We haven't had any ATM transactions rejected due to the existence of a chip, but we typically have a backup credit card with one just in case.

Hint: Make sure that you let your bank know your dates and locations of travel prior to departure so that they do not place a security hold on your card.

Most banks will re-issue your card with a chip if you ask.

Most banks will re-issue your card with a chip if you ask. ??

Really? I cannot find one US bank that is presently issuing chip enabled cards to individuals. I have checked with US Bank, Capital One, Bank of A, Wells Fargo and none have them. What bank do you know that has these cards?

Buying that tickets at train stations is a pain, but I've had no problems at ATMs.

I work for the airlines and fly internationally everyweek. I just got a Visa card from CHASE bank with a chip and it has worked out great! My own airline credit union doesn't offer a chip in a card?

Have used ATMs all over Europe using our card with no chip. Have had problems only at automated gas stations, toll booths, ticket machines, etc. Never been refused at a restaurant or large retail store in a major city. Smaller shops in smaller villages might require cash or a chip and pin card. American Express isn't widely accepted except in upscale shops/restaurants/hotels.

I've never had any issues with ATMs. The chip thing is a wildly overblown "issue" IMO.

dutyfree - which specific card is it; is it a debit or credit card? Thanks.

There have been reports that in some countries, plans are a foot to restrict even the use of ATM's to chip cards; whether any such pans are operational is another story. I'm not sure it has occurred anywhere.....yet. But pressure is mounting.

Several of the Chase cards can be requested with a chip; almost always the cards with high annual fees and the dreaded 3% rip off foreign currency surcharge (some exceptions). The same holds true for some Citibank cdredit cards. Most of the AA credit caqrds do have chips available but again for the most part unless there is an asininely high annual fee (as much as $450), they all come with the near criminal foreign transaction surcharges.

All these cards are chip and signature. I had my AA mc re-issued as a chip and signature card and can report it did work in the UK...but the caveat here is that all the places I tried it took the antiquated American magnetic strip card anyway. On one of the blogs, a suggestion was made for a credut union called Andrews Federal Credit Union which apparently is issuing a non fee chip and pin card but has a 1% foreign transaction fee.

Is this business about chip credit cards overblown? Perhaps it is today, but if you need petrol on a Sunday in France, you might not think so. We've had this debate before here. Whether the emv chip used by many of the European countries is the best is hardly the question anymore. Travelgourmet has made the point the Danish cards don't work in the rest of Europe, for example, yet from what I've read all the Danish cards will be replaced during 2012 by emv cards compatible with most of the rest of Europe.

The Netherlands has become a royal pain in the you know what. You cannot buy train tickets without a chip card either at the automatic machines or at the ticket windows (big signs say so)...whether the cards being issued by Chase, Ctibank, US Bank which are chip and signature, not chip and pin, I can't tell you.

Visa/MC have finallyu woken up to the growing problem instead of burying their heads in the sand with inane comments such as well merchants are required to accept all visa/mc cards, even with the magnetic strips. Tell that to the Dutch National railways and get laughed at.

So....more and more problems are arising. I hope we don't wake up one day and find out the eu has banned the use of all magnetic strip cards...but it's coming.

No such plans are operational at this time. The chip and pin system has nothing whatsoever to do with ATM withdrawals. It's a security system for other kinds of transactions.

If you really desperately want a chip and pin card, Travelex sells one. You load money onto the card, and there is no fee to use it in machines or to withdraw funds, but the exchange rate is particularly bad (you end up losing about 18% on the transaction). But it is convenient if you plan on doing any driving or need to use automated ticketing machines often.

...the key word in the above beng at this time. But there are plans afoot to do this whether it is in the near uture or 5 years down the line.

My Canadian VISA and three ATM cards from three dirrent banks all have Chip's now. More and more store/restauratns are accepting chips.

My one 'wonderment' story was being at a small beach resort in Zanzibar Africa and could not pay with VISA because their machine only took Chip'ed cards, and I had forgetten my code

Yes, the code is preset and cannot be changed, so you do need to memorize it.

