If it were me I would just go to Paris (where there is enough to see and do for a month) and then make 1 or 2 day trips. With the TGV it is possible to make a kong day trip to other parts of France - if you're willing to take a 7 am train out and come back after an early dinner.)

I would Strasboug - which has a very Germanic feel due to it's history as one - and chck out the options you would enjoy most for the other.

Alternatively, you could land in Munich and spend time in southern Germany - which would give you a mix of city, countryside, a day in the mountains and lots of history and palaces. For that I would rent a car to do a 4 day drive around - then spend the rest of the time in/around Munich.

nytraveler: Thank you so much for your response. If we were to spend time in Southern Germany where would you recommend staying and visiting? Just want to have a few ideas to research on that area. I know Paris is considered one of the most amazing places to visit, but I am not sure about spending all 9 days there? Guess I will have to look into that more as well.

Why do you want to visit 2 countries?

With only 9 days I would choose a major city where you can take trips outside the city. Paris would be my first choice followed by Berlin.

From Paris you can take day trips to Giverny, Versailles, Chantilly. From Berlin you can visit Potsdam and Dresden.

If you really want to go to 2 countries you can do Berlin and Prague or Munich and Prague. Fly into one city and home from another.

Hi Adrienne: Thanks for your response. It isn't necessary that we visit 2 countries...I just thought if there was a way to, it would be nice. As an example Munich and Salzburg are not far by train. Not sure if that would be a good idea or not, but thats what I was thinking as far as visiting two countries if close enough by train.

There's also Paris and Belgium. The Thayls train goes non-stop to Brussels in about an hour and a half, I think it was, that I was on the train. I've done the Paris/Brussels train quite a few times over the decades.

If you end up in Paris, here's my hotel thread.


http://www.fodors.com/community/europe/paris-hotels-left-bank-thread.cfm

http://www.fodors.com/community/europe/paris-hotels-right-bank-thread.cfm

Jump to the bottom of the thread and then scroll up to Dec 31,2010. In that section, I have categorized the recommended hotels, by district, and have provided websites.

Happy Travels!

It seems like you're not focused on multiple countries but multiple places such as Munich and Salzburg which happen to be in two different countries. It's a fine idea if you have an interest in two places in two countries that are not far from each other.

It's been a long time since I was in those two cities but I'm not sure there is enough to see there for 9 days (but I could be wrong) so you should look for other things to do between them.

Thank you both Guenmai & Adrienne!

I will look into the Paris/Brussels route more......what are your thoughts on Amsterdam? I know Brussels is closer on the train, but I believe it says Paris to Amsterdam is 3 hours or so. How would you compare Brussels and Amsterdam and which would you choose to visit along with Paris?

I am also going to look into the Munich/Salzburg idea and see what other areas close by may be of interest.

I don't get the relation between all the countries you have listed and what you actually want to do. At any rate, I'd limit it to two countries, or Paris, Brussels, and Amsterdam.

I think you might be a bit disappointed with Brussels and Amsterdam based on your interests. They don't call them the "Low Countries" for nothing. If you want mountains, lakes, fountains, statues and castles, I'd recommend a loop through southern Germany and Austria that contains Munich, Salzberg, Berchtesgaden, Garmisch and/or Fuessen.

When I mentioned Brussels, I wasn't mentioning it as a place that had to be visited. I was mentioning it as a place where the train ends up. One can go to places like Brugges, Gent, Antwerp, etc. I've been all over Belgium and personally find it quite nice; especially the Flemish part as my friends are Flemish. Happy Travels!

May I suggest that you first make a decision between natural scenery (mountains, oceans etc.) and history / culture? Europe is so varied, both historically, culturally as well as from a scenic point of view. The two are probably best combined in places like Southern Germany, Austria, Switzerland and Northern Italy. Take care though that you don't cram in too much in only 9 days. The phrase: "If it's Tuesday, this must be Belgium" describes it all.

Paris is of course one of Europe's jewels in the crown. From there it is indeed an easy train ride to Brussels from where you could visit cities like Antwerp and Gent. Adding Amsterdam to your schedule would probably be even too much in my opinion but transportation/time wise if would be possible. Remember though that you need extra travel time because I assume you plan to buy a round trip ticket from NYC so you need to return to your city of arrival. Bon voyage!

If you can do an open jaw flight, it's your best bet to see most without having to backtrack to your port of entry.
The classic Northern Alps route could take you from Munich (arrival, one day trip to Garmisch area for Linderhof palace and Ettal monastery, Mittenwald, rt via Kochelsee) to Salzburg (1 night or 2) to Vienna (remaining nights and departure).
If you are not too much into museums, you can get a good feel of Munich in 1-2 days.
Salzburg is a small town, and easy to explore. if you don't want another hotel, you can easily discover Salzburg old town as a day break between / en route from Munich and Vienna if you don't start too late in Munich.
Vienna would be a touch of the old emperial empire with the respective buildings which are more impressive than in Munich.

