I'm a proud tourist!

There has been some anti american sentiments in Europe since the Iraq war so you may occassionally get some negative treatment from the local as soon as you approach them. You'd understand what I'm saying if you've been caught in some anti american protests as I have in France, Italy, Austria & Germany.

On the other hand in other cities/places it is cool to be american, so it just depends where you're travelling.

"I keep reading about the importance of "not looking like a tourist" "

Huh?? You may read all sorts of threads asking "How do I avoid looking like a tourist". But that vast majority of answers say basically "wear what you want."

Dax,, I am shocked( and frankly am sceptical that you stumbled into Anti American protests in FOUR different countries, how unlucky is that!!!??,, I sure didn't notice any anti American anything in Europe this summer, so I think you must have been just really unlucky.. or perhaps you miscontrued some comments as anti American when they were anti tourist , and America was not even mentioned.

Back2Sabi I totally agree with you, go and have fun.. its the novice tourists that worry too much about what to wear, some of us who have been around just don't care anymore( within limits of course, dressing neatly and appropriately to venue, no tube tops in churches, etc)

interesting you assumed I was an American... I never said so. (Do only Americans have the monopoly on parkas? or are they the only ones who would dare "stick out"?) I'm not suggesting wearing a flag coat or anything. (Lord knows I haven't been the happiest patriotic camper these last eight years...) Just want to some comfy walking shoes. Is that so wrong?

I tend to think that as individuals go, people are generally civil. It's the government that gives us a bad name.

Bosama: I don't think I was unlucky, it was just an eye opener.

The first one happened in downtown Vienna where I suddenly was faced by a group of protesters yelling and carrying a banner protesting american invasion of Iraq right after we took control of Iraq.

On another trip we had to break through a human wall of protesters to enter a McDonalds in Nurgnberg with the local police escorting us. It was somewhat exciting, my daughter & I didn't feel as threatened because the protesters seemed to be organized highschool students. I figure if we don't break the chain nobody else would since it was on the news at that time that many american businesses were being boycotted in Germany.

In Rome there was a sea of protesters on the day that Bush landed. That's probably the scariest situation because there were thousands of angry people and they were not just anti Bush, they were loud & clear anti american.

In Paris it was my wife who ran into a large group of protesters while I was at the hotel. She was quite affected that she decided to go back to the hotel immediately.

DAX,

Wow. You were unlucky. Protests against the US don't happen that often. There were more right after the Iraq invasion but less now.

Switzerland usually has one during the WEF but it rarely gets out of hand.

A calm protest is a good thing that shows freedom of speech. And protests against the US are usually about politics or capitalism and not towards US citizens themselves.

I'm a proud tourist!

Excellent! Enjoy your travels!

Hi Back2Sabi

I am guessing from your name that you are a South African. I agree that there's nothing wrong with looking like a tourist. Comfort is everything!!! Besides, the economies of the countries that we visit benefit from the fact that we are tourists, so we have a lot to be proud of.

We'll be in Paris in December too and we'll be dressed just like you - you'll recognise us because we'll have our maps and cameras out and we'll be looking very confused, absolutely delighted and in total awe of everything around us.

Enjoy!

DAX wrote: "On another trip we had to break through a human wall of protesters to enter a McDonalds in Nurgnberg with the local police escorting us."

Why did you have to do that?

"I'm going in there; it's the patriotic thing to do; we'll show them that America means business."

Mr P, You don't know if she is American or not. Dont jusmp to conclusions. And Miss Janis, have you taken a survey? Do you have data. Back to your old ways I see!

travelme wrote: "Mr P, You don't know if she is American or not."

Yes, I do. DAX is American (and male).

What underlies this apparent obsession of yours with trying to have a go at me?

Yes I'm a tourist, loud and proud. Here is my prayer:

The Tourist Prayer

Heavenly Father, look down on us, your humble tourist servants who are doomed to travel this earth, taking photographs, mailing postcards, buying souvenirs and walking around in drip-dry underwear.

We beseech You, Oh Lord, to see that our plane is not hijacked, our luggage is not lost and our overweight baggage goes unnoticed. Protect us from surly and unscrupulous taxi drivers, avaricious porters and unlicensed English-speaking guides.

Give us this day divine guidance in the selection of our hotels, that we may find our reservations honoured, our rooms made up and the hot water running from the correct tap if at all. We pray that the telephone works, that the operator speaks our tongue and that there is no telegram waiting from our children which would force us to cancel the rest of the trip.

