Beating the £ in London (and the rest of England)

Most of these have been mentioned over and over again:

Many London museums are free

Taking buses are cheaper (and more scenic) than the tube. £4.80 for zone 1-2 off-peak for tube; but £3 for bus only (per day).

Lots of University dorms in London offer accomdation at low price during school breaks (summer and x'mas). Some dorms have en-suite rooms and some even offer breakfast. All the dorms have shared kitchen.

Half-Priced theatre tickets at TKTS

Taking Southern trains instead of Gatwick Express if you are flying into/out of LGW.

2-for-1 offers at daysoutguide.co.uk with valid train ticket

Not exactly some secret source of wisdom, but anyway:
http://www.visitlondon.com/people/budget/

I've been researching travel in London, and it seems like quite a few B&B's listed include breakfast in the price, some even offer a full English breakfast, or a choice between that or a continental breakfast. Most seem to be a pretty good price, especially for a place with character. They may not be hostel prices, but most of what I've seen were under 100 pounds.

I haven't acutally stayed at any, just what I've seen while researching. There's one that I'll definitely stay at when I do visit.


Also the British Museum I think offers afternoon tea for about half of what the "known" tea places cost. You might have to re-check that, though, I don't have the book that says that with me right now.

What we (Mr. Pickle and I, a mid-40s couple) did last May:

We stayed in YHA hostels everywhere except London and the Cotswolds. We had double rooms, most with ensuite baths, for about $60-70 per night. All had full kitchens, which we used to cook most of our breakfasts, some dinners and to prepare picnic lunches. Far from being soulless, bleak places to stay, many YHA hostels are located in former coaching inns (Snowdon Ranger in Wales), a 16th-century manor (Hartington Hall in the Peak District), and a lovely Italianate mansion (Bath).

We took advantage of Travelodge.co.uk's 15-pound deal to get a nice, clean, large room in the southern Cotswolds for two nights.

Sites like www.fancyapint.com helped us find good pubs in our budget.

Sightseeing: In London, we took advantage of www.daysoutguide.co.uk two-for-one offers to visit Westminster Abbey and the Cabinet War Rooms.

The Great British Heritage Pass, available from www.visitbritain.com, saved us a ton of money! With a seven-day pass - and the fact that the staff at our first two stops didn't validate it - we saw Blenheim Palace, Warwick Castle, Chatsworth House, Haddon Hall, Conwy Castle, Berkeley Castle, Lacock Abbey, the Fox Talbot Museum, the Roman Baths, and Stourhead Gardens.

Otherwise, we really tried not to think too much about the differences between the pound and the dollar. We did the things we wanted to do without feeling deprived and had a fabulous time!

Lee Ann

If you want to attend West End shows that aren't available at the TKTS booth, try www.broadwaybox.com. They have some decent priced specials for dinner and tickets, sometimes for a better deal than buying just the tickets would have been.

The Great Britain Heritage Pass now has a family pass (which I got last summer for our party of 3 for $217 for 2 weeks) which can be a great deal if you are traveling in the right parts of the country (less so if you are only seeing London and its environs). At that rate, you can recoup the cost in just a a couple of visits to high priced sites like St. Paul's, Hampton Court, and Blenheim. Check the list of attractions against your itinerary to see if it's a good deal for you.

You can buy the pass, here: http://tinyurl.com/2sbmn9

Priceline is usually great in London.

London walks (www.walks.com) are a lot of entertainment and history for about 6 pounds.

We're headed to London in May for our third visit. A few of the things we're doing to make the stay comfortable, but economical:

We've rented a centrally located one bedroom flat for 122 pounds/day, which gives us more space and privacy than a hotel room, at a more reasonable rate. Having a kitchen allows us to prepare coffee and tea and have breakfast before we set out for the day. On our first day, we buy some fruit, cheese, crackers, and such, so that we can take something along with us until we're ready to stop for lunch.

Lunch is usually the meal we eat out, but we try to walk a block or 2 off the main tourist squares before we choose a place. We like ethnic foods and pub grub, so lunches are never a major expense. Dinners are usually put together in the flat with the likes of rotisserie chicken or other takeaway items.

We read the Timeout guides, check the 1/2 price TKTS box office, and take advantage of 2 for 1 specials available with our train tickets. Since Gatwick Express no longer offers the 2 for 1 coupon codes for purchase online, we'll take another train service into London, and save about 5 pounds per person each way--that's $40!

We take advantage of the visitor travelcard loaded on the Oyster card for transportation, which gives us the ability to make our way all over London at a modest cost.

We bought "Fodors" and "The Blue Guide to London Museums" and have planned a nice itinerary of sights that don't require steep admission prices. London is full of free museums.

We don't plan on purchasing much in the way of souvenirs, but we usually take back some tea and chocolate, both of which can be bought in supermarkets.

We love browsing through major fresh markets--Borough Market is on our agenda, and since cooking at home is a major hobby for us, it's interesting to check out local markets for comparison of products. We usually buy a few small food items--mustard, tea, spices, to remind us at home of our trip.

Finally, we just make it a point to get out and visit neighborhoods, getting a feel for the area, and enjoying the unexpected pleasures of visiting another place.
Barb

I always rent a flat & it saves me a ton plus it's nice to wake up & not have to get dressed for your AM cup of coffee or tea & breakfast. Usually lunch out & often take-away or the good ready to prepare meals from Marks & Spencer or sandwiches from Pret a Manger, etc.

