Fall trip to The Netherlands and Belgium
Jun 5th, 2015, 11:37 AM
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Fall trip to The Netherlands and Belgium
I have a fall trip (end of September to early October) shaping up kind of quickly. We are flying into Amsterdam for 5 nights, including one day trip to the Hague to see the Escher and Vermeer museums. Don't try to tell me there are other paintings in the Mauritshuis. ;-) I have spent a long time desiring Amsterdam, so am pretty sure about this part of the trip. But then we will take the Thalys train to Brussels. We have a family member living near by, so we will free load there a few days. LOL. I am reading up on Wallonia, but if anyone has any suggestions on things to see and do? From there, maybe back to medieval city life in Brugges. I understand that the cruise ship visitors may overwhelm them at times, but are they still calling in that part of Europe in October?
Art, history and medieval life,but also local foods and drink or anything unique. In answer to "What interests you?" Thank you!
Art, history and medieval life,but also local foods and drink or anything unique. In answer to "What interests you?" Thank you!
Jun 6th, 2015, 03:03 AM
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Gent will tick all your boxes. Now that the strike by garbage collectors is over, anyway, it was a mess last week. Brugge should be ok on a weekday in October. The last week of October is a school holiday, may be busier then.
Or visit Antwerp, also an easy train ride from Brussel, with plenty of art, history and good food.
Or visit Antwerp, also an easy train ride from Brussel, with plenty of art, history and good food.
Jun 6th, 2015, 03:33 AM
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In 2011 we took a trip centered in Brussels. There is lots of info about things to do there and nearby in my TR. At the end I have a link to a separate thread about Belgium beers
http://www.fodors.com/community/euro...etherlands.cfm
We had visited Gent and Brugge on earlier trips and I would certainly recommend both of those in addition to the places described in the TR. If you are a Vermeer fan I am guessing you would be interested in seeing the Adoration of the Virgin Lamb.
We have not spent much time in Wallonia other than our day trip to Tournai (described in the TR) which we enjoyed very much.
http://www.fodors.com/community/euro...etherlands.cfm
We had visited Gent and Brugge on earlier trips and I would certainly recommend both of those in addition to the places described in the TR. If you are a Vermeer fan I am guessing you would be interested in seeing the Adoration of the Virgin Lamb.
We have not spent much time in Wallonia other than our day trip to Tournai (described in the TR) which we enjoyed very much.
Jun 6th, 2015, 05:04 AM
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Hello
If we oversimplify Flanders is flat country with farms and cities/towns, whihc mostly date from end of middle age.
Cities are made of bricks and are well preserved.
Brugge is more Disneylike and highly touristic but quite nice (quaint).
Ghent is also charming but a living city too, as well as Antwerpen, by far the largest city of Flanders.
I especially love Leuven, a student town and Lier, a small town. We can cite Ieper, Audenaarde etc. Some musuems and battelfield mostly from WW1 in Flanders.
Wallonia is less densily populated and more about sceneries and landscape. The Ardennes is full of woods, trails, and small towns. WW2 battlefields in the region.
Durbuy is the smallest city in Europe I think, Namur is nice, Liège is a city I hardly know, some very nice places, Mons is beautiful (cultural city of Europe this year).
If you have a car, I'd advise visiting 'la vallée de la Molignée, following a small meandering river with some beautiful landscape and ruins (visit chateau de Montaigle.
Bouillon with his well preserved castle (medieval of before gunpowder) Godefroid de Bouillon, taker of Jerusalem came from there, Dinant is a small chamring city along the Meuse river, as well as Huy etc.
Les Grottes de Han (caves with exceptionnal stalagtites, mites and tapestries), and I went recently on a touristic old train - charming.
http://www.365.be/attractions/att/re...3-vallees.html
Bruxelles is more flemish looking city, less homogeneous, with exceptional sites (grand place, sablon etc); Frenchspeaking and very much alive.
If we oversimplify Flanders is flat country with farms and cities/towns, whihc mostly date from end of middle age.
Cities are made of bricks and are well preserved.
Brugge is more Disneylike and highly touristic but quite nice (quaint).
Ghent is also charming but a living city too, as well as Antwerpen, by far the largest city of Flanders.
I especially love Leuven, a student town and Lier, a small town. We can cite Ieper, Audenaarde etc. Some musuems and battelfield mostly from WW1 in Flanders.
Wallonia is less densily populated and more about sceneries and landscape. The Ardennes is full of woods, trails, and small towns. WW2 battlefields in the region.
Durbuy is the smallest city in Europe I think, Namur is nice, Liège is a city I hardly know, some very nice places, Mons is beautiful (cultural city of Europe this year).
If you have a car, I'd advise visiting 'la vallée de la Molignée, following a small meandering river with some beautiful landscape and ruins (visit chateau de Montaigle.
Bouillon with his well preserved castle (medieval of before gunpowder) Godefroid de Bouillon, taker of Jerusalem came from there, Dinant is a small chamring city along the Meuse river, as well as Huy etc.
