List prices for individual tickets should not depend on how long you stay each place, but your ability to buy discounted tickets in advance does.

What total price for individual tickets are you coming up with, and how does that compare to the price of a pass?

The individual prices are coming out to 799 vs 844 for the Eurail pass.


Paris to Amsterdam 92
Amsterdam to Berlin 211 (night train)
Berlin to Prague 114
Prague to Munich 115
Munich to Venice 138
Venice to Florence 63
Florence to Rome 63

All values are denoted in US currency. Am I missing something?

I don;t beleive the Eurail pass covers accommodations on night trains - I beleive the cost of the compartment will be on top of the cost of the Pass- but do check.

You're missing a few things.

The list prices for Italy look correct. You can save some money by booking discounted fares in advance at the Italian rr website, www.trenitalia.com, or at any station once your are in the country. If you can nail down your dates, that is. If you can't then you may be stuck paying list price or using a pass.

In addition to the night trains you need to add in the cost of a seat reservation (10 euros each) for the legs in Italy.

The prices for Germany (Berlin to Prague) don't look correct - check the German RR site at www.bahn.de. I see the list price at 62 euros, or $87, discounted fares as low as 34 euros. I didn't check the other fares to/from Germany, but I suspect you're finding incorrect or inflated fares at whatever site you're using.

I realize some costs will be on top of the Eurail pass and you are correct, it would be 87 instead of 114 as previously noted. However, without knowing exactly when we'll be where, is it going to be cheaper to buy point to point when we arrive to each station since we cannot pin down exact dates for reduced rate tickets? Thank you guys and gals for your responses!

The list prices are what you'll pay if you just walk up and buy a ticket. You need to do the math yourself with the correct numbers, but from the itinerary you've listed it would be about $100 cheaper to buy point to point tickets. Bigger savings if you can snag some discounted fares even just a few days in advance. Less savings if you get the 2nd pass at 15% discount.

For some of your legs you may even consider flying, but that would also require an advance decision on dates. I've got to believe Amsterdam to Berlin flights can be had for much less than $200, for example.

You definitely must pay a supplement for a bunk on a night train, but it is cheaper than a hotel room. The T4 and T6 are unisex.

Aside from cost consider the convenience of a rail pass. Unless a reservation is required you just get on a train and go. See the German Rail site for train particulars. It is very user friendly. http://tinyurl.com/3dhgkqc.

Your figures for the CityNightLine Amsterdam to Berlin does not look correct to me. For a walk up price (if you can get a place a couple of days ahead), the price for a double compartment (per person) is € 191, or US$ 264 at today's rate on Oanda.
If booking 90 days ahead, this would cost you €99, or €65 if you hold a Railpass.

Berlin to Prague, walk up price on EC train would be €62 or US$85
Prague to Munich, I don't know how much the walk up price is, if booked online, approx US$ 40
Munich to Venice, walk up price on EC train would be €80 or US$110
I suggest you revisit your calculations again to get a truer picture

hadiwi56a,

The price of the train fare and the price of the bunk are different. Bed prices depend on how many there are in the cabin, T-1, 2, 3, 4, 6, and the class of service, 1st or 2nd.

I know that, my figure was based on per person price for a double compartment, perhaps OP was using a T-4 berth price.

Based on "I will have another person with me so we save 15%..." , that's why I wrote pricing for a double berth compartment.
But for a T4- the price would be € 161, which is closer to what the OP quoted

Just wanted to mention that in your estimate for point to point tickets I hope you aren't using the RailEurope website to come up with your costs. The prices are higher on that site and they don't list all the available train times.

Why do you want a 10-day pass? You have 7 travel legs listed moving through 6 railpass countries - France, Benelux, Germany, CZ, Austria, and Italy. I suggest that you pay for one leg - the one that eliminates Austria, MUNICH-VENICE. There are 49-euro tickets available now at www.bahn.de for some departures on some days - maybe yours. Now you have just 5 railpass countries and 6 legs - and your 6-day, 5-country selectpass in the "saver" version costs $572 (price from ricksteves.com), making your total each about $640. You'll have to add fees for sleeping accommodations.

I have used railpasses for decades and IMO do not judge a pass just on price but the railpass offers total flexibility to travel once there when you want - compared to fully flexible fares it is a great deal - yes you can go into various sites of national railways and weeks in advance get discounted tickets that are train-specific and often non-changeable nor refundable.

And the pass is first class so if you are comparing first class pass to 2nd class fares you are comparing apples to oranges - IME of decades of incessant rail travel in those countries I adamantly suggest you go first class - it is a much much more relaxed experience, especially for those carrying luggage around - in first class there are also nearly always lots of empty seats - I can put my bags on an adjoining empty seat nearly always rather than having to fend for space in often already overcrowded overhead racks in 2nd class - and in 2nd class most of the seats are nowadays often full - due to the online discounts that are meant to fill empty seats.

So consider the first class aspect of the pass when comparing fares - compare to fully flexible first class fares and the pass will be a good deal.

And a 5-country Eurail Select Pass for 8 days may be the target - you have 7 days of travel but from a base you could well use the 8th day - say from Munich you day trip to wondrous Salzburg or Mad Ludwig's Castles in Fuessen, etc. A Saverpass is for two to five people traveling on one pass - p.p. about a 20% savings over two individual passes.

