BDog1984

My question is this: for a 3 week trip starting in Budapest and ending in Amsterdam this June, should I go ahead and book individual tickets for each leg of the journey (Budapest>Vienna>Munich>Prague>Berlin>Amsterdam) which would come out to about 720 USD, or just get the 5 country rail pass and book the tickets as I go, the pass is about 620 USD.

My concerns are: If I don't book each trip now, I might not get the ones I want if I wait until I am there. But at the same time, if I get the rail pass I will have more freedom when I get there and not be locked into a set schedule.

mjdh1957

First make sure you are checking the correct fares: don't use a reseller like Raileurope but the national rail companies of the individual countries.

That might make a difference to the prices of the point-to-point tickets.

fmpden

And second, with a rail pass, there is a surcharge to use most trains commonly call seat reservation fee. Only the regionals or local that do not required a seat reservation are open to rail passes without additional charges. And sometimes the number of rail pass are limited on certain trains.

PaulHahn

I went to each country's rail website and came up with a total of 217 euros buying the tickets individually. Some had excellent internet, advance-purchase deals. Right now that would be about $310 adding in the 1% foreign transaction fee. That is second class, but I've never noticed that much difference between first and second class. I also didn't include any age discount for seniors or children.

So, unless I messed up somewhere (which is possible as not all screens are in English), you could save a bit buying second class seats on the internet as soon as you can.

haxter1

From my experience traveling by train in Germany and Austria there are no required seat reservations on any train. As far as Hungary is concerned I don't know but I don't think so. Never the less I think that seat reservations are a good idea on this trip. If a seat reservation is made with the purchase of a ticket it only cost 2.50 Euros and only good for two trains on the itinerary. Extra ones are four or five Euros.

Go to Bahn.de, choose English and put in your data. This site is good for most of Europe.

LaContessa1

You may find that flights are less expensive than trains for part of your trip. We just bought very inexpensive air tickets from Prague to Amsterdam on EasyJet. $120 total for two of us one-way including one checked luggage each and taxes. The german discount train tickets are available for purchase no sooner than 92 days in advance.

Man_in_seat_61

1. For this itinerary, the trains won't require any compulsory surcharges or reservation fees for passholders, so the $620 pass price is probably all you'd need to pay, except for any sleeper/couchette supplements for overnight trains.

2. However, where did you check point to point prices? Budapest-Vienna is 30 euros or so full-whack, or from 19 euros if you pre-book at www.oebb.at. Vienna-Munich starts at 29 euros pre-booked at www.bahn.de. Munich-Prague also starts at 29 euros, www.bahn.de. Prague-Berlin starts at 24 euros at www.bahn.de. Berlin-Amsterdam also 29 euros at www.bahn.de. So if you're sure of your itinerary you could do the whole lot from 141 euros!! Booking opens 90 days ahead.

3. If you want to travel between Prague & Amsterdam, flying is crazy. There's a hassle-free direct City Night Line sleeper train, departing Prague Hlavni station (a stroll from most city centre hotels) at 18:31, arriving Amsterdam Centraal at 09:30 next morning, a stroll from all the city centre hotels there. Fares start at 49 euros including a couchette, 79 euros including a bed in a 2-bed sleeper, and that'll probably save a night's hotel bill too. It's a key route, so I've put details (and photos) of this train on http://www.seat61.com/train-from-ams...-to-prague.htm. The deluxe sleepers even have a private shower & toilet.

PalenQ

But if you buy the 5-country Eurail Select Pass before the end of March 2011 you get an extra day free - so that makes the railpass cheaper if 6 or more days of travel are envisioned. The special is on 6-day and longer passes but you may use one of those days on a day trip from those cities - such as going from Munich for the day to Salzburg, Austriaor Fuessen for Mad Ludwig's fantasy castles.

The beauty of a pass to me is also that you can just jump on any train anytime in those countries - and fully flexible full fare tickets can be so costly - just show up at the station and viola hop on - no going to any ticket window, etc.

And the pass if first class so if you and Man in Seat 61 are comparing that to second class fares IMO that is like comparing apples to oranges. There are significant differences between first and second class in these countries - and decades of incessant European train riding have made me STRONGLY encourage going first class for the average tourist on the trip of a lifetime.

anyway for lots of great info on European trains in addition to Man in Seat 61 (above post) commercial site, www.seat61.com also check out these info-laden sites - www.budgeteuropetravel.com and www.ricksteves.com. For schedules I always go to www.bahn.de - the German Railways web site with schedules for all European trains - easiest I've seen to use anyway.

But again comparing first class pass to second-class fares is really like comparing apples to oranges - IMO compare first class fares to the price of the pass.

PalenQ

But if you buy the 5-country Eurail Select Pass before the end of March 2011 you get an extra day free - so that makes the railpass cheaper if 6 or more days of travel are envisioned. The special is on 6-day and longer passes but you may use one of those days on a day trip from those cities - such as going from Munich for the day to Salzburg, Austriaor Fuessen for Mad Ludwig's fantasy castles.