Last June when my niece came with me, I joined Historic Royal Palaces as an annual member. For one, it's £ 37 or I think it was £ 55 or 58 for the 2 of us. That enabled us to have admission to Kensington Palace, the Tower, Hampton Court Palace & Kew Palace as well as the Royal Banqueting House. Also, I was given a very nice book that sold for £ 10 in the gift shop as well as all purchases in any of the palace gift shops were discounted. When I got my final membership card mailed to me, the membership actually was for 13 months so I could use it again this year.

http://www.hrp.org.uk/

We are heading to England for the month of May and welcome all suggestions of how to s-t-r-e-t-c-h- those pounds! The South African ZAR is, and has been, horrific for a number of years but we still pay up and enjoy Europe! If only we had the $ exchange rate we'd be smiling.

My recent discovery regarding cheaper ways of eating will be looking out for GBK - Gourmet Burger Kitchen, started from New Zealand by TV chef Peter Gordon.
The localities and menus are on the web for printing out.

Harden's Restaurant Guide has this to say:
"Superb juicy thick ones with all the trimmings - Number 1 in London"

Hello Fodorites,

Thanks for all your posts and enthusiasm! I really appreciate London’s great free museums and I'm always trying to think of creative ways to save pounds so I can visit more often.

These suggestions for alternatives to hotels are great: hostels - ElendilPickle, dorms - yk, B&Bs - caladrius, renting a flat - Barb_in_Ga, Carrybean. But if someone is set on staying in a hotel, any advice on finding a good rate?

yk - Lots of good tips. You mentioned buses over trains but quoted single trip rates. I'm curious if you used an Oystercard like Barb_in_Ga. I noticed that there are actually many threads here about Oystercards. Is the general consensus here that they are a good deal for travelers?

I love Pret a Manger, Wagamama, and GBK. Any other ideas for inexpensive meals out?

Thanks!

I'm not sure that I would call GBK a cheap option. The last time I was there, with a couple of beers and a tip it cost the thick end of £20. Which is quite a spendy burger IMHO.

when we want to eat out we go to the caff. These are ubiquitous, but not in the tourist areas. However you'll never be far away as the workers in those places have to eat.

In general caffs open quite early for breakfast (fry-ups) and stay open to about 4pm. Very few are open in the evening.

In general they sell standard english grub - shepherds pie, roast dinners, ommelettes and various fried combinations for about £5.00 with tea/coffe/coke etc. They vary from the absolutely wonderful to the dire.

The only one I can think of in a toursit area is in Soho - The new picadilly cafe. It's one of the good ones.


THis is a good site for cafes:

http://www.classiccafes.co.uk/Intro.html

The New Picadilly:

http://www.classiccafes.co.uk/newpiccpanel.htm

Katie:

Heading for London and the Cotswolds. As to hotels at decent rates, which we also prefer, we had reservations for early April at The Parkwood near Marble Arch for 79£, with full bkfst., near tube and bus stops.

Had to cancel and reschedule for May, they couldn't book our dates and referred us to their "sister" hotel, The George in Bloomsbury, near Euston Station...same price, etc. Daughter's friends stayed there a few years ago and were quite satisfied.

Also booked for "Small Talk" b and b in Broadway, next door to the much more expensive Lyggon Arms...rate at Small Talk is 69£

Booked a car with our favorites, AutoEurope, (manual) to pick up at LHR for drive to Cotswolds, 4 days for total of $203 USD.

www.smalltalklodge.co.uk/

http://www.georgehotel.com

http://www.parkwoodhotel.com/

Stu T.

Hi Cate_W-

No, the prices I quoted (for tube vs bus) are the max capping price per day using Oyster PAYG.

The PAYG caps the 1-day off-peak zone 1-2 travelcard price at £4.80. But if one travels only on bus all day, the max cap for a 1-day bus pass using PAYG is only £3.

As for food, the Time Out London has a section on Cheap Eats:
http://www.timeout.com/london/restaurants/features/173.html

I also know that the Belgo Centraal (in Soho) has a "Beat the Clock" deal between 5p-6:30p. You pay the price of the time you order. So if you get there at 5pm, your meal is just £5.
http://www.belgo-restaurants.co.uk/

I second Carrybean on Pret and meals from Marks & Spencer and other grocers; UK grocery stores have a much larger selection of ready-to-eat items than most stores in the US. It's so easy to get a picnic lunch or dinner together for so much less than you'd spend at a restaurant.

Hi Cate_W-

Also to add, I stayed at LSE Northumberland dorm last Sept (07). My single en-suite room was £42 all-in. No breakfast. You can see a full review on my trip report here. I also listed a breakdown of all my expenses on the trip.
http://www.fodors.com/forums/threadselect.jsp?fid=2&tid=35064483

For cheap hotel stays, hotel points! I am staying at a 5* centrally located hotel including BF buffet, next to an Underground stop, FREE!
For me, hotel points are the most cost effective way to travel, esp in the big cities of Europe. This week-long stay would retail for well over $2000!

Many hotels programs have special saver awards where it can cost even less points for a stay. American Express Rewards points can be transferred to many hotel programs. The stays can often be booked 1 year in advance.

Other suggestions for lunch include M&S's fantastic food sections. Great sandwiches, fresh baked goods, fruit, even ready-mades that can be heated up elsewhere.
The ethnic restaurants, esp in the East End area, Brick Lane, etc, are usually cheaper and very tasty.