If I had to choose two cities I would choose Munich (since you seem to be interested in this city), and Vienna. I have been twice to Vienna, and I love it so much - the elite atmosphere especially in the centre, the polite friendly people, St. Stephen's Cathedral in the centre, a boat trip on the River Danube, the Prater amusement park where there is the giant Ferres wheel which allows you to see the whole of Vienna under you, the beautiful majestic palaces and buildings and elegant streets in the centre as well as a visit to the incredible Schonbrunn Palace and huge gardens on outskirts, well worth a day's trip,famous main street called the GraBen where it is so wonderful to stop in this pedestrian area to have a coffee at one of its many cafeterias, and window-shop at the beautiful stores - I could go on and on. Vienna just has a special and unique feel - you hear waltz music everywhere you go, it is like going a step back in time to waltz era.

The first time I went to Vienna was in the 80s with friends. We had spent a two-week holiday visiting Vienna, Munich and Salzburg. Salzburg, comparatively a small, is beautiful (lovely surrounding mountain scenery and the birthplace of Mozart), but if I had to pick between Vienna and Salzburg, Vienna would be the tops for sure. Alternatively I would fit all three in since they are on the same route and train connection. There is the high speed Austrian railway called RailJet that connects Munich and Salzburg and Vienna. You said you have 11 nights, including travel days - so if you want to fit them all in I would do 4 nights Munich, 3 nights Salzburg and 4 nights Vienna, arriving in Munich and leaving from Vienna or vice versa (Salzburg is enroute in between). (Or maybe 3 nights Munich, 3 nights Salzburg and 5 nights Vienna)
Or else pick 2 of these three plaaces.

Last vacation in Vienna was a long weekend break (Friday morning to Monday late evening) during the kids mid-term holidays in 2004. We had still managed to visit so many tourist attractions and my kids still say that it was one of their favourite holidays abroad. We hired a car and drove around (we are brave enough - my hubby that is - to drive in many major cities in Europe, but not for the faint-hearted or for those not accustomed to driving in cities of foreign countries, but it is absolutely necessary for us since we have a child with disability).

Alternatively, as other Fodorites suggested, you might be interested in visiting Paris and Brussels, or Paris and Amsterdam since you prefer to combine two countries. In my opinion you can combine two places during your holiday - if you have 11 nights at your disposal I would do 6 or 7 nights in Paris and 5 or 4 nights in the other country you choose.

Forgot to mention - other places of interest in Vienna (really beautiful which my kids really enjoyed) are the Seegrotte on the outskirts - they are underground caves which used to be mines, you even get a underground boat trip on here) and the Vienna woods, really picturesque. There are many day/half-day tours which you can book at tourist offices (which we did when I visited first time in Vienna with friends) that do a combination of places of interest so that you make the best of your time there, so convenient for places outside central Vienna. They are extremely punctually and perfectly organized.

Another area you might want to visit quite close to Vienna centre is an area called the Grinzing, it is long road with restaurants mostly all with gardens (they are called wine/beer gardens). There is such a lovely atmosphere there.

Hi CM,

Intercity airfare in Europe is very cheap (see www.whichbudget.com). There is no need to choose destinations in adjoining countries.

However, you should decide which one or two places you want to visit, eg, Venice and Florence, Munich and Salzburg (of course there is enough to fill 9 days), Paris, London, Paris and London, etc

If you're considering Munich and Salzburg and not renting a car I would go to Vienna. I think it's a joyous city, excellent for walking but not large enough to be overwhelming when combined with Munich and Salzburg.

The other options from Salzburg if you want to get out into the countryside are Hallstat and St. Gilgen. I believe both are accessible by public transport from Salzburg.

I think Austria is an extremely beautiful country.

Thank you all so much for your responses and advice.

For some reason I just have such an interest in seeing Munich and the Bavaria area. I really would love to visit the Neuschwanstein Castle especially. I want to visit the "must see" places, but I also love the thought of just strolling down cobblestone streets, sitting outside eating lunch and people watching. I also grew up watching the "Sound of Music" and fell in love with the scenery in the movie so that was a big reason I wanted to see Salzburg. (Maybe its a silly reason, but it is what got my attention to visiting)

If I traveled to Brussels, I too have heard Brussels is just an ok area to visit, but that Antwerp, Ghent, and Brugges are some great places to see. Would one stay in Brussels and take trips to these places or stay some place else?

