Basque Country, Barcelona, Andorra & France (Biarritz, Bordeaux)
Mar 19th, 2009, 02:01 PM
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Basque Country, Barcelona, Andorra & France (Biarritz, Bordeaux)
Hello,
Looking for ideas on a summer trip and came up with Basque Country. I found cheap tickets to Barcelona and we are arriving July 3 through 12. I've been to Barcelona and because I love it so much, decided to stay 2 days. Following this, we rent a car and drive up to Andorra for a day, and from there to Basque Country for 5-6 days, before making a drive back via Zaragoza on the 12th and catching an evening flight. Some questions:
What is the main drag in Andorra in the summer? Sights? Activities?
Should I attempt to make a day trip from San Sebastian or Biarritz to Bordeaux? Is it a beautiful city? Worth it?
What are the main things to do in Baque Country? (Besides beach in San Sebastian & Guggenheim in Bilbao)
What other towns should we visit?
Thanks so much!
SS
Looking for ideas on a summer trip and came up with Basque Country. I found cheap tickets to Barcelona and we are arriving July 3 through 12. I've been to Barcelona and because I love it so much, decided to stay 2 days. Following this, we rent a car and drive up to Andorra for a day, and from there to Basque Country for 5-6 days, before making a drive back via Zaragoza on the 12th and catching an evening flight. Some questions:
What is the main drag in Andorra in the summer? Sights? Activities?
Should I attempt to make a day trip from San Sebastian or Biarritz to Bordeaux? Is it a beautiful city? Worth it?
What are the main things to do in Baque Country? (Besides beach in San Sebastian & Guggenheim in Bilbao)
What other towns should we visit?
Thanks so much!
SS
Mar 19th, 2009, 02:07 PM
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No, don't bother going all the way to Bordeaux. Your time is limited. I wouldn't even go as far as the Atlantic, though Biarritz is great (St.-Jean-de-Luz is even better), and I'd even question Andorra.
Mar 19th, 2009, 04:23 PM
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Andorra was a tourist attraption [<i>sic</i>] already 40 years ago--mainly a duty free haven. The Pyrenees are beautiful almost everywhere, no need to go to Andorra. But do go to Taüll for the frescoes (that's on the Spanish side) and the Cirque de Gavarnie for the impressive scenery (that's on the French side).
Mar 20th, 2009, 02:05 AM
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I haven't been in Andorra since May 2004. We did some 15 hiking routes over there and it was nice and easy.
The driving took quite a lot of time, because the roads are very slow. I've heard that it has become much worse, because of the traffic - especially during the summer months June, July and August!
Instead of going to Andorra I would consider visiting the Pyrenees mountains in Spain. The valleys of Ordesa and Benasque (in Huesca, Aragon) for example are fantastic.
You can study the routes and views here:
http://www.topwalks.net/en/index.htm
Under Huesca and Aragon, choose Nature park Posets-Maladeta or National park Ordesa and Monte Perdido, and you will find the routes in Ordesa and Benasque valleys. There are a lot of photographs in this site.
I dare to say that these routes on Spanish Pyrenees are much more interesting than the ones in Andorra. And there are very good information on them available.
The driving took quite a lot of time, because the roads are very slow. I've heard that it has become much worse, because of the traffic - especially during the summer months June, July and August!
Instead of going to Andorra I would consider visiting the Pyrenees mountains in Spain. The valleys of Ordesa and Benasque (in Huesca, Aragon) for example are fantastic.
You can study the routes and views here:
http://www.topwalks.net/en/index.htm
Under Huesca and Aragon, choose Nature park Posets-Maladeta or National park Ordesa and Monte Perdido, and you will find the routes in Ordesa and Benasque valleys. There are a lot of photographs in this site.
I dare to say that these routes on Spanish Pyrenees are much more interesting than the ones in Andorra. And there are very good information on them available.
May 18th, 2009, 02:22 PM
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I went through france from San Sebastian to Barcelona, criss-crossing the Pyrenees.
I loved San Sebastian.
I loved driving along the French Basque coast.
I found St Jean de Luz pointlessly touristy. I more enjoyed the lower key port of Ciboure, which is right at its toe-step.
