First-time to Europe. Possible itinerary

Welcome to Fodors Diana. Just a couple of comments now.

1) you need to decide which types of things you want to see and do. Your preliminary plan covers too much in too little time.

2) You will basically see almost nothing of London. Day 1 will probably be a jet lagged fog and day 2 you will be packing to move on to Paris. I'd Drop London unless you can give it at least 4 days - 5 or 6 is better.

3) same for Paris - 4 days minimum because you spend part of 1 day getting there.

4) 7 days in Italy entirely depends on which parts of italy you want to see. 4 days Rome, and 3 days divided between Florence and Venice or 3 days Rome and 2 days in each of Florence/Venice would be a couple of options

Are you including your travel days in the 14 days or is that 14 days "on the ground"?

I agree with Janis that London should be dropped if you want to keep the other items listed on the itinerary. I'd go to just two locations....maybe London and Paris, or Paris and Rome. If Italy is included, definately choose an open jaw ticket to save a day of travel time and the expense.

Margy

Hi diana,

i agree I'm afraid that you are spreading yourselves too thin, which will lad to big frustations when you are on your holiday, as you wil spend far too long travelling, as oposed to actually seeing/doing.

what do you REALLY want to see - London and the UK? - start in London and branch out from there.

Paris and the south of france? - spread your time between the two, using the TGV to travel speeedily from Paris to the south.

Italy - take your pick of a max of 3 places and fly into one, out of the other ["oen jaw"].

you have the huge advantage of visiting europe at one of the best times of year, so far as the weather is concerned. even the UK should have nice weather then, though the south of France and Italy may still be quite hot.

if you MUST try to see all three, this is what I would do :

fly into London, and stay 4 nights, to recover fom jetlag in an english speaking area.

get the eurostar to Paris [very quick from st. Pancras] and stay 4 nights.

get the TGV to Nice - stay 3 nights.

fly to Venice - stay 3 nights.

not long enough in any of them, IMO but it would give you a taste.

have a great trip,

regards, ann

I would cancel the third stop and allocate those extra two days to London. Alternatively, you could skip London all together, and add those two days to Paris, then proceed to Nice from there then on to Italy. Though I honestly think that a first trip to Europe should definitely include London and Paris.

Janis´s Italy itinerary of 3-2-2 sounds good.

Hi D,

Welcome to the group.

You have at least 3 too few days in London and at least 2 few days in Paris.

You can fly through Italy in a week, but you won't remember much.

May I suggest that this visit you split your 2 weeks between London and Paris (fly into one and out the other) with a daytrip from each?

If you really enjoy big cities,I would also suggest London and Paris for the two weeks. The time in Italy would be very nice or Italy and southern France should work. If Italy is not a must see this time you could go to Paris and work your way down to southern France and easily fill your two weeks. You could alternate some cities and smaller towns. We love the trains, but that is also a personal choice. You really have a lot of decisions to make to plan a trip so soon. I am sure you will get lots of help so just ask lots of questions.
Hope this wasn't more confusing than helpful.

many many moons ago, my first trip to europe was three weeks - one week in london, one week in paris and one week in rome. If I had it to do over again, I would have picked one or two countries and gotten out of the big cities after seeing what they had to offer. The country-side is so much more picturesque and relaxing. If I were you, and had two weeks, I would do 4 days in london, then head out into england and see the cotswalds or startford upon avon or bath etc. . . for 4 days. then you can go from london to paris on the train and do paris for 4 days and into the french country side to finish up. There is so much to see - save italy for another trip.

Hi Diana,

I agree with others who say to save London for another trip.

I do think the rest is reasonable, though. Sometimes you want to see all you can! We all don't travel the same way...

Me, I'd pick St. Tropez over Monaco and Nice.

Check into the overnight trains...they're a great way to cover a lot of ground without "Wasting" travel time in between.

Hi Diana,

I guess I have to ditto the other responses. I know it is tempting to try and fit a lot in on a first trip to Europe, but it is frenetic to do that and you will waste a lot of time traveling to different countries. You should plan on this being yout first of many trips!

When my husband and I travel we like to limit our travels to one region of one country to really get an appreciation of it. That way you can spend time in a city or 2 and also get to enjoy the countryside and the regional cuisines, arts & crafts and ofcourse the people.

So as others have suggested, select one of your 3 country choices and plan a trip using the main city as a starting point. For London it could be the Cotswalds, Stonehenge and Bath. For Paris it could be the beautuful Loire Valley or heading doen to the French Riviera. For Italy, between Rome, Florence and Venice you could easily spend 2 weeks and hardly see evrything!

Linda

I wouldn't skip London -- I'd just add more days there.

But it really is hard to make suggestions w/o more input from Diana_CA re what sorts of things they want to see/do.