Elizabeth54: I completely understand why you shouldn't try to cram it all in. I want to be able to see places and enjoy them without feeling rushed. I would love to see Switzerland one day (I really want to go to Montreux) and Northern Italy. I have such a desire to see Venice and the lake region. People have always told me to see Paris and I want to. It just gets so confusing with so many amazing places to see. I want to see Croatia (Split & Dubrovnik) as well as the French Riviera one day. My list is long and one day I will see a lot more of Europe.

I just want to add, I haven't mentioned it yet, but this 9 day trip will probably be our last Europe trip for some time as we are hoping to start a family after this vacation next summer. So with this info where would you all choose to go if this was your last Europe trip for awhile?

If your strongest interest is Munich and Bavaria, then by all means go for it.

Below is a trip report for a recent trip we took: - we flew into/out of Munich non-stop and had 10 days on the ground instead of 9, but you could easily adapt it. It included 1-1/2 days in Salzburg as well as Neuschwanstein castle.

http://www.fodors.com/community/europe/munich-salzburg-and-bavaria-52710-6710.cfm

On the other hand... Paris IS the crown jewel of Europe. A trip that encompassed 6 days in Paris and 3 days in either Amsterdam or Belgium would also be a dream...

Also - some ideas for Belgium

http://www.fodors.com/community/europe/bardo-in-belgium-easter-2011.cfm

I believe Paris practically plans itself. But if you get stuck, there are a gazillion Paris trip reports on this board including a few of mine.

There's a TV station in Salzburg that plays The Sound of Music 24/7!

Agree with bardo1 - if your main places to visit are Munich in Bavaria and Salzburg, then go for it. If you keep on debating about whether you should go to other places and countries (you mention many different countries - you will get even more confused. However, I can totally understand you - when I was your age I wanted to visit everywhere that I never went to. But starting a family is not the end of your holiday trips for sure. I have been taking holidays with my family since my first child was one year old. Of course there were some years when we skipped holiday abroad, but there were many lovely holidays, and we have three kids - now older of course but they still come with us to every single trip.

Yes, the Black Forest in Bavaria is beautiful, and so is the atmosphere in Munich - the locals there are so friendly. Alos, Salzburg is remembered for its Sound of Music movie. In fact, I remember we had taken a day tour (in the 80s) which was called the Sound of Music Tour which takes you to the places where the movie is filmed, really beautiful countryside. I remember we had gone up the very small mountain (or hill) in a tram, and on this high hill there was a restaurant which made a folklore night with their traditional dancing and costumes, including dinner. We had also visited the house where Mozart lived, as I already mentioned, you hear the classic music everywhere. Of course we had also managed to find a disco (renowned in the 80s in Europe). Salzburg itself is so lovely.

My second option would be Paris and Btussels/or Amsterdam. Personally I would prefer Amsterdam, it is so rich in history, the canal strees with the picturesue houses so unique, it has got a very nice Science museum on the harbour, the harbour itself is so magnificent, and so are its street canals and ancient buildings, flower markets and last not least the diamond museum. Personally, Brussels did not impress me much, but Bruges is nice. Check it out, I am not sure about distance, but maybe you might do a day trip to Bruges from Amsterdam, it is certainly possible for Anthwerp.

We had done a holiday to Paris, Belgium and Amsterdam in 2008, and managed to fit in Bruges and Antwerp, staying overnight in Bruges, and a day trip to Antwerp, but we were driving around by car. During that trip we had even gone to Bastogne in Liege as my husband and boys waned to go to the Grand Prix in Spa. It was a two-week holiday, and of course you do save a lot of time when travelling by car, besides having the option to stop at some town or city en route. Paris is so beautiful and magical, both day and night but in my opinion the city of lights, as it is called, is best in the evenings. So much to do and places to visit, though of course not cheap at all. If you are on a budget I guess Munich and the Bavaria area and Salzburg might prove to be more affordable.

Venice and the Italian lakes are also beautiful of course, but if I were you I would shortlist two possibilities for this vacation, otherwise you will get more and more confused and it will make it so much harder to decide. There will be other holidays for you in the future, don't worry. Having kids does not mean no more vacations abroad for a long time. So many Fodorites here travel with babies.

Hub and I had only grabbed long weekends in Paris on our first trips there. On the third, we stayed 2 weeks and I still have places on the "to see" list. So I'd vote Paris. We did take 2 day-trips with Cityrama: one to Bruges and one to see 3 castles in the Loire Valley. We had seen Versailles on previous visits but returned on our own to see more of the grounds.

