Converting to Euros?

"the daily conversion . . ." Yes, their daily conversion rate -- but exactly what is it. I have yet to see a bank that offers the official exchange rate plus just $3. My guess is they are charging their own "special" daily rate

That actually sounds more like what they'll charge for your ATM transactions in Paris.

If you want - just for peace of mind - you can get maybe €50 or €100 from your bank and then use you ATM card in France . . . .

ATM's are the best way to get money. You can get euros at the ATM when you arrive in Paris. If you feel the need, get enough euros to cover your transport to your hotel/apartment. Check with your bank/cc's regarding daily withdrawal limits and any fees they may charge. Don't forget to let your bank and cc companies know when you are travelling.

Agree...that sounds too low for a bank conversion. I used to get 100 euros before going, but the conversion rates stink. Now I just wait til I get over the pond.

Have you looked into a credit union? I joined one before our last trip and there were no ATM or foreign transaction fees...considerable savings. I think their conversion rate was favorable also.

ATMs have now become ubiquitous, so no need to worry that you will not find a machine. I usually carry more than one ATM card, but have found that if one bank does not accept my main card the next one will.
I have a local currency exchange chain that I've used to get my "landing money" in case I'm zonked when I land (jet lag for example).
Also, as you have found, all currency transactions have two components...exchange rate and fees. You will see exchange bureaus that say "no fees", but that's only half a story.
ATM rates are quite competitive, but my bank does not charge a per withdrawal fee.

My rule of thumb is CCs only for large items, cash for rest.

Or get a Cap One account -- no ATM or Forex fees there either. Straight interbank rate.

And even CDG, as cruddy of an airport as it is, has ATMs in the terminal.

Most banks in the US I've heard about add on 7 pct to get what is their bank's conversion rate.

If you want any in advance, I wouldn't get any to cover food, only transportation.

We take a couple hundred in US$ as a backup, but otherwise just get money out of the ATM. I figure that if the airport ATMs don't accept our cards when we land, we can use the currency exchange booth to change a bit of money until we find another ATM.

<<Is the best way to get euros in France by going to an ATM machine and just get Euros out of them?>>

Normally, YES. But you need to understand you own home banks fees on international transactions.

Thanks for ALL your input. I thought it was too good to be true that I would get the true conversion rate plus $3. IF that is the case, I will just exchange enough to get us to our apt and then do the rest there. Good to know there are many ATM's there.

My ATM card has NYCE, pulse, Master Card and STar on the back. The bank said make sure the ATM machines have those on there too. Will I be able to find these in Paris?

>>Will I be able to find these in Paris?<<

yes - all over. (assume you mean "Plus" and not "pulse")

Master Card is everywhere so no worries. Avoid where possible exchange booths as they are pricey usually, especially in Paris. Usually banks charge a percentage of total, say 1.5% with a minimum and max fee and rate varies each day and will almost certainly not reflect up to the minute rate. I find the rate is usually about 100 ponts off real rate! Ask your own cc company what their charges are for ATM usage abroad and be sure to let them know when you will be abroad.
Bon voyage!

It is not necessary to "convert" any money before you go. If you want you can convert enough to get you to your hotel. But to get the best rates you should charge everything you can to your credit cards and pull walking around money from an ATM.

I'm sure your bank will charge youa $3 fee plus convert the money at their usual rate of exchange - which is 8 to 10% worse that the Interbank rate. If you use credit cards of ATM you typically pay 1 to 3% (dpending on card issuer) higher than the Interbank rate (the rate that banks use among themselves for currency transactions in the millions).

If you want to change $100 or so - just do it at the bureau de change at your departure airport. the rate won;t be any wore than at your bak and it will be less trouble. (And pull some cash from the ATM as soon as you get to Paris.)

Rule of Thumb: NEVER, EVER put a credit card into an ATM is there is any alternative whatsoever. Taking a cash advance on a CC is tantamount to a loan at whatever usurous rate the bank charges, with a fee up front and the interest accruing from the date of the withdrawal. My rules:

CC for hotel, train, plane, works of art
DC to get cash from ATMs for everything else
Check transactions at xe.com/ccc when I get home

is -> if

I'd be surprised if you found ANY machine in Paris (and they are just about on every block) that did NOT take your card.

Wow, lots of info. Thanks! I did ask my bank about the fees and they said I have to bring in my card and they can tell me. Thanks for sharing your vast knowledge.

My ATM card does say pulse, strangely enough.

Anyway, as long as it says MasterCard, that is enough. Every single ATM in France takes both MasterCard and Visa.

Make sure to notify your bank that you'll be using your card overseas; some banks/credit unions actually have "blocks" on ATM usage in certain countries, thus, disallowing you to make ATM withdawals. Speaking of credit cards, make sure to charge in the local currency--do not allow vendors to convert charges into USD (it'll cost you more.)
Safe travels

My ATM card does say pulse, strangely enough.

Not strange at all. Pulse and Cirrus are for ATM transactions what Visa and MC are for credit card transactions - networks authorizing and executing the requests.

Like Visa/MC, Pulse/Cirrus charge a 1% fee on all transactions they process. What your bank may charge you for out-of-network withdrawals is another matter and worth the effort (sometimes a sizable effort) to find someone at your bank who can knowledgeably explain the fees.

Thanks again for the additional info. I'm off to the bank to inquire.

wordteacher,
I need to tell each place I shop that i wat to charge in the local currency? I thought they would do this automatically. Good to know. THx.

Thanks for clearing up the pulse Sarastro!

Ok, I went to the bank to get some Euros. Today's conversion rate is 1.413. I asked the bank what their conversion was? They said 1.51130. So, you're right, their rate is different. Not as bad as I thought it might be though.

Robespierre, what is DC in your reply,
"DC to get cash from ATMs for everything else"

Now to try to find out what the fees will be when I use the ATM in France-was kinda like pulling teeth. I talked to 3 people and this is the best info I got:

Using an ATM will cost 2% foreign currency fee, then some might charge a 0.2% cross the borders fee plus what the Paris ATM machine will charge.