I wiggled in and out and all around the French and Spanish Pyrenees, spending nights in Cauterets and Aix-en-Thermes. I wish I had spent a bit of time hiking around Pont d'Espagne. I had been told Andorra was an ugly place that sucked in duty-free hounds, but I still have a twine of regret I didn't follow my nose all the way to the high peaks. The mountain driving can be addictive.
I spent nights in Collioure -- which was so touristy cute I hated it. I used it as a base to visit Perpignan, but if I had it do over again, I would have stayed in Perpignan (or Foix) and gone to Narbonne or perhaps Carcassone.
I spent nights in Cadaques. It's pretty and has a sweet hippy-dippy culture, but it is a pain to get in and out of for day trips, and for the feel of a "white village" Spanish-Catalonian beach town, I much preferred Calella da Palafrugell, which could be used as a base for forays into the Pyrenees foothills of Catalonia, and some rather fascinating towns of the plains as well (like Girona, Vic and Castello d'Empuries).
If I had it to do all over again I would not visit Bilbao, or St Jean de Luz (although I would visit the French Basque coast). I would spend more time on both the Spanish and French side of the Pyrenees out of my car, doing a bit of high peaks hiking. I would skip St Bertrand des Comminges or St Jean Pied Pont or other quaint tourist towns in preference of high-peaks vistas and walking. I would skip Collioure in favor of the funkier Banyuls sul Mer, but skip them both to spend more time in Catalonia.
Hope that helps!
I loved San Sebastian.
I loved driving along the French Basque coast.
I found St Jean de Luz pointlessly touristy. I more enjoyed the lower key port of Ciboure, which is right at its toe-step.
I wiggled in and out and all around the French and Spanish Pyrenees, spending nights in Cauterets and Aix-en-Thermes. I wish I had spent a bit of time hiking around Pont d'Espagne. I had been told Andorra was an ugly place that sucked in duty-free hounds, but I still have a twine of regret I didn't follow my nose all the way to the high peaks. The mountain driving can be addictive.
I spent nights in Collioure -- which was so touristy cute I hated it. I used it as a base to visit Perpignan, but if I had it do over again, I would have stayed in Perpignan (or Foix) and gone to Narbonne or perhaps Carcassone.
I spent nights in Cadaques. It's pretty and has a sweet hippy-dippy culture, but it is a pain to get in and out of for day trips, and for the feel of a "white village" Spanish-Catalonian beach town, I much preferred Calella da Palafrugell, which could be used as a base for forays into the Pyrenees foothills of Catalonia, and some rather fascinating towns of the plains as well (like Girona, Vic and Castello d'Empuries).
If I had it to do all over again I would not visit Bilbao, or St Jean de Luz (although I would visit the French Basque coast). I would spend more time on both the Spanish and French side of the Pyrenees out of my car, doing a bit of high peaks hiking. I would skip St Bertrand des Comminges or St Jean Pied Pont or other quaint tourist towns in preference of high-peaks vistas and walking. I would skip Collioure in favor of the funkier Banyuls sul Mer, but skip them both to spend more time in Catalonia.
Hope that helps!
May 21st, 2009, 07:14 AM
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I was in Andorra last summer. I'm glad I went because I'd wanted to go since I was a kid but I wouldn't go again and I wouldn't make a day trip there from Carcassonne.
Instead I'd go to Foix and/or Mirepoix if you're looking to get out of Carcassonne for a day.
The prices in Andorra were no bargains for me in the electronics/camera line of things... they are less expensive in Canada where I live. Booze and cigarettes seemed cheap but it's a long way to go to get them and the French were checking cars on the way back to France...
Rob
Instead I'd go to Foix and/or Mirepoix if you're looking to get out of Carcassonne for a day.
The prices in Andorra were no bargains for me in the electronics/camera line of things... they are less expensive in Canada where I live. Booze and cigarettes seemed cheap but it's a long way to go to get them and the French were checking cars on the way back to France...
