zarinam

Hi - we (family of 4 with older teenagers) would like to travel to Europe to celebrate my birthday in August 2013. Need help with itineraries, places of interest, restaurants and hotel suggestions. Our original idea was to go to Amsterdam, Paris,London and Edinburgh (not necessarily in that order). Each city represents a key interest to a member of the family. Amsterdam - Anne Frank, Edinburgh - Scottish family roots, London - it's London. And Paris - the city I want to celebrate my birthday. However, the family is willing to just do France if doing the four locations becomes too difficult or if the locations are too expensive. We have 2 weeks but can stretch to 3 weeks. Family interest is in WWII, history, cycling, art and culture, food and wine. Family budget is not posh so practical suggestions with opportunities to use French language skills are welcome. Thanks in advance for your help.

jpie

If you can stretch to 3 weeks you might be able to fit in all 4 places-particularly if you do an open jaw ticket-fly in Amsterdam and back London for instance.

Or if you want to make it easier and cheaper you could drop one place. My suggestion would be to drop Scotland-all of Britain and UK is pretty pricey and London Paris and Amsterdam is pretty "doable" in 3 weeks and 2 as well in a pinch.

You will probably save money at least in Paris if you rent an apartment. Otherwise, some places have triple or quadruple rooms or your teens can share a second room.

If this is a first trip for you all then I would at least go to 2 places rather than the whole time in France-either London or Amsterdam with Paris.

If you give us an idea of some budget we can probably give you more useful suggestions

nytraveler

Agree to the above.

For us to really help you need to give us a lodging budget per night (most rooms in europe are one double bed for 2 people so you will need either much more expensive famiy rooms, 2 room or an a apartment, which I don't reco for a first trip).

If you go for family rooms make sure that they realize you have 4 adults and don;t let them give you a "cot" which is the British word for crib.

zarinam

Thanks for your response - appreciate the help so far. In doing some online research I have noticed that we will have to book two rooms and/or apartments. And that the cities that we originally wanted to visit may be very expensive. For example, going to the Edinburgh Tattoo would be awesome but I see that it is very expensive to do. ...we are open to dropping destinations, if necessary. As for a budget - we haven't travelled to these destinations before so we don't know what is realistic to plan for spending. We have booked a hotel in Paris - Hotel de la Porte based on a friend's recommendation and it is Eur 1,010 for 5 nights and two rooms. I think that seems reasonable at $137 USD/night/room. I am hoping that $125-$150/night is realistic throughout the trip.

As for things we would like to do - I'm interested in doing things that are less touristy. Of course there are things that one has to do to truly experience these locations but I would prefer to experience the culture rather than visit the usual suspects. Suggestions on best day cycle trip through the vineyards, concerts and festivals, bakeries, and must see jazz clubs would be great. If you have a winery recommendation based on a quirky host - that would be good too.

Thanks again for your advice...

jpie

Hi there-the price in Paris is quite good. If it is this hotel, Hotel de la Porte Doree http://www.hoteldelaportedoree.com/ the rooms look very nice and my only comment would be that it is not very central.

This hotel in Paris is only a 2 star so very simple but it is a great location near Montparnasse and they have quadruple rooms that are quite nice. I have stayed there with friends a fair amount because I take the train often from Montparnasse.

Hotel Odessa

http://www.hotel-odessa.com

They let you add beds in so that might also be a solution, but as I said they are only a 2 star not 3 star hotel.

Also, you don't say how old your kids are but Novotel lets kid stay free until age 15, so you might check that out as well.

The French site says this about the kids for free Découvrez nos chambres spacieuses pouvant accueillir 2 adultes et 2 enfants (gratuit jusqu'à 15 ans). but the English site doesn't say it, so I put both links:

http://www.novotel.com/fr/hotel-1978...se/index.shtml

http://www.novotel.com/gb/hotel-1978...e/family.shtml

Sometimes with the chain hotels like that you can find really good family deals even though they may not have quite the charm that some independent hotels do

bilboburgler

Its August so everyone is on holiday and so prices and temperatures are up. I'd look at

Paris (the place empties out in August) for most of a week, a wine region (say Alsace, Chablis, Loire) with a gite for a week with plenty of bike riding, pool swimming, horse riding etc and a week near Amsterdam (a appartment would be good) with lots of train jouneys, bikes etc (Haarlam is good).

zarinam

Thanks jpie, bilboburgler and nytraveler for your responses. I have a few more questions for you noted below.

jpie - I really like the other suggestions for hotels in Paris. The Hotel Odessa and the Novotel look lovely. Question - does it really matter if it is a 2 star vs. a 3 star hotel? If I understand correctly the stars are based on hotel amenities and not on quality, right? Our hotel needs are basic - we intend to only sleep in the hotel. My teens will be 14 and 17 when we travel. They are in French immersion in school - which means they are studying in French instead of English and they want to use their language and education skills to their advantage. They love museums and art history. I am the odd one out who prefers to hang out at cafes and meet people.
Have you eaten at the Montparnasse Tower restaurant. I had hoped to go their to celebrate my birthday.It is a big one and I thought celebrating with a view of the Eiffel Tower would be excellent. If you don't like it please suggest another - I don't want to spend a fortune for a meal however.

