Kathie

We are planning to go to Italy for about three weeks in September 2015. We have traveled extensively in Asia, less extensively in Europe.

We love art and architecture and good food and wine. We prefer to settle in somewhere for a while, no one night stays, no stays of fewer than three nights. We will want a week in Rome, some time in Venice and some time in Florence/Lucca/Sienna. Lots of other places sound great, but may have to wait until next trip, places like Bologna, Verona, Naples and such. What do you think - are we choosing the "right" places for us?

We have a million Marriott points to burn, and there look to be great options in Rome, two hotels in Venice, and a resort in Tuscany. We won't always be staying in Marriotts, but where it makes sense to use Marriott points for a free stay, we would like to do so.

We would like to fly into Rome - out of where? Venice? Florence? What makes the most sense in terms of transportation? I'm assuming we would take trains from city to city, and might rent a car for a couple of days while in Tuscany.

Any comments (especially on locations) on these Marriott properties will be appreciated:

In Tuscany: http://www.marriott.com/hotels/trave...esort-and-spa/

in Rome: http://www.marriott.com/hotels/trave...ph-collection/
http://www.marriott.com/hotels/trave...ph-collection/
http://www.marriott.com/hotels/trave...d-hotel-flora/

In Venice: http://www.marriott.com/hotels/trave...ph-collection/
JW Marriott Venice Resort & Spa
Isola delle Rose, Laguna di San Marco Venice, Italy (no website for the hotel yet, it is to open in March, 2015)

Many thanks for all of your assistance.

PalenQ

Well trains are the best for going to big cities like Rome, Florence and of course Venice - many Italian cities now make their city centres off-limits to private vehicles - public transit is excellent and city centres are also very compact and thus walkable.

Rome 5 days
Florence 5 days
Venice 3 days

Tuscany by car or easily by bus for say 3 days

Maybe the Italian Lake District for the other days - wonderful at that time of year - summer hoards have dissipated to a large extent - Lake Garda is right on the way to Venice from Florence.

Or add in the Cinque Terre - go Florence to Cinque Terre

Cinque Terre to Lake Garda, Verona (another gem where you could spend a great few days) and Venice.

Fly into Rome and out of Venice.

Or for the extra days from Rome go down to the Naples area and the Amalfi Coast - with Capri, Pompeii, etc all easy day trips from a base like Sorrento.

For lots of great stuff on Italian trains check out these IMo superb sources: www.budgeteuropetravel.com; www.seat61.com and www.ricksteves.com. Booking tickets way early but also kind of locking them in in stone can save a lot of money if you do not require flexibility to take which trains once you are in a city - www.trenitalia.com or its competitior www.italotren.com. If wishing flexibility to hop any train anytime then consider the Italy Railpass which lets you do just that (after making the always easily available IME mandated seat reservations).

First class as usual is more comfy than 2nd class, which is comfy itself but on the trip of a lifetime and especially with those lugging around all too much luggage first class has real benefits - large seats - fewer in each train compartment - more room to easily stow luggage, etc.

gh21

The Marriott in Tuscany looks lovely but a bit remote as a base. The nearest town to the hotel is Barga which is 2.5 hours from Florence by train. I might suggest 2-3 relaxing nights there with a rental car to see local towns and then some time in Florence as well. Note that Bologna is only 30 minutes from Florence by train with trains leaving every 30 min-- quite a doable day trip from Florence.

Kathie

Ok, it sounds like Rome (7 nights) and Venice (5 nights) can bookend this trip. In between, Florence/Verona/Sienna for maybe three nights each?

bobthenavigator

I agree that the Barga location is way off the path for a Tuscany base location. I would get a car for at least 3 nights in south Tuscany for the best experience. Here is one example of a good rural location for Tuscany:

http://www.tripadvisor.com/Hotel_Rev...a_Tuscany.html

kybourbon

The problem with using points in much of Italy is the locations of the hotels.