Some great sites for planning a European rail trip and more about passes - www.budgeteuropetravel.com; www.seat61.com; www.ricksteves.com. As Europeans cannot use Eurailpasses they are not readily sold in Europe so buy before you leave if that is your ticket to ride.

"...you could well use the 8th day - say from Munich you day trip to wondrous Salzburg or Mad Ludwig's Castles in Fuessen, etc."

Perhaps a daytrip elsewhere would make extra railpass days worthwhile, depending on the cost of said journey, but when two are traveling from Munich, a daytrip to Füssen can be done for 14.50 Euros per person on a "Bayern ticket" daypass.

the point being Russ that the pass only comes in 6- and 8-day versions and OP needs 7 long travel days on trains - thus may have to buy 8th day and then could at least use it for even 14 euros worth of travel and it is in first class where the Bavarian Pass is only 2nd class - I took a local train to Fuessen recently and it served as a schoolbus in 2nd class with zillions of high school kids swarming on for a few stops - man was I glad I was in first class - again do not forget that the pass provides first class travel and that costs a big premium if buying tickets - so comparing apples to oranges again IMO.

Actually, PalenQ, the OP has 7 legs through SIX countries, and the 6/8-day versions are an option only with FIVE countries. So an 8-day, 5-country pass presupposes the purchase of one leg - which in 1st class is likely at least $100 - to dump one country. This, with an 8-day pass, would yield NINE travel days and total at least $760. You're into a price range now where you might as well get a first-class 10-day global flexi-saver-pass for $800.

Since the OP is considering p2p ticket choices and is focused on saving $ in this post, and since he has not insisted that every train trip be in first class, I don't think our suggestions need to be "apples to apples" at all. I think it makes a lot of $ sense to suggest the 6-day, 5-country, 1st-class flexi-saver-pass ($572) + one 2nd class p2p ticket (49 euros or $67) for a total of $639. Then tack on $20 each for a Bayern ticket IF he wants a side trip.

Actually, first class trips aren't apples to apples anyway. Between Munich and Füssen, for example, you're on pokey regional trains; you aren't being offered fancy drinks in a roomy compartment on a dedicated first-class car with reclining seats or extra cushioning. You're in a tiny compartment that's been shoe-horned into a 2nd-class car with only a wall of glass between you - the 1st-class traveler - and the "school kids" and other undesirables. And to reach the 1st class compartment, he will still have to enter the same doors and momentarily mingle with these folks prior to and after his ride in the more antiseptic glass cubicle.

But if the OP thinks this first class situation is imperative for an outing to Füssen, he could buy standard first class tickets at the Munich station - for $80 more per person each, or a total of about $720 on top of what I've suggested - and still be money ahead.

You need to buy seat reservations for the French and Italian trains. These are not always available at the last minute for popular routes. (There is a limited number of seats for passholders.) So a pass does not offer the total flexibility PalenQ touts.

Here are just a few more thoughts on the subject:

Doing a combo of a railpass and individual tickets might work best for you.

1) Get a one month Global Pass. The one month starts as of the first day you use it, so take care which will be first day. the first conductor that you had the pass to will mark in the initial travel date.

Looking at your itinerary, I'd say you could start the month-long pass either from Paris or Amsterdam and end it in either Venice or Florence (it all depends on how many days you spend where).

The advantage of the Global Pass is that you can just about hop on and hop off any train AND you can also travel on the local trains for "free" with the Global Pass.

2) The rest of your trips can be individual tickets.

Russ - your are right - I neglected to count France for some reason - but I would try to get a cheap Thalys ticket Paris to Amsterdam, available from 35 euros in 2nd class (yes if I were buying tickets I myself would probably do 2nd class but the railpass only comes in first class and IMO it would stack up fairly well against 2nd class regular fares so why not enjoy the significant benefits IME of first class for not much more if any.

And Mimar is right in that some trains in France and Italy - most trains a tourist will take demand seat reservations - the Thalys train is about the most expensive in Europe for passholders, charging an obscene IMO $40 or so supplement even for 2nd class travel with a pass - so the OP could get a cheaper Paris to Amsterdam ticket and not use the pass and then get a 6-day Eurail Select 5 Country Pass and save quite a bit of money.

thanks Russ for pointing out my miscue!

And again I was glad I had some first class seats on that train to Fuessen when school kids mobbed aboard - though it was not a dedicated car I was in a dedicated section where the kids standing all over the 2nd class area dared not to enter. And the schoolkids is not an anomaly IME on regional trains in Germany that often IME double as school buses as students seem to travel often from nearby cities to a larger city for upper level schools.

try www.thalys.com for deep discounted Thalys tickets to Amsterdam

the Global Pass mentioned above is good for folks traveling many days on trains in a short period but the OP IMO is better off considering the Flexipasses that are good for two months and give you a certain number of unlimited train travel days midnight to midnight. OP does not indicate they will be using the train most days and they are going for 45 days with just several train rides indicated so the flexipass would be better than Global Pass as for 45 days they would have to buy a 2-month Global Pass at way way too much money - just use the Eurail Select Saverpass for how many actual travel days you need - six days as you can buy the Paris to Amsterdam Thalys ticket cheaper than what the supplement is if you used the railpass for that (7th) day.