For travel, we plan to use the 7-day Travelcard, which gives unlimited travel on buses and the Underground. Kids under 11 are free with adults! Discount TC for kids under 16 (underground). And kids 16 and under are free on all regular London buses (not the tourist buses).
Unlike the daily TC, this card does not have time restrictions. The daily TC can only be used after 9:30AM.
Holders are also eligible for the 2 for 1 discounts for attractions.

We found that an extended stay at a BandB reduced our cost to less than 70 pounds per night. I hesitate to recommend yet, exactly, as our trip is in mid-July, so we haven't actually seen it, but it looks good on the internet, the office has been most helpful, and it's a BandB in Belgravia so in a great spot for tube access as well as near Hyde Park and shopping venues. (Some breakfast, free wi-fi, and use of refrig, too.) By staying 14 days, we got a reduced fee. (So we've opted to do this and take day trips via train 4-5 times rather than spend nights outside of London.) I think several different BandB providers will do this extended stay discount. The one we used is at www.athomeinlondon.co.uk/

(I'd love to hear if anyone has used this BandB provider already.)

Also, besides the 2for1 deals, which I'll have vouchers for and purchase the correct tube tickets (as well as get Oyster card for rest of our travels), I found a website offering 20% off attractions and restaurants with voucher--www.discountbritain.net

I've been happily searching via internet and maps for pubs, cafes, and grocery stores, plus MandS sites, for ways to spend less on meals by using take-aways or specials or packaged meals (I loved MandS's variety when there in 2005).

Home exchange..we got to stay in a lovely home in Hampstead Heath for two weeks

Senior concessions..1/2 price for National Express Bus from Heathrow to Gatwick, plus many other savings

Priceline for a hotel for a night or two, apartments

Airmiles, use their buses, walk, oyster card, eat in

Join National Trust or Royal Oak Foundation

Everyone else has covered a lot!

caladrius

ALL B+B's include breakfast, that's what the second B is for and I'd be disappointed if that B wasn't full English.

My husband and I spent a week in London last winter, and I made a point of searching out only the attractions that were free. We literally ran out of time to take in everything on our list. The only exception to my rule was an evening ride on the London Eye - my 50th birthday present - and it was worth every penny! We bought an Oyster card for off-peak hours and almost always rode the bus rather than the tube so that we didn't miss any of the sights.

My big complaint was finding an inexpensive cup of tea while we were out shopping and walking in London. I was just loathe to spend the two or three pounds that some places charged. We finally discovered that MacDonalds provided a great, cheap cuppa with a surprisingly relaxing environment in which to rest our feet for a bit.

As for souvenirs - I did quite well at the airport when we were returning home. Harrod's has an outlet there with a good selection of gifts - cheaper than in their store. And there were several other places offering nice, reasonably priced things as well. I actually wished that I had waited to purchase all my souvenirs there - it would have saved lugging my purchases around as we went about our days.

While we stayed in a great, inexpensive hotel in Belgravia, we intend to rent a flat next time - much more economical. There is more room to relax, and you can save a lot by preparing simple meals of your own -- Tesco's has a great selection of pre-made meals! Wherever you stay - hotel or flat - always check out the neighborhood and find a local grocery store. While we loved our pub meals, we discovered that not every pub serves an evening meal - or they might one day and not the next. Tesco's was a great backup plan.

Farther afield ... on a previous trip we visited York (in May). It is a GREAT tourist-friendly place to visit - give yourself at least a couple of days there. We had expected a tourist trap and were pleasantly surprised at how reasonable prices were - from B&B's to souvenirs.

The Railway Museum is FREE!!! and it is fantastic. It is just too grand to merely pop in and out. My husband is a retired railroader and he couldn't see the point of going to look at "a bunch of old trains" Well, I couldn't drag him out of there. We closed the place!

Our favorite money-saving trick when we are touring the rest of the UK: buying a cheap bottle of red wine, a chunk of local cheese, and a loaf of crusty bread and finding a secluded spot of country-side to enjoy a picnic. For us, it just doesn't get any better than that!

Head north, in general things are cheaper the further north you go and there are some beautiful and interesting places outside of London.

If you stand at the base of the steps to St Paul's, you can see an M&S food only. Sitting on the steps on a sunny day are a hundred people fortifying themselves for the hundreds of steps to the top.
PS. You need to save on lunch, since it is now 10 GBP to get into the church.

If staying in London (and are happy to leave your accomodation as late as possible) Laterooms.com is a fantastic website which offers heavily discounted rates on hotels in London (and the rest of the UK)

I live in the UK and have used it myself and have gotten rooms i hotels (at a great discount) when i haven't been able to get them thru the hotels themselves!!!!

Home exchange has already been mentioned as a way to save on accommodation costs (it's free!) When visiting London, check out the many home exchange offers on the London based site Home Base Holidays: http://www.homebase-hols.com

There is so much to see and do in London that doesn't cost much (or sometimes anything) plus the pound has dropped in value against the euro in the last few months, which makes a trip to London more affordable too. I enjoyed walking in the many beautiful parks and along the Thames and browsing in the markets (picking up tasty goodies to eat back in my 'home' when I did a home swap to London).

Another penny pinching option is to watch out for a JD wetherspoons pub. This is a chain that sells very cheap drinks and offers two meals for £6.99 and the food's OK.