bilboburgler - thanks for the suggestion on Haarlam. It is a great suggestion and has me thinking that is the right location. Would you happen to have an apartment suggestion? Also, would you have a suggestion on a place to rent in Loire? If we do Amsterdam then perhaps we should do Brussels as well. Any suggestions? Sorry for the numerous questions.

nytraveler - I have a feeling you have spent time in London. would you have a good suggestions on an apartment to rent in London?

thanks again...

bilboburgler

The Netherlands. Most holiday homes are in the countryside or by the beach but this company seems sensible
http://www.aanzee.com/en/search?coun...1&duration=WK1

The Loire is 1000km long which makes my advice poor and I either use http://www.gites-de-france.com/ or I look at the village website I want to stay in and check out their local gite (often very good value)

The Loire is a fantastic place to visit with wine, canoes, bikes and chateaux all over. If I were coming for the first time, I'd catch a train to Tours (a little dull but a good train spot) hire a car and assume you are going to spend the week going up and down the valley. There are some very good guide books on the Chateaux of the Loire. There are some experts on the area in these pages so search away.

Amsterdam is a tourist attraction of world class, Brussels is down there in level 3 along with Swanage, UK or Halifax, Nova Scotia

jpie

Hi there:

For me the biggest thing you might want out of a higher end hotel in August is air-conditioning. The Odessa has an elevator but not air-they do have double paned glass but if it is roasting and you need to open the windows that is where it can be problematic for light sleepers. The Odessa does have an elevator but it is small.

I have not eaten at the tower, but since it doesn't rate very high on foodie lists I would be inclined to go up the Montparnasse tower and Eiffel tower for the views and spend my precious food budget on a better birthday restaurant. I am a foodie, so I consider those dollars closely And I prefer to find little mid-range, more relaxed restaurants than special occasion restaurants anyway, since I usually find them pretentious and end up disappointed in the food-particularly at the price point. But again, many folks enjoy a splurge restaurant for one time on their trip...

Another thing you might consider is kind of giving your kids a holiday from you one night and let them eat some causal around the hotel or greek sandwiches or pizza in the Latin quarter and then you and you husband can go out and splurge ona birthday restaurant for you. They seem like they will be at an age where they can spend an evening on their own, right?

Here are a couple of my favorite food blogs for Paris:

http://alexanderlobrano.com/hungry-for-paris-index/

And any of his links on his site:

http://alexanderlobrano.com/links/

http://www.davidlebovitz.com/

And there are lots of French food sites as well you can use to practice your French.

In general I think the most important thing to decide is whether you can take 2 weeks or 3 weeks since that will ultimately shape a lot of your choices. Another approach my be to make it a 2 week trip but tack on a couple of more days just for the travel and jet lag. I will be interested to see what you decide.

janisj

I ate at the Montparnasse tower just in late October. I ate lunch instead of dinner. It is relatively very expensive, the food is certainly very good but not up there with the best meals I've ever had, BUT the views are unbelievable and actually makes the experience worth the €€€. The service was VERY good. (I've been up the tower before and eaten there before it was re-done/upgraded)

The food is good but it is more about the view/experience. I'd think it would be a fine place to celebrate a 'special' birthday.

kerouac

How about renting a car in France? That could make a really huge difference in your possibilities outside of Paris.

carolyn

If you take the kids to a casual eatery in the Latin Quarter, you adults could eat at Perraudin on Rue St. Jacques. It was a Fodor's recommendation, and we thoroughly enjoyed our anniversary dinner there a few years ago. There was an ex-pat couple at a nearby table who chatted with us after hearing our American accents, and they said the restaurant is where they always take their visitors to eat.

Don't skip London if you can work it in. The Bloomsbury area is not as expensive as some.

StCirq

Actually, hotel prices are at their lowest in August. And no, the place doesn't empty out - that was 25 years ago.

The Hôtel de la Porte isn't in a particularly convenient location, though it's fine. For your first visit, you might look at the Hôtel Diana or the Hôtel Marignan or the Hôtel Cosmos.

I also think you need to determine whether you have 2 or 3 weeks - that will make a big difference.

bilboburgler

"Actually, hotel prices are at their lowest in August. And no, the place doesn't empty out - that was 25 years ago. "

Agreed prices drop because the place does empty out (like it did in 2011 when I saw the place last). ;-)

zarinam

Wow - this is fantastic information. It has helped tremendously to figure out what we want to do. Please see the end of the post for our proposed itinerary.