Since posting above, I have found that there is a credit union that has a true chip and pin card and you can apply online. It has no annual fee either! As I just filled out an application online, I have no idea how arduous this task will be; will post back.
-----
http://www.andrewsfcu.org/globetrek
http://www.andrewsfcu.org/page.php?page=554

None of my chip and pin (all 7 of them) have set codes that I cannot change. You can change them in the UK at any associated bank machine.

I was referring to the above card; sorry for the confusion.

The Netherlands has become a royal pain in the you know what. You cannot buy train tickets without a chip card either at the automatic machines or at the ticket windows (big signs say so)

I'm about 99% sure that you cannot buy a ticket from the machines in the Netherlands with ANY credit card. They only accept a local Dutch debit card standard. This is also the case for all ticket windows, except at Amsterdam Centraal and Schiphol.

There have been reports that in some countries, plans are a foot to restrict even the use of ATM's to chip cards;

Which countries, exactly? Links to such discussions would also be nice.

No offense, but I think you are overly dramatic about this.

Follow up: I was approved in about 15 minutes. I have to open a savings account for $5 and had to join a credit union association first [which was free]. Then I do a few things via email and the card should be sent. So far, so good.

Its an ATM with no foreign fees DebitNM.

OK, that's what I thought. I had no trouble using my regular ATM card from Cap One in Europe.

Deb - the webiste says it's a Visa credit card. I am excited to hear that it is a chip and pin card. Will you please report back after getting the account open? This will be a great help all over Europe when trying to pay for anything with a credit card. Thanks!

I will report back. I plan on calling tomorrow and asking about fees etc.

1% FOREIGN TRANSACTION FEE......NO ANNUAL FEE.

Question for Dutyfree,

You say your Chase chip card has worked fine but you don't say what kind of transactions you have made. The key question is does it work in French train station ticket machines and service stations. I particularly would like one that works in French train stations. Until someone has successfully bought a train ticket in France with an AMERICAN chip/pin card I won't believe such a card exists from an AMERICAN bank. I was assured by AE that their AE Blue Card with chip would work only to get one, find out they lied and then having to cancel the account.

XYZ is correct; there is a 1% foreign transaction fee but no fee charged by Andrews FCU for foreign transactions and no annual fee. The rep I talked said that the feedback from members [military in Europe] have indicated that the cards works as true CHIP and PIN.

So, I will use my Cap One no fee debit and credit cards where ever possible and this card for unmanned kiosks.

Hope this helps.

Deb

The Andrews FCU card sounds very interesting.
I'll be anxious to hear about your experience with it.

The Andrews card is relatively new but there is really no reason it should not work as it is indeed chip and pin.

Some of the other banks, Chase, Citi, US Bank for the past few months have been offering chip and signature cards (Why they didn't want to go the whole way is beyond my comprehension but that's the direction they chose to go in). There have been very mixed reports concerning some of these cards especially in the unmanned or unwomanned places. They do seem to work on RATP and SNCF automated machines, on the whole they have been problematic with the gas stations. This is where it stands today. Tomorrow? Who knows?

Travelex offers a chip and pin card, but it's got a horrible exchange rate (really bad) to load. But no fees to spend.

It seems that there is a misunderstanding at to what CHIP and PIN really is about. A TRUE CHIP and PIN does not require a signature. It is put into a reader, a PIN is then entered by cardholder and the transaction is complete.

Most of the card that say they are CHIP cards, may have a PIN to use with it, but ultimately the transaction HAS to have a signature to complete. Very different things.

This link shows the various cards and if the require a signature. And also note, that many of the cards either are for commercial accounts or if they are for individuals, have [high]annual fees. Buyer beware when searching for cards.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0Ani-u3tGk5hedGRvcE1ELVg5UmlGZk01SHZvTUMxdUE#gid=0

Debit -- Did they say how long it would take to receive it? Thanks!

As OP tagged this thread Netherlands and Belgium, one should bear in mind that (railway) ticket machines neither in NL nor in BE take any sort of credit card, chipped or not.
You either book, pay by CC, and print out ticket at home (for any connection in BE) or simply use the staffed ticket counter (NL, BE).

