gruve

Hi, -kinda long post, so quick summary is, I have time for a side trip besides Venice, Florence, Rome, where should I go? Where Should I stay throughout the trip? Any good eats for me and my new bride? Read on if you can help a guy put together a memorable trip for his girl.... THANKS!

I'll be honeymooning in Italy in late june/early july for 12 days. I've been to Italy before and seen Venice,Florence,Rome, although my fiance has not. We are doing an open jaw flight into Venice and out of Rome. I want to take her to see the 3 major cities.

I'd like to know suggestions for hotels to stay that are very charming/romantic with a budget of maybe 150-300 per night depending on where we are. Venice, I think I definitely would like some sort of water view, but I'd probably pay through the nose for it.

I've already been to these places, and my fiance's not a HUGE history buff, so were more interested in just soaking in italian life - great food, romantic walks, good people, WINE - not that we're connoisseurs or anything!

Given that the historical sites aren't exactly priority 1, we should be able to salvage time by not battling crowds and waiting in lines. SO, with a tentative itenerary of venice, florence, rome, I think we have time for a side trip - whether thats a day trip or an overnight somewhere...

I was thinking of the coast going from venice to florence, Portofino, 5 terre, etc, but I'm worried that this will be more resorty and less 'italian.' Correct me if I'm wrong, because I'm totally a lover of the sea.. which is why I love venice.

I don't know if we have time for both side trips so I feel like its a trade between The riviera, or Tuscany/Umbria. I've been reading up, I WILL be in the area for the Palio in Siena, although, i'm not sure this is going to be a romantic occassion what with 40k sweaty people screaming and yelling. I also read about smaller towns like Gubbio, Lucca, Assisi, etc.

Anyway, I'm marrying the greatest woman, and I want to give her a great honeymoon. We're both 26, so we do like to have fun and let loose, but we also want some romantic seclusion.

If ANYONE has ANY advice about how I can make this a special trip for my bride to be, I'd really really be greatful. I'm especially interested in where to visit on the side trips, and what hotels to stay in throughout the trip.

ALSO, if anyone has ever eaten at a restaurant in italy and thought "wow this place is just incredible.. or this is the best <blank> i've ever had.." please share.

Any suggestions on a great restaurant for our first honeymoon dinner in Venice?

I sure am thankful to anyone who cares enough to share some details with me. Thanks a lot guys! Sorry for the long post... this is just really important to me!

LoveItaly

topping for gruve.

gruve

thanks for the top, really appreciate some help here guys!

I'm an avid photographer, and a web developer by profession, so it would be good to give me advice! cuz then i can build a neat page documenting the trip! Free pics for everyone!

capkirk1

Cinque Terre is AMAZING. This place is 5 small villages built on the side of mountains and has great hiking, beaches and other outdoor activities. The walk from Riomaggiore to Manarola is even called the "Via dell' Amore" or the Walk of Love. This is actually a perfect place for a sidetrip and a honeymoon because it is a small area that can easily be overviewed in a day or two and is set in such a beautiful environment. There was also a wonderful restaurant with the BEST seafood pasta. Unfortunately, I don't remember the name of the place, but it is near the base of Via Colombo which is the main street in Riomaggiore. Another advantage would be that Pisa is on the main train route from Cinque Terre to Florence so you could jump off the train and show your new bride the leaning tower too. Hope this helps and have a great trip.

