maja30

I was wondering how much I would be expecting to spend? I have about $1300 budgeted for the main flight. From what I've looked at traveling costs, accommodation and food doesn't seem expensive. Is about $2200 fine? I'd be staying at hostels.

I know that people usually drive because public transportation in the Balkans is unreliable, but I'm trying my best to see if we can just stick to trains, buses and planes.

Flight to Ljubljana on August 7th

1) Ljubljana 4 nights (8-11)
- Arrive afternoon
- 1 day in Ljubljana
- 1 day trip to Lake Bled via a train to Kranj and bus to Bled
- 1 day Predjama Castle via train and taxi (1.5 hours) from Ljubljana

2) Zagreb 2 nights (12-13)
- train 2.5 hours directly from Ljubljana
- 1.5 days exploring Zagreb

3) Pula 3 nights (14-16)
- flight from Zagreb
- spend 2.5 days in Pula

4) Zadar 2 nights (17-18)
- will be arriving in Zadar early morning (7:00 am) if we hopefully get that flight
- next day trip to Plitvice
* how can we do this? Do we have to rent a car because I can't seem to find any buses that will allow us to do it.

5) Split 3 nights (19-21)
- maybe an island day trip

6) Dubrovnik 2 nights (22-23)
- 5 hour bus ride from Split to Dubrovnik with an evening there
- 1 day to explore Dubrovnik

7) Budva 2 nights (24-25)
- ~3 hour bus ride
- 1 whole day in Budva

8) Belgrade 4 nights (26-29)
- bus to Tivat from Budva, flight from Tivat to Belgrade
- 3 days in Belgrade

Flight home on August 30th

maja30

Forgot to add, we are females in our mid-20s (currently 2 guaranteed to go, 2 more might be going as well so in that case car rentals might be easier hopefully!)

Andrew

I don't agree that public transportation is necessarily "unreliable" in all of the Balkans. In Slovenia and Croatia, anyway, there isn't a vast train system, but there is a decent bus system. "Inconvenient" may be a better word. Lots of people explore the area via bus/train.

I can't comment on your plane ticket cost because I have no idea where you are flying from. If you are trying to save money, check the cost of flying into Venice instead; if that's a few hundred euros less, consider that - you can take a direct bus from the Venice airports to Ljubljana, for about 25 euros per person.

August is peak vacation season in Croatia, as you probably know. I'd expect a day trip to Plitice Lakes to be not very rewarding, because I would expect mobs of tourist groups in August. Staying over in Plitvice so you can get into the park first thing in the morning would be better. (There are hotels right in the park but they might blow your budget.) You could bus from Zagreb to Plitvice instead, about two hours each way. From there to Pula might be a challenge, though. Check www.buscroatia.com to check bus schedules.

Renting a car in August may not be cheap but maybe not too expensive. Check the economycarrentals website to check prices. You can do one-way rentals within one country if you have a minimum number of days. You might also be able to find a guided tour from Zadar instead of trying to take public transportation to Plitvice.

I'm not sure about your daily budgets - check hostel prices yourself for each city on your proposed dates, on a few of the hostel booking sites, just to get a rough idea.

maja30

Thanks for your help! We would rather take buses/trains if none of us feel comfortable driving so that's great to know!

The flights I've seen are around that price so that's why I made that estimate. I think at most I might have to pay $100 extra.

It definitely sounds better to add a day to Zagreb and take a day trip to the Plitvice Lakes from there. There seems to be a bus that arrives at 8:09 there but tickets can't be bought...other than that the earliest is 10:07 so we might aim for that instead.

kja

Sorry, but I'm no help on the budget. As for the itinerary:

"1 day Predjama Castle"

You might give some thought to visiting the stunning Škocjan Caves instead. Info, including info on how to get there, here:
http://www.park-skocjanske-jame.si/eng/index.shtml
Just a thought....

"next day trip to Plitvice
*how can we do this? "

Bus from Zagreb or Split. Of visit the Plitvice Lakes en route between Zagreb and Split. Try to spend a night at the lakes. And FWIW, sometimes the way to beat the crowds is to wait until the tour groups have all set out. Just don't wait too long! Not only are the lakes connected by travertine waterfall formations, each lake has unique microbiota, and as a result, the lakes are different colors. The best way to see that is to make a single, long loop through the park -- something on the order of 6 hours or more (including time for the boat that connects the lower and upper lakes). The price of a room near the park might be higher than you would prefer, but do give some thought to making it a splurge if you can -- it is a truly magnificent place!

