What are your interests and what are your goals for this trip? I ask because I suspect that many people with think you are trying to see WAY too much in the time you have. For example, I think many people will recommend at least 4 or 5 days for just Paris or for just Rome. It will help us respond if we know more.

Hi bensonwho,
This is a really really rushed trip. One day in Paris and one day to see the Loire AND Versailles is just not realistic. Luzern to the BO and back is a day I would definitely not look forward to.

It looks like you have 12 days on the ground. I would pick at the most 3 places, preferably two, and visit those instead of basing there and day tripping every day.

Sounds very rushed...I think you will regret it.

>>>21-Jun Depart Luzern for Milan (day trip) - > Florence<<<

That's a very long day (7-9 hours on the trains) with multiple train changes.

Venice as a day trip from Florence is a bit doubtful. It takes two hours each way on the train from Florence to Venice, so it would be a very short visit.

Hi

Thanks all for the replies. Basically we just want to take a look at the main attractions and take some photos and move on (sounds pretty much like going with a tour group I guess). We don't have much interest in musuems and churches (but may include one or two in our trips). We are thinking of visiting either loire valley or versailles, but not both, if time allows.

We will reach Paris in the morning so I thought we would have about 3 days.

Thinking of skipping Milan as well but not sure if it should be skipped so planned a day trip. We would like to go to venice to take a look and not expecting to a lot of venice, hence the day trip as well.

As for the 2 days in switzerland, it's quite a headache for me so far. I'll give Jungfrau a miss and go for Mt Schilthorn. But no idea whether to base in Luzern or in Lauterbrunnen as we want to visit Luzern as well.

quite a dilemma as to which cities to drop out of my itinerary.

> quite a dilemma as to which cities to drop out of my itinerary

Indeed!

One thing to consider is that there is no guarantee that you will be able to actually see Jungfrau or Schilthorn - because clouds are frequently pervasive, my understanding is that you really need to plan on several days in the area to have any hope of a clear day. If this were my first trip to Europe, I'm not sure that trying to see these peaks would be a priority for me. I would encourage you to think about what you are willing to forego for an opportunity that is not guaranteed.

Paris and Rome are, IMO, great target destinations for a 1st trip to Europe.

I must admit, though, that I can't imagine visiting either city without visiting multiple museums and churches - they provide such magnificent displays of the art and architecture of these cities through the ages. Are you sure you want to exclude them from your travels?

> We are thinking of visiting either loire valley or versailles, but not both, if time allows.

If you are extremely selective, hold yourself to a very tight timeframe, and have planned your transportation carefully, you should be able to visit a a few Loire Valley chateau from Paris on a day trip. Versailles can be easily visited on a day trip (as in FULL day trip, or at least most of a day!) from Paris.

> Thinking of skipping Milan as well but not sure if it should be skipped so planned a day trip. We would like to go to venice to take a look and not expecting to a lot of venice, hence the day trip as well.

As others are noting, you are giving yourself at most a few hours to see things that most people think require a minimum of a couple of days to see at even a very superficial level. And you aren't even allowing any more than that for your "base" cities! As examples, when, exactly, would you actually visit Lucerne? or Venice? Or any of the places you list? If you pursue the plan you have outlined so far, you will spend a HUGE proportion of you time in transit and you will see VERY little of what draws most people to the places you say you want to visit. Is that really what you want?


I strongly encourage you to get a few good, basic guidebooks before making any further decisions. I would think that the books by Fodor's and Frommer's would give you a good starting point, as well as some ideas about how to plan your time.

Hope that helps!

Versailles requires a full day. It is not distant from Paris but it is usually very crowded, and even if you bought the ticket in advance (absolutely recommended) long waits are still possibile.

Luzern to Florence is fairly long and does not leave more than two hours or so in Milan. It does not make sense going south to Florence and then going north to Venezia the following day. Go to Venezia instead, overnight there, and then move to Florence.

kja and asps, thanks a lot for your pointers. it's certainly helpful and set me re-considering my options. shall hit the books and re-plan again!