Lead us, Dear Lord, to good inexpensive restaurants where the food is superb, the waiters friendly and the wine included in the price of the meal. Give us the wisdom to tip correctly in currencies we do not understand. Forgive us for undertipping out of ignorance and overtipping out of fear. Make the natives love us for who we are and not for what they can screw out of us.

Grant us the strength to visit museums, cathedrals, palaces and castles listed as "musts" in guidebooks, and if perchance we skip a historic monument to take a
nap after lunch, have mercy on us, for our flesh is weak.

For husbands only:
Dear God, keep our wives from shopping sprees and protect them from bargains which they neither need nor can afford. Lead them not into temptation for they
know not what they do.

For wives only:
Almighty Father, keep our husbands from looking at foreign women and comparing them with us. Save them from making fools of themselves in cafes and nightclubs. Above all please do not forgive them their trespasses for they know exactly what they do.

Together:
And when our voyage is over and we return to our loved ones, grant us the favour of finding willing audiences and a sympathetic ear for our stories, so that our lives as tourists shall not have been in vain.

Amen

But the Op just said "looking like a tourist" and the thread has been hijacked by people who assume he/she is American and therefore sees the world with American eyes.

Could be American for all I care.

But Back2, I agree absolutely with what you are saying. If you are going to say in a few luxe places and travel between them in a similar style, and carry mega amounts of luggage, then maybe you can look perfectly groomed and well dressed all the time. Whether the style will be that of the country you are visiting is another matter.

But we ordinary people take stuff we are not too bothered about. It could be lost in transit, or destroyed by laundry services. We also wear travel pants which are a dead giveaway I reckon. And we take SENSIBLE SHOES - because it is far more important to be able to get out there and walk than it is to get out of the door looking smart.

Who cares? The locals will know you're not a local pretty much whatever you do.

Especially when you open your mouth.

Ha Ha.

Cheers

<<I'm amazed by the great amounts of money people spend to "blend in.">>

Really? I've been reading these boards for years and years and don't recall any posts about folks spending a lot of money to "blend in." Can you cite your sources?

<<After all, everyone figures out you're not from "here" the second you open your mouth.>>

Kindly speak for yourself.

<<My mantra: Better to "look like a tourist" than "act like a tourist.">>

So yours is a snobbism of a different kind, eh? Is that because it costs less to act like a tourist than to dress like one?

I think the reason "tourist" is a dirty word is not because of maps and comfortable shoes. I think it comes from a lack of respect for a culture if your tourist comforts insult the culture.

Wearing comfortable clothes into a restaurant where everyone else has spent the time and effort to dress nicely is a tourist insult. Possibly even being the only one on a Paris street in shorts and tennis shoes is also an insult. You are taking away from everyone's view of what Paris should look like.

But I think you've found a happy medium between practicality and not insulting a culture.

I usually look like me. I was actually in Paris when the current war broke out, & in my many trips to Europe have had only one instance of any type of bad behaviour towards me. I think DAX either a) exaggerates a bit or b) may cause some reaction based on what his own actions. By the same token, I am not 'advertising' that I am a tourist by wandering around lost, map in hand, etc. as it can make you a target. As a person who is constantly approached by persons abroad for directions and such, it would appear to some that I (at the very least) appear to know what I am doing...Looking like a tourist w/a big bag of photography equipment will draw attention, that you don't want, or need. I also very much doubt that you'll need a parka. After all, if it is raining, it can't be all that cold, can it ??

When I travel I like to be comfortable and to wear appropriate clothing for the weather. I also would like to be treated respectfully and respect is gained by looking presentable and behaving decently.

Take the common safety precautions - don't be an easy target for criminals.

So enjoy being a tourist, respect the country you are in and their customs and be aware of your surroundings.

When you travel you are a representative of your country whether you like it or not.

"Tourist" is not a dirty word in the German language. When did it become one in English?

kelliebellie wrote: "Wearing comfortable clothes into a restaurant where everyone else has spent the time and effort to dress nicely is a tourist insult."

I'm in trouble, then. All my clothes are comfortable.

But perhaps I'm not in too much trouble: if dining in a particular restaurant requires that I be uncomfortable, then I don't want to dine there.

schuler wrote: " "Tourist" is not a dirty word in the German language. When did it become one in English?"

German tourists?

"tourist"

Merriam-Webster:
one that makes a tour for pleasure or culture

Encarta.msn:
a traveler who visits places away from home for pleasure

Doesn't sound bad to me...

