HELP- Family trip between Switz & Paris; Car Rental (drop charge) vs Train
Sep 12th, 2011, 03:09 PM
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HELP- Family trip between Switz & Paris; Car Rental (drop charge) vs Train
Hello Travelers:
Dilemma: renting a car in Switz (5 people); staying 3-4 days there, then 2-3 days just inside Germany. Then was going to drive from Germany to Paris. 6-7 hour drive from what I can tell. But, we are wondering if it is worth it to drive the 1 hour back to Switz, return the car, thus AVOIDING THE PARIS DROP CHARGE, and try and catch a train to Paris.
Obvious questions: Will the cost of rental drop charge and 7 hour drive gas usage be offset by the train ticket fees for 4-5 people? Is it worth riding the train given we loose some "freedom" of driving ourselves? HOW MUCH IS A TRAIN TICKET FROM SWIZ TO PARIS? Are the trains faster (TVG?) than the drive to Paris? Anything else this newbie is not considering? Thanks in advance.
-JAC
Dilemma: renting a car in Switz (5 people); staying 3-4 days there, then 2-3 days just inside Germany. Then was going to drive from Germany to Paris. 6-7 hour drive from what I can tell. But, we are wondering if it is worth it to drive the 1 hour back to Switz, return the car, thus AVOIDING THE PARIS DROP CHARGE, and try and catch a train to Paris.
Obvious questions: Will the cost of rental drop charge and 7 hour drive gas usage be offset by the train ticket fees for 4-5 people? Is it worth riding the train given we loose some "freedom" of driving ourselves? HOW MUCH IS A TRAIN TICKET FROM SWIZ TO PARIS? Are the trains faster (TVG?) than the drive to Paris? Anything else this newbie is not considering? Thanks in advance.
-JAC
Sep 12th, 2011, 04:30 PM
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You can check the Swiss Rail site, http://www.sbb.ch/en/home.html
I'm not sure what city you were thinking of dropping the car. I checked Zurich to Paris, and depending on the departure time, the travel time was about 4:30 to 6:30 hours. You can view the timetables with the link above. I checked adult fare, 2nd class and it was 140 Swiss Francs. I think there are some group discounts and reduced fares for children, so be sure to check that.
What is the rental charge drop fee for Paris?
I'm not sure what city you were thinking of dropping the car. I checked Zurich to Paris, and depending on the departure time, the travel time was about 4:30 to 6:30 hours. You can view the timetables with the link above. I checked adult fare, 2nd class and it was 140 Swiss Francs. I think there are some group discounts and reduced fares for children, so be sure to check that.
What is the rental charge drop fee for Paris?
Sep 12th, 2011, 05:00 PM
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Between the Rail site and your rental car site, you should be able to get the figures you are looking for.
Looking at Hertz, for example, if you do ZRH to CDG rental, it will be adding about 1000EU (yikes!) drop off charge. However, depending on where in Switzerland you are renting, for example in Basel, I think you have a choice of crossing boarder to the French side of Basel,rent a car there, drive around Switzerland with a proper Swiss highway sticker, drive in Germany, drop off in France, it seems to add minimum to the rental. You can try a similar maneuver in Geneve.
Looking at Hertz, for example, if you do ZRH to CDG rental, it will be adding about 1000EU (yikes!) drop off charge. However, depending on where in Switzerland you are renting, for example in Basel, I think you have a choice of crossing boarder to the French side of Basel,rent a car there, drive around Switzerland with a proper Swiss highway sticker, drive in Germany, drop off in France, it seems to add minimum to the rental. You can try a similar maneuver in Geneve.
Sep 12th, 2011, 05:57 PM
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As Greg says, pick up your car in France (the Basel airport has a French section) and return it in France to avoid the cross-border drop-off fee. However, if you are landing in Zurich, the savings will be lost in the train tickets cost from Zurich to Basel. If you are landing in Geneva, pick up your car on the French side of the Geneva airport, and make sure you pay for the sticker to drive on Swiss limited access highways.
Use Kemwel.com to order your car. If you are willing to have your credit card carry the CDW, choose the basic rate.
Or you could return your car in Basel and take the TGV to Paris. If you order the tickets on-line early enough, you might get a good PREM rate which could be as low as 25€ per person.
http://www.idtgv.com/en/
Use Kemwel.com to order your car. If you are willing to have your credit card carry the CDW, choose the basic rate.
Or you could return your car in Basel and take the TGV to Paris. If you order the tickets on-line early enough, you might get a good PREM rate which could be as low as 25€ per person.
http://www.idtgv.com/en/
Sep 12th, 2011, 06:41 PM
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Thanks everyone for replies. I am trying to figure some of your questions out. In the meantime:
Michael: I can't find a TGV station in Basal. I assume we would need to get to Mulhouse?? Any suggestions on that?