The beauty of a pass to me is also that you can just jump on any train anytime in those countries - and fully flexible full fare tickets can be so costly - just show up at the station and viola hop on - no going to any ticket window, etc.

And the pass if first class so if you and Man in Seat 61 are comparing that to second class fares IMO that is like comparing apples to oranges. There are significant differences between first and second class in these countries - and decades of incessant European train riding have made me STRONGLY encourage going first class for the average tourist on the trip of a lifetime.

anyway for lots of great info on European trains in addition to Man in Seat 61 (above post) commercial site, www.seat61.com also check out these info-laden sites - www.budgeteuropetravel.com and www.ricksteves.com. For schedules I always go to www.bahn.de - the German Railways web site with schedules for all European trains - easiest I've seen to use anyway.

But again comparing first class pass to second-class fares is really like comparing apples to oranges - IMO compare first class fares to the price of the pass.

Man_in_seat_61

Well, the point is you can't buy a 2nd class Eurail (unless you're a 'youth'), so if it's the best deal you want, and you're sure of your itinerary, the cheapest option is simply to pre-book, online, cheap deals in 2nd class.

1st class is certainly nice, but not essential. Europe isn't darkest Africa where 1st class is arguably a necessity, 2nd class is fine. Indeed, for most of us Europeans, 2nd class is the norm, 1st class is what you use on business and your Company is paying the fare! Consider 1st class as a 'treat' if the extra cost isn't important to you, and yes, the extra cost isn't always that much. You can get cheap book-ahead deals in 1st class too!

The extra flexibility of a pass is indeed useful if you're going to use it, just don't pay $X000 for a pass to do a few journeys that could each be booked for 29 euros a pop online.

PalenQ

ell, the point is you can't buy a 2nd class Eurail (unless you're a 'youth'), so if it's the best deal you want, and you're sure of your itinerary, the cheapest option is simply to pre-book, online, cheap deals in 2nd class.>

The Fodor's mantra is that 1st class is a waste of money and that 2nd class is just as fine and I say this is just bunk - for the average traveler on the trip of a lifetime I say go first class as, contrary to what Man in Seat 61 finds, my decades of incessant European rail travel shows there is a BIG difference between classes

Like lots more room for luggage and tourists are unlike Europeans do local journeys - they often have way too much stuff in tow. There are simply IME quite a few empty seats in first class and perhaps thanks to online specials very few in 2nd class these days it seems. So in 2nd class you are usually sitting 2 by 2 with the seats full - in first class I usually have it seems an empty seat next to me where I can leisurely stow my baggage (and keep a good eye on it) rather than trying to find space in perhaps already crowded overhad luggage racks in 2nd class

And only in 1st class do you find so-called isolated seats - a seat with a windown and an aisle - 2nd class is always it seems 2 by 2 - 4 seats in a rown vs 3 seats in a row in first class - thus first-class seats are bigger and some bigger Americans may find this worth the money as well.

But the isolated aisle and window seats - which at times face each other with a table in between them for couples - are something that I am happy to pay extra money for.

And then the flexibility of a pass in countries with no mandatory seat reservations - just to get up and go to the station and hop the next train - no having to run to catch a train that is non-refundable or changeable, etc.

Yes if I were traveling like Europeans a lot I'd go second class - luggage would not be a factor but for the trip of a lifetime I say definitely go first class - cheapest is not always the best.

Apply the same criteria to train travel IMO as you do to a hotel or eating - you can eat perfectly well at McDonalds and you can sleep perfectly well at Motel 6 type places in Europe but most folks find paying a bit more gives them a bit more luxury.

Man_in_seat_61

I actually agree with PalenQ in many ways, I'm a first class afficionado myself!

It's just a callibration/expectation thing. Just don't think you HAVE to bankrupt yourself (if you're on a tight budget) travelling 1st class to avoid the wooden seats and chickens in 2nd class.

We have running water and electricty and everything in Europe now(!), and 2nd class is fine for all normal purposes, remarkably few wooden seats and chickens in it these days.

But yes, treat yourself to 1st class if you can!

PalenQ

And I certainly would say that on mainline European trains 2nd class is yes not a cattle car a'tal but very comfy, modern train cars, etc.

It is not that 2nd class is insufferable but that first class is much more relaxed and again casual tourists carrying often too heavy luggage will find it even more relaxed that fending for luggage space in 2nd class - I say give the same criteria to train travel as you do to your hotel and restaurants - you can eat perfectly well at McDonalds and sleep perfectly well in Europe's equivalent of Motel 6's but most want a better experience for their trip of a lifetime.

And for those really on a tight budget who scimp on restaurants and hotels then yes do the discounted 2nd class fares often readily available and give thanks to folks like Man Seat 61 and many Fodorites who readily tell you about them and how to do them.