The downside to them is that they tend to be souless barns full of the sort of people you would imagine being attracted to a place that sells cheap booze. In general they're fine at lunchtime though.

I've posted this before, but in London and other cities, University accommodation offers great value - but is limited to outside term time.

We often stay in student accommodation belonging to the London School of Economics. Locations are good, rooms - while a little bit shabby - are perfectly clean and safe, cooking facilities are available and the price - which can be as little as £50 for a twin room - includes a cooked breakfast.

Here's the website - http://www.lsevacations.co.uk/

Fodor's editor, shouldn't you have said the rest of *Britain* ? The rest of it does use the £ as well, you know. And some people get very cross when Americans use 'England' when they mean Britain.

here we go again.....

We ate at the Westminster Central Hall cafeteria just across the street from the cathedral. Nice and clean with good food, very reasonable prices and handy restrooms.

Point well taken, Caroline. England was used basically because we are currently updating the England guide and would like to include some member tips. The Scotland editor will be by in the coming weeks I'm sure to hear your tips related to saving money there. However, Wales is actually covered within the England book.

Any Wales-specific tips out there? My former roommate here in New York was from Wales. Despite spending almost a year in England, I'm ashamed to say that I never made it to Wales. After meeting her, I realized the full error of my ways based on her photos.

The Scotland editor will be by in the coming weeks I'm sure to hear your tips related to saving money there.>>>>

You're goping to ask the Scots how to penny pinch? You're going to need bigger servers!

Author: Cate_W
Date: 03/26/2008, 10:06 am

I love Pret a Manger, Wagamama, and GBK. Any other ideas for inexpensive meals out?

Marks & Spencer
Iceland Groceries (Meal Deal £2.99 sandwich, crisps, 20-oz drink)
Sainsbury's (we ate at the Marble Arch store)

Thanks!

Boots the pharmacy to a meal deal for £2.99 for a sandwich or pasta sald, snack (eg crisps, fruit bag or chocolate bar, and a drink. Boots are everywhere and the larger the store the wider the choice of sandwiches.

They are great for lunches although the best sandwiches go quite quickly as many office workers buy them

"However, Wales is actually covered within the England book. "

The Welsh won't like that.

Anywhere with a reasonable working population is going to have a selection of shops selling cheapish sandwiches/baguettes/whatever to workers for their lunches, roughly c.£2-5. Avoid petrol stations, railway stations, and any tourist site food sales (eg cafe at stately home) - they are almost always overpriced. Drinks tend to cost more there than they would in a supermarket - if you like soft drinks but are staying somewhere there's a fridge it would make sense to stock up i a supermarket and use fridge/minibar to chill a couple of bottles or cans overnight before you go out for the day.

A B&B will nearly always be nicer than a hotel charging the same rate.

If staying in a B&B always take advantage of the breakfast, and have it cooked unless you really can't bear hot food at that time of day. You may not need lunch then, or only want a light snack.

If driving in the countryside, you may find garden centres have cafes with reasonable prices. It's not going to be haute cuisine, but is often perfectly adequate for a light lunch or afternoon tea (usually with home made cakes etc), and will be cheaper than a teashop in the centre of a town or village.

In the evenings, pubs are cheaper than restaurants, although food is variable. Chain restaurants are sometimes cheap too, although not necessarily worth it.

Buses are cheaper than trains or hiring a car, but are generally less convenient and take longer than either. If travelling by train get your tickets well in advance - there are significant savings to be made, but at the expense of flexibility.

Using ATMs: make sure the ATM deosn't charge. They are required to say by law if they do, but you'll always be safe with one from the Nationwide buidling society, who don't charge on principle.

Masala Zone is a Wagamama-like chain of restaurants with an Indian theme. Great value (2-course lunch or pre-6.30 meal for £8.35!) and delicious with branches over London - www.masalazone.com .

bookmark

We'll be in London in June. Thanks!

I love the Indian YMCA hostel in Fitzroy Square (Warren Street Tube Station, or walk from bus stops on Tottenham Court Road or Euston Road). Great tasting Indian food at incredible prices.

http://www.indianymca.org/

Wagamama for Japanese food - great filling bowls of noodles or rice for less than 12 GBP a head. but get there early - the queues start from 7pm.

Also under 16y olds are free on buses, so try to work out the system - it's not too hard to do, and the cheapest way to get around London. Day passes for adults are 3.50 GBP. Yes, you will often find you go past your stop, or get off too soon, but it's not the end of the world, and never too far to walk back/forward to where you wanted to be!

I second the recommendation of London Walks (www.walks.com). Most of the guides are realio, trulio professional actors, so for a mere six pounds you get not just a brilliant walk but a fabulous performance! I hope to go on three or four next visit.

You'd save a great deal more by just downloading walk routes from www.walklondon.org.uk

great thread, I'm hoping to be in London later this year, the info here has helped me budget/plan my trip. Thanks

Last October I paid under USD 100 per night for the Hilton Islington. The room was fine but souless. The best thing was the location. The station is very close.

It's very lively and has lots of great inexpensive restaurants. I splurged on a three course french meal (main was duck) with a kir royale and a glass of wine for under GBP 20.00.

Perhaps I'm stating the obvious here, but with the exchange rate so high, I'm stocking up on every supply I could possibly need on my trip: batteries, wet wipes, vitamin supplements, band aids, etc. If I run out, I can still buy supplies there, but when I know I'll use them and not tote them back, I may as well buy them here.