Local transport vending machines in Brussels take (only chipped) CCs. But at almost any station there is also a staffed desk for manual cash transactions, and all the machines also take cash/coins (usually a sufficient solution as it will only be a few euros).

ATMs take any CC/DC as long as one of the logos they sport matches your card's.
Merchants or restaurants will take chip'ed or non-chip'ed cards as well.
The only item I cannot verify is gas stations after hours.
You can hardly do THAT much driving in either country to run out of gas by accident at 3am in the morning. You would be in another country by then anyway

So in NL or BE the issue is a non-issue and not worth to get another CC.

Great table.....but as you can see, at this point in time there doesn't seem to be a chip and pin credit cardwith the correct foreign transaction fee which should be $0 alathough when it shows a 1% foreign transaction fee, they are just passing along the visa/mc fee which I suppose is justified as they do the actual currency exchange and do assume a risk of currency fluctuations which is the only possible justification for this fee.

It's kind of idiotic for both Chase and Citi (US Bank also has some chip and signature cards that I don't remember if they were listed after taking a quick glance at the table)...they are evidently better than not having a chip but still the jury is out on how many of the unmanned or unwomanned kiosks will take them in some places.

As noted with chip and pin, you insert the card into the reader yourself (no more running to a back room where god only knows what can happen) and while the card is in the reader you will be prompted for a pin. You enter it and the transaction will be completed and you get a receipt. With chip and signature, you insert the card and it ithen prints a receipt which you sign in the same way you would sign a swiped transaction say at Walmart's in the USA. In those cases say in the Lonon tube where you use a machine, no signature is required but then again the London tube machines I have used do take the antiquated American magnetic strip cards anyway and don't require a signature (just like when buying gasoline in the USA at a self service station, no signature is required.

It's a whole new world out there, that's for sure.

Just to be clear, chip and signature isn't really sufficient (i.e., better than nothing). You can't use a chip and signature card in most automated ticketing machines, in most automated gas pumps, or to pay most unattended tolls. Those are the three main uses. In most other places (with some exceptions), regular credit cards are still accepted.

The best course is just to make do with the system we have. Take cash out of an ATM (absolutely no problems there), and use your regular U.S. credit card for large purchases, to rent cars, and to pay for hotel rooms. The difficulty may be in some restaurants and small shops, but I've personally never had problems, though I know a lot of people have.

In many places you can buy train tickets from travel agents, which will save you a trip to the train station and help you get the best deal (I've done this quite successfully in both France and Italy).

Thank you Doug

A lot of people do buy those Travelex pre-paid chip and pin cards (you can get them at booths in most international airports ... just look for the signs or stop at the Travelex exchange booth to ask). It might be worth paying $20 to put $100 on a card just so you can use them for tickets, tolls, etc.

To me, it's a huge hassle to apply for a brand-new credit card, and it affects your credit rating. The Travelex card, when considered solely as a travel convenience tool, is worthwhile.

Citi has one. Unsolicited, they sent me a new card for my MasterCard account with the claim that it was the first/only card with a chip available in the U.S.

And I have been able to use it on European sites for which my other cards have not worked (e.g. Trenitalia).

wayfinder....if you used the card online for trenitalia, it wouldn't know it's a chip card and not a magnetic strip card so I assume it was just your lucky day that it worked (not trying to be negative am I). If you're in Italy, tyhat's another story. However, they were not the first.

No, they didn't say how long it would take. I will post when it gets here.

I think there is much confusion here [and pretty much on all discussions on this topic] between a card that simply has a chip in it and requires a signature and one that is a TRUE chip and pin that does not require a signature and that only leads to more confusion about these cards. And using a chipped card for an online transaction is really no different than using a card without a chip, since you don't enter pin or sign for online transactions.

As I mentioned in my earlier post, the US Bank card I used in France last fall worked both as a chip and signature card and as a chip and PIN card not requiring a signature. It also works as a swipe and signature card. It worked in every automated ticketing machine we tried, and at some unattended toll booths with neither signature nor PIN. It never worked in a fuel pump, but others have reported that even some chip and PIN cards from European countries other than France don't work in those.