Rob
May 21st, 2009, 08:17 AM
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Personally, I think Foix is a dump. And I highly doubt you'd find Collioure or St-Jean-de-Luz over-touristed unless you came to them with the jaded attitude of someone who already lives on the Med and can wander to more remote spots anytime at whim. Collioure is crowded in summer, like lots of places along the shore in Europe. It's an artists colony, and that makes for an interesting atmosphere, not to mention its lovely setting. St-Jean-de-Luz has some fascinating history, as well as a beautiful setting and some fabulous food and charming hotels. Biarritz is big and glitzy - the most popular surfing venue in Europe and a grand casino. It's all good.
May 21st, 2009, 10:19 AM
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First of all, i didn't live on the med when I went to Collioure.
It's not only over touristed -- there's tourists everywhere you look! -- it's kitschy in its approach to art and the art history of the area.
I'm hardly jaded. I've never liked the kinds of tourism you and Maribel urge on other people. Even innocents abroad can feel that away -- but St Cirq, you are just so stuck in your own head.
It's not only over touristed -- there's tourists everywhere you look! -- it's kitschy in its approach to art and the art history of the area.
I'm hardly jaded. I've never liked the kinds of tourism you and Maribel urge on other people. Even innocents abroad can feel that away -- but St Cirq, you are just so stuck in your own head.
May 21st, 2009, 10:35 AM
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For the OP, here's a complete album of all the kitsch in Collioure:
http://photos.linternaute.com/paysville/8322/collioure/
http://photos.linternaute.com/paysville/8322/collioure/
May 21st, 2009, 11:04 AM
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SShprints,
If you're still in the market for information about the Pays Basque, coast and inland, here's a handy page, with photo albums of all the municipalities, from Urrugne to Ciboure to St-Jean-de-Luz.
www.terreetcotebasques.com/home/index.php?L=2
And for the Spanish side,
from Bilbao to the Urdaibai Biosphere Reserve to the fishing villages of Hondarribia and Lekeitio to the resorts of Zarauz and San Sebastián look at
www.basquecountry-tourism.com/home.php
If you're still in the market for information about the Pays Basque, coast and inland, here's a handy page, with photo albums of all the municipalities, from Urrugne to Ciboure to St-Jean-de-Luz.
www.terreetcotebasques.com/home/index.php?L=2
And for the Spanish side,
from Bilbao to the Urdaibai Biosphere Reserve to the fishing villages of Hondarribia and Lekeitio to the resorts of Zarauz and San Sebastián look at
www.basquecountry-tourism.com/home.php
May 21st, 2009, 11:20 AM
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If you are looking for a cliche-idea of Europe, Fodor's messages boards and others can surely supply. Google up the word "cute" and "Collioure" and you'll get enough hits.
People -- perhaps -- understandably travel to Europe looking for something they've already got in their heads. The tourist spots are there to set up for you to find it.
Obviously sophisticated people don't want accordion players -- but some have more tolerance for little choo-choo trains either and having their art history literally -- I mean literally -- framed for them.
Of course Collioure can be photographed to show empty streets, no art kitsch displays, and no choo-choo train.
So many people enjoy this kind of tourism and the template for it, I don't why anybody being a cheerleader for Fodor's should feel threatened by my honest reactions to Collioure or express bitterly intended comments about my psyche when I made it perfectly plain to the OP these were just my subjective reactions. St Cirq seems to think she's universal woman or everybody's travel mother.
People -- perhaps -- understandably travel to Europe looking for something they've already got in their heads. The tourist spots are there to set up for you to find it.
Obviously sophisticated people don't want accordion players -- but some have more tolerance for little choo-choo trains either and having their art history literally -- I mean literally -- framed for them.
Of course Collioure can be photographed to show empty streets, no art kitsch displays, and no choo-choo train.
So many people enjoy this kind of tourism and the template for it, I don't why anybody being a cheerleader for Fodor's should feel threatened by my honest reactions to Collioure or express bitterly intended comments about my psyche when I made it perfectly plain to the OP these were just my subjective reactions. St Cirq seems to think she's universal woman or everybody's travel mother.