I once alighted from the HOHO bus and, out of water and thirsty, I bought a bottle of water for two pounds. Aaaiiieee. After that, I started to stash a few bottles in my hotel room, and always carry an extra.

Sorry - should have mentioned that price was through priceline.

i agree with cw...wetherspoons also has very cheap illy coffee and they generally know how to handle a real ale....a pint here is cheaper than almost anywhere. the clientele and atmosphere are a little better after the smoking ban. many also do breakfasts i believe. you can certainly do better for food but considering the price, the value is clearly there and the places are usually quite well managed.

you can also go to the bakeries in chinatown for very cheap snacks. for a light lunch you can spend about £2 for some buns that will fill you up.

Also try pubs that are off the tourist path...the beer tends to be cheaper and the food better as well! There are tonnes of pubs in residential looking areas, and just around the corner from the major streets.

Also have a picnic in the parks! You can buy alcohol and great ready made sandwiches in Tesco or any grocer and sit in Hyde Park for example and enjoy a sunny day.

London Walks Explorer days (www.walks.com) provide great value. You get 2 walks (one in the morning and one in the afternoon) for 12 GBP + rail travel costs. You get the advantage of group travel rates and top notch guides for a fraction of the price of some organized tours!

ttt

Excellent recommendations!

Great information....bookmarking

Based in part on opinions expressed here, Herself and I tried Pret a Manger when in London last week.

That's it done. Won't do it again.

<<<KatieH:
Wales is actually covered within the England book.>>>

*blink*

Crikey, don't you mean the "England and Wales" book? That's a bit like including Canada in the USA book!

My "cheap" tip is to pick up a pub guide, while prices vary and they're not always the cheapest option for a B&B, staying in a five hundred year old coaching inn and chatting to the locals is an education and entertainment in itself, one which can give you for free a far better "Piece of Eccentric and Old Fashioned England" than you'll get from many expensive tourist attractions.

While we were in London, we got into the habit of popping into the Tesco market and grabbing salads and sandwiches to eat in a park every day for lunch. There are beautifiul places to sit and eat wherever you go.It was perfect because we didn't have to plan a lunch stop or time our sight=seeing around meals. Have fun!

Just some pretty general money-saving comments for the U.K.

Food:
In general Pubs are cheaper than restaurants.
In general, cafes are cheaper than pubs (but usually only open till around 4 or 5PM)
Sandwiches and some pretty decent take-out food can be purchased at super-markets and other places (like Boots (drugstore))
A hearty breakfast at a B&B makes lunch unnecessary.

Accommodation
B&Bs (and gueshouses) are usually better value for the money than hotels and motels.

B&Bs outside of towns are generally cheaper than those inside of towns (and usually have better parking).

If you don't mind sharing a bathroom, you can save a lot of money (when I was single and travelled on my own I did this a lot).

Youth Hostels are a great alternative for those on a really tight budget. In my young and single days (late 20s), I stayed at a lot - my favorite was Carbisdale Castle in Scotland.

Public Transportation is always cheaper than renting a car but personally I like the flexibility of a car. However if you are mostly going to be in cities (like London, Edinburgh etc) a car is completely unnecessary.

Walking (except for investing in some decent maps) is free and a great way to see the countryside.

BTW IF you are intending to see a number of castles and great houses - the following is REALLY worth it:

http://www.britishheritagepass.com/

Check out the website and see if the sights you intend to go to are covered.

MandS is indeed very good for sandwiches, crisps, fruit and pop etc. Tesco is good too, and cheaper, and (unfortunately) ubiquitous in most English towns and cities.
Walking is the cheapest form of transport, and is sometimes quicker than the bus in the centre of London.
Ask for tap water in restaurants. If you don't want an alcholic drink in a pub, ask for a pint of lime and tap water or blackcurrant and water.
For travelling on certain routes, try megatrain.com
Avoid thetrainline.com and try the websites for the specific train companies. That way you won't have to pay the scandalous charges for credit and debit cards and postage (and send a sign to Trainline, which used to be a great enterprise). Try to get two single tickets rather than a return, as it could be cheaper that way.
Don't tip more than 10% in cafes, curry houses, and never in pubs, taxis, hotels. (Yes, I know many Americans will find it hard not to tip in hotels, but I stay in hotels a lot in the UK and in Europe and never leave a tip. It is simply not done.)
Scoff a big breakfast in the BandB or hotels, and take a cake or muffin for a snack if you are lucky enough to stay in a place with a big buffet breakfast.
When offered a big or small glass of wine at a restaurant, go for the latter. The waiters and waitresses are obviously told to push you to take a large one.
Borrow a library book on the country you're visiting and bring it with you, rather than buy a guide.
Happy scrimping!

If you don't want an alcholic drink in a pub, ask for a pint of lime and tap water or blackcurrant and water. >>>>

If this is all you buy - expect to get a frosty reception. If it is part of a larger order, especially one that includes food, then it's fine.

Some of the bottled non alcoholic drinks aren't pricey. I like the J20 brand which are fruit juice drinks in various flavours and usually cost about £1.50 a bottle.

''Tesco is good too, and cheaper, and (unfortunately) ubiquitous in most English towns and cities. ''

Why is it 'unfortunate' to have supermarkets in most towns? How many people in this day and age are home 9:00-5:00 and actually able to use small high street family-owned stores for all their shopping? Not that many, I'd think.