Since you may fall hard for Italy when you attend the wedding, plan B would be fly into Venice and out of Pisa or Rome. Stay in Venice for a few days and then choose a lovely town in Tuscany to base or head down to Rome and finish your time there.

Forgot to mention the delicious Mozart chocolates round ball-shaped ones or flat round ones filled with praline which the picture of Mozart on them - you will find them in every confectionery in Salzburg = soo good, not to mention the German beer in Munich, although Beligan beer is just as good in my opinion.

I understand that you are going to Italy for another vacation, so I think I would choose to go to a different country/countries during this holiday. Maybe you might manage to fit in Venice for a couple of days in the September vacation, and depart back home from there if you are so eager to visit this city? But if you already have many stops I would leave it.

ANNA: I can't thank you enough for your response. You are so right, I know this won't be my last European trip and I know one day with our children we will want to take them, but it truly is so hard to choose where to go when there are just so many places that fascinate me! I agree that because I am going to Italy in September I would rather choose other places to visit for this summer trip. I would love to visit Amsterdam & Paris together or Munich (bavarian area) and Salzburg.

So with these two possible ideas what do you choose and why? My husband and I also like to be flexible with traveling. Of course we want some kind of plan, but like I said before, we also like the days not packed with sightseeing. We also would prefer not to spend much of our time inside museums. How would one split up their days in these areas?

I don't know if you will be able to see this, but one of my non-museum, non-sight seeing passions is window shopping. This is from a 2010 trip to Paris and Amsterdam.
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=1440639069262&set=vb.1631629411&type=2&theater

"So with these two possible ideas what do you choose and why?"

First off, EITHER of these will be a fantastic trip and I hesitate to simply pick one over the other. Instead I'll just mention some intangibles:

Paris/Amsterdam can be done completely without a car. Paris can be thoroughly enjoyed without concentrating on tourist sites (though those available are amazing). I would fly into AMS, spend 3 days in Amsterdam, then train to Paris (always save the best for last!) for the remainder of your trip and fly home from CDG. This is totally subjective, but there is no places I would rather spend time than Paris (though I imaging a number of Fodorites would agree).

The Germany trip lends itself toward renting a car (though not while in Munich). It also lends itself toward some stunning outdoor hiking/scenery (including Zugspitze). This trip also allows for visiting some drop-dead cute small villages. This trip makes most sense as a triangular route. Fly in MUC, stay 4 nights, get a car in the city and head to Salzburg for 1 or 2 nights and then continue toward Garmish/villages/castles area for remaining time. You might want to stay your final night near Munich depending on what time your flight home leaves before returning the car at Munich airport. You DON'T want to pick up a car in Austria and return it in Germany. Driving in Germany/Austria is a snap and the perfectly maintained roads in the countryside are practically empty.

That is a hard questiony ou are asking me CMurphy88 Both options have beautiful places to visit.

I know you you mean, Ilike visiting museums as well, but I do not like to stay in historical buildings all the time. I must admit, I have a passiion for palaces and cathedrals, but I love everything else that is outdoors, even during Wintertime holidays like unusual Christmas activities in Italy.. I also love unusual places of interest, like mines, ascending unusual monuments or wheels, river or harbour or canal boat rides, and most of all taking in the outside atmosphere of any city or town.

As I said, it is all a matter of personal choice. Paris is so beautiful with plenty of sites to see and Amsterdam unique is in its own way, more visited by the younger generation - many Europeons go to college there, and also maybe because drugs were legal there - but there was some law lately that drugs can't be sold to foreigners. Saying that it is a beautiful city with one of the most beautiful harbours that I ever visited.

If you are into more mountain scenery and countryside, then Munich and Salzburg might be for you and a slower pace, then these places might be for you. Amsterdam countryside is totally flat. People are so friendly and orderly and helpful in Bavaria (Munich is the capital city of Bavaria - Bavaria is a region in Germany) and also Austria. The Austrians are very well-mannered and orderly people. Somehow,m in my opinion, these places feel maybe safer. But it is so hard to choose between these two options. Personally, I would not miss out on Vienna, I love it so much, I would not even consider not visiting Vienna if I were to visit Salzburg, even if it were the hundredth time. But each to his own.

One thing you might take into consideration. Paris (also Amsterdam) are expensive cities to visit. The food is so expensive, I remember in 2008 a sandwich and chips cost us 13 euro each in a normal, not high class restaurant in central Paris close to the Eiffel Tower, (unless you plan to eat fast food or take-outs or buy groceries from supermarkets - you see so many people doing that close to the River Seine). It is nice to do that, undoubtedly, but I also enjoy meals in good restaurants. And to eat in a good restaurant you have to pay very good money for it. The accommodation is very expensive as well.

