Gah... I so badly want to plan my next Europe trip, but I don't know where, or when.

Do you have to go business-class? If not, maybe you could justify a week.

Maybe pick one spot, so as to save inter-city transport costs, find a good-value lodging choice, and go.

Example: Rent an apartment in Rome and stay there a week.

I "need" to go to Europe about 3 times a year. We fly coach, on paid tickets during the off season, and FF miles for summer trips. B&B's run about 50-80 Euros and in France we're renting gites for 350-450 Euros per week.

We were in Croatia last summer and if you stay in Sobe's it's inexpensive. Sobe's are B&Bs. It's a wonderful destination.

You could "plan" a 2 week trip on paper, finding places you'd be interested in staying, and add up the costs. Maybe you'll find a way to make it afforable so the trip can be a reality!

I understand. We have been fortunate enough to travel to Europe 2/3 times a year and I still long for it when I'm not there. Our last vacation was to Japan, and we just got back on Saturday, and I already miss traveling.

We used miles to go to Japan and were only gone for a week. And we are going back to Europe (Austria and Czech) next year for just a week on miles. Do you have to travel business? We always consider business but in the end we would take two free coach trips each to Europe over one free business class trip...it means we can go more often!

From one Europe lover to the next, happy travels!

Tracy

Jenblase-I know how you feel! I, too, am missing Europe. We haven't been since 2005 when we went to Provence & the French Riviera. We planned to go this year, but purchased a business, so travel was not in the cards for 2007, and 2008 is uncertain at this time. We don't fly on miles, but I really want to find a way to do a trip next year, even if it's a week or 10 days instead of our normal 2+ weeks. I figure if we pick destinations that are a little less expensive for us to fly to from the midwest (like Ireland or Germany) and stay in a little more budget accommodations, we can probably do it.

Good luck with whatever you decide, but as Images said, plan it out on paper and figure all the costs (that's what we do as well) and you may be surprised to find it can work!

I say go and enjoy!I don't know how old you are or if you have kids or plan to have kids, but go now while you don't!!
I would take the trip, fly coach using miles or use the business miles and go for it! You can stay in moderate priced hotels and spend at least 10 days and enjoy.
I am not sure of your situation. Kids did not halt travel altogether, but changed it for a while. We were more focused on other things, costs, etc... We are now going for the first time together (we are married 20years and have gone many other places) to Europe with our teenagers! They have traveled around the US, Caribbean, Hawaii US, but now they are going to experience different cultures and hopefully use some of their newly aquired foreign language skills . I just say go and enjoy, enjoy it while it is just the two of you and you are young and can afford it (lucky!) When we were younger, we definitely could not afford it.

I'd plan to go sooner, plan to fly coach, and choose less expensive hotels. It will be just as much fun (well except for missing business class on the plane ride over -lol!).

I'd also allow for at least 2 weeks because I agree I would not spend the money/miles to go all the way to Europe for only 7 days myself.

It sounds like you are making some obstacles for yourself that could be resolves, and maybe you just need to get some figures on paper, as suggested.

I agree as I don't fly that often that I would never use 80K miles for a one-week trip. It takes me too long to earn them. But the issue seems to just be money as to why you are making that a one week trip, and that seems to stem back to how much money you spent on your honeymoon. Otherwise, why would your husband refer to a two-week vacation as a "big trip" if he didn't mean so expensive. What are your alternatives? To take a vacation in the US or Hawaii or something? Those can cost just as much, so that's why I don't understand what the real issue is.

If he means you cannot ever take two weeks off for a vacation, that's another issue and would affect any vacation, Europe or not. If it's just another bias that since you spent 3 weeks in Europe last time and tons of money, then any vacation to Europe must be 3 weeks and very expensive -- well, it obviously doesn't. So it sounds like you haven't been very convincing that you can do it cheaper, or he doesn't want to. If it's a time thing -- I can't remember the last time I took a three week vacation, as I just can't due to my work. YOu can easily do a 10 day to two week one, if you want.

My sister just did a 10 day vacation to Europe and had a great time. That's a nice amount of time if you concentrate on one area, which she did.