Michael: I can't find a TGV station in Basal. I assume we would need to get to Mulhouse?? Any suggestions on that?
Sep 12th, 2011, 06:59 PM
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TGV trains to Paris leave from Basel's main SNCF/SBB station. Check fares at www.sbb.ch (from as little as 25 euros per person if pre-booked 2-3 months ahead)
Remember that a fast drive on autoroutes doesn't mean 'freedom' it means stuck in a car droning down an eyesore tarmac highway. You'll need to double the drive time (at least) to mean smaller roads with all the pretty villages etc. that would make driving worthwhile in its own right.
Remember that a fast drive on autoroutes doesn't mean 'freedom' it means stuck in a car droning down an eyesore tarmac highway. You'll need to double the drive time (at least) to mean smaller roads with all the pretty villages etc. that would make driving worthwhile in its own right.
Sep 12th, 2011, 07:26 PM
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My error. The site I gave you is more limited than http://www.voyages-sncf.com/billet-train, which gives the lowest price for a Dec. 10 ticket at 38€.
Sep 12th, 2011, 09:35 PM
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Hi JAC2071,
Take a close look at what Man_in_seat_61 says -- if you book in advance, fares can be as los as 25 euros per person.
You may find trains to be more convenient than cars in Switzerland, actually. The cities, born in medieaval times, are not designed for modern traffic, and you'll find yourself competing with busses, trams, and pedestrians while navigating narrow one-way streets in a maze while looking for (expensive) parking.
In contrast, trains will whisk you from city center to city center with no hassle and no fuss. While on the train, you'll be able to engage your seat-neighbors and ask questions about the area, or you can all talk among yourselves. You can also bring along a picnic to share while enjoying the views and relaxing.
In the countryside, trains will take you where cars cannot go -- ie to the mountain villages and the mountaintops.
In addition, trains run frequently, so they are truly convenient.
You may also have some trouble finding a car to fit five people plus luggage -- and if you do find a car big enough to fit all of you, chances are it'll cost you a fortune in gas.
Finally, trains of course are more ***green***, yaaaay! You may be pretty happy to leave Switzerland as pristine as it was when you arrived.
I live in southern Germany and don't have a car. You may find that you don't need one for your visit there, either. There are regional tickets you can buy where all five of you travel for one day for a low sum, such as 29 euro.
Hope you can figure it out easily!
s
Take a close look at what Man_in_seat_61 says -- if you book in advance, fares can be as los as 25 euros per person.
You may find trains to be more convenient than cars in Switzerland, actually. The cities, born in medieaval times, are not designed for modern traffic, and you'll find yourself competing with busses, trams, and pedestrians while navigating narrow one-way streets in a maze while looking for (expensive) parking.
In contrast, trains will whisk you from city center to city center with no hassle and no fuss. While on the train, you'll be able to engage your seat-neighbors and ask questions about the area, or you can all talk among yourselves. You can also bring along a picnic to share while enjoying the views and relaxing.
In the countryside, trains will take you where cars cannot go -- ie to the mountain villages and the mountaintops.
In addition, trains run frequently, so they are truly convenient.
You may also have some trouble finding a car to fit five people plus luggage -- and if you do find a car big enough to fit all of you, chances are it'll cost you a fortune in gas.
Finally, trains of course are more ***green***, yaaaay! You may be pretty happy to leave Switzerland as pristine as it was when you arrived.
I live in southern Germany and don't have a car. You may find that you don't need one for your visit there, either. There are regional tickets you can buy where all five of you travel for one day for a low sum, such as 29 euro.
Hope you can figure it out easily!
s
Sep 13th, 2011, 07:51 AM
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Hi Swandav,
Thanks for your advice. As a rookie Europe person traveling with family, my first and obvious question when considering trains is luggage issues. Is it not hard lugging around at least one large suitcase from train to train, etc? What is the best way to make use of trains when traveling with 5 people and luggage?
-JAC
Thanks for your advice. As a rookie Europe person traveling with family, my first and obvious question when considering trains is luggage issues. Is it not hard lugging around at least one large suitcase from train to train, etc? What is the best way to make use of trains when traveling with 5 people and luggage?
-JAC
Sep 13th, 2011, 08:12 AM
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It is hard lugging around "large" suitcase onto train. But that is not the only place you will have issues. Cars and taxis don't always have large space either and neither are elevators especially at older hotels, if any. Even getting to the hotel receptions can require lugging up luggage.
Do you have to carry a large suitcase?