Much needs to be done to make credit card transactions easier across national boundaries, but for now I am glad to have this card that works well a lot of the time.

DebitNM - Sorry, I'm just getting back to this post! The bank with our chipped cards is RBC. Now, our is the US RBC, but it may be that because it is (was) RBC, that's why we have the chip. Now that it's converting over to PNC, I'll let you know!

Much needs to be done to make credit card transactions easier across national boundaries, but for now I am glad to have this card that works well a lot of the time.

I agree much needs to be done. That is why I suggest letting the European market settle on a standard before considering whether to adopt it. Many of the problems being reported have little to do with chip vs strip.

The reality is that much of the problem comes from a highly fragmented European market, but I do recognize the appeal of blaming the "backwards" US for those predisposed to that sort of thinking.

I missed reporting back, I got the card within 10 days of applying. I applied on a Thursday and that meant 2 weekends, as I got the card on a Monday.

What highly fragmented European market?
All EU credit cards are chip and pin cards which work in all other EU countries and other European countries. We have no problem using our Chip and Pin CC in any other European country as a chip and pin card.

Our debit card is also chip and pin and the Netherlands and most other European countries now only accept chip and pin debit cards for payments in shops etc. We had no problems using our debit card in Norway using it as a chip and pin card.

Soon Dutch banks will be issuing debit/ATM cards with no magnetic strip on them only a chip.
For trips outside the EU (read the US) we will have to apply for a separate debit/ATM card with a magnetic strip on it.

Reading the recent thread about pickpocketing in Rome, I did wonder if U.S. credit cards are more attractive to thieves, as they can be easily used without the accompanying PIN.

I have read that theft of cards In European countries is only common when the thief has already identified the accompanying PIN, perhaps by observing a transaction.

All EU credit cards are chip and pin cards which work in all other EU countries and other European countries.

Not true.

In Belgium at least, the banks are aggressively moving away from cards that make use of the magnetic strip. So I have the opposite problem when traveling. My cards don't work on devices that don't support the chip and pin.

Even online within Belgium, it is becoming more and more common that you need a digi-pass reader that requires you input your pin code to complete a purchase with your credit card.

Businesses that still use legacy devices will still support the magnetic strip, but as they get replaced over time, they probably also will only support the chip and pin.

One option is to get a prepaid credit card. Most can be ordered online, but you can also purchase them at any post office here without hassle. While you are there, you can transfer your money directly on to the card in cash and start using it immediately. The whole process takes less than ten minutes.
You can always refill it later either online via another CC, a bank transfer, or in cash at the post office.

The eu has been pushing for a uniform emv chip throughout the eu; whether that's reached fruition I cannot say. Travelgourmet constantly points out a Danish card seems to be on a different system although from what I've read, the push is on to make it uniform within the eu.

Is the hype overblown? Perhaps not today but more and more businesses are no longer accepting magnetic strip cards. Try buying a train ticket in the Netherlands without a chip card as an example. For the most part, right now, ATM's are not affected but you never know.

The good news is that visa and mastercard have finally come to the realization that too many of their American customers are being put at a disadvantage, more and more every month and are pushing for US banks to begin issuing chip and pin cards. Some banks issue a chip and signature card and reports are mixed. I have gotten my Andrews FCU card and will be tgesting it out the next trip to Europe.

Since reading this correspondence, I have started looking more closely at the card readers commonly used in shops in the U.K. I would say that 2/3rds of them will only accept chip and pin cards. They have no facility to accept cards with a magnetic strip.

I am sure that some of the shops may have a card reader for magnetic stripe cards, even if most of the readers only accept chip & pin. I am also confident that hotels, restaurants, and places which serve a large number of foreign tourists will have dual readers or know how to get round the problem. However, self-service machines for transport tickets, car parks and similar will only accept chip & pin.

Since reading this correspondence, I have started looking more closely at the card readers commonly used in shops in the U.K. I would say that 2/3rds of them will only accept chip and pin cards. They have no facility to accept cards with a magnetic strip.