Can you tell me what the Paris ATM machine charges for using it with an ATM card from the US? They had no clue.

They said if I use it as a debit card, there would be a 0.8% fee+ 2 % currency fee. That actually is less than Visa and MC which charge 3%.

I was allowed to pick my amount I'm allowed to withdraw daily and also to charge as a debit. But then you have to consider if you lose the card, anyone could go charge happy with it. So it's a double edged sword. They said if you don't tell them you lost the card within 2 days of when you lose it, you are liable for the entire amount they charged on the card. Sometimes you might lose one of your cards and just not be aware of it for 2 days I would think.

DC = debit card (your ATM card)

"Using an ATM will cost 2% foreign currency fee, then some might charge a 0.2% cross the borders fee plus what the Paris ATM machine will charge. "

As usual - your bank staff knows nothing. The ATM in Paris will not charge you anything -- the ONLY added costs are added by mc/your bank. A "cross the borders fee" - I suspect they are making that up.

I basically would not rely on much of anything they said since US banks seldom know what they are talking about when it comes to foreign currency . . . . .

DC = debit card.

Your bank will be the one charging you ATM fees. My ATM card is from a credit union and gives me the interbank rank (the 1.41 you mentioned above as shown on sites such as xe or oanda) as does my credit card (also from the credit union).

Re: credit cards: Visa and Mastercard charge 1%, not 3%. A few banks, like Capital One, eat that charge. Most credit unions pass it on but charge no more. Most banks charge an additional 2% or so.

And, as Janisj says, in general the personnel working at your local branch have no idea about what is charged on overseas purchases.

Simplest solution....credit cards for most everything. Personally have never understood this only charge large items on a credit card bit.....more and more places in Paris take credit cards, no questions asked.

Used my credit card to buy a single ticket from zone 1 to zone 3 on the RER (€2.30), no questions asked. Used it at McDonald's (sorry guys, sometimes you just want to eat something in a hurry and don't have the time to plop down for a meal and an hour and a half to eat)....no questions asked. When we stopped at the autogrills or whatever on the motorways, used the credit cards for goodies.

Then as necessary to replenish the cash, use the ATM's.

Be aware different banks have different policies regarding fees but in 99.9% of the cases, no matter what the fees the credit card companies charge, you'll do far better than exchanging cash whether it be at home or in Paris.

You are absolutely right that the banks just don't know about what goes on outside the US.

Ohhhh DC= debit card. Of course, duh. My bad. Thanks for the clarification. I thought of Discover Card right off the bat. BTW, Discover Card said they are accepted in France wherever Diner's Club is accepted.

As for Visa and MC, i called both of mine and they both said 3%. So, Mimar you are saying MC and Visa charge 1% but the banks charge an additional 2%?

The networks charge a 1% International Service Assessment. Many banks rebate it to the customer, as Schwab does.

Card issuers tack on whatever Currency Conversion fees they want to. Sometimes 2 or 3%, but I've seen as much as 5%. Schwab charges 0%.

just returned from vacation in paris. went with NO euros in hand and was concerned, but being that we had shuttle service prepaid, we decided to hope for the best. we ended up needing NO euros at all and didn't even use ATM in bank, but converted money in at ATM on the street as soon as we arrived. if transportation is already covered, don't worry and just use ATM after settling in to your hotel.
banks charge big fee for ordering euros and exchange rate is terrible here. so go and enjoy and not to worry.

I wouldn't say "many" banks rebate the 1%. Mainly Schwab and some credit unions. Some other banks will refund the fees for their very best customers but not for general accounts.

oops, i meant to say...didn't use ATM in AIRPORT! no time, and tired.

>>>Simplest solution....credit cards for most everything<<<

I am always surprised at the number of places that only accept cash in Italy including major tourist sites such as Herculaneum.

Thanks!

Germany is very much that way too.....France used to be that way until a strike by the employees of the armed car companies that deliver cash to merchants. In short, there was little cash available throughout Paris. So they began accepting credit cards even for small amounts (at one time the RATP had a rule they would not accept credit cards for fares worth less than 45 Francs or something like that but during that strike, they were forced to accept credit cards for all rides and it stuck so in France, today at least, you can use credit cards for the most part for purchases no matter how small.

That day will come too in Germany and Italy. The UK is already like that!

But then you have to consider if you lose the [debit] card, anyone could go charge happy with it.

Here's what we did. My regular debit card is attached to a checking acct with automatic deposits flowing in & out during the month. I didn't want to take a chance of someone getting access to the acct when there was a large balance sitting there.

Went to a credit union and opened a ck acct just for the trip. Deposited $3000, more than enough for planned w/drawals (apartment was prepaid). Set a daily limit of $500.

As a backup, I also carried my AMEX card. And I left a signed check with my sister: drawn on regular ck acct, blank amount, made out to me. Also gave her a cr union deposit slip. In an emergency, I would tell her how much to make the check for and she would deposit it at the credit union.

The ATM fees were minimal, like $4 for a $500 withdrawal. And the exchange rate was very close to the official one. Thankfully, the emergency backup plan was never needed....but it was nice to know it was there.

The real moment that tipped the balance for France and some of the other countries was January 1, 2002 when the euro began to circulate. Stores were so afraid that 1) people would be afraid to spend cash and 2) the cashiers would get all mixed up giving change that many stores said they would accept cards for ANY amount with no minimum. That has remained in place in most of the normal every day stores, and I still see people paying amounts like 3.50€ with a card when they never would have dreamed of doing so in the past.

1) Card issuers use computers that scrutinize every transaction that goes through them, from the authorization phase to approval.

2) This allows the issuer to block any transaction that "doesn't look right." You've probably had it happen to you when you used a perfectly good card. Remember, it's the bank, not its cardholders, that is liable for fraudulent use of the card above some specified threshold. So the issuers will always err on the side of caution.