"I know that people usually drive because public transportation in the Balkans is unreliable"

Like Andrew, I thought the public transportation in Croatia and Slovenia reliable and comfortable and, for many (not all) purposes, very convenient. I have read that buses between Zagreb and Split (or vice versa) are sometimes full, and if they are, they won't stop to pick anyone up in Plitvice. I don't know if that is true or, if it is, how often it happens.

aleksander57

1- Ljubljana-Bled you have a bus every hour direct, no need for train.
Visit Postojna Caves and you get free shuttle to Predjama Castle included in price of ticket. No need for taxi, is 20-30min walk.
2- Plan is ok.
3- Pula alone is not worth 2.5 days. Port city, only Roman Amphitheatre worth visit and Brioni Islands. I will include Rovinj, short bus drive from Pula.
4- Zadar to Plitvice complicated for the time spending there. Just spend time on some nice beach.
5- Plan is ok.
6- Dubrovnik will be swamp with tourist-Cruise Ships. Tourist trap, completely rip off, but I understand why you want to visit. I will personally look for different time to visit it.
7- Plan is fine.
8- I will go for train ride Bar-Belgrade. It's very scenic route worth doing.

kja

@ aleksander57 -- sorry but I must disagree with your assertion: "Dubrovnik will be swamp with tourist-Cruise Ships. Tourist trap, completely rip off'

Yes, there will be other tourists there. Yes, on some days, there can be enough day-tripping tourists to make daytimes less than an ideal experience -- but IME, one can plan around that. And once the cruise-based tourists return to their ships, OH! -- what a magnificent place! And yes, it can be price-y, but I don't believe that it HAS to be a "rip-off" or a "tourist trap."

And I also disagree with your suggestion, "4- Zadar to Plitvice complicated for the time spending there. Just spend time on some nice beach."

A nice beach is not, and IMO, never will be, a substitute for the Plitvice Lakes. Particularly because swimming is not permitted in the Plitvice Lakes! And for that matter, some of us aren't interested in beach time. Maybe the OP is, but the idea that these places are, or could ever be considered, interchangeable is, IMO, absurd.

I'm sure you mean well, aleksander....

aleksander57

Kja, I know how beautiful Dubrovnik is, but when you have just one day to see it when is full of tourist, you can barely move around and you can't have nice experience. Sometimes you have three Cruise Ships there at the same day, it's a mad house. I am from this part of the world originally- ex Yu and will never visit Venice or Dubrovnik in main season. Years ago it was different story, but not know. Place is expensive enough and if you pay big money then you must have positive experience. I know the tourist who came from afar look differently, but this is just my 2 cents.

Plitvice Lakes are indeed unique, worth visit of course, but you need all day there to see it all. Better even stayed overnight, go early before all the tour buses came. You will spent cca 5h just on buses, leaving not enough time to visit it properly. Perhaps will be better to visit Krka National Park which is closer to Zadar.
I mentioned some beach time because OP has just one day to visit and this is very short time and her itinerary is quite compact and few hours beach time can't do any damage.

maja30

Thanks for all your replies! This is the new itinerary:

1) Ljubljana 3 nights (8-10)
- Arrive afternoon
- 1 day in Ljubljana
- 1 day trip to Lake Bled via direct bus to Bled
- 1 day Predjama Castle and Postojna caves - leave onward to Trieste

2) Trieste day trip 1 night (11)
- spend the 12th in Trieste

3) Pula 3 nights (12 - 14)
- 2 days in Pula

4) Zagreb 1 night (15)
- flight from Pula to Zagreb
- 1 day exploring Zagreb and leaving in the evening to a Plitvice hotel

5) Plitvice (16-17)
- arrive in the evening on the 16th
- visit on the 17th

4) Zadar 1 night (18)
- we might get very little time in Zadar depending on when we leave Plitvice, but we're trying to early morning on the 18th

5) Split 3 nights (19-21)
- maybe an island day trip

6) Dubrovnik 2 nights (22-23)
- 5 hour bus ride from Split to Dubrovnik with an evening there
- 1 day to explore Dubrovnik
- I know that this may not be that great during August but it would be nice to still go and maybe come back another time when it's not as crowded

7) Budva 2 nights (24-25)
- ~3 hour bus ride
- 1 whole day in Budva

8) Belgrade 4 nights (26-29)
- bus to Tivat from Budva, flight from Tivat to Belgrade
- 3 days in Belgrade

My concern is too much time traveling and just too much of it. We might skip Budva entirely and add 1 day to Zadar and 1 day to Dubrovnik.

maja30

Other itinerary

1) Ljubljana 3 nights (8-10)
- Arrive afternoon
- 9th in Ljubljana
- on 10th trip to Lake Bled via direct bus to Bled
- on 11th day Predjama Castle and Postojna caves - leave onward to Trieste

2) Trieste day trip 1 night (11)
- spend the 12th in Trieste before heading to Pula around the evening

3) Pula 3 nights (12 - 14)
- 2 days (13th & 14th) in Pula

4) Zagreb 1 night (15)
- flight from Pula to Zagreb early morning on 15th arrives 7:30 am
- explore Zagreb on 2nd half of 15th and 1st half of 16th and in the evening to a Plitvice hotel

5) Plitvice (16-17)
- arrive in the evening on the 16th
- visit on the 17th

6) Zadar 2 nights (18th-19th)

7) Split 3 nights (20-22nd)
- maybe an island day trip

8) Dubrovnik 3 nights (23-25)
- 5 hour bus ride from Split to Dubrovnik with an evening there
- 2 days to explore Dubrovnik
- I know that this may not be that great during August but it would be nice to still go and maybe come back another time when it's not as crowded

9) Belgrade 4 nights (26-29)
- flight from Dubrovnik to Belgrade
- 3 days in Belgrade

aleksander57

Much better itinerary with time in Plitvice, but I would recommend you stay with Budva and skip Zadar. Budva is much better with Bay of Kotor and Park Lovcen.

kja

I'm glad you've found a way to stay overnight in Plitvice!