OTOH, I fly coach from the west coast, stay at two star hotels and can only stay 7 or 8 days max on the ground. If I waited to be able to stay 14 full days, I'd be waiting a lot of years.

jenblase, what is it you like to do on vacation? Do you want to just lay on the beach or are you into scenery? History? Art?

Personally, having just returned from first trip that included Rome, I'd go with previous poster suggestion and rent an apt in Rome for one week or 10 days. Less expensive than hotel and you can save money by cooking some of your own meals. Search on this site for rome apts to rent.

You can then if you wish take day trips to Orvieto or even FLorence (the Express can get you to Florence in about 1-1/2 hours). Pompeii. There are lots of possibilities.

Don't wait! If you like history and art, Rome awaits you!!! It is awesome!!!

Bon voyage!
Paula

My husband's told me that he doesn't think he can tolerate the flight overseas in coach. I've done it once before, and thought it was fine, albeit not ultra comfortable, but certainly tolerable. But this was his first trip outside of the states, and he insists he could never do that kind of trip while flying in coach... he'd not sleep, couldn't handle the space constraints, etc. We've been to Florida and Vegas since the Europe trip and both times he's commented to me, "see, I couldn't handle this on a flight to Europe."

I think now that he's flown Business he's spoiled for good.

Thanks for everyone's insights, by the way. We did talk about this a little last night and we think we might do a London trip for 4-5 days and then tag it with a visit to our B & B in Provence that we love, for another 5 days. So a 10 day trip total. And we won't have to spend money on accomodations in London since his old boss moved there and he has invited us to stay with his family.

The only problem is pinning down the dates for the FF flights... All of the dates I've checked are booked for up to June travel, so we may have to go in Sept. or October, if I can find anything then.

Jenblase, it might not seem fair, but maybe he could go in business and you in coach, to save miles and possibly make it easier to find tickets.

lucky you with friends in London. Actually, I can see his point about the business class thing. If I had my way, I wouldn't fly any other way, either. But I think 10 days is a good compromise. I feel the same way he does about flights to other places than Europe, actually. I would love to go to some place in Africa (like Kenya) and just cannot face it due to the time on the plane. Once I flew coach to Egypt and that total flight time was more than 12 hours, as I lived in Los Angeles at the time. Now, I don't think I could do that -- of course seats are closer together now, also.

Girl, looks to me you guys have gotten yourselves in a box and need to get out of it! Why in heavens somebody would wait FOUR years to go to Europe just so that they fly business class...!!?? and when does a trip to Europe has to be a "big trip"?? If you really wanted to go badly you would find a way; Europe is done every day in non-shallow ways, too, you know...?

Viajero. The thing is, we don't have kids yet. I keep telling him we need to travel as much as we can now, because if we decide to have 'em in the next few years our traveling days will be over for a while!!

And it wasn't just that we waited 4 years to fly business class... we wanted to go on a nice honeymoon, so it took that long to save up the money too. It was sort of a "dream trip."

Another approach is to figure out how you can earn some more money in the next year, thus making the trip more justifiable. (I know this is sort of duh obvious, but it often seems to be the last thing considered.)

Business class is for wimps, degenerate softies and social poseurs. Tell your husband to suck it up and fly in the back with the rest of us! ;^)

I've never been in business class, and I don't want to because I don't want to spoil myself where I won't fly coach!

I don't think coach is that bad. I just pop am Ambien and I'm good to go. And after our 14 hour flight to Tokyo in coach Europe is going to feel like cake!

I am 28; DH is 30. We are planning on having kids in a few years so we have been traveling as much as possible. No way would I hold off on a trip to Europe because I would of flying coach, but different strokes for different folks...

Tracy

Seriously, tell him to suck it up and fly coach.

A transatlantic flight in coach only seems daunting, and in a way it's unfortunate that his first transatlantic flight was in business, as he's been spoiled. Kids are going to change everything--not just your flexibility, but the economics of travel, so go while the getting's good.

Sounds like you're earning miles more quickly than you used to in any case.

You have the miles to fly business so do it! I did coach for 30 years and now I save miles to upgrade or get free BC trips. Do everything you an to keep earning miles. I just paid my house taxes with Amex, double miles this month, 5000 miles added in.

There are other alternatives to luxury hotels, rent an apartment in London, Rome or Paris, Amsterdam..eat in a few times a week with foods from the wonderful markets ,check out the free stuff in cities, get transport passes.