I'm not really that much into bus tours/excursions, BUT i went with a friend on one from Paris to the Loire valley. It was a day trip and we saw three chateaux. It was really a very nice day out and having "someone" pick you up, drop you off, show you around, etc was quite pleasant in this particular case. You might actually enjoy having a bit of a nap on the bus too. Your hotel or the tourist office will surely have a list of companies that do this. I'd do that instead of Versailles. I enjoyed it the Loire Valley tour much more than Versailles.

As for Milan and Venice. You don't sound too keen on them. So just you should just skip them. You won't enjoy rushing around and traveling so far for and spending money on a place you're not that interested in. I'm not a fan of Milan either for "looking around". It's not that beautiful as Florence and Rome.

Le's see your revised version!

Oh, PS, I'd skip Pisa it's horrible and there is nothing there but the tower which takes 1.5 minutes to see. But Siena is a dream! And that is an easy day trip from Florence.

The Luzern/ Lauterbrunnen/Milan portion of your trip is the most challenging part. While Switzerland is gorgeous, the mountains make travel a little slower so you really don't have the time to enjoy the area. And Milan doesn't have as much to offer the average tourist compared to Rome, Florence, and Venice, So I'd suggest cutting out that middle portion of your trip and reallocating those days to Rome, Florence, and Paris. Those three cities would make a lovely first trip to Europe.

16-Jun Reach Paris(0940)
17-Jun Paris
18-Jun Paris (loire valley)
19-Jun Depart Paris for Lauterbrunnen(2nights stay)
20-Jun  Murren - > Mt Schilthorn or Interlaken/Luzern(depending on weather)
21-Jun Depart LauterBrunnen for Florence
22-Jun Florence -> Venice (Day trip)
23-Jun Florence (siena/pisa/san gimignano day tour)
24-Jun Florence
25-Jun Depart Florence for Rome
26-Jun Rome
27-Jun Rome
28-Jun Home sweet home

Thanks all for your input.This is my revised plan. actually still Undecided to stay in Interlaken or lauterbrunnen

day trip to Venice is not a good idea. Venice you have to transfer trains or take a boat, will take about 3 hours to get into the city....drop some of your cities....see less and enjoy it more...stay everywhere at least 2 nights and you will be happier....you can always come back

To see a couple of the chateau of the Loire inone dayyou either need to rent a car or take one of the van tours from Tours. The chateaux are in the deep countryside and most cannot be reached by train at all and bus service is for locals - as in 1 or 2 buses per day.

I suggest you pick which 2 chateaux you want to see (based on interest in architecture, history, gardens, etc) and then see if there is a van tour that does that or if you will need to rent a car.

As for the rest - not the way I would travel - but you have obviously made your decisions. (We prefer to learn about the countries I visit and also get at least a touch of feeling for the local culture).

Loire Valley can be done as a day trip - but it is a long day. If you do want to do this, go on an organised tour as they take in 3 chatueax and get back. (Also, is better in general if you get one that involves taking the train to Tours and a bus from there ...)

In general, Versailles is a great day trip, and I would suggest doing that instead of Loire. easy to do on your own, and is a super impressive place.

As far as the Switzerland part - staying in Interlaken or one of the BO villages is a good idea.

Or can stay in Lucerne and go to Mt Titlis/Mt Pilatus ... loads to do, and has better connections both from Paris and on to Florence.

remember though, 2 nights will only leave 1 full day to do whatever excursion you decide

Florence - day trip to Venice is doable, but its a long day. With 4 nights in Florence its a better plan than changing hotels constantly.

Paris - Interlaken - Florence - Rome ... is a full holiday, but its doable if you just want to see some very basic highlights.

newbie - thanks. will consider versailles instead! and we just wanted to go venice to take a look/walk, hence the day trip (first train in, last train out).i do agree that we won't see most of the cities in that few days; but we will leave out many musuems/churches so we reckoned that the days allocated should be sufficient for a trip that's akin to a tour grp but with more freedom.