So read your User Agreement until you understand it, and quit screwing around with separate accounts. They are simply unnecessary.

All great suggestions, thanks!

I'm glad France allows you to charge for almost any amt now. I think we will use that to the hilt unless I get stopped by the problem Robespierre mentioned.

Disney, just remember what was said initially by Robes:
Keep your Credit Card well away from ATMs

your comment:
" They said if I use it as a debit card, there would be a 0.8% fee+ 2 % currency fee. That actually is less than Visa and MC which charge 3%. "
nearly reads that someone at the bank has said you may be able to use your credit card as a debit card!

Some banks [at least here in Oz] do have cards like that for I have a single card that I can use either as a CC or to withdraw from savings with, but some ATMs did confuse the action once and so I never use it like that now.

But seems the credit/debit card fees may be higher in US or they have gone up in recent years for in Oz it is generally just a 2% bank fee for overseas creit card purchases or withdrawing with debit though latter can be more as some have a structure like 1% + $5 to withdrawals limited to $500.

If you take 500 $ or Eu out you'll pay 2% but take out 100 and you'll pay 1 + 5 and that gets to 6%.

So do check detail of your bank charges to work out what's best and you might even want to ask at the local if they have an international section at HQ you can check with.

Bushranger,
No, the bank didn't say I could use the DC as CC. They just said if I use the DC to buy something in a store, those would be the charges.

You lost me here:

"If you take 500 $ or Eu out you'll pay 2% but take out 100 and you'll pay 1 + 5 and that gets to 6%."

Make sure your PIN number is 4 numbers and not 5. Happy Travels!

<<< BTW, Discover Card said they are accepted in France wherever Diner's Club is accepted. >>>

Diners Club isn't generally accepted in France (or most places in Europe). So relying on a Discover Card could be problematical unless it's also affiliated with Mastercard / Visa

"Make sure your PIN number is 4 numbers and not 5."

Used to be the case, but is no longer true. 4, 5 or even 6 digit PINs will work almost everyewhere.

Thanks!!

SherrillMills
"but converted money in at ATM on the street as soon as we arrived" I assume you meant you withdrew euros when you arrived, not converted $ to euros at an ATM machine?

Dmania...someone else mentioned to make sure charges are in local currency...what they are taling about is Dynamic Currency Conversion. Someone, say hotel or shop, asks if you would like to charge it to your card in $ instead of euros and you figure, why not, Easy to see and understand total costs...except...they charge you a very poor exchange rate. They assume you will not know the exchange rate, and can make a few more euros off of the sale So just make sure that ALL of your purchases are in the local currency.

Don't know if someone mentioned this already but make sure to always be cognizant of the current coversion rate when withdrawing so as to not go over your limit, e.g. if your US bank has a 300 USD ATM max, then you won't be able to get withdraw 300 euros because--based on the coversion rate--that would add up to more than 300 USD. Hope that makes sense

One other thing, my ATM withdrawals in London this year came out of my checking account...I was not able to choose between checking and savings at the ATM machine, nor have I in the past, that I can remember. So...have money there if you have multiple account on your ATM card

Michel_Paris-good to know about the charge in local currency. I would have thought like you first said, easier to charge in USD so I know how much I'm paying. I will keep that in mind. Thanks for that helpful tip!!

wordteacher-I never thought about that also. Excellent point.

Michel-I understand what you are saying, good point once again.

The bank told me now that I have to pay 3% for every ATM transaction. Sigh...

mimar,
Thanks for your post about Capital One eats the charge. So, I opened a Capital One credit card today to use for Paris. That 3% charge adds up fast. They confirmed that there is no foreign currency charge. Thanks!!

Now if only one of those American banks would start issuing chip cards...

What's a chip card?

You don't have one so don't worry about it . . . .

(European cc's use different technology than US-issued cards. They have embedded chips, ours have magnetic strips - they work differently. Chip cards require entering a PIN every time they are used. Like I said, don't worry about it since you couldn't get a chip card)

We have embedded chips AND a magnetic strip since we sometimes visit backwards countries.

yeah - I know - but I didn't want to confuse disney even more

JeanneB, we did something similar ... I didn't want the risk of an account open linked to checking.

A local bank is very fee-free and they don't charge the 2%, so I opened an account there, deposited cash and used that throughout Europe. I still have that account open and it is my 'slush fund'... I deposit money that I stumble upon in it as my cash for vacations. (for example, a rebate check or something). Makes paying for vacations pain-free.

Also, heads-up... my Merrill Lynch visa does NOT work in Europe. Last I knew, it was blocked from foreign transacations even though it has the plus sign on it. Now that they are part of BOA, I'll have to check, but I'd rather not take that one anyway since it has a rather large limit...

I always get a lot of flack from most people on Fodors, but we do it differently and have always done it with EASE!
Take a lot of euro from U.S.,,,,have it on hand....avoid the ATM's UNTIL you need more cash and then it is fine. Charge hotels on credit card,,,,,(and yes, try not to let a hotel charge you in dollars! ,,,,,we fell into that once, and later the manager explained that we were not paying more. Still in doubt, however).
We travel a lot, lived overseas for 5 years, so we're not "inexperienced". OF course many people don't want to have lots of euro/cash with them,,,,. We aren't out late at night, though we do walk interesting streets....just hold on to it.!!!
To each his own~~~OK? just sharing what my husband and I do.)
We "might " pay a little more getting euro from our bank in U.S.,, but we put it into the catagory of CONVENIENCE>.

