skatterfly

Hi folks,
For those of you who have been so helpful as I plan the various parts of my 2015 trip, I thought I should start a specific post relating to the Chamonix to Paris leg. We'd like to make this trip in one day, preferably breaking up the 7 hours of driving by taking TGV for part of that journey. I also don't want to drive into Geneva because Europcar charges so much more for dropping off in Switzerland (picking up in France).

<u>Of the following options, do any of them have a particularly beautiful route by TGV, a particularly easy or difficult station for Europcar rental return, or morning workday commute traffic I should factor in? </u>

Option 1: Drop off car in Chamonix, take 1ish hour shuttle to Geneva for a 3.25 hr TGV (Lyria)
Option 2: Drive to & drop off in Annecy (1.25 hours) and take a 3.75 hr TGV
Option 3: Drive to & drop off in Lyon -drive 2.75 hrs to Lyon for 2 hr TGV

All 3 options have us leaving Chamonix earlier in the morning than we'd like (7-9 am).

Option 3 gives us a handful of extra (i.e. slightly later) options because Lyon has trains leaving hourly.

For Option 1: I'd also appreciate any recommendations for the most reliable shuttle/van service that can take us (2 adults and 2 children) from Chamonix into Geneva. Several of the ones mentioned online also get pretty crappy reviews.

And once again, let me say thanks to all of you who have helped with your ideas and suggestions. I know I always ask a lot of questions to get familiar with my options, but in this case I don't think I've ever had a trip so carefully choreographed as this one.

But since we want to take advantage of the best rail fares (and get all our vacation rentals lined up), we've had to make so many of these decisions really early. Thanks again for your help getting it organized!

kerouac

I would drive to Annecy to get the train. I was there a couple of weeks ago and appreciated th simplicity of the train station and the Europcar agency.

neckervd

Why don't you want to drop off your car at
Europcar ANNEMASSE Car Rental
42 A ROUTE DE THONON
F-74100 ANNEMASSE
(Phone : +33 0 450920730
Fax: +33 0450920773),
about 1 1/2 miles from Annemasse railway station and 47miles from Chamonix?

You may then take
a train from Annemasse to Bellegarde (Annemasse dp 6.17, 7.17, 9.17, 11.17, 13.17, 15.17, 17.17, 19.17; 30 min journey) and board there a Geneva - Paris TGV (Geneva dp 6.13, 7.42, 9.42, 11.42, 14.30, 17.42, 18.30, 19.42 - Bellegarde dp 6.43, 8.10, 10.10, 12.10, 15.00, 18.10, 19.00, 20.10 - Paris ar 9.27, 10.49, 12.49, 14.52, 17.49, 20.49, 21.49, 22.50
or
go by Geneva city bus line 61 from Annemasse to Geneva (Annemasse dp about every 15 min form 5.50am until 21.35; 30 min journey) and board your Paris bound TGV there.

BTW:
It's har for me to believe that
Europcar Geneva Ferney Voltaire Car Rental Station
GENEVA FERNEY VOLTAIRE APT (FRANCE)
ARRIVAL HALL (FRENCH SIDE)
PO BOX N-62
01210 GENEVA FERNEY VOLTAIRE
Phone: +33 41 227178596
Fax: +33 41 227178597
will charge higher drop off prices than other French Europcar rental stations.

Man_in_seat_61

Is there no Europcar office in Chamonix?

Then you can do the blindingly obvious: Book Chamonix to Paris at www.capitainetrain.com

This buys a through ticket on the hourly narrow gauge local train from Chamonix station to the mainline railhead at St Gervais where a TGV is waiting as the connection to Paris.

Man_in_seat_61

Ah, I see you do mention Europcar Chamonix, but then go off on a tangent about buses to Geneva. Why???

Just hop on the train to Paris at Chamonix station, that's what it's there for! ;0) Easy platform-to-platform level-access change at St Gervais.

That's how my wife and kids and I returned from Chamonix to London a couple of years ago, after a week's winter holiday there.

neckervd

The problem is only that the St-Gervais - Paris TGV is seasonal and not daily anyway. There is often a second train change at Annecy (sometimes with a certain layover).

kerouac

If you take the train from Chamonix out of season, there are two connections to get to Annecy, but they are easy.

skatterfly

Hi guys, thanks for replying and persisting with me in this.

Though it may seem blindingly obvious to hop on a train in Chamonix, that's 8-hour journey—4 of which is taken up by getting to Annecy, which I figure I can drive to in 1.5 hours.

I was trying to find an option with the fewest transfers (with kids and luggage, I'm a little intimidated by too many connections) and the shortest possible travel time. It just seemed more efficient to me (if not quite as elegant) to drive to one of the nearby TGV hubs.

Driving to Annemasse is compelling if I'm willing to put up with the taxi & transfers... because the overall travel time could shortened. (That is, if I catch one of the morning trains that go through Bellegarde. In the afternoon the TGV options change to go through Geneve Cornavin, adding another 1.5 hours to the journey.)

Neckervd... ya know, I hadn't even considered dropping off at the French side of the airport (which would *not* charge me extra) and then I can take a 7 minute train or a 15 minute taxi to the Geneva Cornavin for the TGV. That's definitely an idea I'll add to the mix.