>>>>>
If this is all you buy - expect to get a frosty reception. If it is part of a larger order, especially one that includes food, then it's fine.
>>>>>

barmen don't care what you order. this is nonsense. just order a bag of crisps if this is what you want.

er...someone just suggested you never tip taxis. Wrong - taxis are one of the few things that we do tip.

I'd agree with CW that you'll get an odd response if you ask for a pint of what we call 'squash'. Just buy a soft drink if you don't want alchohol. Grown-ups don't drink squash in the UK.

I suggest that we adopt walkingaround as our very own British hooting loon.

Why let the seppos have it all their own way?

I would like to see you try and go in a pub and order just a pint of squash or a packet of crisps on it's own.

HOOT! HOOT!

For goodness sake, get real, people.
Noone gives a hoot what you order. You people who suggest otherwise must be very self-conscious or slavishly unindividual to worry about whether a barman/maid might roll their eyes at you, or - gosh - sigh lightly when you place your crisps and squash order.
I often ask for a pint of squash and water, and hold the Crispy Bacon. (But that's me - iconoclast, eh?)
Most of the bar staff in central London are from Eastern Europe and wouldn't even be able to string together a rebuke even if they did know they should be indignant at your asking for such a paltry order.
And as for taxis. Who is 'we'? I do as a I please, and am civil and polite at all times. Why the heck should I give my money away, and why should a tourist? I wouldn't give a bus driver a tip for getting me from a to b, and he has a much harder job.
It might suit Nona1 and CW to think that they are adhering to some well-known rules of the barroom, perhaps to allow themselves to feel members of a special club, but for the visitor I'd say 'ask for what you want'. They can only say no.

For visitors to the UK please tip the cabs. Don't tip anyone else (unless you must hairdressers) and round up meals over £10 but do tip the cabbies.

Do what you like in your own country and if you are abused that is ok but in UK tip the cabbies.

No I'm not one but I cannot stand another 100 line thread about tips in europe

Well there's at least two people on this thread that I wouldn't want in front of me in a busy pub. They'd probably pay by credit card too (which is a hanging offense IMHO). In fact the last time I said on here what I thought should happen to people who use credit cards in pubs I was banned because I was to graphic.

I don't tip cabbies - they earn plenty. I have pals who atre cabbies and they're minted.

Uhm, my husband and I order squash a couple of times in pubs and we were not ridiculed and forced to consume vast amounts of alcohol. The bartender didn't even blink.

the original sentence is a bit unclear and i'm not sure why everyone is going off on the squash thing. ordering a lime and soda (water) is not going to raise any eyebrows. ordering tap water alone might...however, most of the time in a busy pub, no one will know (or bother to care) if you have ordered something else and are just approaching the bar for a water. same goes for buying a single packet of crisps....it happens all the time.

anyway, i doubt anybody here is going to wander into a pub and order just tap water...the main point here is that the barmen do not keep mental notes on what you buy or don't buy to make sure you spend some magical amount that pays for the seat you occupy. it just doesn't happen. that's more how american bars work. british pubs are not about driving revenue from the customer. since barmen are generally not tipped, they really aren't bothered if you nurse your half pint for an hour or order a £1.50 lime and soda or a £3.00 pint.

and for squash, if they have it and it's easy, they will serve it...if they don't have it or it's too much of a bother to serve, they will just say they don't have it. most pub bartenders are very straightforward and aren't into sizing up customers to determine who gets invited into the vip suite and who gets unapproving looks and taken off the vip guest list. CW has a bizarre perspective on this....not sure what kind of freaky pubs he frequents.

Top quality hooting old boy. We'll give the septics a run for their money if you can keep it up.

>>>>british pubs are not about driving revenue from the customer.>>>>

The always seem to manage to part me from a decent chunk of change. I'll tell the landlord next time that he's actually running a charity.

Of course pubs care what you spend. That's their business.

If you are seriously telling me that if you go into a busy pub at lunchtime and take up a table and only order cheapskate drinks that you will be welcome.

It's true that pubs don't have a minimum charge or cover charge. That's no excuse for taking the piss.

i never said that revenues were not important to pubs. i said that pubs don't drive revenue from the customer. why don't they send staff around constantly asking if you want another drink...giving you dirty looks if they need to ask you twice or suggesting drinks that cost more. that's what they do in america. they just don't do business like that. they are passive. they don't care what you do.

nigello is right. the barman just does not care. they are not incentivised proportionally to the revenue of the bar as is the case in the tip for service model. most are just working to pay for tonight's toke or clubbing. the objective is to earn the £7/hr with the least amount of hassle. nobody cares what you order or don't order. nobody. cw is in fantasy land.

anyway, it's after 17:00...shouldn't you be clocked out by now?

Walkinaround,
Well said! I'll buy you a virtual lime and soda, and mebbe we can share a packet of Frazzles?
And to get back to the topic - please order what you want and don't be afraid of the consequences.
And if your lime and soda is more than £2 - don't pay! Pubs make lots of dosh from their overpriced lagers and spirits, so they don't need to rip you off for not drinking alcohol.
I've done just that, and got the price down to a quid or so.
I can sense CW's heckles a-risin' at my flagrant disregard of The Drinking Man's Rules, circa 1952.

Christ on a bike.

Can you lot let me know what funless hell-holes you drink in so I can avoid them.