To me, stopping at an ATM on the way out of the airport is far more convenient than making a special trip to my bank. I've only been to my bank (actually a credit union) maybe 3,4 times in 20 years (do most of my banking online). Making a special trip to pay extra seems senseless.

yes it is still amazing that people go into hives and frothing and foaming at the mouth and wringing their hands over "converting" or obtaining foreign currency before traveling to Europe. People people people....just use your ATM card and the hordes of bank/ATM machines in europe to obtain your currency and stop the endless useless sweating and special bank trips and paying crazy fees to obtain currency....stop the madness already.

mari5: Just about every time there is a thread about this, you come on to say you always get thousands of € from your bank ahead of time. No matter how many times you repeat this - still doesn't make it a good idea. You are happy doing this -- fine -- but PLEASE don't recommend it to others.

Your bank loves you since they are making a small fortune off your currency purchases. OK - maybe you can afford your own private stimulus program. But for most people that would be very foolish/wasteful. If it was me - I'd keep this to myself and not brag about throwing $$ away.

mari5 on Jul 4, 09 at 06:32 PM

We "might" pay a little more getting euro from our bank in U.S., but we put it into the category of CONVENIENCE.

Even if s/he got exactly the same exchange rate as we do, a first-timer would still have to go the effort of getting that first load. And whatever subsequent transaction needed (for another trip) requires that same effort. So your CONVENIENCE factor, I'm afraid to report, don't mean diddly. All downside, with no upside.

Have you ever checked at xe.com/ccc to see what your actual cost was? You might find doing so to be enlightening.

Yes, of course we check,,,and we haven't found that much difference..TRULY............
AND the euros can be sent to your home! Simplest thing in the world, (or have them waiting for you at your bank) What's this about going to the bank,,, and having a hassle.
I think there is misunderstanding,,,, we don't get ALL the cash/euro for the whole trip.. but more than just a small amount suggested "for the ride to the hotel". The ATM's do come in handy a little later into the trip.
THis is "fun"~~ and some of you, though obviously educated and often sensible ,never cease to amaze me.
I still think our way can often work for a first timer.!

Interesting to hear everyeone's take on this subject. Thanks for your input!!

I don't think there is a misunderstanding. You said "Take a lot of euro from U.S". And then you said "OF course many people don't want to have lots of euro/cash with them,,,,. We aren't out late at night, though we do walk interesting streets....just hold on to it.!!!
To each his own~~~OK? just sharing what my husband and I do."

Now you are trying to backtrack and say the opposite. You also don't seem to know how much it costs you to do this (much more than just using an ATM once you are there) and you don't seem to understand DCC either. Bad advice all the way around.

I could also walk around here in Canada with a load of cash and state how convenient it is to not have to go to a bank...but it isn't. If I can have all some of the same convenience of home while abroad, why would I not want to take advantage of it? And yes, costs have to figure into any choice, but dollars to donuts (or is that euros to pain au chocolats) it is cheaper AND more convenient to use ATM/CCs when travelling.

Some people also still use travellers cheques...that does not make it easiser nor better

Another reason to avoid Dynamic Currency Conversion, in addition to the less-than-advantageous (for you, it is great for the merchant) exchange rate: Your credit card issuer may still treat it as a foreign transaction and add its 2-3% foreign transaction charge on top of the figure you see on your receipt.
Check the fine print on your credit card terms, it probably defines a foregn transaction as "a transaction occurring outside the US" or something similar, not "transaction in a foreign currency".
When offered DCC, always say no thanks.

DCC means that they charge the thing you are buying in USD and not the local currency Euros?

disneymania4444: Yes

Dynamic Currency Conversion never comes out in your favor, so always make sure you are charged in the local currency.

Not only do you usually get a bad exchange rate, your credit card will also tag on a currency conversion fee - even though they aren't converting anything . . . .

I have used the Capital One CREDIT card - with no transaction surcharge...and (since it is not an ATM card) no ATM surcharge, and a great rate -- probably interbank rate or close to it.

It's great...highly recommended. Just remember to pay it off on time -- the interest rate is probably high (I'm guessing, becaue I never checked --- I only planned to use it in Paris and to pay it off immediately.)

SS

Two more things...

(1) Be sure to notify the card issuer of your impending trip, so they won't deny the charges.

(2) Be sure to take some Euros in cash with you (if you can) just in case you get to the airport and nothing works. We usually hold about 75-100 Euros from each trip for future trips. If that is not feasilbe, take a few extra cards for such emergencies, even though the rates and charges may be horrible.

SS

No matter what anyone says about arriving with lots of cash, it's both dumb and expensive. You've gotten good advice apart from that.

I have been taking my euros with me for a great many years. I do not consider it either dumb or expensive!

Most people go the ATM route. I do not. I stay for 6 weeks, perhaps, but take probably less than 1000 euros, as I use a Capital One card for most everything. I do carry other cards, too.

I carry a bank ATM card. Only used it once, when in Sarlat, and passed a machine and decided to see if it worked..It did!

I just don't like to be bothered with having to think about the need to going someplace to get cash! The small added cost for purchasing the euros in advance, is well worth the convenience FOR ME. It is the way that I prefer and will continue to do. I always come home with at least 100 euros.

It is whatever works for you and the way you prefer to do it. It is everyone's choice to make and should not be said to be "dumb" just because it does not agree with your way of doing it.

Joan

Practical advice for avoiding Dynamic Currency Conversion:

1. Look at your credit charge slip before you sign it.
2. If the amount you are charging is in local currency, sign it.
3. If it's in US Dollars, ask for the merchant to re-run the charge in USD. Go to 1 (but only once).
4. If they refuse, write the following above the signature line (don't be shy): LOCAL CURRENCY NOT OFFERED and sign it.
5. SAVE YOUR COPY.
5. When your credit card bill comes, decline the charge, and enclose a copy of your copy of the slip.

All card networks require merchants to offer local currency, so they should back-charge the merchant for whatever DCC they tried to get away with. If they don't, escalate.

gracejoan3 on Jul 7, 09 at 11:03 AM

I just don't like to be bothered with having to think about the need to going someplace to get cash! The small added cost for purchasing the euros in advance, is well worth the convenience FOR ME.