"Also what's the best way to get from one country to another? I have heard trains is a very popular way of transportation or may be it's better to take a plane for the sake of cutting the travel time since we only have 2 weeks? "

It entirely depends on the destination(s). very often a train is faster city center to city center since you don't have to travel to a remote airport or check in ahead of time. On other routes, flying is cheaper/faster.

Hi Diana,

Re: your stop on the French Riviera.

My husband and I spent six days in Nice a few years ago, and took the train to Monaco and back one day, and the bus to Cannes another day (the bus was slow, so we rode the train back to Nice). We didn't make it to St.Tropez, but would have taken the train if we did.

The trains are very inexpensive, fairly fast, and easy to navigate.

I'd definitely go to Monaco for a day, it's very small and easily walkable. Built on a slope, the train station being at the very top, so you can see far as you leave the station. Definitely see the Royal Palace and the guard ceremony, there's also a small gift shop there for souvenirs. We even saw Prince Rainier arrive in a small black car, driven by his chauffeur. He was only about five feet away from us (a highlight of our trip).

Nice is beautiful with its Promenade by the ocean, Old Town, and many small shops and interesting cemeteries. Also there's an outdoor market Cours de Saleya (?) where you can buy fresh fruit and flowers, pastries and other delicacies. I believe Mondays it's all antiques.

Enjoy!

Benita

Hi Diana,

I agree you are spreading yourselves too thin! Either spend your 2 weeks all in 1 country OR pick 2 major cities.

You choose. Buon viaggio!

I would limit your trip to one country. Our last three trips to Europe have been to Italy, and we finally feel like we are ready to tackle some other country. Trying to see three different countries would be hectic and costly. In addition, it would be stressful to try to adjust to all those different languages and cultures.

Thank you guys so much for your suggestions!
We have talked and decided to skip London this time and start in
Paris-4 days
St.Tropez or Monaco (still not sure)-3 days
Italy: Venice, Lake Como and Rome-1 week

We are planning to spend 14 days on the ground traveling from US and back is extra.

I do understand that it's hard to really understand what a country is about in just a few days but we just wanna get the feel of it. We are flying 1st class and very much used to traveling over long distances. So I don't think we are gonna be really tired and jet-legged upon arrival.

We were looking at the train vs plane option and it seems as business class for trains isn't as cheap as I thought it to be. But i may be wrong. THere's so much information; I have been reading up and it's still a bit confusing.

In these 14 days of coarse we wanna hit the main tourist attractions but also try to spend some time relaxing. I would assume Lake Como in Italy might be good for that, as well as beaches of St. Tropez?

Again, thank you all for your comments and suggestions.

I was wondering if you guys can suggest based on our itinerary if it is better to go to St.Tropez, Monaco or Nice? I'd like for someone who has been to all of them to express their opinion. Which one is the easiest/hardest to get to from Paris (business class train vs plane) and then what's the best way to get to Italy from there? Thank you very much. You all have been very helpful!
Diana

I agree. Way too many destinations for two weeks. Remember you loose a day just flying to Europe. I would pick 3 or 4 places to go. Each day that you move from one city to the next consider it a travel day. Packing; transportation to from airport/train station; transportation to new hotel; checking into hotel; getting the point?

If this will be your only trip to Europe, I would say London/Paris/Rome.
If you think you will be going to Europe again than I would save Italy for a trip by itself (so much to see there).

I just got back from France. Ten day trip. Four nights Bordeaux and five nights Paris. Still did not do everything I wanted and at times felt rushed. And I have lost count at how many times I've been to France.
Decide what your main interest are. Art and museums than try Paris/Florence combo. If more Scenic than Nice/Venice combo with 1/2 day side trip to Monaco ect.

Research..Prioritize...and group. Make list of what you want to see and cut in 1/2 because realistically that is what you will accomplish. This way you will have more realistic expectations.

Hi again Diana,

Honestly your new itinerary is not really an improvement. Venice, Lake Como AND Rome in a week. No, no, no. Choose Rome OR Venice and Como.

Personally, I liked St. Tropez. I was there in early Oct and it was perfect. Not crowded, nice temps. I understand summer traffic to/from the peninsula is a nightmare. Don't know about Sept. Probably still quite busy. If I couldn't easily do day trips from St. Tropez, I think 2 nts there would be enough. If you could do a day trip, 3 would be nice.

Everyone I know who has been to Monaco didn't care for it at all. There was a big debate post here about it. Do a search putting in "Monaco", it will help your decision.

Remember, you will loose at least a 1/2 day traveling down to the Riviera. You would loose another day traveling to Italy and yet another 1/2 day between Rome and Venice.

What you have left is not worth the $$$$ you will spend traveling between destinations.