Look more closely. It doesn't look like a card will fit, but there is a gap on one side of the readers where the card swipes (usually the trim around the screen looks slightly different on one side). I have NEVER had a problem using a swipe card in the UK, and I am in London as frequently as every month and give the card (even <gasp> my AMEX!) a major workout while I am there.

However, self-service machines for transport tickets, car parks and similar will only accept chip & pin.

Not true, at least to the extent both the HEX and the tube constitute transport tickets. Or maybe the US cards I used last weekend for both have a hidden chip and a mystery PIN I don't know about? Can't speak to UK car parks.

The eu has been pushing for a uniform emv chip throughout the eu; whether that's reached fruition I cannot say.

Even if they get the technology aligned, there is still the issue of disparate networks. The famous troubles with purchasing tickets for Dutch trains, for example, is because they only accept the local Dutch debit card network. The same is true of many, if not most, Danish train ticket machines (as well as many shops). And I've seen several grocery stores in Germany that only accept local standards. In most cases it isn't the lack of a chip that is the primary problem, sorry.

Try buying a train ticket in the Netherlands without a chip card as an example.

See above.

I know my position isn't popular with the "the US is too stubborn" crowd but, as someone with cards from 3 different countries (US, Switzerland, Denmark) and who travels a lot across Europe and elsewhere, I'd like to think that I have more than a passing familiarity with the actual situation, as opposed to blowing up misunderstandings about difficulties purchasing Dutch train tickets to be some sort of failure on the part of American banks or consumers.

I have a different question as to why certain sectors in the EU feel that they have to upend a system that has worked exceedingly well in the rest of the world (despite substantially higher credit card penetration in many other countries, especially the US). Is it that Europeans are less trustworthy and more prone to fraud? Is it that EU banks prefer to push risk of use to consumers? Is it that Europeans are stubborn and simply want to be different? Who knows, but there must be some reason why they have decided upon a quixotic and meandering path to haltingly and partially implement a technological standard across the EU, while ignoring a) that the technology is obsolete and barely a marginal improvement over the old standard and b) that technology is only part of the problem.

Travelgourmet, as someone who uses U.K. card readers every week, and actually owns one which will accept both chip & pin cards and swipe cards, I think I can tell the difference. The card readers I see are not in London, and not in tourist destinations, and are designed solely to accept chip & pin.

Because I have a card reader, I also know that the rules (and commission) for accepting swipe cards differ from those for chip & pin, at least in the U.K.

Travelgourmet, as someone who uses U.K. card readers every week, and actually owns one which will accept both chip & pin cards and swipe cards, I think I can tell the difference.

So there is only one model? If you don't own the other models, are you really such an expert in what they can or can't do? And if you've not tried to use a strictly swipe card, just how much experience do you have with the problems it may or may not cause?

The card readers I see are not in London, and not in tourist destinations, and are designed solely to accept chip & pin.

Are you saying that Tesco, for example, uses different terminals in London than elsewhere? That seems odd, and brings me back to my question about why Europeans can't seem to settle on a standard! I mean, I know the Scots are a stubborn lot and might consider it out of spite, but Reading can't get on the same page with Liverpool? But, hey, humor me, if we exclude chain retailers, as well as any business that deals with tourists, and pretty much all of London, how do we get to 2/3 of the readers in the UK, again? More importantly, how do we extrapolate from your numbers, given what you describe as a highly fragmented card reader situation in the UK?

Because I have a card reader, I also know that the rules (and commission) for accepting swipe cards differ from those for chip & pin, at least in the U.K.

Small shop owners that obsess over credit card fees are small for a reason... If shops want to turn down affluent credit card users and chase after debit card holders to save a few pennies on the transaction costs, then it is no wonder that much of Europe's retail sector seems so positively antiquarian compared to the US or Asia.

Travelgourmet. methinks you do protest too much.

There are many different types of card reader in use in the U.K.. Some are connected by wire to a computer terminal/cash register, some connect wirelessly or by bluetooth. Some are standalone, some are portable. Look at a catalogue and you will see dozens of different models, all with particular features. The one I have is a portable machine with 3 sim cards in it, which connects using a mobile telephone signal to the bank. It uses whichever mobile phone signal is strongest.

