and not directly with an apartment owner. Check to see see that the agency will refund any money you've paid if the apartment owner cancels the rental (which is your concern). Airbnb, for example, explicitly states that <b>"If your reservation has been canceled and you’d prefer not to book another space on Airbnb, you can ask for a full refund, including Airbnb guest service fees, online at any time."</b> Also, you should of course also book a fully-cancelable hotel reservation in case the apartment rental does fall through.
To the OP: You really don't need insurance at all. If you want to reduce your risk, you should book through an agency and not directly with an apartment owner. Check to see see that the agency will refund any money you've paid if the apartment owner cancels the rental (which is your concern). Airbnb, for example, explicitly states that <b>"If your reservation has been canceled and you’d prefer not to book another space on Airbnb, you can ask for a full refund, including Airbnb guest service fees, online at any time."</b> Also, you should of course also book a fully-cancelable hotel reservation in case the apartment rental does fall through.
