WillTravel

http://travel.latimes.com/articles/la-trw-money30mar30

In short, a retired couple booked two separate tickets, one from Phoenix to JFK New York airport on American, and one from JFK to Rome on Alitalia. They allowed more than three hours between flights.

The first one was late, causing them to miss the connection to the other flight.

After some to'ing and fro'ing, they ended up buying walkup tickets for over $2K each to get to Rome, and when they tried to return home, they found their Alitalia booking was cancelling, so they had to pay another $2K each to get home.

Travel insurance is mentioned in the article, but the article should mention that most travel insurance policies require four hours between unrelated flights. The $500 cap wouldn't have helped that much, in any event. The couple should have at least got in touch with Alitalia agents at JFK or by phone.

The article mentions allowing six hours between flights, which might be a reasonable idea if the flights are not related, but it's not needed if the flights are all on the same ticket. The article does not distinguish between the separate tickets vs. one ticket scenario.

yk

The article says:

"If [this story] doesn't make your blood boil, consult a cardiologist."

I don't understand why it has to make such a statement. I mean, the couple gambled (by buying 2 separate tickets) and they lost. What's more is there to say?

I actually am surprised American even tried to help this couple. AFAIK, they got them from LAX-JFK. I'd be interested to see by how much that flight was delayed by.

3 hours to connect in JFK for an <b>international</b> flight is definitely not enough! They need to be checked in 2 hours in advance, leaving them just 1 hour to connect in reality.

I hope they learn their lesson.

highflyer

Ouch, but this was risky.
The one time I considered separate tickets it was for an interisland flight from Oahu to Big Island.

I decided not to risk it as I thought it would be too stressful! I didn't want to be on time and hang about in an airport for 4 hours or disastrously late so we spent our first 2 nights on Oahu.

SusanP

Well, it's obvious they don't come to Fodors!

This topic has been discussed numerous times, indicating the chance you take by booking separate tickets.

djkbooks

The article states &quot;The hapless couple had fallen into a regulatory black hole.&quot; And, &quot;As the Lopilatos learned, when you're caught between two airlines, you need all the help you can get.&quot;

It is only because I participate in various web travel forums that I know better than to make the plans made by this couple. Otherwise, I would have thought their self-planned itinerary perfectly okay.

Neither of the airlines was at fault here, and regulations had nothing to do with it.

cheryllj

I guess I need a cardiologist, because my blood really isn't boiling from that story.

It's sad, and a cautionary tale, but this couple really didn't do their homework and make good choices. &quot;More than three hours&quot; is not nearly enough time before an international flight. You have to check in three hours ahead! That's no time buffer at all.

And it also sounds like they didn't really investigate their options for getting to Rome after missing their flight. Why were they talking to American when they should have been negotiating with Alitalia to get on a later flight? It sounds like they just took American's offer to purchase &quot;walk-up&quot; tickets at an inflated price and didn't really see what Alitalia would charge to rebook them on a later flight.

I guess they were pushing to make their tour, but again, poor choices all around. I would have joined the tour late if it saved me $10,000.

AAFrequentFlyer

<i>You have to check in three hours ahead! That's no time buffer at all.</i>

huh?

I usually show up 1-1.5 hours before my int flights and never had a problem.

cheryllj

Don't most airlines recommend 3 hours now for international flights? I thought that was the norm now.

Last year I checked in 2 hours ahead for a flight from LAX to Auckland, and barely made it, due to ridiculous lines for check-in and security at LAX. Now I don't cut it that close and try for 3, although I agree that it's usually overkill and shouldn't be necessary.

Either way, this couple did not give themselves nearly enough time as a buffer for a late flight landing at JFK.

bettyk

I think the biggest mistake this couple made was not going a day earlier just in case something like this happened. Whenever you absolutely have to be someplace for a cruise or a tour, it's better to arrive a day or two early than to risk arriving late.

AAFrequentFlyer

Recommended:

<i> For international flights, <b>we recommend</b> you arrive at the airport at least two hours prior to departure to allow sufficient time to complete all necessary international requirements.</i>

Actual rules:

<i>INTERNATIONAL TRAVEL
For flights originating outside the U.S., you must check in 60 minutes before departure, and be present at the departure gate and ready to board at least 30 minutes prior to scheduled departure time to retain your reservation and a seat. Standard baggage acceptance cutoff for flights originating in all airports outside the U.S. is 60 minutes before departure.

For international departures from a U.S. city, standard baggage acceptance cutoff time is 60 minutes.</i>

mariposa85

No, my blood doesn't boil. They didn't leave anywhere near enough time to make a connection for an international flight. It always annoys me when people can't be bothered to wait around in the airport for 6 hours, so leave 2 or 3 and then get mad when they miss their connection. When I took my last international flight, I was advised to arrive at JFK 3 hours before the flight, and I did so. There was already a longish line at check in, I was selected for further screening, and in the end there was only time to grab a quick lunch before heading to the gate. What was this couple thinking? It's VERY easy for a flight to be delayed by an hour or so, you usually have to pick up your bags at the carousel, which can take forever, you sometimes have to walk to another terminal...... I'm amazed at how many people totally underestimate how much time things take.

So no, I don't blame the airlines. If the couple had left a 6 hour gap, sure, I'd feel bad for them. But they were careless and planned badly and the outcome wasn't really that surprising.

travelgourmet

I read this as less a cautionary tale about booking separate tickets and more a cautionary tale about booking on Alitalia. I think American's actions showed that your average airline will go to some effort to help. Unfortunately, Alitalia is not an average airline.