Some card readers accept both swipe cards as well as chip & pin, while some accept chip & pin only. All I wrote was that as far as I could tell, about 2/3rds of those on open display were chip & pin only. Why don't you go to John Lewis and look at the terminals on their counters? They are chip & pin only, although I am sure they have other ways of accepting payments from tourists who have cards which only have stripes.

I am not obsessing over credit card fees. However, I am aware that our bank has different commission rates and security requirements depending on the card used. Chip & pin has the lowest rate, with swipe cards a little higher (and sometimes requiring telephone authorisation). The highest commission is charged on "cardholder not present" transactions.

This is not a matter of "My country is best". I just want to make sure that international travellers, especially those from North America, are forewarned about the ways things can be different.

I don't know; I visit London several times a year and quite frankly have never come across any shop that doesn't have the ability to process both magnetic strip cards and chip cards. If you want to tell me things are different outside London, well I can't argue as I am usually not in that neck of the woods. Credit card terminals have a very limited shelf life (many are rented not owned) and are constantly being replaced. I believe for the most part almost all card readers (note almost) in the UK are both swipe and chip (as I remember and I can be corrected, there was an outcry when the UK went to chip and pin and certain handicapped people were exempted from the requirement that only chip and pin cards would be issued by UK banks).

As to the whys and wherefores, the US banks claim crtedit card fraud is less of a problem in the USA than elsewhere that the phone lines used to transmit credit card data in the US are more secure (don't shoot the messenger here).

Is it a big problem as of today, probably not but it is a growing problem and as I've said both mc/'visa in the USA have finally thrown in the sponge on this and have set a time line as to when chip and pin will be necessary in the USA whether any of us like it or not.

Why don't you go to John Lewis and look at the terminals on their counters? They are chip & pin only, although I am sure they have other ways of accepting payments from tourists who have cards which only have stripes.

I was there last week. Bought some stuff for the kitchen. Used a US credit card. They may have swiped it on the register, but I don't remember.

This is not a matter of "My country is best". I just want to make sure that international travellers, especially those from North America, are forewarned about the ways things can be different.

Agreed. That is why I seek to correct misstatements like you made.

The reason why they are stepping away from magnetic strips here is due to the problem of card skimming that was on the rise. Several gangs have been installing fake card readers on ATMs and other automated devices that look almost indistinguishable from the original slots.
When you insert your card, you are also passing it through their card reader, which copies all the info from your magnetic strip. With a hidden camera somewhere above, they can also retrieve your pin code while you are none the wiser. With this information, they can easily make duplicates of your card and start charging things off your account.

A second reason is online e-commerce. A lot of people here don't really trust handing over their card details online, and so banks had to come with a more secure solution.

And as far as I know, each country in Europe has its own payment system for debit cards. But they are all interconnected provided that both your card and the reader has the Maestro logo. Otherwise, it will likely not work.

In switching our banking to a local credit union, now we have chip and pin debit/check cards, 1% foreign transaction fee, plus we get interest on both checking and savings accounts in excess of what BofA offered. We'll keep the BofA account for a while, but it may only be used for six months more. The credit union is a much better deal, and a friendlier placed, too.

After hundreds of posts on the subject of chip and pin credit cards I have still not seen a single post claiming to have bought a train ticket (SNCF) or a Paris metro ticket from a ticket machine with a chip and pin card obtained from a source in the USA. Anyone...............

Last September I bought Metro tickets from a machine in the Gare de Lyon Metro station, and Transilien tickets from a machine at the Gare du Nord and a machine at the Auvers-sur-Oise station using my U.S. Bank Flexperks chipped card. No PIN was required for either transaction.

hi folks, I'm a first timer here and wonder if you can help. I have a visa debit card from the Caribbean with no chip and pin. I have been unable to find an ATM which accepts it. In some cases it will not even enter the slot. Tried with Barclays, Santander, HSBC & Link without success.
Spoke to the issuing bank and have been told that some of their customers are able to use it but just don't know where. Any suggestions much appreciated.