I think the inconvenience of having to think about the need to go someplace to get local currency in cash before traveling pales in comparison to the convenience of replenishing my cash every few days whenever I happen to pass a bank ATM in other words, I don't wait and be forced to find an ATM before my cash is depleted. I look at my cash situation from day to day and decide whether I need to stop at an ATM that day. I usually do so when my walkin'-around money is down to about a day's worth.

Robespierre,

You probably do as I did when in Sarlat and passed an ATM machine and decided to see if it worked. When passing one and it is convenient.

I think whatever works best for each is the way to go. None, is the ONLY way.....

Joan

Before we left on our trip last year to Scotland we phoned our bank and asked them to get us about 500 pounds in small denominations (because of our type of account we were not charged any fees). I took half and DH had the other half so in case one of us was robbed or lost our wallets we would still have some cash. About a week later we passed an ATM and got out more cash--didn't purposely look for it. We were going to be driving for the next 2 weeks and weren't sure when we would come across another ATM. Most of our trip we used our VISA and the odd time were able to use our debit card and in the end we had money left over so we just took it back to the bank for exchange. The Banks don't take coins back so this trip we will make sure we spend the coins as well as the bills. We will probably do the same thing before we leave on our trip to Paris.
When I went to Singapore last year I stopped at a foreign exchange kiosk that is in a local shopping centre here and got a few hundred dollars out--they charged a fee but if I returned anything of it I could get the fee back. In Singapore I used the ATMs all the time. I didn't have to worry about exchanging the money when I got back as my son who I stayed with, got the leftovers!

Thanks for all the advice. Certainly very helpful.

ssanders, I applied for a Capital One card just for the reason you described-to avoid that 3% foreign currency fee. I hope it get it in time.

I plan to use the ATM card for our cash out there. Hope it works!

Thanks again!!

You will appreciate the CapOne card. It should only take about a week to receive it...unless they have changed.

Do be sure that you call them and any other credit cards and your bank ATM card before leaving. You need to give them the dates of your trip and the countries where you will be travelling. If you don't do this, they may block your card the first time you use it.

It really doesn't hurt to call them twice, as they sometimes fail to note the details on your card.

Enjoy your trip...

Joan

StCirq...

I agree that one shouldn't carry "lots of cash", but a hundred bucks or so as backup cash (~50 for me and ~50 for my wife) makes sense to me. I do that even when I travel in the US.

SS

"because of our type of account we were not charged any fees" But you probably WERE charged an exorbitant exchange rate. And selling the currency back to the bank means you lost on the exchange again.

People who take lots of cash are not only wasting money, they have the added security issue of protecting that much currency.

So for those of you who think this is a good idea -- that is fine it is your money after all and you can do what you want w/ it. But please don't recommend it to others. They might follow your advice and that would be a real shame IMO.

janisj

Please note that I did not recommend it to anyone. If you noticed I purposely said that it was MY way of doing it...for many, many years and the way I will continue to do it.

Hard for me to believe that there are people who think that their way is the only way to do things. For me, where you stay, where you eat, how you spend your money is certainly not the business of anyone else. To each his own! It is not even nice to criticize someone because they do not agree with you. That is rude. People want to know how others do things, where they stay and where they eat. All kinds of different ways and thoughts about it all. Then let them make their own decisions on how they want to do it.....their way, their choice!

To simplify, fi I can travel and am able to manage my cash the same way tht I do at home, why not? I travel to the USA regularly, both for holidays and work, I would never think of buying a bunch of $USD before going, just as I expect no one coming to Canada would either. So why would Europe be any different?

I was in Ghana in 2005. In that case with the lack of bank branches especially ones to do currency exchanges, no ATMs, no CC network, it made sense for me to carry around hundreds of thousands of Cedis. In Turkey during 2007, I brought some euros and US$, couple of hundred of each. I had not researched at all the "financial system" of the country. In the end, used ATMs and CCs.

Carrying large amounts of cash would, to me, seem riskier, especially since I probably look like a tourist. Next year I may be going to South Africa, I'm thinking carrying cash there would be...unwise.

gracejoan - Somehow you ignored the OP's question.
"Is the best way to get euros in France by going to an ATM machine and just get Euros out of them?"

The best way, of course, it to use the ATM's which are on every street corner these days.

Note the OP didn't ask how you got your own money or how you personally choose to spend your own money. The OP asked the "best way" to exchange.

Michel_Paris -- no need to carry cash to South Africa. There are ATMs everywhere.

Oh yes, and I was mugged when I went there.

As in many questions asked by people..we do stray away from the primary question asked. I think the OP received a large variety of information..even to mugging in S Africa!

The important thing is that they have been able to sort it all out and to make their own decisions for their trip planning.

Have a good trip...

Joan

Kerouac, I will pick your mind at some time. There is move afoot to plan a trip to the World Cup, seeing some games in Durban. Need to buy game tickets soon. I have an image of SA that is...needing some input

janisj--no we were not charged an exhorbitant exchange rate! It was the going rate-nothing added. And selling it back to the bank we actually came out ahead a little. Why would I be wasting money taking cash? It doesn't take any more effort to safeguard this money in my purse than it does to safeguard our other possessions that we are carrying about. Cash in hand or something billed to my Visa was the same amount for us.
I'm not recommending this to anyone or telling them that this is the way that they have to travel, just that this is how my husband and I chose to do it. What shame would there be if they did follow what we did? All I did was relate our own personal experience on this particular subject.

decee: The bank doesn't "add" anything. They charge a different rate. Yes a "going rate" -- just not THE going rate. What rate did they charge you per £ and about when was it?

For various reasons, I have had dealings w/ many different banks re foreign currency and have yet to find one that charged the official rate. Say the day's "going rate" is $1.60 - then most banks will charge between £1.67 and £1.71 - but to the customer it looks like there are no fees.

oops - wrong symbol . . . . . will charge between $1.67 and $1.71 per £ . . . .

decee,

I don't get it, either. What possible difference could it make!