Ms. Bear and I spent the month of May in Paris. Most people seemed to figure out that we were English-speaking, hence visitors. Our attitude (and I hope it was expressed in our behavior) was that we were not locals but wanted to experience what locals did and both accepted and valued the opportunity to blend in. We tried to be "pretty" (? = opposite of "ugly") Americans and received nothing but friendly treatment within the limits of cultural variations in interpersonal style. No one treated us more rudely than they did each other; and for our part, we never took the attitude "How much is that in real money?" Being a "proud" tourist means never having to say/act that you are sorry to be there!

"[wearing shorts]you are taking away from everyone's view of what Paris should look like."

Assuming the people of Paris give a rat's fart what you're wearing is an insult to Parisians' common sense and requires a level of self-obsession even Barack Obama might find excessive.

Fashion is boring.

Questions about fashion are boring.

People who worry about fashion are boring.

JMHO.

Padraig -

I meant "comfortable" in the American sense as in sweat pants and gym shoes. I wasn't suggesting that everyone in nice restaurants are wearing corsets. And if all you in fact own are sweat pants and gym shoes, then yes, stay out of nice restaurants.


flanneruk -

I would think wearing short and gym shoes down the streets of Paris because I'm more comfortable that way involves the self obsession. I'm leaving this topic now.

Back2Sabi, Are you relatively new to Fodor's? I can't say I've ever read post about people spending a bunch of money to blend in or anything recently about the "importance" of not looking like a tourist. I don't think that's a common opinion on this board.

But I am in agreement with you that there is nothing wrong with a neatly dressed & easily identifiable tourist. I work in downtown Seattle in a popular area and see "them" all the time, from all over the world. Easy to spot (neat sporty shoes, street map in hand, property dressed for the weather -unlike Seattle natives!) but I'm not saying that in a negative way.

The thing about staying out of anywhere in Europe if you are wearing athletic shoes ("trainers") is about the funniest thing I've read here in weeks.

Padraig: Totally ignore travelme. S/he has some sort of snarky obsession about me too. S/he managed to have a go at both of us in one teensy post. It does get old - travelme's posts seldom add anything to the discussions other than slamming other posters. But I guess if one doesn't have a life . . . . .

There must be something strange about me.
I live in the North of England and if I visit London, I wear exactly the same clobber that I wear at home.
It's just the same if I cross the Channel. Bald-headed old coots in Italy or France look very similar to me.
I don't feel that I need to buy myself special tourist gear.
In London, I carry my trusty A to Z and think that many Londoners do the same.
I carry a small digital camera with me, so I suppose that I might look like a tourist if you look carefully.

Padraig: I don't think you have to worry about it this year. The experiences I described didn't happen this summer but rather within the last few years since the Iraq war started. I'm only writing them down as an argument which Back2Sabi asked for.

We didn't HAVE to break the 3 layers of human chain blocking people from entering McDonald at that time. We just chose to because we felt bad for the owner to be the victim of circumstance. They were nice to reward my daugter with all kinds of goodies for willing to get inside. Plus the local police was there to help us break through, the protesters didn't look wild and angry as in Vienna & Rome plus I was getting used to it maybe. With the exception of the thousands of protesters in Rome, they were all small groups of protesters.

It's true that it has always been said that they're protesting against Bush & the US government, but when you're in the middle of those situations it doesn't matter anymore.

Padraig, you act surprised when some calls you on writing a nasty and negative comment. No obsession just a sort of duty I suppose.

Hi Back2Sabi, no matter what you wear on your feet - they will hurt!! If it's doable ie your accommodation is conveniently located, then I find it helpful to change shoes 1/2 way through the day.

Hope you have a fabulous trip! I'm determined to visit Paris in the winter. Not sure when, but it will happen!

I have been in Europe for 13 years. I have yet to meet an anti-American European. I have yet to be hasseled any way as an American. Instead I have been treated as a guest and forgiven for cultural glitches. 99% of the travellers I see, Europeans and Americans and all others wear the same garb. Actually looking like a tourist or visitor may be a god-send. A lady in London grabbed me as I was about to step into the path of a bus...it was coming the other way. A young lady in Trencin, Slovakia called a taxi for us as the station was closed. She waited until it arrived and then told the driver where we wanted to go. I suspect that what some know are 'travel legends'.

