Sorry!
A search result will usually note up-to-date information. It will also provide accurate information and the information can be down-loaded for later reference. Perhaps instead of,"Please, do a search.", suggest an address.

lyb,
You say that some people don't come to this site for months and months. Indeed so, they only come when they are preparing a trip. But nothing can assure you that the people who have the answers to your questions come to this site everyday... So, to do a search is a rather intelligent thing to do, don't you agree, especially when someone who tries to help remembers that this subject has been treated before...

I disagree, I think being asked to do a Search makes a lot of sense, and often results in many more relevant answers than you will find just relying responses to the question.
I also think that many 'new' people do not realise that this option is available at first and are then alerted to it.

Do a search is great advice for a newcomer, and helpful for everyone else who has posted a message as well. Every unnecessary message added to the queue pushes someone else's inquiry further down the list where it is less likely to be seen.

lyb, I'm sorry that you feel that "Do a search" is unwelcoming. As a Fodorite who has used these boards for years, and who gladly contributes details and help upon request, I must say that it is also rude for newcomers to arrive on this board, NOT do a search, and then ask basic questions, expecting long customized answers. Just how many times should I re-write the information about the London Pass, or the various London tube passes?

Many of the discussions that would turn up in a search include long series of comments from several people. Surely you're not suggesting that the wheel get re-created every time someone needs one?

I have advised people to do searches, just the way I was and have been advised to do one.
How else do some people learn how this site even works?
That is why the search option is here, to help people with their research.
Some might say it in kinder tones than others but I think it is all helpful.

Dear lyb,

I see your point, but I can't agree. Suggesting that people do a search is one way of teaching them how to do their own research.

Also, it is like looking through the stacks in a library. You find things that you weren't looking for.

lyb,
There's no question that _how_ a newcomer is advised to do a search has a lot to do w/their initial impression of the site.

<semi rant on>
However.... once you _have_ been around this forum for a while, there are times when you see so much duplication and/or , dare I say it, annoying/stupid/self-centered questions that you flat out want to scream! It's a tribute to the folks here that there has been so little screaming.

So while you may think "do a search" is a testy or unwelcome answer; in reality it could be considered very kind when one considers the alternative(s). And, as previously noted a wealth of info. awaits one who takes the time to search.
</semi rant off>

Sometimes if I see a question (that I know has been asked many times) and the post is not getting many responses, I'll recommend a search knowing that the requestor will find the answers they're looking for.

Newcomers shoudl be told that there's a wealth of information hidden in there and most of the general questions can be answered many times over by searching. There's nothing wrong with that.

lyb, I'll go out on a limb and say I'm mostly with you on this. If you've only been reading this forum for a month or so, you have actually seen a kinder and gentler set of responses. Before registration, there were lots of posts which I found disagreeable, implying that the person asking a question was rude and lazy for asking before doing research.

My belief is that people asking questions here believe they are doing research. Showing a newcomer how best to use this forum by using the search function can be helpful and is not necessarily rude and unwelcoming, but the tone of many such "do a search" posts is.

Anonymous, the answer to your question of how many times you must rewrite the information about passes in London is "none". You need only write when and what you want. If you believe the question is redundant and the questioner rude, as you say, why would you answer at all? We are all here because we want to be, because we find it enjoyable to talk about travel. I don't think anybody here is posting out of an altruistic obligation to give advice.

Nikki- I agree with your post 100%. This forum has become much nicer to read since registration. I think many times people may take something posted as being rude. That is a problem with any type of e-correspondence. The tone the writer (sometimes) intends to use can be lost. I think advising someone to do a search is fine- its all in how its worded.

I often advise people to do a search, particularly when I know there is good past info out there. That said, I think the search function leaves a lot to be desired. About half my searches result in nothing even though I know I have seen a thread on the subject before. And if you are looking for the Hotel de France.... Rex says Boolean searches work here, but I can never remember exactly what to put.

Boolean searches DO work here, and they really are no different from Boolean searches anywhere. Parenthese work too. Moreover, it is now possible to SHOW HOW to do a search, by using "copy shortcut" on the URL that gives the search results.

For example, to search "newcomers AND search"

click on

http://www.fodors.com/forums/pgTopics.jsp?fid=2&searchText=newcomers+and+search

Best wishes,

Rex
rbmd@usa.net

Thanks, Rex. I did try a couple of simple searches a week or so ago and had no luck with quotes or + signs, but today it is working fine and dandy.