Les Grottes de Han (caves with exceptionnal stalagtites, mites and tapestries), and I went recently on a touristic old train - charming.
http://www.365.be/attractions/att/re...3-vallees.html
Bruxelles is more flemish looking city, less homogeneous, with exceptional sites (grand place, sablon etc); Frenchspeaking and very much alive.
Jun 7th, 2015, 11:47 AM
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Thank you for your input everyone. Lots of reading for me. ;-) From the train tables, it seems one could stay in Brugge or Ghent and do a day trip to the other, am I correct?
pariswat: Your description of the difference between the two areas is what I was imagining. Yes, our family will have a car, and probably providing guide services, too, if we are lucky. I was seeing this as a change from the cities we are contemplating on either end. Is there any wine production in this area? Is it all beer?
vttraveler: Reading your trip report...
pariswat: Your description of the difference between the two areas is what I was imagining. Yes, our family will have a car, and probably providing guide services, too, if we are lucky. I was seeing this as a change from the cities we are contemplating on either end. Is there any wine production in this area? Is it all beer?
vttraveler: Reading your trip report...
Jun 7th, 2015, 12:42 PM
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Nearly everyone loves and raves about Bruges after going there - Gent and Antwerp are nice but not nearly so awe-inspiring it seems.
Yes base in one and do easy short daytrips by train to the other - Bruges is most magical IME at night when the day tripping/bus groups are gone and the ancient humpbacked wooden draw bridges and ancient Flemish facades sublimely and surrealtically illuminated.
and only the main central square and the area immediately around it - full of lace and tourist shops - is Disneyesque - there are plenty or non-thronged normal places in this large regional town as well.
https://www.google.com/search?q=Brug...=1600&bih=1075
99% of folks will love Bruges more than Gent or Antwerp - I base this comment in large part on leading over 1,000 people thru all three - staying in all three on bike trips - everyone raved about Bruges and rather liked the other ones. Some even went back to Bruges after the trip they loved it so so much. Bruges, exceptional is an understatement IMO.
Yes base in one and do easy short daytrips by train to the other - Bruges is most magical IME at night when the day tripping/bus groups are gone and the ancient humpbacked wooden draw bridges and ancient Flemish facades sublimely and surrealtically illuminated.
and only the main central square and the area immediately around it - full of lace and tourist shops - is Disneyesque - there are plenty or non-thronged normal places in this large regional town as well.
https://www.google.com/search?q=Brug...=1600&bih=1075
99% of folks will love Bruges more than Gent or Antwerp - I base this comment in large part on leading over 1,000 people thru all three - staying in all three on bike trips - everyone raved about Bruges and rather liked the other ones. Some even went back to Bruges after the trip they loved it so so much. Bruges, exceptional is an understatement IMO.
Jun 8th, 2015, 03:10 AM
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I am in the 1% who did not love Brugge more than Gent or Antwerp.
It is definitely possible to stay in one city and do day trips. We found the trains to be affordable and very convenient and had the advantage of our friends' car for some day trips that were harder to get to with public transportation.
In answer to your question about wine, Belgium is really the place to try different beers. And the food is very good.
It is definitely possible to stay in one city and do day trips. We found the trains to be affordable and very convenient and had the advantage of our friends' car for some day trips that were harder to get to with public transportation.
In answer to your question about wine, Belgium is really the place to try different beers. And the food is very good.
Jun 10th, 2015, 10:44 AM
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My spouse and I were two who were disappointed with our "part of one day" in Bruges a few years ago, mainly because the place was so crowded it was difficult to see anything or get into restaurants, etc.
We're going back this fall (around the time you're going) and will stay one nite, so hopefully we'll find the charm of it after all the tour buses, etc., part. When we saw the movie "In Bruges" it showed what the town could look like when there were not many people there, and it seemed charming. I realize that the movies can make [insert your choice of crummy cities] look like Paris, however.
We're going back this fall (around the time you're going) and will stay one nite, so hopefully we'll find the charm of it after all the tour buses, etc., part. When we saw the movie "In Bruges" it showed what the town could look like when there were not many people there, and it seemed charming. I realize that the movies can make [insert your choice of crummy cities] look like Paris, however.
Jun 10th, 2015, 12:42 PM
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I am not a fan of Brugge either. But it is much nicere in fall.
Nearly no wine in Belgium. Napoleon destroyed all vineyards - he didn't get away with it unpunished, since he lost at Waterloo, Belgium !
We won a contest (or so I've been told!) about sweet white wine - but unfortunately half the production was used for the test (...) we also have have some méthode champenoise.
I have never drank belgian wine (a shame) and only one bottle of méthode champenoise. We cannot be champions in all fields ... can we ?
Here our main 'domaines' - not a lot, and awfully small...
http://lapassionduvin.com/phorum/read.php?17,357177
France produces 5 billions liters per year (in 2011), we produce about 100 000 bottles (75 000 liters in the biggest production), so maybe 500 000 litres in total ?
Nearly no wine in Belgium. Napoleon destroyed all vineyards - he didn't get away with it unpunished, since he lost at Waterloo, Belgium !
We won a contest (or so I've been told!) about sweet white wine - but unfortunately half the production was used for the test (...) we also have have some méthode champenoise.