May 21st, 2009, 11:35 AM
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Here's the Collioure's little tourist choo-choo
http://www.collioure.com/images/lois...ouristique.jpg
Collioure helpfully puts up for you a reproduction of a real artist's painting of what you're seeing!
http://www.laroque.org/Collioure-art.JPG
Cute, huh? Those funny fauves!
http://www.paulwrightjewellery.com/b...ure-744079.jpg
better to go off season when all the chairs aren't filled, unless you like crowds of tourists
http://l.b5z.net/i/u/6006068/i/Colli...m_cafe_ezr.JPG
Really, there is more to Europe and France (and Fauvism). For many people, the whole point of traveling to Europe is snapshots of things that aren't the whole story -- but print the legend, right?
I just can't get into it. I keep seeing what's outside the frame.
http://www.collioure.com/images/lois...ouristique.jpg
Collioure helpfully puts up for you a reproduction of a real artist's painting of what you're seeing!
http://www.laroque.org/Collioure-art.JPG
Cute, huh? Those funny fauves!
http://www.paulwrightjewellery.com/b...ure-744079.jpg
better to go off season when all the chairs aren't filled, unless you like crowds of tourists
http://l.b5z.net/i/u/6006068/i/Colli...m_cafe_ezr.JPG
Really, there is more to Europe and France (and Fauvism). For many people, the whole point of traveling to Europe is snapshots of things that aren't the whole story -- but print the legend, right?
I just can't get into it. I keep seeing what's outside the frame.
May 21st, 2009, 11:37 AM
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Sorry SSH -- I was attracted to your thread because you expressed an interest in going to Andorra. Thought I'd share my decidely quirky point of view of Europe beyond the carefully framed tourist snapshot.
May 21st, 2009, 12:33 PM
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Zeppole : the "carefully framed tourist snapshot" is part of a permanent exhibition by an artist called Marc André de Figueres - http://www.ma2f.com/pages/actu.php
If you click on Galeries, then Sculptures, you will see that the frames sell for €22,000 .... but I agree, it does not have the charm and the quaintness of Andorra :
http://www.andorramania.com/vapas/pas_010.jpg
If you click on Galeries, then Sculptures, you will see that the frames sell for €22,000 .... but I agree, it does not have the charm and the quaintness of Andorra :
http://www.andorramania.com/vapas/pas_010.jpg
May 21st, 2009, 12:49 PM
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Yes, yes, I already knew that Pvyoygeuse. I have a lot of respect for Catalan culture and the Fauvists, and the concept -- at least what comes across in photos and critiques -- falls between two stools for me -- not up the best of the tradition and at the same time rather rudely biting the hand that keeps people flocking to Collioure.
I've not been to Andorra, so I have no reaction to it. My reasons for wanting to go, as I posted above, were not because I'd been told it was quaint and charming.
But I will say that I haven't got any problem with people coming to Europe and wanting to see only "charm and quaintness." Not do I have a problem with people coming to Europe to find and confirm the pictures they already have in their head of it -- which doesn't include ipermarkets, right?
What I have a problem with is insisting this a superior form of travel (?) or most especially that these small, isolated places, which have been hived off tourism, means you've been to Europe! Or even -- get this -- since the best place for miles around. You've just seen the most popular one. All along the med there are places as pretty as Collioure that American tourists never go to because they are afraid to go someplace not recommended by a chorus of people pushing quaint.
Europe is a really dynamic place -- and most of it still beautiful. Only tiny parts of it are picture perfect and, increasingly, with the help of the tourist industry large and small, they are becoming culturally unmoored.
I've not been to Andorra, so I have no reaction to it. My reasons for wanting to go, as I posted above, were not because I'd been told it was quaint and charming.
But I will say that I haven't got any problem with people coming to Europe and wanting to see only "charm and quaintness." Not do I have a problem with people coming to Europe to find and confirm the pictures they already have in their head of it -- which doesn't include ipermarkets, right?
What I have a problem with is insisting this a superior form of travel (?) or most especially that these small, isolated places, which have been hived off tourism, means you've been to Europe! Or even -- get this -- since the best place for miles around. You've just seen the most popular one. All along the med there are places as pretty as Collioure that American tourists never go to because they are afraid to go someplace not recommended by a chorus of people pushing quaint.
Europe is a really dynamic place -- and most of it still beautiful. Only tiny parts of it are picture perfect and, increasingly, with the help of the tourist industry large and small, they are becoming culturally unmoored.