franco

Well, for a truly romantic dinner on your first evening in Venice, it depends on the day that you're arriving. If it happens to be a Saturday, and you're arriving early enough, you should absolutely make the boat trip to Locanda Cipriani on Torcello island. The food there is not soooooo amazing, but certainly good, an elegant restaurant, and re: romanticism, it's simply unbeatable. The more-than-one-hour-each-way boat trip alone makes it very special, you're crossing the better part (in the double sense of the word) of the laguna, and Torcello with its 20 or so inhabitants is romantic over the top. But the only evening the restaurant is open is Saturday, I repeat (otherwise they're just open for lunch).
As far as accomodation, I keep telling it everybody - www.rosadivenezia.com is my favourite. An apartment, which suits honeymooners better than a hotel IMO.
Re: your 4th destination besides the three famous cities, I'm absolutely voting for Umbria (without Tuscany). That's my personal paradise: a soft but breathtakingly beautiful landscape, sprinkled with gorgeous medieval towns (now rather villages), maybe the best food in Italy, and super-quality red wine (less famous than those from Tuscany and Piemonte, though often quite better, and certainly much cheaper!!). Assisi is of course the best-known place, and a must to visit, but also the most crowded place, and therefore the least recommended to stay there for the night. I strongly suggest staying in the Bevagna - Montefalco - Foligno area, just a few kilometres from Assisi, but almost without tourists (and with Umbria's best red wine). As for the hotel, the Orto degli Angeli in Bevagna might be a good choice. As for restaurants, don't miss the Villa Roncalli on the edge of Foligno, a stylish restaurant with a genial cook who is a master in combining Umbrian tradition and creative cuisine (the latter normally strictly to avoid in Italy, where culinary tradition reigns strongly); and the Coccorone in Montefalco, as the best example of hearty, gorgeous traditional Umbrian food.
In Rome, I've had a wonderful studio apartment in the tranquil half of Trastevere, but don't find the address at the moment, sorry. As far as food, Rome is one of the world's hotspots for superb cooking ... there are so many choices! Let me suggest just three of them: Checchino dal 1887, maybe Rome's most famous restaurant, and nevertheless really excellent (normally, places as famous as this one relay on the kitchen's quality of 40 years ago, but not Checchino); Sora Lella on the Tiber island, very famous as well (which one is the better of these two depends on the mood of the respective cooks on that precise evening - they're both glorious); and, hearty & simple stuff, but in a sense the best of all restaurants in Rome, Osteria dell'Angelo in the Vatican area. The restaurant is run by former (famous!) football players, and the service is a little, let's say, rough, but somehow very nice. No menu here, you will be eating what THEY tell you, and they will simply put it on your table without asking or explaining anything. The coffee comes already sweetened TO THEIR TASTE whether you like it or not... and so on. But the food they are cooking is IN-CRE-DI-BLY-GOOD!

gruve

wow what terrific responses. This should become the definitive guide for honeymooners in Italy. Just enough siteseeing to feel like you've done them justice, mixed with lots of food, wine, romantic walks, and great views and atmosphere...

I hope I can get more suggestions. Franco, thanks for the great details! I will certainly look into those restaurants. I will be arriving on a monday (sunday departure) so unfortunately it looks like we wont make it for dinner, BUT being the ever adventurous traveler, and especially fascinated by all things nautical, I will certainly make the trek for lunch.

KIRK - SEAFOOD PASTA IS MY FAV!!! I really hope you remember what restaurant that was... maybe you can give me a better description of the place... side of the street or building characteristics , etc. I've had a lot of friends tell me about Cinque Terre, and reviews are overwhelmingly positive, but with a few nay sayers saying its too touristy or not true 'italian.' I've seen pics of portofino, and it looks like paradise. The idea of small italian towns rising out of the sea sounds to me like italian perfection. I read somewhere about a place called Lucca.. anyone know anything about it?

Also Franco, I stayed in a flat last time I was in rome. The only thing I have reservations about there, is I'm not sure there's interraction with people and services... ie directions, suggestions from the concierge/owners, etc. In smaller hotels this is a big plus since I always stop to talk to them. I guess the plus in a bigger hotel would be a restaurant or room service.

ANYWAY, i'm totally serious about putting together a travel pictorial with hundreds of pictures! So gimme more suggestions guys!

Thanks!

franco

Well, gruve, re: apartments, it's a question of personal preference, I guess. However, I must say I don't share your view: the apartment owners normally provide far better suggestions for restaurants and so on than hotels do, I think. In Rome, the owners of "our" apartment lived just across the street, we had their mobile phone numbers, and could ask them whatever we wanted to; as far as Venice, the owner of the Rosa di Venezia apartment doesn't live there, but has prepared a small booklet for you with all his favourite restaurants (e.g. I discovered the Locanda Cipriani thanks to his suggestion!), marketplaces and so on, and he has a local representative there in Venice whom to ask further questions. As far as room service, in Rome, we couldn't have one; at Rosa di Venezia, however, you can choose the daily maiden service, too, which we did not, so I can't tell you the price, but it was actually cheap... but I repeat, it's certainly a matter of taste.
As for the Cinque Terre, I wouldn't go there in June/July. You are absolutely right, it IS touristy, and hard to imagine HOW touristy. I'd go there in November, or in February, when there is certainly nobody, but not in summer! The landscape is truly amazing, one of the wonders of the world, but nowadays, it's simply too crowdy in high season. You might spend three days there without meeting a single Italian other than the restaurant waiters...
Have a nice holiday/honeymoon!

franco

Ah yes, I didn't reply to your Lucca question! I've been there many years ago - for me, it was nothing special. Pretty, but boring. Two very nice churches. But somehow rather dead. Hard to find a place where to sit outside and have a drink or something.

nessundorma

Your are taking your honeymoon when you are likely to experience very hot weather, which suggests to me you might enjoy Lago di Como or one of the other lakes (tiny Lago di Orta is also very romantic). There is a fantastic hotel in Varenna (reachable by train) with spectacular views of Lago di Como. It's called Eremo Gaudio.

http://www.eremogaudio.it/

Ask for a room with a balcony. It's truly a lovely spot.