I have never drank belgian wine (a shame) and only one bottle of méthode champenoise. We cannot be champions in all fields ... can we ?
Here our main 'domaines' - not a lot, and awfully small...
http://lapassionduvin.com/phorum/read.php?17,357177
France produces 5 billions liters per year (in 2011), we produce about 100 000 bottles (75 000 liters in the biggest production), so maybe 500 000 litres in total ?
Jun 10th, 2015, 03:09 PM
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Bruges shines at night but a few hours there in midday and only in the thronged Markt - town square with belfry could be rather unnerving - but take time - take the canal boat tours and especially be there at night when the bus tour throngs have gone and to most the city takes on a very magical glow.
pariswat is not the first Belgain to diss Bruges and that is not surprising but for a foreign tourist looking for that proverbial old-world romantic thing Bruges is a perpetual favorite - again on tours I led 99% it seemed just loved -= loved Bruges. But we stayed there two nights not just for a few hours. May not be worth it for a few hours - could be a nightmare.
pariswat is not the first Belgain to diss Bruges and that is not surprising but for a foreign tourist looking for that proverbial old-world romantic thing Bruges is a perpetual favorite - again on tours I led 99% it seemed just loved -= loved Bruges. But we stayed there two nights not just for a few hours. May not be worth it for a few hours - could be a nightmare.
Jun 10th, 2015, 09:25 PM
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I'm not Belgian, but I like Gent better. A real, living town, with a great bar scene and a beautiful city in its own right. The Graslei compares nicely with all that Brugge has to offer
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...sondergang.JPG
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...sondergang.JPG
Jun 11th, 2015, 06:54 AM
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The Graslei is neat for sure but Bruges has many Grasleis - none quite so opulent IME but overall just a cuter neater more romantic old town - most folks do not go to Bruges looking for night life though there is an active nightlife square on the south side of the main shopping street near the train station.
Jun 11th, 2015, 10:32 AM
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Tulips - I base my Bruges comments on taking hundreds of folks thru Bruges, Gent and Antwerp - each stop for two days - nearly everyone loved Bruges much more than the other two and I will hold that the VAST majority of American tourists will also love Bruges even more than they do the other two.
Your mention of the other two are a red herring (Dutch style!) - I myself like all those cities about the same - a lot - I base my comments on what tourists I have taken thru them felt and that is a very valid critieria in my mind.
So yes I can wrap my mind around the fact that some folks, especially locals, will like Gent or Antwerp better.
So yours is a bogus charge.
Your mention of the other two are a red herring (Dutch style!) - I myself like all those cities about the same - a lot - I base my comments on what tourists I have taken thru them felt and that is a very valid critieria in my mind.
So yes I can wrap my mind around the fact that some folks, especially locals, will like Gent or Antwerp better.
So yours is a bogus charge.
Jun 11th, 2015, 12:18 PM
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Dissuading folks from going to Bruges in favor of Gent and Antwerp shows an autistic appreciation of what average American tourists are looking for. Bruges is so so exceptional for northern Europe.
Jun 11th, 2015, 12:45 PM
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Well Pq
Sorry to disappoint you.
I'm a Belgian, lived all my life in Belgium and I consider I have the right to say I favour Gent above Brugge.
Don't see why it makes me autistic.
So good for you if you love so so so Brugge but don't see what gives you the right to judge me.
And reference to US tourist is quite egocentric actually. US is not center of the world, at least last time I checked it was not...
And lastly, if you use Gent in its correct flemish spelling, please use Brugge too.
Or use US spelling for both.
Sorry to disappoint you.
I'm a Belgian, lived all my life in Belgium and I consider I have the right to say I favour Gent above Brugge.
Don't see why it makes me autistic.
So good for you if you love so so so Brugge but don't see what gives you the right to judge me.
And reference to US tourist is quite egocentric actually. US is not center of the world, at least last time I checked it was not...
And lastly, if you use Gent in its correct flemish spelling, please use Brugge too.
Or use US spelling for both.
Jun 11th, 2015, 02:54 PM
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My god some folks do not think out of the box here do they? I was pleased to you have thought about something out of the box....Wallonia.
Head that way and forget about the usual places that tourist head for.
Straight away Mons is the 2015 European Capital of Culture. Besides this event it is still a great city to base yourself in.
http://www.mons2015.eu/en
There is a lot to do in the Ardennes.
http://www.visitbelgium.com/?page=hiking-biking
Namur http://www.namurtourisme.be/
Bouillon http://www.bouillon-tourisme.be/en/b.../tourist-links
Waterloo http://www.waterloo1815.be/
plus a lot more.
Head that way and forget about the usual places that tourist head for.
Straight away Mons is the 2015 European Capital of Culture. Besides this event it is still a great city to base yourself in.
http://www.mons2015.eu/en
There is a lot to do in the Ardennes.
http://www.visitbelgium.com/?page=hiking-biking
Namur http://www.namurtourisme.be/
Bouillon http://www.bouillon-tourisme.be/en/b.../tourist-links
Waterloo http://www.waterloo1815.be/
plus a lot more.