Must defend Sabi here, as I've read a lot of posts asking whether to buy this kind of shoe or that kind of shoe; this kind of waterproof rather than that kind of waterproof - like going on holiday to a different country means you needed a whole new wardrobe.

And the posts were well patronised with brand names touted, etc. Personally I just hope I can find something that will "do" in my wardrobe.

Would like to know from SanParis2 which war we are talking about:

"I was actually in Paris when the current war broke out".

Cheers

Travelme wrote: "Padraig, you act surprised when some calls you on writing a nasty and negative comment. No obsession just a sort of duty I suppose."

You never let the truth get in the way of your prejudices, do you?

99% of the travellers I see, Europeans and Americans and all others wear the same garb.

Yep. The labels may change, but not much else.

Personally, I dress largely the same when I travel as when I am at home (Denmark).

- If it is hot, I will wear shorts, except in countries where it will cause serious offense. I can't think of a single country in Europe where that would be true.
- I only wear a suit or slacks to places that explicitly require them. I wear jeans to work and figure that they are good enough for just about anywhere.
- I don't wear a backpack, but that is just because I prefer an over-the-shoulder bag.
- I'm going to take pictures. This means I have to tote a camera. No way around it.
- I carry a guidebook and a map. I am not going to scurry into a corner to read it. The street corner is good enough.

However, if I am going to a venue (restaurant, concert, etc) that has a dress code, I will dress accordingly.

I've never buy special "travel clothes" myself. As someone was mentioning above seems funny. I just take the best of my normal wardrobe appropriate to the season.

" I just take the best of my normal wardrobe appropriate to the season."

That's exactly the opposite of what I do. I try to bring clothes that I don't like so I can throw them away after I wear them and not carry much dirty laundry when I get home. It's the best time to do so since it's less likely that you'd run into people you know when you're travelling out of the country.

This is a problem that seems to plague Americans (of whom I am one) more than people of other nationalities. It's not that we don't want to appear to be tourists, per se, it's that many of us are afraid of being confused with those other tourists that we refer to as the Ugly Americans.

The term was the title of a 1958 novel, in which one character says, "A mysterious change seems to come over Americans when they go to a foreign land. They isolate themselves socially. They live pretentiously. They're loud and ostentatious. Perhaps they're frightened and defensive, or maybe they're not properly trained and make mistakes out of ignorance."

The UA designation is now used to describe those rude, arrogant, noisy Americans who behave in foreign countries in ways that embarrass the rest of us. It has nothing to do with fashion. It has everything to do with not wanting to be confused with "them."

I am a Californian and every time I travel to the south, I hear "Y'all aren't from around here, are you." Can't even blend in my own country - even if the south sometimes feels like a foreign land Forget blending in other places.

weindell wrote: "... many of us are afraid of being confused with those other tourists that we refer to as the Ugly Americans..."

Given how obnoxious some of them are, I fully sympathise.

But be reassured: most Europeans know the difference between a normal American and an ugly American. It generally has little to do with how people dress, whether they carry guidebooks and cameras openly, or show other signs of "being a tourist". It has a great deal to do with how people behave, and the mindset that seems to underpin their behaviour. I'll probably spot an ugly American at 50 paces; the rest can probably come within 5 paces before I even notice that they are American.

Padraig wrote:
You never let the truth get in the way of your prejudices, do you?

You do what you do best. Calling the kettle the black!

DAX~ Yes I've heard of that idea, but I am unwilling to wear clothes that should be thrown out for a trip to Europe. Call me crazy but I want to look nice even if no one knows me.

suze wrote: "Call me crazy but I want to look nice even if no one knows me."

The world is full of potential friends. It's a good idea to be prepared.

Padraig wrote:
The world is full of potential friends. It's a good idea to be prepared.

Nothing beats good manners.

Since you are talking about tourists and bad cinema - did anybody see the movies "Tourista" and/or "Hostel"?

But be reassured: most Europeans know the difference between a normal American and an ugly American.

And, rest assured, most Americans can tell the difference between a normal European and the types that seem to plague many parts of the world. You know who you are - topless women in Thailand, obnoxious stag and hen parties in Eastern Europe, short shorts and tank tops in the Middle East, the buses that drop off Brits in Amsterdam every weekend, basically everyone on vacation in the south of Spain, etc.

The problem with the "ugly American" stereotype is that there isn't much evidence that Americans are, on average, any uglier than any other tourist group.

Weindell,

I know I could look it up. But that book you mention sounds interesting. Can you remember the author and is it worth reading?