I would look at flying into Venice and out of Rome. Rome and Milan have quite a few non-stop flights to the states. Venice has a few, otherwise you have to catch an early departing flight and change planes in Europe.

Elizabeth_S

Re the hotels - the 3 in Rome are reasonably close to each other. Friends stayed at the Grand Flora this summer and loved the rooftop breakfast terrace and views - I find it the least convenient location of the 3 but that's a minor quibble.

Re Venice - I wouldn't want to be at the JW Marriott (Isola delle Rose) - too remote from Venice and I wouldn't want to be dependent upon a shuttle water taxi. I'd feel stranded there.

OTOH the other Venice Marriott property, while a longer walk to the main sites, is in a neighbourhood we really enjoyed that is less touristed than others (which appeals to us).

We met a nice couple when we were in Lucca in February 2013 who had a boatload of Marriott points (from their wedding) - they stayed at the property in Barga near Lucca and very much enjoyed it. They had a rental car which you would absolutely need. While we love Lucca and the area I agree with others that it is a little off the beaten track for a Tuscany destination.

bvlenci

The Exedra in Rome is on Piazza della Repubblica, a fairly convenient location. Two of my favorite museums (Museo delle Terme di Diocleziano and Palazzo Massimo alle Terme) are nearby, and the lovely Basilica of Santa Maria degli Angeli. Termini Station is a short walk, and it's not far to walk to the Colosseum.

All these "Terme" and "Termini" refer to the enormous ancient Rome bath complex ("terme" in Italian) that once took up the entire neighborhood. The name Exedra itself refers to the entrance hall of this bath complex, which took up all of the Piazza della Repubblica. The basilica is located in part of the ancient bath complex; Michelangelo designed its conversion to a church. The Museum of the Terme di Diocleziano includes a large hall that was part of the baths.

I've never stayed in the Exedra; it's not in my price range. I do know that it's one of the few central hotels in Rome that has a pool, on the roof, I believe. You could look at the reviews on www.venere.com or www.booking.com . These sites accept reviews only from verified guests, so they're pretty reliable.

Kathie

Thanks for the feedback.

That was my sense as well, Elizabeth, that the JW in Venice would be inconvenient. I'm glad to hear the other one is in a neighborhood you enjoyed.

I'm least inclined to stay at the Marriott in Tuscany. I think we want to be in towns/cities rather than out in the countryside.

I've done a bit of looking at flights, but need to do more.

Kathie

Oh, we were posting at the same time, so I hadn't seen your comments on the Rome hotels, bvlenci, but your comments are very helpful, thanks.

Leely2

What do you want to do/see in Rome? I would stay in any of those hotel (if they were free), but have been to Rome many times so the out-of-the way locations wouldn't bug me. I would probably choose the Via Veneto one that's closest to Borghese Gardens because I like to exercise and the park would be good for that. I also live in San Francisco so what they call hills in Rome don't faze me. Are you good walkers/hill walkers? If not, you'll be on the bus or metro or in taxis a lot. But maybe that's not a bother for you.

Piazza Della Repubblica is a pretty good location too, but that is a very busy, noisy (with cars) piazza.

sdtravels

Our trip to Italy was quite a while ago now but I still remember most of it and we are planning to go back soon. We flew into Venice and out of Rome. I was glad that we did because Italy is so beautiful but everywhere we were was just a prelude to Rome. I think if we did it the other way, seeing Rome first, I would have been disappointed for the rest of the trip. Also, we rented a car when we were ready to leave Florence and drove to Rome, taking a few days. We were able to see and stop in many small towns along the way even if just for a few hours. That might be difficult on a train.

PalenQ

That might be difficult on a train.>

Yes for many but not for Orvieto - a classic hill town which is right on a main rail line between Florence and Rome - but not sure there is any baggage check near the train station - a problem in many Italian towns these days as only large stations in places like Rome are sure to have them.

PalenQ

Perugia, Cortona and Assis are three more hill towns or cities really that are on main train lines between Florence and Rome - making easy stops and Perugia has baggage storage in its station or did last time I was there.