Munich and Salzburg (as well as Vienna) are much more affordable holidays for sure. Accommodation is not so expensive. Their sausages and schnitzel (pork or veal in batter) are to die for. In fact, in the Vienna 4 day break me and my family went to, I remember well that we did not even spend the budget we had planned for it - I must say in most of our other holidays we spent more than we anticipated.

So if you have a strict budget or a budget limit for your holiday you might also consider this.

Ultimately, do some research with your husband on these places, and try and find out what your priorities and interests are.

But if you really really had to press me for which option I would take, trying to imagine that I have never been to any of the places, I think I would ultimately say Paris and Amsterdam. But if you include Vienna, then probably I would bend to the other option, as I would have included a bit of everything, beautiful countryside and mountain scenery and a most beautiful historical city as well. Munich is nice and has its own lovely atmosphere as well, but always in my opinion, cannot be compared to Vienna. I just love it - the palaces, the grandeur of the historical sites, the classical music, especially the sound of Blue Danube on the boat trip and everywhere you go - it makes me feel that I am in another era. Forgot to add - operas are also unique in Vienna if you are into that, and also the concerts. I went to an opera when I visited there with friends, and a concert at a palace when I went with my family. At the concert there was even dancers dressed in epoque ballroom attire in the background dancing to each piece of classical music played by the orchestra. Heavenly!!

Forgot to ask - How many nights do you have in total? I aways prefer to plan holidays based on the number of nights, due to booking accommodation, etc

Switzerland is fabulous (Montreux is stunning), why not just go there?? 9 days would be fine to see some highlights of the country. Summertime beautiful weather there.

Anna - It sounds like the OP has 10 nights to make for 9 full days on the ground with last night being before the flight home.

CMurphy - I concur with Anna's observations on costs. The Paris/Amsterdam (major cities) option will be a more expensive trip that the Germany (medium city Munich, very small city Salzburg, plus very small country villages) option.

Not unlike the price differential between Midwest US/NYC or similar city/country divides anywhere else in the world.

CMurphy, here are three quotes from your own posts:

"We love beautiful scenery & views: mountains, oceans, lakes, buildings, fountains, statues, castles"

"For some reason I just have such an interest in seeing Munich and the Bavaria area. I really would love to visit the Neuschwanstein Castle especially."

"I also grew up watching the "Sound of Music" and fell in love with the scenery in the movie so that was a big reason I wanted to see Salzburg."

You have obviously made up your mind that you want to go to Munich, Salzburg and Fuessen (where Neuschwanstein is located), but just aren't admitting it yet. So, I will make the decision for you...You are going to Munich, Salzburg and Fuessen and you are going to love it. Now go make your reservations.

I'm bookmarking for all the wonderful information.

Camporico: HAHA! Thank you for this! I really did think my mind was made up but now I am really considering Paris & Amsterdam. I'm going back and forth!

I like that we would not have to rent a car visiting Paris & Amsterdam.

Castles are a big highlight for me. I have been looking at both the Chateau de Pierrefonds and the Neuschwanstein Castle. Any advice on which one people prefer?

Just want to add this bit of info about my husband and I: We live in the country or suburb in a small town in NJ. About an hour train ride from NYC. We love to go to NYC for a few days to walk around (especially the village area) wine and dine but after a few days we can't deal with the crowds and the business and love to come home to privacy and quietness in our own backyard. Knowing this about us, if we decide to do Paris and Amsterdam will there be days where we can find down time in or around Paris in the country or winery?

I have been wanting to go to Amsterdam for a long time as well (not for the partying) I want to see the canals and just stroll.

But then when I think of munich and salzburg i think of the beauty, friendly people, and not the crazy city feel.

As far as budget, we can do either trip. When you say expensive trip can it be equivalent to prices we see in NYC?

I am just so torn........

Paris/Amsterdam combo is great.

Switzerland is great.

No need for a car with either itinerary.

IMHO London, Paris and Rome are really the big three for first timers. With the time you have You can easily pick two cities with nearby daytrips. The next tier of cities to visit include Amsterdam, Munich, Barcelona, Vienna, Berlin, Venice, Prague, Athens, Madrid, Florence and more.

I would recommed that if you would like to see Munich/Salzburg, split your time with Bavaria and one of the top three. Fly into one and out of the other to save time. If you pick London or Paris you can daytrip to the other one on the chunnel train. It will give you a glimpse of the other city for next time.

Unless you are going out into the country you wont want or need a car in the cities because of traffic and parking hassels. Most of these cities have great public transportation systems.

Just a note about Paris - it's a bog city that does NOT feel like a big city to me in the way NY, Chicago or London does. So in terms of feeling crowded it's a much easier city than others.