We are retired live on investment income and SS and manage at least 2 trips a year , one for 10 days and 1 for 3-4 weeks.We don't aste money on new cars, Strbucks in the Am and other trash.

It sounds like your honeymoon was first class, all the way.

Unless you've wealthy, you and your husband will have to come to grips with the fact that all subsequent trips won't be like that. Unless you wait for years between trips.

For me, I'd rather fly coach during the off season and Priceline a 4 star hotel in London for $135 plus taxes, visit free museums, walk around town, eat $20 ethnic or vegetarian meals and just enjoy being there. Well, first class is very nice, but one first class trip versus four regular trips is no contest for me.

[When travelling with DH and kids, it gets so much more complicated, with 4 airplane tickets, apartments, etc.]

Is it the European experience you're after? Or the experience of travelling first class? These are two very different things, although they can both be had on one very expensive trip.

It sounds like maybe you have the same problem I do. DH likes travelling, while I absolutely love it, so I'm always the one dying to go.

We go frequently together and with the kids, but last year and this year, I also took a solo long weekend in London, just because I missed it so much! In the off season, airfares can be reasonable. Last Feb, I paid about $380 (or something like that). Unfortunately, this October, the airfare was more like $670, but I had to go anyway...

"Gah... I AM trying to figure out what that word means!

We just spent 700 USD each for flights to Venice on a very comfortable 767. After several A330 flights to Italy in coach, we thought the 767 was heaven. We use all the information we can to pick the most comfortable seats. This time, it really was fine.

Our apartment in Venice was about 1000 USD and we spent 150 on transportation passes that got us a lot of discounts into many venues and all transportation was included. We didn't shop, ate lunch either very casual seated or cichetti, and had a nice dinner every night. For about 1300 each, without meals, we had an incredible time in Venice for a week.

I cant imagine a more pleasing trip at a more pleasing price. It took some planning, but in the end, it was wonderful. I am older, but I was still comfortable.

And you can collect miles in a hurry if you really work it. We are going Biz class next May, but I don't really need to and neither does DH. It is all in what we tell ourselves we need to be happy. If I were you, I would have to prove to DH that he could do it in coach.

Thanks guys. I suggested that DH fly in business class while I fly in coach, and he said no way, he'd fly in coach with me before he'd make me do that. So, maybe he will come around to flying coach one day.

But we *do* have the miles for business now and since it does seem we're earning them faster than we did before (we've been putting everything on our Starwood AmEx and paying it off each month), I won't worry about burning the miles on this trip because hopefully we'll accrue enough in the meantime for our next one.

Looks like a 10-11 day
trip to London/Provence & possibly Amsterdam in September is in the works. I posed it to him as... yeah we'll spend money in London but we don't have to worry about accomodations because Rob lives there and has been inviting us to come for years. And our Provence B & B was the least expensive place we stayed in all of our travels last time - $125 euros a night - yet it was the place we liked the best!!!

He is definitely excited about the prospect of getting to go back earlier than he thought, and I'm so happy!!

I just noticed this comment posted by Travelgirl2:

"Is it the European experience you're after? Or the experience of travelling first class? These are two very different things, although they can both be had on one very expensive trip."

It is definitely just the European experience that I'm after. I don't need to travel first class, no way. In fact I wouldn't even say that our honeymoon was first class. But since it was our honeymoon and DH's first time to Europe, I wanted to do it up right. Certain things we splurged on... i.e., we had ocean views in Nice and lake views in Montreux, and a Paris Perfect apt. for example. So all of those little things cost extra money. But now that I've "been there, done that," we wouldn't need to stay in those kind of places again. We have the pictures and our memories to remember what the view of the Med. looked like from our hotel window in Nice.

Like I said we enjoyed our simple, comfy B & B in Provence the most and it was the least costly of all of our accomodations.

With DH it's a matter of comfort... he has a bad back and bed comfort and plane comfort is important to him. But I've learned that just because you spend more money on a hotel room, doesn't mean it will have a comfortable bed!!!

Some airlines have a class in between coach and Business class, with a little more space. Might that would satisfy your husband? Which airline is the one where you've amassed all those miles? Maybe it has a partner with "Coach+" British Air and United both have an Economy+ class.