Joan

There is the official exchange rate in the newspaper, then there is the bank rate at your local branch, which seems to be ~5% more last time I checked. The "going rate" is the rate they charge you and make money.

As with all currency transcations, fees and exchange rates are where the businesses make money. In bank's case, no fees but worse (i.e. more than what they pay to get it) exchange rate.

decree: The only way you could come out ahead selling back is IF the $ - £ exchange rate changed a lot in the interim. For instance in early April the £ was very low against the $ but by May the £ had climbed about 13¢ so selling back would mean making a cent or two per £.

Banks use different buy and sell rates so normally you lose on BOTH ends of the transaction.

Always use an ATM at your destination. When you arrive at your destination airport, go the ATM and withdraw as much as you can to avoid multiple ATM and conversion fees. Carry around as much as you feel comfortable with and put the rest in the hotel safe.

The ATM fees are much cheaper than converting USD to Euros at banks or currency exchange offices.

Should have added.... use you ATM debit card, not a credit card at an ATM. Also, if you use an international bank at home such as Chase or Citibank, you will avoid ATM withdrawal fees if you use that bank in Europe.

This is the way I see it: For banks that handle foreign currency, that cash is inventory that requires humans to handle, safeguard, and dispense, and space to store it. The banks sell this inventory at a markup to cover the handling expenses. No one should expect to buy that inventory at a price that would result in a loss for the bank, so the bank's rate for cash will necessarily be higher than the cost of getting local currency (pounds, euros, whatever) from an ATM where the entire transaction (as far as the US bank is concerned) is completed electronically.

yes, kayd -- simple concept isn't it

Janisj
We all know that banks are in business to make money. There is the official exchange rate and the rate the bank charges. I don't know why you think that I am being ripped off--I know that to buy a foreign currency that I will be charged an exchange rate that my particular bank charges--the price of doing business so to speak. I paid the exchange rate that was posted by my bank and nothing else.
If I wanted to spend forever time trying to find a bank that doesn't make money doing this type of transaction then I wouldn't have time to take a trip.

decee: The point is -- NO bank will give you a good rate. None. Buying currency is expensive and totally unnecessary in the vast majority of cases.

You posted that you were not charged any fees and I was just saying you they got their "fees" through the exchange rate they charged you. Which is just money down the drain IMO. But it is your money . . . .

decee,

I think it is pointless...janisj prefers to use ATM's..she says that is the best way..what she forgets to say is that it is the best way for her! It is definitely not the best way for me and it evidently was not the best way for you for your last trip. She can only speak for herself.

Whatever I pay to take my euros with me is for my convenience and I am the only one that I have to satisfy for that. The same for you. Yes, it is our money to spend as we please, and for her to do the same. That way we are all happy. Why not drop it. The OP has found out what they want to do.

Joan

gracejoan,
cap one said it will take 3 weeks to get the card. That's a long time. I need extra cards too, they won't send extra cards yet. I did call the other credit cards to notify them. Cap one won't let me do anything til they send out the first card.

Sorry to cause such a heated argument. I did learn both sides of the coin though-thanks!!

I just found out the VIP apts don't have a safe in the apt. I was planning on keeping important stuff in there. With no safe, do you recommend just getting euros from ATM as we need them?

That's too bad about it taking so long to get the cards. It is probably the time of the year. They definitely told you that you won't have them in time for your trip? Try getting to a supervisor and maybe you will get one who will get something to happen for you.

Don't worry about what sometimes goes on within the discussions. Some just think their way is the only way.

I guess you will be using the ATM machines more than you wanted to. Yes, they are probably the way for you to go for most of the time.

Not sure about the security in the VIP apartments. The apts. that I stay in do have safes, but I never use them. Never felt it necessary with them.

Split up whatever cash you have..taking with you or from ATM's. Don't carry it all in one place.

I have never had a problem of any kind. Just use some good common sense about things and you will be OK.

Good luck with the CapOne cards...

Joan

decee - You don't seem to understand the exchange rates and how they work. If you go to bank in the US and get money, you will pay whatever rate that bank decides to charge which is generally 7-10% (or more if they so decide plus sometimes a transaction fee in addition)above the interbank rate that day. If you go to an ATM in Europe, you will get the actual interbank rate plus 1-3% depending you your type of ATM card. You are overpaying 7-9% to get money from the US bank. It's fine if you want to overpay, but most people don't want to waste money that way.

If the interbank rate is $1 = .72€ (this minutes current rate) your bank rate will be around $1 = .65€ (or worse). Additionally, they tack on fees for exchanging smaller amounts on top of giving you the lousy exchange rate. If you were to exchange $1000 at an ATM in Europe you would get $720, but if you exchanged at the bank in the US you would only get $650 (or less). A loss of $69. As janis said, no bank in the US will give you a good rate. Just doesn't happen.

Joan,
I did ask the Cap one people if they could expedite the cards. She said no. I didn't ask for a supervisor though.

Robespierre, you posted useful rules for spotting and dealing with DCC. But shouldn'nt step 3 read:

3. If it's in US Dollars, ask for the merchant to re-run the charge in the local currency. Go to 1 (but only once).

disneymania4444..

It might not hurt to call and ask to speak with a supervisor. You never know what you might get..from very helpful to not wanting to give you the time of day! How much time do you have before leaving?

Joan

Disneymania, I hope you have a wonderful trip and all goes well for you!!!

3. If it's in US Dollars, ask for the merchant to re-run the charge in USD. Go to 1 (but only once).

Robes, just to clarify:

Did you mean local currency?

Thanks.

KY, a good description

What we are trying to do here, kind people that we are, is to show people options, and identify those that are: cheaper and mroe convenient. Having options allows people to choose what suits them best. But..a big but...we should be clear on what the pros and cons are for each option. Correcting fuzzy or wrong information is just one way to allow for choosing the proper option.