BIG city that is.

I'd do the first few days in Paris. Rent a car for three days and tour around the Loire and the chateaux to get a feel for the countryside. Then come back to Paris for the last few days.

No one has mentioned Innsbruck. If you choose Munich and Salzburg, I would add Innsbruck in for a day. I agree that Vienna is wonderful; and if you go there in season, try to see the Lipizzaner horses perform--pricy, but breathtaking. The subway system is quite easy to navigate there. I'm not a big fan of Amsterdam. We all like different things!

If you do Paris/Amsterdam, I, in my opinion, I do not think you really would need a car. It is so difficult to park in these cities. Even we found it difficult, and often went round and round same streets to find a parking space, and we even have the blue sticker for reserved parking for disability, as we always have our daughter with us on holiday. Many of these reserved parking would either also be taken, or reserved for residents. Ulimately though, we always found somewhere. Saying that, there were times when we were lucky and found a parking space immediately. You would have plenty to see in Paris, there is an efficient underground train service, ferry service to places of interest etc. I would not imagine it would be a problem in Amsterdam either. The train station is very central, and there are tourist buses that take you to places of interest, boat trips on the canals an easy walk to the harbour where there is the science museum, walkable to the flower market etc. Maybe you might take trains to surrounding countryside attractions. In Paris try and make sure that you include the Versailles Palace and gardens - we went by car but I am sure that you can easily go by train or bus from central Paris - other Fodorites would provide this information for sure. We also enjoyed the the Asterix and Obelix theme park, it is very French and unique, nicer than Disneyland Paris in my opinion. It is outside Paris, but I am sure there is transport to this attraction. If it were me, I would spend 3 nights in Amsterdam and 7 nights in Paris. If you decide on these destinations, that is.

I am not sure, always in your case, about Munich/Salzburg - I haven't been with my family driving around, only with a group of friends in the eighties and we used public transport or taxis. But maybe this option might be more worth considering car rental since these are relatively smaller places and would most probably be easier to navigate for sure than Paris and Amsterdam. It would be nice to drive around in the Black Forest, visiting castles, palaces etc, and drive around surrounding countryside of Salzburg. If you decide to drive, try and find hotels that have parking facilities or have parking areas close by, or that are not in the very centre as there might be restricted zones. Check this out with hotel before booking. I personally do not think it will be that hard for you.

Now, if you are going to ask me what I would do if it were me LOL, we hire car anywhere we go, for the comfort of transport, because we always travel as a family of five, and because of my disabled daughter. BUT if I were you (LOL) I would hire a car only for the option of Munich and the surrounding countryside of Bavaria and Salzburg - especially since you do intend to wander around outside these cities quite a lot. This would save you doing day tours, which might prove to be costly, and saves you the inconvenience of travelling as a group with a tour leader dictating everything, or taking buses/trains every time to different areas. I also love the convenience of having a car at our disposal at the airport - no need to worry about transfers or taking taxis. We used to do that when travelling with friends of course, and it was no problem, but now I know the difference. Of course the more experienced one gets, the better. Most large and cities congested with traffic like Paris and London are not for the faint-hearted tourists or those not accustomed in driving in city centres as it needs a lot of concentration. No piece of pie. Try and book flights where you land in Munich and out of Salzburg or vice versa.

Just a reminder just in case you decide not to hire car - the Austrian rail service is excellent, these people like to do things perfect in every way, they are very disciplined yet accommodating and friendly. No bus or bus tour or whatever will leave even one minute late, I am sure their public transport will offer an excellent service, as well as that of Germany.

Now you have to decide what suits you most.

I was seeing maitaitom's suggestion, and it gave me an idea.

Since it is important for you that you do not stay just in cities during your holiday, maybe you can pick up hired car from Paris airport, and drive to the Loire and chateaux country area for a few days (2 or 3 nights). You then return car to Paris airport and do 5 nights in Paris and spend the last 2 or 3 nights in Amsterdam. Otherwise, start off from Amsterdam and finish off your holiday in Paris.

On our visit to Amsterdam, we only stayed slept night there. We arrived late in the afternoon, spent the evening there, and had the whole next day in Amsterdam as our plane departed at 11pm from Schilpol airport. We managed to visit the diamond museum (stop included in the short bus tour), go on a ferry trip around the harbour, a canal ferry cruise, a bus tour around the historical centre, and wander around the centre and narrow street canals. It was enough for us, though I wished we had managed to fit in the science museum mainly because of my boys. But I felt it was an enough experience of Amsterdam to have the feel of it - it was quite crowdy on our short visit. Of course I am glad that we managed to fit in this city.