I have this vision of moosey-faced ASBOnauts, coffin-dodgers and dole moles nursing halves of lime and soda while watching Sky (which costs money) sitting at a table (which has to be cleaned) on carpet (which has to be cleaned) in a room with electric light (which has to be paid for) and so on, feeling all righteous and shiny inside because in their twisted minds pubs don't have to make any money.

Look chaps. These people are tourists. They have spent thousands of dollars (about five quid) to come here. They can do better than taking the piss out of some blokes livelihood just because a bunch of loons on the interweb told them it was OK to do so.

If you want to drink orange squash - do it in the park. Don't deprive some bloke of money just because you're skinflints.

If you go in a pub buy a proper bloody drink (soft drinks are fine) - don't listen to these loons. They are the sort of people who go to all you can eat buffets and ask for a glass of tap water.

What has become of this country? I ask you. I blame Shirley Williams.

we are now talking about two completely different things:

1. whether or not you will be treated poorly if you don't order beyond some amount that cw thinks will provide sufficient income for the pub owner (typically a fairly large corporation) to make a profit. the answer is that you will NOT be treated poorly.

2. if a pub customer should feel some sort of obligation to order enough product for the pub owner to pay the bills. there is no answer...everyone will have their opinion.

however, i do feel a good using the pub's facilities rather than my own. given a choice, i will 'hold it' until i get to the pub in order not to waste my own water. and if the value of my consumption of the pub's amenities (heat, tele, other people's juke box selections, toilets, aircon, water, lights, chairs, napkins, etc) exceeds my spend in the pub then i feel that i can go home a winner. unfortunately free wireless is not so popular.

i then can walk home sober, refreshed and fully hydrated (dare i say 'detoxed' from so much pure tap water with free lemon slice)...all the while laughing vulgarly at the thought of my obscene city bonus and how poor my chump of a publican is.

bookmarking

semiramis - no one ever suggested thagt you have to order any alcohol so I'm not sure why you made your comment.

Walkinaround - you've changed your tune. First you said you could go into a pub and order ONLY tap water with lime, or ONLY a packet of crisps. We've said, well you could but it's not really reasonable. Now you are saying that if you've ordered other items you can order a lime and soda (different drink) or a bag of crisps, which is a completely different situation altogether. Of course if you are in a pub and someone fancies a packet of crisps you can go and get some. But you wouldn't walk into a pub, buy just a packet of crisps, and sit in the corner eating them, which is what you originally suggested is ok.

I still think squash (with specified tap water) an odd drink to order for an adult in a pub. OK, if it's a quiet lunchtime, true they won't really care. But if you sit there taking up a table at peak time nursing your 50p drink for 2 hours, honestly, they won't be pleased to see you come back.

nona...reread my posts...i have not changed anything.

i said LIME AND SODA.

i did not comment on whether tap water 'is OK'. i said that if someone goes up to the bar and orders only tap water in a busy pub, the barman will probably just assume you are part of a group that already ordered...in fact, he won't bother to try to work it out as 99.9% of the time he DOES NOT CARE...COULD NOT BE BOTHERED EITHER WAY. IT'S NOT HIS PUB.

i made it totally clear that i am not talking about what i feel 'is OK'. that's another issue. i'm talking about the likely reactions (or lack of them) that you will receive if you approach the barman and order a single bag of crisps, etc. people do this all the time and it does not raise eyebrows.

the main point is simple...the barman does not care what you order. i'm not going to argue if it's 'OK' if someone orders a bag of crisps, a single jaffa cake, 3 peanuts, just goes in to use the fruit machine, when it's 'OK' to use the toilets (half pint to urinate, pint and crisps to defecate, etc). this is not about what people think one SHOULD do in a pub or how much they feel they should spend to justify using the chair. there are a million opinions on that and i don't find that very interesting to debate.

my line of thinking has totally consistent on this.

Apologies, Nigello originally suggested ordering the tap water squash. You just defended this as an option.

OK, of course you in theory can order anything. But is it reasonable to do so or should he have advised other travellers to do this? No, I don't think so. Sure, if you're doing a flying visit to a pub you'll never go to again, who cares, but if you are staying somewhere for a week and want to re-visit one as your temporary 'local' and be on good terms with them, no, bad advice. Especially as in smaller or country pubs the person serving you will very likely be the landlord/landlady and not just barstaff.

nona...i think that i have a very different perception of pub culture. the pub culture has certainly changed greatly over the last 20 years or so. thankfully, however, one thing that is constant is the ability to go into a pub and order what you want without being made to feel like you are a flint...not being looked down upon for what you order or don't order...not being 'upsold' when you order a cheap wine, etc. it's just a place to relax and not worry about this rubbish. if you want this sort of atmosphere, go to the clubs that harry and wills go to.

we can argue the ridiculous extremes but i don't think very many foderites are going to rush into pubs and order just tap water simply because someone here says that you can likely get away with it. i think there are bigger problems in the world to worry about.

True

ACtually I did once rush into a pub shouting for a jug of water - to rush out and pour into my car which had smoke pouring out of it! And very nice they were too.

all the while laughing vulgarly at the thought of my obscene city bonus >>>>>

This explains a lot.

Corney and Barrow is not a pub.

And finally by the power invested in me (by myself) I declare you to be Her Majesty's Hooting Loon Persuivant to the Fodorite Community.