That being said, I am usually pretty careful about booking unrelated itineraries, and accept the risks that come with it. BUT... I have done it several times without incident, would do it again if the circumstances warrant, and think others are crazy to dismiss the idea out of hand. The likelihood of missing a well-planned connection (which 3 hours at JFK is not) is low enough that it can often be a risk worth taking.

Sue_xx_yy

So, when they discovered they missed the outbound portion of their JFK - Rome-JFK flight, they went and bought a ONE WAY ticket to replace it?

At that point, they should have at least inquired as to the cost of a ROUND TRIP JFK-Rome-JFK, if not a multiple-point trip (JFK-Rome-JFK-Phoenix) and thrown away the rest of their separate itinerary tickets. ONE WAY flights are nearly always bad value, sometimes more than even last-minute round-trip tickets. Rebooking the remainder of their entire itinerary - on ONE TICKET - would likely have been their best choice at that point. Cut their losses in one go, instead of continuing to gamble.

Plus, I'm not sure what their status would have been once they missed the outbound portion of the JFK-FCO leg and replaced it with a one-way. Seems to me their return leg would have been cancelled anyway, in such event???

(I had to laugh at the journalist in the cited article and her indignant diatribe against the 'self-serving' policies of the airlines. When one books separate tickets, one is voluntarily opting out of the contractual obligations imposed on the vendor airline(s) of a one-ticket itinerary. A buyer generally does so, in the attempt to serve his or her own self interests by foregoing the extra cost normally associated with those obligations. Why does the journalist assume it is okay for buyers to be self-serving, but not the vendor? )

Padraig

travelgourmet wrote: &quot;I read this as less a cautionary tale about booking separate tickets and more a cautionary tale about booking on Alitalia.&quot;

What did Alitalia do wrong?

travelgourmet

<i>What did Alitalia do wrong?</i>

What did they do right?

It isn't that they did something wrong, it is how unwilling and unable they were to help out. The ticket office was closed, leaving AA with no way to try and get them to endorse over the ticket. And then they canceled the return ticket, which is well within their rights, but I'm not certain that another airline wouldn't have tried to accomodate the couple on their return, once the situation had been explained.

What separates a good airline from a bad airline, in my opinion, is what they do when something goes wrong. Alitalia seems to have done nothing in this case, and it seems like they could have done a bit more.

Sue_xx_yy

What makes my blood boil are people who buy tickets in which the terms of the fare contract clearly state &quot;tickets must be issued a minimum of 7 days (21 days, whatever) in advance of departure&quot; - and then who complain bitterly when they cannot rebook tickets 3 days, 3 hours, or 3 minutes ahead of departure, for the same fare or worse yet, some fare they unilaterally decide is 'reasonable'.

I have no complaint with being self-serving, for who else can best serve one's own interests but oneself? I only object to the claims that only airlines are self-serving.

Carolina

I allowed 15 hours between 2 flights last week and still had an anxious time. My flight from Spain to UK was delayed a few hours, then the plane had engine trouble and we had to get it checked by an engineer. I sat on the runway at Alicante talking to USAir to see what the position would be if I couldn't make my connection. I would have been put on standby for the next flight or given the option to pay $200 each to change the tickets - as long as I let them know before take off.
I did make my flight but had 5 hours in UK instead of 15. These days, delays are more and more common. 3 hours is nowhere near enough, especially with weather and air traffic delays.

ira

Sounds to me like a tyro couple who thought that they could save $100 pp by buying separate tickets.

They didn't consider the consequences of missing the connection.

They didn't ask anyone to call Alitalia for them, which would have prevented their return ticket from being cancelled.

They were very concerned about missing their group tour.

For all we know, their flight to Rome was scheduled to land 10 min before the tour left.

AA did offer to put them up for the night, but then they would have to have to connect to their tour somewhere other than Rome.

Overall, this is unfortunate, but their own fault.

These are people who really needed us.

Padraig

travelgourmet, I think what you want of Alitalia is unreasonable. Passengers failed to turn up on time for check-in; the flight was closed, and then departed. Should they have kept their ticket office open outside normal hours? I don't see that they should.

You agree that Alitalia was entitled to cancel the return portion of the tickets, and still you take the position that they were somehow wrong. Yet there is no report of any communication between the Lopilatos and the airline. How can you make a fair judgement?

Sue_xx_yy

travelgourmet, let me see if I understand your expectations.

You want Alitalia to keep its ticket offices open, not only until their last flight has left JFK for the day, but so that they can 'endorse over tickets' for 'connections' that did not in fact ever exist (unless one is on a single-itinerary ticket, there is no 'connecting' flight. One simply missed the flight, period.)

Alitalia just flew what might have been two empty seats from JFK to FCO. For those seats, they received revenue on a highly discounted fare basis, and as part of a single point-to-point ticket (i.e, they were not bound by the terms of the contract to receive or handle any 'connecting' passengers at all.)

Now, if I understand you correctly, you expect that, notwithstanding the fact that they have incurred costs to fly the now-departed plane, they are to forfeit such revenue as they have received in respect of those seats, pass that revenue over to American airlines or whoever, and oh, by the way, pay someone to staff the ticket counter 24-7 so that they can do this.

They're already going bankrupt as it is.

Moral of story: when one buys beer-budget tickets, one cannot expect champagne service, even and perhaps especially in the event that 'something' goes wrong.