I do not want to influence you in your choice, but you might also take into consideration when you ultimately choose which option you take - that it might be easier to visit Bavaria and Salzburg when you have babies or toddlers with you than it would be to visit Paris and Amsterdam, since the lateer are bigger cities.

ANNA: Thank you so much for all your advice. I think it is a great idea to hire a car and spend a few days in the country. I feel like it would be a great way to get both city and country visits. In no way are you influencing me one way or another, however you did make me think about Salzburg and Bavaria being easier to visit with babies. I think that is something we really will think about and I think it makes a lot of sense to maybe hold off on that trip. Thank you for that!

One quick question: We are hoping to travel middle of June 2013 for this trip, however it is tentative due to work schedules. If we had to move it to the end of August 2013 is it still ok to do Paris & Amsterdam?

Sure, Paris and Amsterdam in August or June either one are OK.

Either June or August is just fine for a Paris/Amsterdam trip.

You'll have the best weather in one and it will be acceptable in the other. June is optimum for Paris and August is optimum for Amsterdam.

Both months would be fine. Paris might be warmer in August, but if you don't mind it and are used to hotter weather, then it should be ok for you in that regard. Saying that, it is not uncommon that there might be spells of hot weather even in June. But I love the heat, maybe because I am used to it. The Summer months are my favourite months.


We were in Belgium, Paris and Amsterdam between the first and third week of September a few years ago, and weather was quite warm in Paris, about 20 degrees celcius, mostly always rainy days in Belgium. and a nice sunny day in Amsterdam (last 2 days of the holiday), but it was quite cool, we needed a light sweater during the day and a thicker one in the evening.

So weatherwise, June and August are both fine. However, August would be more packed with tourists, as many Europeons prefer to do their holidays in July/August (probably many Americans as well), as schools in many countries in Europe start their Summer term holidays later than in the USA (many after mid June up to even mid July), and start again after the second or third week of September, in some countries even end of September. That is why I prefer around second week of September, as it often means less tourists, especially family holidaymakers and group tours, but then weather would start getting cooler and more chance of rain showers in various countries. But we were always lucky with the weather - except from some rain showers here and there which did not deter us from enjoying the holiday.

So, if it were me, I think I would choose mid June, but that does not mean I would not be willing to do a holiday in August either if that is the only vacation time I have available during the Summer. In my younger days I used to take holidays in August with friends and I loved the fun atmosphere especially in the evenings.

CMurphy88 - I am reading your question again, and noted you said END of August (so holiday would be end of August to first week of September- so that should be a good option as well, since the very very peak tourist is the first 3 weeks of August, Italians, for example, have their shut-downs and holidays usually up to around the 23rd of August.

So you will be fine on both options.

Thank you!! Yes, plans are up in the air yet regarding the month we will go, but if we go in June it will have to be the 2nd or 3rd week and if we went in August we would leave sometime after Aug 19th. Glad to know either or would be fine! And yes, we are use to the hot humid days being in NJ!

Hi CM,

You want to visit Munich and Salzburg, visit Munich and Salzburg.

>where would you all choose to go if this was your last Europe trip for awhile?<

Paris. Everyone should visit Paris before they die so that when they get to heaven they won't spend eternity wishing they had gone to Paris.

Yes....I think we have decided....Paris and Amsterdam it is! Now the fun part....actually planning the trip! Please help with must sees, places that we can just stroll around, outdoor cafes to people watch, restaurants, etc....

I would really like to see castles one day too....would visiting the Chateau de Pierrefonds be a good day trip?

When I first read your posr, I thought Paris amd Amsterdam. I reallyn ove Amsterdam and it pairs well with Paris. Great choice. They are different and will give you a great experience for yoir first trip to Europe.

CMurphy88 - good choice in my opinion!! Paris and Amsterdam are so grand and unique.

Do you still plan to spend a few days in the countryside of France?

In my opinion 3 nights in Amsterdam should be enough (unless you want to do a day trip out of Amsterdamor even Belgium.

Do not leave out the visit to Versailles, the palace and gardens are just wonderful.

Do you intend to take train from Paris to Amsterdam? Careful which railway you select. I was reading just now in Frommers that RailEurope are agencies and tickets are more expensive. Maybe other Fodorites can give suggestions on this as we never train to cross different countries, but used hired cars.

I have another idea - If you plan your holiday for August, would you be able to allow an extra night or two? - (maybe trying to fit in two weekends in case of limited vacation leave) - on how you can expand your trip a little, especially since you might not visit this part of Europe for a long time (I am sure your next trip will be to Bavaria and Salzbrg, lol).