Hey, I've used Amex TCs, bought tons of euros before going, even bought US$ (I'm Canadian) and brought all that over. But time and experience has changed how I now handle currency.

That was my interpretation of Robes's steps also. Very helpful feedback to help us to make an informed decision. Thanks to all!

Your Canadian readers should be wary of the Capitol One MasterCard, frequently recommended on other travel forums as well as this one. While I am a fan of Capitol One, the company does charge a foreign exchange fee on its cards issued in Canada. Currently the rate is 2.5 per cent. As well, international purchases are converted into US dollars first, and then converted again into Canadian. Any conversion will cost the customer something -- financial institutions make their profit from selling currencies at a higher rate than they purchased the money. CapOne is competitive with other Canadian credit cards, but not a bargain.

That's too bad that you don't have the same CapOne benefits in Canada that we have in the US.

You may have to do some searching to see if there is another one that is best for Canadian users.

Joan

My system for a trip of approx 1 week(may not be appropriate for everyone):

(a) Bring about 75-100 Euro in cash (left over from previous trip) in case there is a problem at the airport...split evenly between my wife and me.

(b) At the airport, get another 300 Euro with my credit union ATM card (very small surcharge) for use during the trip where only cash is accepted.

(c) Use my CapOne credit card (good rate, no surcharges) everywhere a credit card is accepted. NOTE: Every place I've charged in Paris, the numbers are in Euros, so I can't comment on DCC.

(d) Get more cash if needed during the trip and be sure to carry home about 75-100 Euros for my next trip.

NOTE: If there is a significant hotel discount for cash, I use the ATM for that.

Hope this helps. Forgive me if there is some repetition from an earlier post of mine, but I wanted to summarize my system.

SS

Yes, step 3 should read re-run the charge in local currency. I guess my latest chemo treatment took out that part of my cognitive ability. Temporarily, I hope. Thanks all for the heads-out.

Interesting about the Cap One and Canada. Wasn't aware of that.

ssander,
Thanks for the succinct review.

Robes,
Good luck with your treatments and thanks for the correction.

as some more useless(ful?) information, I just did a wire transfer to Spain and was charged an exchange rate of 1.6614, while XE.com says the exchange rate is 1.63017. So it would seem that the customer rate for wire transfers is a 1.9% mark-up over the interbank rate, and then the charges for the wire transfer itself.

Best wishes RP.

It is not rude to point out that it's ridiculous to pay a local bank a 7-10% markup and foolish to travel with large amounts of cash.

There's a big difference between staying in a posh apartment with a safe, keeping mostly to the local neighborhood, using a private car service, as opposed to using public transportation to/from CDG and all over Paris day and night and visiting all the touristy destinations where it's just not a good idea to carry a lot of cash, especially in a wallet or purse.

Robes, I was pretty certain that was what you meant, but I just wanted to be 100% certain. I made the adjustment to my word document and added it to my Trip Portfolio. Thanks for the advice. I hope you are feeling better very soon.

Semi-exciting event for me in Canada...my new CC has the "chip"...and it worked in London. Call me a techno-leader

djkbooks,

What may seem foolish or ridiculous to one person, may be exactly the way another person prefers to do it. To criticize because you feel differently I do think is rude. Think as you wish, but do it in silence. That is the way I was brought up.

For me, I do not use ATM's as IS the most common way that others do, but not my preferred way. It is very simple for me to get the euros before going and the fee is small for the small amount that I take, and well worth it to me. I really never take large amounts of cash. Probably only 600-700 euros for my stays of at least a month. My credit cards take care of everything. In fact, I always have excess cash to get rid of in the last week. I like to return home with about 100 euros.

My apartments do have safes, but I don't use them. I never carry all the cash or all the credit cards with me at any one time.

I prefer the bus for transportation. I use the Navigo Decouverte. It is great. I do use private transportation to/from the airport for 40 euros each way. They are waiting for me when I arrive with my name on a sign.

I have been there, done that, with many of the peopular tourist attractions, so probably do not go to them. I do keep very busy all over Paris, walking, bus mainly and use the metro as little as possible. Rarely do I take a taxi. That has been several years.

So, you see, there are so many ways to do things and so many choices that we each can make. Whatever makes one happy is the way they should do it. Each of us thinks their way is the best, and it is the best for each of us.

I would never consider telling another that they were foolish or ridiculous because they did not do something the way that I considered the best, because I am only doing what is best for me, not for them! I don't know why all don't look at it in the same way.

Joan

gracejoan: exactly - You don't visit/stay the sorts of places most first timers do. So to even suggest they should handle their money the same way you do is not that helpful. In fact it could be downright harmful.

"Think as you wish, but do it in silence. " Nope - that is what these forums are for. If someone is giving iffy/bad/terrible (or anywhere along that scale) advice it is our right (and responsibility) to say so.

What you choose to do works for you -- but IMO and the opinion of 90+% of the folks posting here - it would be a BIG mistake for most travelers.

Yes - sheep seem to hold all sorts of fascination for colonial visitors. Most folks I've taken on trips (not SCQ btw) have taken lots of photos of the sheep. And if it was lamb season -- scores of photos. Maybe some Welsh blood in there somewhere

My very first morning on my own when I moved to England (a wet/cold January day) a ram broke through the fence and led his entire harem into my (rented) back garden. Me a city girl from CA had not met up w/ roaming sheeps before and had no idea rams are mean. Well I can testify!

I did get them out of the garden but not before getting drenched, angering that ram and scaring the living daylights myself. Oh but the babies ARE cute . . . .

oops - that last ended up on the wrong thread Can I blame it on Fodors being "twitchy today . . . .

janisj,

I know a great many posters on Fodor's who are long timers..not first timers...some old-timers, too!

I never suggested to anyone to handle their money as I do..in fact, just the opposite if you read what was said..."For me, I do not use ATM's as IS the most common way that others do, but not my preferred way"...that is what I said that ATM's were the most common way, but not my preferred way. That is most certainly not saying to do it my way!!