Seat61, I realize you are *the* guy for trains and I often use your website when I'm stumped, but when I look at the (French) SNCF voyages website, I see no TGV that leaves directly from St Gervais Les Bains. Am I missing something? They all involve multiple transfers and ultimately connect through either Annecy or Gare de Lyon. If there were a direct TGV from St Gervais Les Bains, now *that* would be awesome.

Thanks!
-kristin

PalenQ

Though it may seem blindingly obvious to hop on a train in Chamonix, that's 8-hour journey—4 of which is taken up by getting to Annecy, which I figure I can drive to in 1.5 hours.>

You can leave Chamonix at 9:14 am and by switching in St-Gervais-les-Bains and Bellegarde by in Paris at 14:49 - 5,5 hours not 8 - this according to www.bahn.de/en - the German Rail site that is usually infallible for all European train schedules.

save a day on a car rental and have a scenic train ride to St Gervais - by narrow-gauge mountain train, then a regional train to Bellegarde then TGV blasting into Paris.

The change at St-Gervais-les-Bains is from one train to another simply because of track gauge (width) differences.

so not direct from St Gervais by TGV but if it were a TGV it would go no faster on older tracks to Bellegarde and the high-speed line.

Man_in_seat_61

Yes, a major advantage in dropping your car off the day before, or even days before as you won't need it at the end.

You'll find direct trains St Gervais to Paris on Saturdays & Sundays Dec-March and various other times, you just have to check the timetables. www.capitainetrain.com being the weapon of choice for France.

If you need to change, changes of train are usually easy - you get off, you walk over to the other train, you get on.

skatterfly

Thanks, everyone.
I'll be travelling on a Friday in June, which explains why I can't find the direct TGV from St Gervais.

We'll consider all these great options as we get ready for the trip. We may also try to stay just a little longer in the day so we can take the kids for one final long walk before all that travelling... which means I have to go now and explore all the various scenarios departing closer to 10-11 am, but arriving in Paris before 6. I may check out the Bahn.de site that PalenQ recommended.

neckervd

" They all involve multiple transfers and ultimately connect through either Annecy or Gare de Lyon"
I suppose you know that Gare de Lyon is the final station of all TGVs coming from South-Eastern France; it's situated in the center of Paris.

"I have to go now and explore all the various scenarios departing closer to 10-11 am, but arriving in Paris before 6"
I suppose you know that in June, it will get dark around 10pm only. If you chose TGV9780, you will do the whole journey by day light.

PalenQ

Ditch the car when you get to Chamonix and save however many days of rental - no need for a car once there as everything of interest is off-limits to cars and public transit up into dem hills so so great. check Man in Seat 61's commercial site www.seat61.com for good details on discounted tickets - two other sites for general info on French trains I like aree www.ricksteves.com and www.budgeteuropetravel.com.

PalenQ

Once in Chamonix if you want to take one of Europe's most awesoemly scenic trains lines take the train down to Martigny in Switzerland and back - the last half in Switzerland is terrifically scenic and the whole way is nice with glaciers, glacial lakes, etc. The MOB - Martingy Ober Bahn (?) railway, one of the classic scenic Swiss railways. The approach to the Rhone Valley is thrilling for many and nail-biting for others as the train creeps along an all-too-narrow ledge for many tasts - looking like an airplane landing in the valley far below.

neckervd

Mont Blanc Express: Chamonix - Martigny (Company: TMR - Transports de Martigny et Region)
Golden Pass: Montreux - Gstaad - Zweisimmen (Company: MOB - Montreux Oberland Bernois).

Martigny is 4 3/4 hrs by train from Paris; change at Lausanne (same platform)

skatterfly

Thanks everyone... all really helpful information. (Even the pushing back a little on the train routes.... I figure even if it won't work for me, all the content these posts generate will help future travellers.)

If the circumstances were a little different, I'd probably be inclined to start the journey in Chamonix as some of you suggest. Who knows? After 10 days of driving from Paris to the Loire, then to Burgundy, then to Chamonix... we may be tired of driving at that point.

Neckervd...
"I suppose you know that Gare de Lyon is the final station of all TGVs coming from South-Eastern France; it's situated in the center of Paris."

Yes, of course I know that. The point I was trying to make was that (at least according to ViaMichelin) we can drive to one of those TGV stations more quickly than getting there by regional train (thus allowing us to enjoy even an hour or two more in Chamonix). To me, that alone is a plus.

"I suppose you know that in June, it will get dark around 10pm only. If you chose TGV9780, you will do the whole journey by day light."

Yup, know that too. Getting to Paris by 6 has to do entirely with meeting up with a friend in the evening, and nothing to do with arriving in daylight. But it's good advice.

PalenQ... that ride to Martigny sounds beautiful!

I have to admit... Chamonix was an afterthought, and we squeezed it in between Burgundy and getting back to Paris for the last few days of our trip. (Hey, we reasoned, we're only a couple hours away... who knows when we'll get another chance to see Mont Blanc this close.) We have 3 nights (so really 2 days). If we can get up Aiguille du Midi and do a couple easy family friendly hikes/walks... we'll feel good about the trip. We may also try seeing Montenvers and Mer de Glace if the weather is nice. Part of me wants to take a drive into Courmayeur just to say we had lunch in Italy, but that probably won't happen this trip. We're already making a long list of the things we want to do on our next, *next* trip.

PalenQ

PalenQ... that ride to Martigny sounds beautiful!>

If you want to drive the main road follows pretty much the course of the railway - for a different type of driving - getting to Chamonix by car is scenic but not harrowingly so.