So, let us say you have 11 nights instead of 10. I would fly to Paris and spend the first 5 nights (6 days) there, just visiting the beautiful central sites of this city, and include a visit to Versailles. After those 5 nights I would hire a car and base myself in a town/village north France. On the way, I would stop for a visit at the Chateau de Pierrefonds (it is to the north of Paris).

So I would then base myself for 3 nights north of Paris in northern France, the next day I would do a whole day driving around at your leisure, maybe visiting another castle or chateaux, around the countryside of France, and the next day do a whole day's visit to Bruges or Ghent (Bruges is only an hour's drive from Lille, and even less from Ghent). Then the following day, at the end of the 3 nights, I would leave car at Lille (which is extremely close to the Dutch border - maybe you can base yourself in a town or village close to Lille) , and take a train journey from Lille to Amsterdam (which would be a much shorter train journey than Paris to Amsterdam. Then spend the last 3 nights in Amsterdam, and fly back home from there.

That way you would have 3 nights away from city centres so you would be able to drive around the French countryside at your own leisure, maybe visiting a castle or two and also fit in a visit to Bruges. It is very easy to drive into Bruges, it is not huge, we did it. When we went in the month of September it was not packed with tourists.

I chose Lille in France to deposit your car, since there are very hefty charges if you pick up car in one country and deposit it in another, and since it is exactly near the Dutch border, and would probably have good train connection to Amsterdam.

Maybe you should pick up car from Paris airport if you want to avoid driving out of Paris centre - or anywhere or anywhere outside the very city centre.

AMS & CDG are both MAJOR airport hubs - the result is that you can fly open-jaw (into AMS & home from CDG, always save the best for last!) for about the same price as a straight round-trip ticket from one or the other. I highly suggest you do so.

Anna has thrown in a lot of new ideas - all good but contingent on extending thew trip. FWIW, I would not suggest any changes that involves less than 5 full days on the ground in Paris.

I'll withhold any "must see" (museums, monuments, etc.) suggestions until you have finalized time planned in each place - however, here are some nice generalized "strolling/sitting/watching" ideas ideas:
PARIS: a river tour via Batobus, Place des Vosges, Ille St. Louis (an outdoor table here facing Notre Dame listening to street musicians in early evening is really special abrasserie-isl.fr‎ ), Arenes de Lutece for a nice daytime rest, Jardin des Plantes, Rue Mouffletard, Square Rene Viviani is also a nice rest stop, When returning from Montmarte (I assume you'll go), stop at Relais au de Butte for a meal/rest as you wind you way down the hill back toward the MEtro stop - totally local, cheap, delicious and convivial.

Amers

AMS & CDG are both MAJOR airport hubs - the result is that you can fly open-jaw (into AMS & home from CDG, always save the best for last!) for about the same price as a straight round-trip ticket from one or the other. I highly suggest you do so.

Anna has thrown in a lot of new ideas - all good but contingent on extending the trip. FWIW, I would not suggest any changes that involves less than 5 full days on the ground in Paris.

I'll withhold any "must see" (museums, monuments, etc.) suggestions until you have finalized time planned in each place - however, here are some nice generalized "strolling/sitting/watching" ideas ideas:

PARIS: a river tour via Batobus, Place des Vosges, Ille St. Louis (an outdoor table here facing Notre Dame listening to street musicians in early evening is really special abrasserie-isl.fr‎ ), Arenes de Lutece for a nice daytime rest, Jardin des Plantes, Rue Mouffletard, Square Rene Viviani is also a nice rest stop, When returning from Montmarte (I assume you'll go), stop at Relais au de Butte for a meal/rest as you wind your way down the hill back toward the Metro stop - totally local, cheap, delicious and convivial.

Amsterdam:
in separate post... gotta run...

I know the afficinados will tell you need a month or a year to really see Paris or Amsterdan or anywhere else. Trouble is you have to get as much as possible out of the time you have. Take a look in the front of Rick Steves Paris book. He has a quickie guide for those of us who have only one day. Then what to add if you have a second or third day. Versailles is definately not a castle but maybe it will give yiu a taste of royal living. Enjoy my favorite part of the trip ... The planning part.

I would love to add more days to our vacation, however the time and the month all depends on my husbands work and MBA class schedule. I am a teacher so I'm the lucky one that gets summers off. If we take this trip at the end of August we probably would be able to add more days then, but not in June. (crossing my fingers then for an Aug trip)

I was also thinking the best thing for us to do is fly into Amsterdam and out of Paris. I was thinking Amsterdam may be a better city for us to deal with the jet lag.

Anna: Thank you all for all your suggestions and great info! You have helped so much!

Bardo: Love your Paris strolling ideas! Can't wait to hear about Amsterdam!