I have to say that I do do it sometimes, but I also try to do it nicely. I'm aware that I must have been around some weeks before I even relaised there was a search function on the Board.

But there's stuff on here I've posted a dozen times. the basic information doesn't change. I don't want to type it every time which is why I save stuff and paste it in; but everyone else must get bored reading the same stuff over and over There's a bit of text I used which says "perfidious Albion" and I suspect a search on "perfidious" would get at least half a dozen hits. As would a search on Loch Leven, about which I was writing.

there is a place for telling newbies how to use the search function, so long as it's done right.

I agree that it's fine to tell someone to do a search. I am not comfortable passing along other poster recommendations. I agree with baldrick that if I remember seeing the topic posted, I pass on that on to the person asking the question. I have found so much information on my own just doing searches. It's a valuable tool to use to search this site.

Don't get me wrong, I think advising someone to do a search is a really good thing. However, what I've often noticed is that people are told to do a search in an abrupt manner. Many it is due to e-correspondence as someone mentioned.

But I've some responses where the person who replies says outright, "this subject has been covered enough"....that's the ones I have more problems with.

I have no problems with the ones that suggest that if they do a search the person asking will get more questions, I think that's great. It also lets the newcomer know that searches are possible. I know that it helped me when I first started my research for my trip.

So, to recap advising to do searches is great, but telling someone that the subject has "been covered enough" I don't think is good. Ah...the problems of communicating through email.

Overall, people probably get more varied and complete results through a search. They probably get a better warm and fuzzy if they can interact with others for that follow-up question and feel it's more personal.

What someone new (being relatively new myself) might not understand is how often this stuff comes up and exactly why more seasoned users are here answering questions (much more to hear alternate answers than to be heard in my case). That's where the search comes in. So as not to create an exodus of the knowledgeable but bored.

*Kindly* suggesting a search be done and how to do a search, without being patronizing or dismissive is a very positive 'teach a man to fish' thing to do.

I do notice however that Fodor's help link/FAQ is very, very light in the mechanismns behind the search function. No where does it mention the boolean capabilities. True, these work on Google too, but many surf in here not knowing much about computers OR Greece.

I'd suggest starting a "How to do a search" thread, but then it would eventually drop below 50.... and we'd have to suggest that people do a search for it.

lyb.
If you would do a simple search, you would find that in the last year (ie Apr 16, 2002 onwards) there have been 3,352 threads on which posters have recomended a 'search'. This is no lie, simply a statistic.

Check it out for yourself. Just do not ask me how.

Whatever I know, I'll share, because in early years, I wish I had me for me!

Ici, I'm going to do a search on that one!

Now, did I tell you off???

Ha Ha.

Watch my tailflip.

Icithecat, Now you may tell me to do a search for this one, making it 3,353, but are you to be pronounced "eesee" as in French, "here is" the cat. Or are you "icky" the cat, like in English. I'm thinking it's the English pronunciation, right?

gocats.
My real name is not 'icithecat'. Gofigure.

I am Ici the french and the cat in English.

Or
Hereislechat

Icithecat,

You must be feeling schizophrinic these days!

I am gocats because I want the cats to get the heck off my lap and go away, not because I like my cats. I feed them; I pat them; I change their kitty litter. They think I'm their slave!

I am 2002 because I forgot it was already 2003 when we had to pick our names. Can you believe it?

Not to PS myself, but PS.

I guess we are opposites, almost. You are Ici the cat, and I am Go the cat!

Well.
The older we get , the more chronologically challenged we become.

Yeah. One year is like the next. It's like locker combinations or phone numbers, especially cell phone numbers. You run through so many in a lifetime, you eventually figure out that you are wasting valuable storeage space on the latest number, which will soon be replaced with yet another. And programming a VCR. I won't even go there. Good night. Sleep gives my filing system time to reset itself!

This seems to be a popular thread, so I thought I would squeeze in a couple of questions:

1) I'm going to have a free day in Switzerland in June. Is Italy a realistic day trip?

2) What should I wear in Europe?

3) Will I be attacked by a terrorist?

4) I'm spending 5 weeks in the UK, France, Italy, Spain, Switzerland, Greece, Germany, Austria, and Portugal. Can someone recommend an itinerary?

Thanks for your help everyone!!!