PalenQ

We were able to see and stop in many small towns along the way even if just for a few hours. That might be difficult on a train.>

Even with the many hill towns that do have rail service the stations are often down at the bottom of the hills those towns regally crown - making it cumbersome to stop for just a quick look - but even with a car I've found parking hard to find close to the top - depends on the season of course.

But only with cars can you easily stop at a series of hill towns, I agree.

Kathie

Thanks for your comments.

We are not averse to renting a car to visit some hill towns. But first we need to figure out exactly where we are going. I think we've established Rome and Venice. We are thinking Florence plus one or two other places in the area, likely three nights each. Verona, Sienna, Lucca? Or should we spend longer in Florence and go just one other place? What do you recommend?

PalenQ

In three weeks why not spend a week or so in Rome, Florence and Venice - with a few days in Verona - use those places as bases to do day trips - like from Venice itself Padua and Vicenza (a wonderful town a short train ride away).

Base cities are great - packing up and moving is a pain and takes a lot of time relocating. From Florence you can easily day trip by train or bus to any of several great hill towns - Siena, San Gimignano, Cortona, Perugia, Assisi and many others. I found driving around Tuscany to be tedious due to secondary narrow roads with surprising truck traffic and parking often hard to find without a long hike to the town center, etc.

Chianti-en-Greve is a very easy day trip from Florence - do the tours of the vaunted Chianti wine houses in town. Lucca and Pisa are classic day trips from Florence.

From Rome tivoli and the Villa d'Este and Hadrian's Villa are great great easy day trips as it Ostia Antica and hill towns like Orvieto, Viterbo, etc. Even Pompeii though a few hours each way by train is a possible day trip.

Base in 3 places and use them as bases. Verona can even be a nice day trip from Venice. Trieste is a more off-beat day trip from Venice but a very unique neat place.

Leely2

An alternative viewpoint: I like overnighting in the hill towns. They are often best by night, especially the more touristy ones. I personally don't think packing up every three days is a big deal, particularly as you are bookending with long-enough stays in Rome and Venice. But we are all different. That's what makes it a horse race.

FWIW, spent three nights in Bologna this summer and enjoyed it very much, my first visit to the city. I took a day trip to Ravenna, which was spectacular. Followed up with eight nights in Rome (my fave).

Kathie

Thanks to both of you.

PalenQ, while I understand how the hub and spokes technique is supposed to work, we have a hard time tearing ourselves away from a place. So we spent 10 days in Paris and never did a day-trip (beyond the end stations of the metro). Why not? Too much to do and see in Paris. Next time, we said, we'll go to Chartres or Versailles or Reims. So I expect to spend the 7 nights in Rome IN Rome, the five nights in Venice IN Venice. Yes, we could take a day trip, but I'll bet we won't.

Leely, we know for sure we want to spend some time in Florence. With the rest of the trip, which other places would you suggest for 3-night stays, keeping in mind our love to architecture and art and good food. Bologna is certainly an option.

I'm interested in everyone's thoughts on this. I'll likely make a short list of 5 or 6 places to do more in-depth research and choose from those.

annhig

Definitely into Venice and out of Rome - you will be grateful you did it this way round when you get to Rome and think what it would have been like to have had a week there as your first experience of Italy.

With 5 nights in venice [do take a trip out to the islands - that doesn't really count as an excursion outside Venice as it's included in the vaporetto pass if you get one] and 7 in Rome, [where you might manage one day trip] that leaves you with 9 nights. I would suggest 4 in Florence, then get the bus [not the train] to Siena, spend a night there, then pick up a car and head for the Val d'Orcia and spend 3 nights near there, eg in Montepulciano, then drive to Orvieto, return your car, spend a night there, and then get the train to Rome.

I know that you said no one-night stands, but in this case they give you the chance to see the places when the day tripping tourists have mainly gone home and fit in well with swapping from train to car and vv. Plus they are both very interesting, but can be seen pretty well in a day or so.