Another possibility is spend a few nights at an agriturismo in the Tuscan or Umbrian countryside. For that you should rent a car out of Venice, stay in the wine country, then drop off the car in Firenze. You can visit lots of small charming towns with your car at your leisure or just enjoy the views of the hills. Just make sure whatever agriturismo you book at has a swimming pool.

I think your instinct that Cinque Terre is too far and no longer so very Italian is spot on. It will be mobbed with foreign tourists and it is not really easy to reach. If the two of you aren't interested in history, it's silly to sweat your way through the sightseeing of Assisi or Gubbio. What might make sense is renting a car out of Florence and driving to Orvieto, which would allow you some lovely vistas along the way, topped of by a truly spectacular catehdral in Orvieto and drinking it's great wine (and it's an unusual town). It's not too much to take in.

In Venice, a "water view" often means the Grand Canal, which is terribly noisy! Better to go for a place on a small, no-name canal, and that needn't out of sight expensive if you are willing to go over 200 euro. But again, be sure to get air conditioning.

Have a great trip.

nessundorma

PS: I wanted to add that if you drive to Orvieto from Firenze, you can drop off your car in Orvieto and take an hour's train ride to Rome.

To sum up, the options I suggest to you are either:

From Venice, take a train to Varenna on Lago di Como. Spend a night or two in Eremo Gaudio and tour the lake on boats. Take the train to Firenze and continue your journey.

Or rent a car in Venice and drive to an agriturismo in the NORTHERN Italian countryside. Drop off your car in Firenze and continue the journey.

Or take a train from Venice to Firenze. After touring Firenze, rent a car and spend time traveling to Orvieto. Drop off the car in Orvieto and take the train to Rome.

TexasAggie

La Calcina and Locanda Orseolo are two extremely popular hotels in Venice. I believe both are within your budget and both get awesome reviews both here and on Tripadvisor.


http://www.lacalcina.com/

http://www.locandaorseolo.com/en/

---------------------------
The Cinque Terre is a fairly short train ride from Florence (less than 3 hours). It is almost 5 hours by train from Rome. I have visited the Cinqe Terre on four occasions and I love it dearly. By June/July there will be a lot of tourists but it is still an amazingly special area. Our favorite hotel is in the old town (the charming part) of Monterosso. Hotel Vila Steno.

http://www.villasteno.com/

franco

Re: Assisi, nessundorma (btw, what a nice nickname! do you prefer it being sung by Bonisolli or by Kullmann?) - gruve didn't say they're NOT interested in history; rather, he said they're not PRIMARILY interested in history. And if I were to choose only one single art jewel to visit all over the world, it would perhaps be the San Francesco basilica in Assisi...

gruve

Wow awesome responses! Sorry for the delay, just been swamped... anyway I like the idea of being in a small port town with boats, wine, and good seafood, whether or not this is cinque terra, i dont know.
I was worried Lucca was a dead spot, but then, I was looking for what I just mentioned. Anyone know anything about Portovenere?

As for the apartments, I guess i've only stayed in one or two before, and there was no interraction with a local "inn keeper" or person of that sort, which I do like.

Renting a car is not out of the question, and there were some neat sounding places in Umbria and Tuscany that I'd consider looking at. Anyone been to Gubbio? Maybe thats a dead spot too.

We ARE interested in doing SOME sightseeing but going to church after church and museums for this and that isnt exactly what were going for. We want to be emersed in italian culture, lifestyle, FOOD! We'll stop in some churches, but only if they coincide with our itenerary. I don't think we'll go out of our way to see anything like that, but if it's there, then we'd probably pop our heads in.

How far are the lakes from Venice? I hadn't thought about it, but that might too be kinda fun. I even thought for a second, and a brief second because I imagine the place is CRAWLING with tourists, to go south of rome and hop out to Capri for a night or two.

The trip will enter through venice and out of rome. I think I mentioned Ill be in the area in time for the Palio, but that sounds like a pretty miserable way to spend what should be a romantic afternoon. Maybe that's better saved for a trip with my brother or something.