Your trip appears to be about 10 days total? Many here travel with only carry-on for longer trips. Of course, you cannot do this if you pack as if you are taking a car trip locally on a large family car. But do you really have to pack that way? Some come here saying that they cannot take just carry-on luggage on a 2 wk trip when they have to take 6 pairs of shoes.
Do you have to carry a large suitcase?
Your trip appears to be about 10 days total? Many here travel with only carry-on for longer trips. Of course, you cannot do this if you pack as if you are taking a car trip locally on a large family car. But do you really have to pack that way? Some come here saying that they cannot take just carry-on luggage on a 2 wk trip when they have to take 6 pairs of shoes.
Sep 13th, 2011, 08:45 AM
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Hi again,
Yes, as greg notes, one important thing is to learn to pack light. I generally take enough for five days of wear, then do wash in the hotel sink.
But even without that, how big is "large"? Really, for 14 days, you should be able to pack well in a 24" case. I'm a small, middle-aged woman, and I can handle that size suitcase and do it frequently. I just . . . eh . . . don't have to hit the gym that day!!
If you feel that you just don't want to hassle with luggage, you can sent it separately on Swiss trains. It costs 20 chf per bag, and if you check it before 09.00, you can pick it up after 18.00 the same day at your destination. I do cheat and use this service often.
Have fun!
s
Yes, as greg notes, one important thing is to learn to pack light. I generally take enough for five days of wear, then do wash in the hotel sink.
But even without that, how big is "large"? Really, for 14 days, you should be able to pack well in a 24" case. I'm a small, middle-aged woman, and I can handle that size suitcase and do it frequently. I just . . . eh . . . don't have to hit the gym that day!!
If you feel that you just don't want to hassle with luggage, you can sent it separately on Swiss trains. It costs 20 chf per bag, and if you check it before 09.00, you can pick it up after 18.00 the same day at your destination. I do cheat and use this service often.
Have fun!
s
Sep 13th, 2011, 09:24 AM
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I think, overall, the decision of car vs. trains depends on all the factors already listed, plus a few more: how old are the people in your group (i.e., older or younger, so less able to carry their own luggage, more likely to get lost, need hands held, etc.); exactly which town(s) in Switzerland you end up staying at/visiting; your personal comfort levels with cars vs. trains.
While we haven't visited Switzerland in about 15 years, we generally prefer renting a car when we visit Europe, including Switzerland (Gruyeres, Grindelwald, Kandersteg, Zermatt, Geneva only one night before leaving, and where we dropped our rental car, some other small towns, no other big cities). But when we're visiting places where we don't need a car (big cities), we don't rent one. For the countryside, we find more flexibility with a car rental. But I'm totally fine with driving in Europe, have driven a stick shift all my life, and actually find driving on small, narrow roads to be fun; DH is an excellent navigator. While others find trains easier, I get stressed at having to make sure to make it to the train station on time, buying the right ticket, etc. Obviously, a very individual thing.
When we travel, these days usually myself, DH and a teen-aged kid, we take either two 21-inch rolling bags and one 24-inch rolling bag, plus a daybag/backpack for each of us. With that amount of luggage, we can rent an economy-sized car and fit most - but not all - of the luggage in the trunk area. Even when our kids were younger, they could pull their own luggage, and only needed help with stairs. You'll definitely have to work to find a car large enough for 5 people and even smaller luggage. On the trains, there are areas in the front and back of each car to store luggage, as well as spaces between the seats. We sometimes can put the 21-inch bags on the overhead racks on the trains.
While we haven't visited Switzerland in about 15 years, we generally prefer renting a car when we visit Europe, including Switzerland (Gruyeres, Grindelwald, Kandersteg, Zermatt, Geneva only one night before leaving, and where we dropped our rental car, some other small towns, no other big cities). But when we're visiting places where we don't need a car (big cities), we don't rent one. For the countryside, we find more flexibility with a car rental. But I'm totally fine with driving in Europe, have driven a stick shift all my life, and actually find driving on small, narrow roads to be fun; DH is an excellent navigator. While others find trains easier, I get stressed at having to make sure to make it to the train station on time, buying the right ticket, etc. Obviously, a very individual thing.
When we travel, these days usually myself, DH and a teen-aged kid, we take either two 21-inch rolling bags and one 24-inch rolling bag, plus a daybag/backpack for each of us. With that amount of luggage, we can rent an economy-sized car and fit most - but not all - of the luggage in the trunk area. Even when our kids were younger, they could pull their own luggage, and only needed help with stairs. You'll definitely have to work to find a car large enough for 5 people and even smaller luggage. On the trains, there are areas in the front and back of each car to store luggage, as well as spaces between the seats. We sometimes can put the 21-inch bags on the overhead racks on the trains.
