William76

Hello everyone,

I'm new to this forum but I'd like to start off by saying I've done some thorough reading in the past few days trying to find ideas, but do to the overwhelming amount of contradicting opinions I feel like I need some assistance. I do apologize in advance if this has been covered in other topics.

I have traveled extensively around various parts of the world so I've come to realize I prefer not having much of an itinerary and sort of let what I encounter lead the way... with that being said...

My scenario: This will be my first trip to Europe. With some time frame limitations I am allotting myself a 16 day stretch (minus flight time) in mid-August to make it from Berlin to Brussels. So 14 days on the ground. I've been planning to make a trip for two summers now and things have come up along the way, so I finally pulled the trigger on the cheapest RT flight I could find in this time frame and I'm going to just work with what I have.

I am inquiring about places worth interest along that route (which I plan on traveling via DB, at least through Germany) and how much time to spend in said place. The one place I would really like to explore, even if it's only a day or two is Cochem and it's vicinity, but it isn't necessarily do or die.

My interests include architecture and photography, but at the same time maintaining some distance from the overly touristy areas. Tough in August, I know.

Or, on the contrary with that amount of time, would it be worthwhile to extend my route outside of German territory leaving enough travel time to make it to Brussels.

Sorry for the extensive rambling... Any and all considerations greatly appreciated!

Dukey1

architecture: definitely consider including a stop in Cologne if only for that massive monster they call a cathedral: unforgettable and apparently immune to exterior cleaning.

Berlin you are already going to and I think you'll thoroughly enjoy that.

Amsterdam? architecture you won't see in some other places and one of the four supposedly greatest, or at least most significant, European museums IF that is of interest to you and the place is finally fully back open, too.

PalenQ

Berlin is so multi-faceted that it deamnds 4 days - including your first day.

Other ten days: The Rhine and Mosel - 3 days - base in Cochem which yes is a fairy-tale town most folks only dream of staying in but never do - use it as a base to visit the Rhine Gorge one day with k-d boats (k-d.com) and another day to putz along the Mosel by rented bike or train or bus or boat - Burg Eltz could be on one day - one of Germany's most famous castles really close to Cochem. Trier, Germany's oldest cities and one replete with some of the best Roman relics north of the Alps is an easy day trip.

Day 8 - Head up the Mosel Valley to Luxembourg - a day in the quirky Duchy of Luxembourg - Luxembourg City is one of the most physically gorgeous in Europe as a deep gorge bisects the town center. An easy few-hour stop could be made on this route in Trier - put your bags in a station locker.

Day 9 -10 Brussels

Day 11-12 Bruges

Day 13-14 Amsterdam - did not say you wanted to go to there but it has a lot of flight options and is one of the most gorgeous and fascinating cities in Europe - cut a day off Brussels and add it in here.

Voila

If going by train around Germany and Belgium and Luxembourg and Netherlands then strongly look at the Germany-Benelux Railpass that allows you to hop on nearly every train in Germany, Blegium, Netherlands and Luxembourg any time (except Thalys trains which you do not have to take).

For lots of great info on trains in those countries, passes, etc check out these IMO fantastic sources: www.budgeteuropetravel.com (be sure to download their free online European Planning & Rail Guide for lots of rail-itineraries in each country and lots of options on where to go; www.seat61.com (click on its commercial link to RailEurope to check railpasses prices; www.ricksteves.com.

Aramis

Berlin - 4 days (daytrip to Dresden)
Quedlinburg/ Wernigerode/Goslar (Harz Mountains) - 3 days
Cochem - 3 days
Luxembourg - 2 days
Brugge 2 days
Brussels (airport hotel the day prior to departure only)

Goslar - Cochem - Brugge is a bit of a jaunt but I put it in because you really want to visit Cochem. If you are going west from Berlin, it is hard for me to not recommend the Harz mountain trio, though. Once there, adding Cochem adds some complexity and time to things.

William76

Thank you all for the great feedback, I'm going to use your suggestions to get a rough/flexible itinerary and I'll post for some opinions.

PalenQ

Berlin - 4 days (daytrip to Dresden)
Quedlinburg/ Wernigerode/Goslar (Harz Mountains) - 3 days
Cochem - 3 days
Luxembourg - 2 days
Brugge 2 days
Brussels (airport hotel the day prior to departure only)>

aramis' itinerary is great too - you could substitute the Quedlingburg area (Quedlingburg however is a UNESCO World Heritage site) with just about anyplace on the way to Cochem - like Heidelberg, Wurzburg, Rothenburg - and then take the Castle Road bus to Heidelberg, etc.

2 days in Luxembourg would be about 1.5 days too much for me - saying this after visiting that fair city many many times on business - not much there - but if he/she means going into the bucolic Grand Duchy's countryside then yes - get a rover pass for trains and buses for a few euros and explore this neat place - Clervaux for its great castle and lots of other small-town gems.

William76

PalenQ... thanks for the extended feedback!

So I was just messing around with some ideas and I like to know if this sounds too ambitious...

Fly LA to Berlin (arrive early am)

Day 1-3: Berlin
Day 4: Berlin - 4-6 hrs. in Dresden - Prague
Day 5-7: Prague (Overnight to Cologne)
Day 8: Colongne (Evening to Cochem)
Day 9-11: Cochem and Vicinity
Day 12: Cochem to Brugge
Day 13-14: Brugge
Day 15: Brugge to Brussels (early am)

Day 16: Fly out Brussels


Option B would be to swap the Prague portion for Amsterdam.

If this is too much in 15 days then I would assume heading a diagonal route from Berlin to Brussels is my best option. I don't mind so much traveling a little by train since this is my first visit and would like to take in some scenic ride time.

Thanks again for any input!

PalenQ

William - sounds great - I would try to spend one more day in Berlin - so much to see and do there - a trip out to Sans Soucci Palace and park is a must IMO - the Prussian Versailles and a vast park filled with oddities - short S-Bahn or mainline train trip from Berlin. But Berlin is so so big and has so so much varied sights and figuring first day most folks are wiped out, etc. but otherwise seems great - I'm sure some will say a bit hurried but I travel like that for years now and love it - no need to spend a week in every stop as some may like.

Swapping Amsterdam for Prague simplifies things a lot and IMO Amsterdam is way way nicer than Brussels - nicer than Prague - to me yes but Prague is also really neat but it is a major detour - put time in Berlin and Amsterdam and scratch Brussels - or take a few-hour look at it en route to Cochem - the great Gothic cathedral is right next to the train station - about the only reason for the average tourists to stop in Cologne IMO.


Still look in the Germany-Benelux Pass with add-ons to Prague - and a new caveat with German Passes this year is you can add on Prague for xx $ - that is on a German Pass but not sure about Germany-Benelux - for any question about passes call Byron at www.budgeteuropetravel.com - I've bought passes from him for years and he knows all the nitty-gritty - that said you may find booking weeks in advance if you can get the discounted but limited in number tickets - that however cannot be changed nor refunded - locked in stone and must be bought weeks in advance to guarantee availability - that could be all told cheaper if you can nail down every segment - paying full fare on a long segment could make the pass pay off.