The three weeks vs. two weeks debate depends on our pocketbooks. With the added costs of two teens in tow means a bit more expense which will mean that we must sacrifice a week of holidays to bring them. Some family and friends have suggested they stay at home but we are trying to bring them - it may be our last family holiday before university starts

jpie - I am a foodie too. Seems like our foodie styles may be the same as I don't like pretentious restaurants either and find that the atmosphere is better at mid-range restaurants. Thanks for the blogs. I will read them.

Janisj - I think staring at the Eiffel tower while dining may make a spectacular night to remember. I will do it at least one night.

bilboburgler - You made me laugh over Brussels "Brussels is down there in level 3 along with Swanage, UK or Halifax, Nova Scotia". I think, however, Belgium needs to be visited once especially since we are going to Amsterdam. I enjoy your passion for Amsterdam - it wasn't high on my list of places to visit but I think from what I have heard and read, I have to add Amsterdam in.

kerouac - driving in France may be an option if we extend our trip.

carolyn - I will check out the restaurant you suggested. I think the kids will be on their own for at least one night. Is the Latin Corner safe? We are going to London - a trip to Paris without seeing London seems wrong.

StCirq - great suggestions about other hotels. The rationale behind Hotel de la Porte Doree was that it was in a less touristy neighbourhood with a fantastic bakery and park close by. However, it is our first trip so perhaps we may want convenience verses atmosphere.

Based on your collective advice our itinerary looks like this:
Aug-13 &14 - begin our trip
Aug-15 Sight-see Amsterdam
Aug-16 Sight-see Amsterdam
Aug-17 Sight-see Amsterdam
Aug-18 Haarlam
Aug-19 Belgium
Aug-20 Belgium (WWI & WW II sites)
Aug-21 Paris
Aug-22 Paris
Aug-23 Paris
Aug-24 Paris
Aug-25 Paris
Aug-26 London
Aug-27 London
Aug-28 London
Aug-29 London
Aug-30 Leave London
Aug-31 Arrive home

If we have extra time we will try to fit Edinburgh in but as it looks now with kids no Edinburgh

Thanks again everyone for your fabulous suggestions.

bilboburgler

Haarlem railway station is a wonder (like an art deco wooden ship on the inside) the centre of town has a good market and a religious building worth poping in.

Lexma90

I love your destination wish-list - it's very similar to that of our family two years ago (our kids were 17 and 13)! Except we only had two weeks (or so), and DH and I had previously been to all of the locations, so we already knew the lay of the land. And we were travelling in May, not August. But our destinations were London, Scotland (incl Edinburgh), Paris, Belgium and Amsterdam, because nobody could bear to cut "their" favorite destination from the trip. Beware of your trip - as a result of our visit to Edinburgh, our son is now a University student there!

Do note that two members of the family felt that the trip was too rushed, and two did not. Because except for Scotland (which I visited as a teen with my family) either the whole family or one of the kids had been to all of the other destinations, we did not feel compelled to visit all of the tourist "must-dos," which relaxed the pace.

For lodging, we had fewer days than you did, but we had a quad room in Paris, London and Edinburgh; two rooms in the Scottish Highlands, Brussels and Amsterdam. What is your budget - some of our choices might work for you.

We really like Brussels - this was our second visit. The national art museum is quite good; we also visited the Magritte museum. We like Belgium; to us, it seems like a relaxed version of France (not to disparage either country, we like both a lot).

The WWII resistance museum (that's not the real name, but I'm too lazy to look for it right now) was very good and interesting for all in our group. It was good to get another country's viewpoint on that time period.

isabel

In Paris I can recommend Hotel Marignan which is in a superb location in the fifth. Only a couple blocks from the Cluny Museum. August is considered mid season on their website and quads with private toilet are €126. www.hotel-marignan.com There is no lift but they do have free breakfast which very few Paris hotels include. They also have a small kitchen guests can use to prepare other meals.

I think your itinerary looks great. I think you are right to skip Edinburgh for this trip both because it would take extra time to get up there and because it will be so expensive in August. I was there in July a few years ago and my room was going to be literally double in price the following week when it would be August.

In Amsterdam I can recommend Hotel Brouwer although it's €95 a night double and they don't have quads so you'd need two rooms. www.hotelbrouwer.nl/ But it includes breakfast and is absolutely wonderful. It fills up really early though so you'd need to book soon. I assume you didn't mean you'd switch hotels to do Haarlem. You could also stay in Haarlem the whole time and 'commute' to Amsterdam, it's a 15 min train ride and trains come every few minutes. However, it does cost 7 or 8€ so any price savings could get eaten up pretty quickly if you planned to go into Amsterdam each day. I stayed there a couple years ago but I was going to other towns (Delft, Leiden, Gouda) most days. And if you only want to do one day trip from Amsterdam I would probably choose Delft over Haarlem.

For Belgium I would base in Antwerp, Ghent or Brugge and day trip to the others (and Brussels, the least interesting). They are all within an hour of each other and the trains are frequent and relatively inexpensive.

bilboburgler

anther vote for hotel Brouwer, odd little place but such a great find

janisj

Zarinam: your itinerary looks very nice/doable. A very nice pace.