Diana, I agree with Dayle, still too much and distances between places too far. I assume you are flying into Paris and out of where? I don't know how other people plan, but we usually use our ff miles so I have an idea of what areas I would like and get two cities I can work with, one to fly in and another to fly out and plan the trip in the between area and always stay at least 3 and sometimes more nights in each place. You are looking at many, many hours on the train to do your itinerary with change of trains 2 or 3 times per journey on some of them. You will get a good itinerary, just keep working on it.

Thank you guys for your help. I have a question how difficult it is to get around if you don't speak the language?

After reading all of your suggestions we have altered our itinerary and here is what we came up with:

Paris 3 days
Italy 11 days: Venice, Rome and Positano (not sure how to divide 11 days between the 3)

Let me know what guys think about this?

I would personally drop Paris and focus on Italy. For 3 days you wont see much and its a hassle to travel.

I would fly into Venice and out of Rome (or vice versa) and spend 2 weeks in Italy...3/4 days in Venice, 6 days in Rome and 3/4 days in Positano.

Diana,

You're doing a little better, but what you are still not grasping is the effort and travel time between cities! What you are trying to do is something like traveling from Dallas to LA to SF to Seattle.

Venice to Rome would take about 6 hours by train. Rome to Positano about 1/2 day.

Arrange your trip geographically and you will get more bang for the buck (and time).

Diana, you should have no problems with language. You will often find many of the people just look at you and start to speak English, always amazes me, and I usually wear black and no white tennis shoes. However, I think it is very important and just courteous to at least learn greetings, thank you, etc. in the language of the country you are visiting. Take a little phrase book just in case you need it and one with foods to help in restaurants.
You can learn a lot from www.slowtrav.com and www.ricksteves.com websites. Both have excellent information on train travel also.

I also tend to feel you should just make Italy your focus this trip. You are getting there!!!!

Hi Diana, I am with the others that would urge you to cut down the number of destinations. Most first timer do some combination of London, Paris, Rome (or Venice). Figure in your travel time and spend about 4-5 days in each of those and you will have a wonderful trip.

Diana, on my first trip to Europe I did what the experienced travelers here are telling you not to do--a quick look at a lot of places--and against the advice of the International V.P. of my company who was widely traveled.

What that trip did was give me a taste of several places that helped me to know where I would most like to return for longer and more thorough visits. You can certainly get a taste of Paris and a closer look at Italy on a 14-day trip if that is what is in your heart to do.

Thank you guys, I appreciate all of your comments and suggestions.
We have decided to spend 4 days in Paris and 10 days in Italy (venice, Rome and Amalfi Coast).

Diana, I'm going to be the voice of support for your plans here. Some people like to zip around to different destinations. You can't see a whole city in a month either but that doesn't mean you shouldn't visit for less than a month.

Your plans all sounded ok to me but then I'm in Europe and it's very common for us to nip about for weekend trips to other European countries - or even day trips! I know that many people prefer to stay in one place for a while, that's fine, but you shouldn't say that others always have to do the same.

Your travel to and from Europe is in addition to the 14 days here. I'll say you can pretty comfortably aim for 4 locations then. Take a look at train/plane timetables to help you work out which four. London/Paris is actually a pretty good idea as they are only 2.5 hours apart by train (like I said, people do it for a day trip).

It's up to you to pick your travel style - but I'd disagree with anyone who says a short stop 'isn't worth it'. I've enjoyed a lot of my short hops.

Ok, Diana,

Much Better! As for your Italy portion, I would do this -

Venice 3 nights
Amalfi Coast 3 nights
Rome 5 nights and depart

Buon viaggio!!

You latest itinerary is much more reasonable (enjoyable). I would not worry so much about the language, many people travel around Europe without local language skills. I've never had a difficulty. That said, the more simple you keep your plans, the less language/logistics will be required.

For example, I try to have my plans organized when I go out for the day, so I'm not in the situation of needing to ask directions in a local neighborhood.

Much better, Diana. Hope you have a great trip. One thing that might help you is to have the names of the train stops printed so you will know when your stop is coming up and you can be by the door and prepared to exit. On the train schedule you open details and it will list the stops.

DIY travelling uses much time simply moving from site to site. It is also replete with physical hassles. Find one week bus tours of England, France and Italy. Pick two. Don't neglect to check Elder Hostel tours. Let us know what you decide.

Thank you guys again.
Can you rate St.Tropez, Monaco and Nice according to your preference? Which one would be number 1, which one is 2 and 3.
Thank you

Nice is easy to get to and visit other places on the Cot from.
Monaco is no big deal IMO, have not been to St. T.

What happened to the 4 days Paris/10 days Italy plan? Adding in the Fr coast only stretches things too thin again . . . .