I do know a great many people who pretty well do things as I do..people who enjoy staying, dining etc. in the same kind of places....we all find one another. I seem to have found a great many people who have become great travel friends because of our shared interests.

I also have a large number who ask me for advice and information on lodging, restaurants etc. I had a nice email from someone re the insurance posting that I made and asking for more info. I'm helping several others in their planning, too. I helped some locals with their 2 children and in-laws with what turned out to be a super trip during school break this year. I supply information, but force them to make their own decisions on most things. I want it to be their trip, not mine!

I read a lot of things given to first timers from those who are practically first timers themselves and I'm sure it is not very good advice.

Yes, I do what works best for me and feel it is the only way it should be for everyone. I seem to share a great deal in common with a large number of travel friends along with a growing list of French friends. I am very grateful for the friendships that we share.

Enjoy your trip planning...

Joan

In the scheme of things, the cost differential between obtaining foreign currency at home vs an ATM overseas is a few glasses of wine. Let it go people!

So I learned something today. If I use an ATM on my trip to France I will only be charged the interbank rate + 1-3%. If I purchase euros from my bank before I leave I will be charged much more than the interbank rate. Am I getting this right? So when I get to my rented Nice apt. and have to pay a large amount immediately to get the keys I should get the money from an ATM? I know that there is a limit on how much I can take out but there are 3 of us and we can each do it. Where do I check the interbank rates? I had to send a bank wire transfer today and had to pay 1.675. + $30.00 - ouch!

www.xe.com

The limits are set both by your bank and the French bank and of course it's the lower one you have to worry about...it may be as little as $300 (not €300)

This thread, wow!

One of the cheapest ways to send money overseas is via bank draft. Essentially it is a "certified" cheque in that the bank guarantees the amount (taken out of your account), is denominated in the receiver's local currency, and does not cost anything to deposit (although I have been told that French banks charge for any cheque deposit?). And, if anything ever happens (lost) you can recover your money.
Exchange rates as per my above post, and the cost of the draft is $6 for me.

Thanks for all your input.

GraceJoan - I was not being critical at all, only pointing out that it's foolish (makes no sense) to pay a 7-10% markup for foreign currency when there are ATM's everywhere. There was an ATM right under the windows of our ParisPerfect apartment.

Rather than "get rid of" all that "extra currency" your last week, it would be more prudent to hold onto it for your next trip - don't you think?

djkbooks...

Yes, since the Euro is used in so many countries, that's what we do...save some for the next trip.

SS

djkbooks:

Joan stated that she always comes home with at least 100 euro.

This whole thing is so ridiculous. If the little bit that I spend on my euros in advance will affect my trip budget, I just better not plan a trip! You may spend money on things that I would consider foolish for me to be spending on..so what, who cares! I certainly don't.

If someone asks what is the best way to do something..there is no best that could be for everyone. If they ask for cheapest..that might be able to be given...if they ask what options..that opens the door for a great deal.

You could run this into the ground...I get a 15 euro discount each way on my to/from airport transportation! Some would say cheaper to take some metro/bus or something. I stay in nice apts...some would say a hostel is cheaper. Look at the difference in deciding to have lunch at Les Cocottes or l'Obe in the Crillon..ah, but because I am a good customer I receive free Taittainger champagne (menu price 24euros), free sides and I am asked if I would like a 2nd dessert!. Do I add these as a plus to all my savings? Or should I eat at McDonalds? Laughing, yet? This could go on and on!

If someone wants to take a trip to see how little they can spend..that is their choice. It would not be for me. I know roughly what a trip is going to cost me. Obviously I know the air and lodging in advance..the rest will be entirely the way it plays out. Just a choice of dining in a day can make a big difference...simple or starred!

I think as weekender suggested..it might be time to drop all this. We should all do things as we like to do them, be happy with the way you travel. Try to help others by passing on all sorts of information for them to decide what is best for them.

Enjoy your trip planning...

Joan

For those concerned about the ATMs in your arrival airport not working for some reason: If the ATMs should all be out of order or out of money or whatever (we've never had that happen to us, but I guess it is possible), just carry a couple of hundred dollars along with you and exchange it at the bank or exchange booth in your arrival airport. In our experience, the rate will not be as good as the foreign airport ATM would give, but it will be better than what you can get at home.

All good things to keep in mind. Thanks!

gracejoan3 would I be able to email you privately? Or is this not something that is done on this forum.
Denise

Sure decee..use my travel mail address:

abbynoelle3@yahoo.com

Joan

Clark Howard was giving his best travel tips this morning. One was on exchanging money. He said NEVER EVER get money in the US as the rates everywhere in the US were terrible. He said get your money at the ATM's after you arrive.

Good to know. I'm just hoping the ATM's don't eat our card or anything like that.

If you take ATM cards for accounts at two different banks plus two widely accepted credit cards, keeping the spares someplace separate from the primaries, you'd be covered for just about any eventuality.

Of course it is possible for the ATMs to not work or be unavailable, I've had that happen at least twice on my travels to major international airports. I always carry several hundred dollars in cash on me, anyway (my own currency), and I take some USD travelers checks as emergency backup as I get them free from my bank (don't someone try to get into about how they aren't free, they are absolutely free if you get them in USD, not euro). If I don't use them, I just spend them at the grocery store or put them in the bank at home when I return, so they cost me nothing.

And you can exchange cash or TCs at airport exchange bureaus, they all do that, so that is my backup now. I do always have extra euro on me from former trips, but when I got to other countries with other currencies, I don't worry about getting their cash ahead like I used to. Airport exchange bureaus usually do have a hefty markup, but sometimes it isn't that bad, fine in an emergency (at CDG, it is only around 10 pct, as I recall, which isn't bad for an airport). Prague airport is another one with rather reasonable exchange bureau fees (less than at CDG).