And are you sure that the use of the term on this forum is borrowed from the book title?

As an aside, on my various travels I've come across Americans rarely. When I have they have been brilliant company.

But few Americans (compared to other OECD nationalities) travel independently. So you are more likely to come across them in herds - on tours. And it is quite funny to watch such a tour group going by. They are all wearing super-clean gear. The day packs without a mark; the shoes without a scuff. The t-shirts freshly out of their wrapping.

All bought for the trip one assumes.

I'm not saying that I don't sometimes have to go out any buy something new, but I am 100% with whoever it was who said you take stuff with you that you don't mind losing. And you'll be happy to bin when you get home.

Once again, it's how you travel. Two week all-organised trip - new clothes. Trip of whatever duration doing your own thing (probably not for the first time) then you aren't so fixated on what you are going to wear. You just need enough to keep you warm and enough to cater for times when you won't be able to get them clean again.


Nuff said.

sometimes mc donald protests have to do with vegetarian/ animal treatment issues and also with locations of the business vis-a-vis across the street from a memorial, etc...

The authors of the book "The Ugly American" are William Lederer and Eugene Burdick. It wasn't about UA tourists so much as misguided, blundering American diplomacy efforts in Asia.

afterall, I'm glad that your encounters with American tourists have been positive. I must have met you somewhere in my travels then?

And I know that it's not only Americans that can be ugly tourists. I've seen a lot of British and German visitors to my home state of Florida that were pretty obnoxious, and no, I haven't formed an opinion about Brits and Germans in general based on that sunburned, beer-swilling, loud-talking lot at Disney World.

I know of several Americans who travel frequently to Europe, who, when asked by Europeans if they are Americans, claim falsely to be Canadian. No one appears to hate the Canadians the way so many appear to hate Americans. Not all Americans are so defensive, of course, but quite a few are, and thus try very hard not to appear to be tourists and call attention to themselves.

Sadly, there are people who prey on tourists with various pick-pocket schemes, thievery, and the like. Tourists are often easily distracted and do carry money or other valuables with them. If you blend with the population, you are less likely to be picked out as a victim. Note "blend" does not mean "dress identically."

But few Americans (compared to other OECD nationalities) travel independently.

Do you actually have any evidence of this? I would be interested to hear if this is actually the case. If one bundled cruises in with the non-independent travel numbers, then it might make sense. But, would this be enough to outweigh the much greater prevalence of the package holiday in Europe?

And the scene on the ground doesn't really match up with this claim, either. The Costa del Sol wasn't built for Americans. Neither were the more downmarket Greek resorts. And certainly not the Egyptian, Israeli, or Emirati (word??) resorts. And, while the SE Asian beaches may have been popularized by the independent traveler, most are now just gaudy cliches of beach resorts, frequented much more by Europeans and Australians than Americans. They may not be the tours that you find funny, but it sure ain't "independent" travel.

why would ANYBODY fight there way into a McDonalds?

Maybe because they need to use the bathroom?


<<suze wrote: "Call me crazy but I want to look nice even if no one knows me."

The world is full of potential friends. It's a good idea to be prepared. Padraig>>

I'm with Suze on that one, I like to look nice for myself and wouldn't wear clothes ready for the trashheap for anything but garden work, washing the car, painting, etc.

There is that French saying for women, which reflects the attitude about dressing nicely whenever you go out --- "on est toujours prête"

which says it all... that refers to the fact that you never know whom you will meet, romance is always a possibility.

Christina wrote: "There is that French saying for women, which reflects the attitude about dressing nicely whenever you go out --- "on est toujours prête" "

Unless that advice is intended for only some women, then it is indicative of a very biased perception of how people relate to one another. We men should also be prêt, just in case we get lucky.

[Herself might not like the idea.]

We wear comfortable German shoes, dress nicely but conservatively, and keep our mouths shut. Capris for ladies when it's warm.
Have been mistaken for Dutch/German/French (I am Finn/German, hubby Irish/Italian).
Lets hope Obama wins the election and people will love us again. I am ashamed of what the current regime has done.
Europeans are great and so are the countries!

"There is that French saying for women, which reflects the attitude about dressing nicely whenever you go out --- "on est toujours prête"

Unless that advice is intended for only some women, then it is indicative of a very biased perception of how people relate to one another. We men should also be prêt, just in case we get lucky".

It might come as a disappointment but the saying does not refer to possible enjoyable encounters of the first and second kinds but to a boy-scout mantra "Toujours prêts".