Sep 13th, 2011, 11:28 AM
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Thanks all. But I am overwhelmed. Lots of issues to consider. A few actions I am considering:
1. Definitely will try and pack light. We have three adults and two teenagers.
2. I will call a recommended rental car company and check rates and drop charge amount.
3. Cheap TVG tix: Seems like most sites don't allow you to book until 2-3 months in advance. Seems like you have to act fast in in a small window in order to get the prem cheap seats on that train.
4. I must consider fairly high gas costs while there
5. I love the Basal or Geneva idea of towns close to the border to return the car in same country. We will have to check on the Basal idea since almost certain flying into Zurich.
Anything else I need to think about?
1. Definitely will try and pack light. We have three adults and two teenagers.
2. I will call a recommended rental car company and check rates and drop charge amount.
3. Cheap TVG tix: Seems like most sites don't allow you to book until 2-3 months in advance. Seems like you have to act fast in in a small window in order to get the prem cheap seats on that train.
4. I must consider fairly high gas costs while there
5. I love the Basal or Geneva idea of towns close to the border to return the car in same country. We will have to check on the Basal idea since almost certain flying into Zurich.
Anything else I need to think about?
Sep 13th, 2011, 11:44 AM
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You can't book TGV tickets more than 3 months in advance.
If you rent the car in France, chances are that you will get a diesel, especially if you are willing to drive a stick shift car. That will help your mileage and fuel costs considerably--you generally will get 500+ miles to a tank of diesel if you minimize high speed driving on the autobahn.
Flying into Geneva might be a better idea. You could rent the car on the French side of the airport, drive around Switzerland and Germany and return the car in Strasbourg to catch the TGV to Paris.
If you rent the car in France, chances are that you will get a diesel, especially if you are willing to drive a stick shift car. That will help your mileage and fuel costs considerably--you generally will get 500+ miles to a tank of diesel if you minimize high speed driving on the autobahn.
Flying into Geneva might be a better idea. You could rent the car on the French side of the airport, drive around Switzerland and Germany and return the car in Strasbourg to catch the TGV to Paris.
Sep 13th, 2011, 11:48 AM
#18
1. Every member of your group should be capable of carrying their personal baggage if taking a train. Millions of people in Europe do it every day.
2. www.autoeurope.com is excellent for rentals of 3 days or more. If driving, it is quite simple to drop a car on one side of the border and pick up another one right across the next border. The Basel airport would be an obvious choice, because even though it is located in France, it has exits to both Germany and Switzerland -- the only tri-national airport in the world, probably. Another possibility is the Basel train station, where you could drop off a car and take a train for a few minutes to Mulhouse to get another car.
3. Cheap TGV tickets are not as hard to get as a lot of people claim. Yes, you can get a rock bottom price by booking 3 months ahead of time. But I usually book only about a month ahead of time and can find fares only 5-7€ more (as long as we are not talking about midsummer weekends). Just keep away from booking for Friday afternoon or Sunday evening. In any case, the SNCF site will show you exactly which trains are still offering the cheapest tickets. There is often a 400% difference on the same day, depending on travel time.
4. The www.viamichelin.com site will tell you both the cost of tolls and gas for your itinerary (you enter the price of gas yourself after checking one of the many websites that will give you the current price of petrol throughout Europe). And of course, nobody is forcing you to drive on toll roads.
5. Yes, Geneva is another good city to do a border switch. Geneva shares something like 70 km of border with France and only about 5 km with Switzerland -- it is just a little wart protruding into France (but still a very lovely city).
2. www.autoeurope.com is excellent for rentals of 3 days or more. If driving, it is quite simple to drop a car on one side of the border and pick up another one right across the next border. The Basel airport would be an obvious choice, because even though it is located in France, it has exits to both Germany and Switzerland -- the only tri-national airport in the world, probably. Another possibility is the Basel train station, where you could drop off a car and take a train for a few minutes to Mulhouse to get another car.
3. Cheap TGV tickets are not as hard to get as a lot of people claim. Yes, you can get a rock bottom price by booking 3 months ahead of time. But I usually book only about a month ahead of time and can find fares only 5-7€ more (as long as we are not talking about midsummer weekends). Just keep away from booking for Friday afternoon or Sunday evening. In any case, the SNCF site will show you exactly which trains are still offering the cheapest tickets. There is often a 400% difference on the same day, depending on travel time.
4. The www.viamichelin.com site will tell you both the cost of tolls and gas for your itinerary (you enter the price of gas yourself after checking one of the many websites that will give you the current price of petrol throughout Europe). And of course, nobody is forcing you to drive on toll roads.
5. Yes, Geneva is another good city to do a border switch. Geneva shares something like 70 km of border with France and only about 5 km with Switzerland -- it is just a little wart protruding into France (but still a very lovely city).