And for the HEAT, I'm used to it. I'm from Texas, it gets hot here... but escaping it would be nice, considering we'll probably be broiling in Rome.

Anyway.. GREAT feedback. I'd like to decide pretty soon on where to go for this extra 2 or 3 days that I have. Also, where should I stay in Florence? Rome?

Theres a special for Sofitel in florence right now that includes dinner, champaign, and room that might be good. Any experience with Sofitel? Looks like its right down the block from the Duomo.

Thanks A lot Guys... all your info is really helping me a lot.. seriously.. thanks!

franco

Hi gruve,

I'd immediately forget about that Capri idea: it's taking a lot of time to arrive and return (ships are always slow!), so it would certainly be rather stressing than romantic - and above all, as you already imagined, Capri is a TERRIBLE place. I've been there almost 17 years ago, and even then, it was so crowded that it was really hard to stand. A true never-again-experience.
As for the lakes, the only one within a reasonable distance from Venice is Lake Garda, which is 1. almost as crowded as the Cinque Terre and 2. certainly not exciting enough to put up with those crowds. By far more beautiful is Lago Maggiore and, above all, Lago di Como, but they're too far away to make a pleasant trip for 2 or 3 days.
Portovenere is very much like the Cinque Terre (beautiful as well, crowded as well), just with a softer and wider scenery around it, and therefore, there was space enough to make the village grow a little bigger than the five others.
All in all, if you take my advice, don't try to participate in that kind of Guiness-book-of-records race "who can do most Italian destinations in 10 days". It's your honeymoon! So I'd decide for just ONE additional place, besides the three cities. If you don't want to go to Umbria (you'd truly regret it if you just knew this heaven on earth!), and if you believe me that the Cinque Terre are not exactly a romantic place in summer, given the number of tourists... then, if it must really be the beach (always a problem in summer!), you might head for the Ponza island south of Rome. What I said for Capri about the long journey by boat is true also for Ponza, but it's not that far from Rome - and at least, this is a beautiful (and not THAT crowded) place if you must go to the beach. Of course, the food is NEVER excellent in beach resorts, remember: they're mainly catering pizza to those all-day-long-on-the-grill tourists... At least, in Ponza village, there is an amazing pastry shop run by Sicilians, with very good ice cream, too, and maybe the best Italian espresso that I've ever had in my life. I don't know name or address, but Ponza is tiny, and everyone will know the "pasticceria Siciliana" if you ask. If you decide to choose Ponza, book your accomodation immediately, the island is tiny, and rooms are scarce (and btw very expensive).

gruve

I'm actually not set on a beach, in fact it's not the 'beach' im interested, it's the sea and its tranquility, seafood, boats, etc. and I TOTALLY agree on a single destination for the side trip... that still allows me 3-4 days in each place with 2 or so on a side trip... which sounds perfect to me... and if it's in Umbria.. TELL ME ABOUT UMBRIA... then we can stay in some town, and if the towns are small and we feel like venturing, maybe we can head out into the country or hop over to another small town for an afternoon... but I know nothing about Umbria... and given that you've called it heaven, you must know a lot! so... what about it?
THANKS!