It's about time we brits had a hooter of our own.

bookmarking

>>It's about time we brits had a hooter of our own<<

Page 3's been going quite a while already, surely.

I don't know if you've seen page 3 lately. The cpation to Hayley, 19, Cardiff is the poppet's view on an issue of the day such as the credit crunch or interest rates.

It's an interesting conjunction of ideas.

What a wonderful thread! (Well, most of it anyway! ) Thanks for starting it, Katie. And for all of the great responses.

My son and I are going to be staying a week longer than my husband after our daughter's June wedding in Ireland. We're considering using it to go to London and Edinburgh (with a possible stop in York). But can do it only if we find ways to drastically cut costs.

Although I'm not sure it'll work for us on this trip, I loved your info on the YHA hostels, Lee Ann. I'm going to look into it, just in case.

I'm very encouraged by all the posts about eating economically. I particularly like the idea of eating supermarket sandwiches in a park. But is there any type of "street food" in London? I mean anything comparable to eating crepes in Paris? And do fish and chip places (chiperies?) tend to be inexpensive? Or is that a meal best gotten at a pub?

But is there any type of "street food" in London? I mean anything comparable to eating crepes in Paris? >>>>>>>

Yes. Sandwiches.

And do fish and chip places (chiperies?) tend to be inexpensive?>>>>>>

Depends what yopu mean by inexpensive. Fish ain't cheap these days so fish n chips is around a fiver to take away - more if you're eating in. There are cheaper options lik epies. But Americans can't cope with British pies. The big softies.

Or is that a meal best gotten at a pub?>>>>

The very LAST place you should buy fish n chips is in a pub. Very few do it well. The few that can do it charge a fortune.

Hi CAPH52 - congratulations on your daughter's wedding! As C_W mentioned, you won't find much in the way of street food as you're thinking in London. When I was there in the fall there were chestnuts outside the British Museum; in the summer I've seen a small produce/drink stand near Trafalgar Square. That's about it. No New York hot dog stands or anything like that. But there are Marks & Spencers, Tesco Expresses and Sainsburys all over with a selection of prepared foods.

I've actually not had fish and chips in London, but I know there are several threads on here with some recommendations. I think there's a place in Bloomsbury (Leigh Street, perhaps?) that's gotten some good reviews here.

I think there's a place in Bloomsbury (Leigh Street, perhaps?) that's gotten some good reviews here.>>>

That's the North Sea Fish Bar. Bloody good it is too(but not cheap for the restaurant)

Thanks, CW. And, jent, thanks for the congrats and the info!

>>Although I'm not sure it'll work for us on this trip, I loved your info on the YHA hostels, Lee Ann. I'm going to look into it, just in case.<<

You're welcome! Do check on hostels; YHA's London Central just opened last year, and the one in York looks good.

Lee Ann

Thanks, Lee Ann! Since you mentioned that you hadn't stayed in one in London, I thought maybe it wasn't a good option for London. But I'll definitely check it out! The one in York too. I assume I'll be able to google them?

This may be an odd question, but can you have a bottle of wine in your room? Seems to me I've read that you can't have alcohol in your room if you stay in university housing.

Hi again, Lee Ann. I found the website. And the price is certainly good! As is the location of that new one in London. But you're sure this 56 year old mom wouldn't be out of place in a youth hostel?

I did London twice on the absolutely broke scale. First off-- do the free sights. The museums, the British Library... the markets, the views from the Thames. You can see most of the things that London has to offer for free. Wander down those weird sidestreets and see what lies at their ends. Do your research before you go, and know all the tourist walks. Know that places that charge admission often have some free or cheap options.

Plan for a few splurges. Westminster Abbey and the Tower of London are two that come to mind. I've gotten into lots of churches by attending services, but Westminster isn't that sort of church. If you want to see the tombs and historical parts, be prepared to pay admission. No one at Westminster turns a blind eye to wandering "worshipers." That said, I've wandered into St Paul's with nary a question asked on a Sunday morning. My other recommended splurge is a walk with the LONDONWALKS group. They have a website that describes all the walks they offer. I've been on three; they were all top-notch and totally worth the 5 or 6 pounds they charged (as of 2005.)

Have a couple drinks at a pub. If you only have one drink at each pub on your sightsee list, you will pay full price each round. But if you find a nice pub, preferably uncrowded, and settle down, you may get a buy-back, or someone may buy a round for you.

Eat a good, filling lunch. Lunch is way cheaper than dinner (even if it is sometimes the same food.) Fill up at lunch and breakfast, and have a small, cheap dinner at a fast food place or sausage stand. Or eat a really early dinner at 4pm, if you find a place that offers an early-bird special.

Remind yourself that your trip is not about meals. Take pleasure in cheap Cadbury chocolates at Tube Stations or Scottish shortbread in convenience stores. Eat from sausage vendors and other street food. Buy fruit, veggies or prepared foods at markets and take them back to your hostel or hotel. Eat in less touristy areas-- I had reasonable meals in Bayswater and Islington, for example. Lots of people knock Wetherspoons here, but their cheap pub food is edible, if not authentic, and can be a lifesaver. Take pride in being cheap!


The best advice, of course, is simply to research as much as possible, discover all possible discounts and free sights, and don't get swayed by emotion. If you do (and we all do sometimes,) just go cheaper the next day. Expect that at least one night you will go totally off budget, plan accordingly and adjust your budget as needed. Have fun!