Did you find a bus from Plitvice to Zadar?

northie

even with cruise ships in Dubrovnik you can avoid the crowds-go early as cruise ships seem to unload later and go back to ship in late afternoon. You could also go later in day.

aleksander57

Northie, in August Dubrovnik is a mess, full to the brim with people who are holidaying there + few thousands day visitors from ships. In late afternoon is indeed better, but you will still struggle to find somewhere to sit down and enjoy the city.

danon

Sorry to hear Dubrovnik has become so crowded and touristy .
I visited years ago, it was a stunning place.

kja

Perhaps what I've read has been mistaken -- I had thought that the restrictions on the number of cruise ships in Dubrovnik had resulted in substantial improvements.

When I was there -- shoulder season, but before the restrictions on the number of cruise ships, so the city was MASSED during the days -- I found it fairly easy to manage my time around the day trippers. I didn't try to walk the walls until after day-trippers had left, and then, I shared them with only a few people. While day-trippers were busy following their guides, I took a boat to Lokrum, and again, shared my time there with very few others. Even during the day, the cloisters of both monasteries were abandoned. The ONLY place where I had ANY difficulty was the treasury of the cathedral, and yes, I admit that the crowds there were nearly (but not completely) insurmountable. I even managed to snag a rail-side seat at the Buza Bar by going before most tourists had finished their lunches!

Whle crowds can be very off-putting, I think we each need to make very personal decisions about how those crowds will (or might) affect us. I don't like crowds, but I'd rather see Dubrovnik with crowds than miss seeing it all together! JMO -- YMMV.

aleksander57

Of course, every person is different and if you come to Dubrovnik from another side of the world you must take it at it is. Just travel to Europe is costly so you want to see as much as possible. We Europeans have more choices, so I personally avoid world class tourist sites in August when whole of Europe has holidays. Personally for me is not value for money, crowded and completely rip off.
Unfortunately Croatia is very bad example of ripping off tourist in peak season, as tourist season is short and they want to earn as much money as possible in short period.
Dubrovnik in August or in September looks completely different. Even in first half of July is not bad.

maja30

Is Dubrovnik any better in July maybe? It would be impossible for us to move this trip up to June right now unless we can still get places...but would it be that much of a difference? Or maybe push back the trip? What's the ideal time to visit?

kja, I found a bus departing the Plitvice Lakes at 09:30 am and arriving at Zadar at 11:15 am. The park seems to be open around 8:00 am so I was thinking...it should be possible for us to enjoy the lakes properly and still catch the 5:23PM bus to Zadar that evening? We just want to make sure because if the hotel we get at the Plitvice Lakes is too expensive we'd prefer to spend just 1 night (the night before) there.

kja

"Unfortunately Croatia is very bad example of ripping off tourist in peak season, as tourist season is short and they want to earn as much money as possible in short period. "

In what specific ways are Croatians "ripping off" tourists -- and in particular, budget travelers (such as the OP) during high season? I think that might be very helpful information as they plan.
Thanks in advance!

kja

I think our earlier messages crossed in hyperspace....

"I found a bus departing the Plitvice Lakes at 09:30 am and arriving at Zadar at 11:15 am. The park seems to be open around 8:00 am so I was thinking...it should be possible for us to enjoy the lakes properly and still catch the 5:23PM bus to Zadar that evening?

Great! A bus at 5:23 p.m. should work very well for you. That is the bus you meant, right? Not the 11:15 a.m. bus?

I'm sure you already know to visit Zadar's Sea Organ and nearby solar art display -- very cool!

As for the ideal time to visit, well, my first thought is: go when you can! Beyond that, I don't have good information about differences between July and August. I think a poster who goes by the name "thursdaysd" has posted links to a site that gives information about cruise ship dates in Dubrovnik, so you might want to do a search for that. If you could push your trip into September, you might find less crowds and lower costs -- children will be back in school then, and so family vacations will come to an end. Many of us aim to travel during "shoulder" seasons because doing so lets us avoid the worst of the crowds while taking advantage of somewhat lower costs for lodging than high season. Of course, there are potential disadvantages to traveling outside of high season: sites may close earlier, the weather might not be as nice, and days will likely be shorter.

You would do well to consult one of more really good guidebooks to identify the differences between traveling in the months that are feasible for you and your friends. FWIW, I found the Rough Guide the best of the half-dozen guidebooks I consulted when planning my time in the area. (And yes, buy a guidebook! You'll learn all sorts of things you never even knew to ask!)

Hope that helps!