franco

Well, gruve, I tried to tell you something about Umbria in my first posting in your thread, but I'll do my best to render the picture more complete.
Umbria was full of powerful, rich & independent cities in the middle ages, which were step by step conquered by the popes - in the late 13th century, Perugia was the last to surrender. Given the relative proximity to Rome, the popes would never again allow these cities to grow or prosper - and today (now you understand why I'm teaching history here), they're merely bigger than in the 12th/13th centuries! That means that they don't go much beyond their medieval walls, e.g. - and that immediately outside these walls, you are right in the middle of acres and vineyards. Nevertheless, these small towns (in modern terms, they're rather villages) have kind of an urban flair to them, though in an almost intimate manner - everyone knows each other, like deep in the countryside, but then - there is that certain urban-civic pride, and the structure of a city, complete with magnificent churches, a civic museum (often boasting works of international importance), a tiny theatre and so on. Just get me right: you don't have to visit the museum or the churches or the theatre - but you FEEL they're there, even if you don't KNOW it. That's the urban flair that I'm trying to describe (not very well, I guess).
All in all, it's that unique coexistence of urbanity and cultivated landscape that makes Umbria very, very special; or where else do you have merely five minutes to go by foot from the urban theatre to the next vineyard?
Then, the landscape is marvellous - very much like Tuscany, though a little more alpine and a little less man-made. And above all, it's soooo tranquil and relaxed (nobody would ever lock the front door in Umbria, there's no need to), and I think it would meet your requirements perfectly: some of the world's greatest art treasures right around the next corner, but if you don't feel like passing by, you'll nevertheless love the experience - that incredible wealth of historic monuments is contributing to an atmosphere which is just great to absorb even without visiting a single of those monuments.
Food and wine alone are certainly profitating from that rich culture. As for restaurants, please read again my first posting in this thread, I have nothing better to add. For me, the Umbrian cuisine is Italy's best. Umbria (and not Périgord or Piemonte) is the world's richest country in truffles, and they have so many species of truffles there that some truffles are available almost all year round - and that they are absolutely unexpensive. Umbria has Italy's most famous smoked hams and sausages, often made from game like wild boar or deer; they're making great cheeses (often with truffles, like many salamis). The food is hearty, tasty but not rustic - again, there is this certain urban quality about it.
And as for the wine, I already told you that it is cheaper and less known, but quite often much better than Tuscan wines; and the region of Umbria that I've recommended to you is Umbria's best wine country: Montefalco and surroundings. The local grape variety is called Sagrantino, and I really don't understand why anybody should be growing Cabernet Sauvignon, Merlot, Zinfandel or the like as long as this GREAT grape variety exists. For me, that's the best red wine in the world, it's all that simple. There are only about 25 (tiny!!) producers, so the total production is literally minimal. Try the wines of Ruggeri, Fongoli and Caprai (Caprai being by far the most famous of the three, but he is not as good as the two others), or also Antonelli. There is a good wine store (with bar) on the main square of Montefalco, if you don't want to go directly to the producers (which is great fun btw if you have a car - and you should have a car for Umbria!).
The city-flair-with-vineyards-around-the-corner-phenomenon is most famous in Todi (elected "best place where to live in the whole world" by some American magazine a few years ago) - which means for me that I wouldn't choose Todi (nor Orvieto) for a short visit; it's already too well-known, beginning to get spoiled (though not spoiled yet!). For me, Bevagna is what Todi has been elected: the best place where to live in the whole world, and that's why I suggested to stay in Bevagna, in the Orto degli Angeli hotel.
Well, THIS is a long post. Any more questions?

franco

Strange enough, my post seems to have been TOO long - the system simply ate one passage, which I'm adding here:
Special hint for insiders: four kilometres from Bevagna, you can spot Torre del Colle, if you have a good road map. Don't miss that - it must be the world's tiniest town. Everything is there: medieval walls with big tower (the Torre on the hill = colle) two gates (still ready to be locked), church, main road, main square; but the whole "town" is hardly as large as a farm, and when entering the "main gate", you feel like saying "good evening" to the locals sitting there - it's like entering a private house, tiny as it is.

Traviata

Gruve,

Franco's suggestion of Orto degli Angeli in Bevagna gets a second vote from me...we stayed there in the fall and it is lovely..like staying in a private home which just happens to be a palazzo!! Bevagna and Montefalco, just a stone's throw away, are small and quiet..not much night life if that matters to you...Montone is a wonderful little town not far from Bevagna with a great restaurant at the Locanda del Capitano...

Franco...your knowledge is amazing..we are looking at Palazzo Terranova near Citta di Castello..what do you know of it?? Gruve might like to hear about that as well..

franco

Traviata - never heard of that Palazzo, I'm sorry. I don't like Città di Castello that much, however, I think it's rather a boring town.
Another addition - excuse me, I'm not intending to write a book, just trying to make your decision a little harder, gruve... or not to drive you exclusively to visit Umbria. If you want to be at a coast without beaches, the Sorrento peninsula might be a good choice! No beach - steep rocks falling right into the sea, the villages hanging above... seafood, yes, of course... this is a true tourist region, but already since the 19th century, which makes a somewhat different picture - an elegant, high-quality tourism here, and expensive, too. But certainly quite out of your way, and therefore less relaxing for a short sidetrip!

portiaesq

All of you sound incredibly knowledgeable about Italy. My fiance and I are planning a 2 week honeymoon to Italy in mid to late September. We are wondering if it is too cold for the beach and thoughts in terms of itinerary. Neither of us have ever been to Italy (THE HORROR!) Our thoughts were to do Venice, Tuscany and Rome, and possibly a beach location but we want to have a good portion of the honeymoon be low-key and relaxed. Any thoughts in terms of itinerary and recommendations for accomodations would be appreciated. Price range for hotels can be anywhere from $300 to $650 per night. We'd prefer on the more luxurious side.