a minor miracle in Italy
Oct 28th, 2013, 06:09 AM
#1
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a minor miracle in Italy
We recently took an 11 night cruise from Venice to Rome. We started the trip with a 3 night stay in Cernobbio to enjoy the Italian Lakes. On the first morning there, DH discovers that he has not brought his high blood pressure medicine - aaarrggh - I pack almost everything for us but figured he could be relied upon to bring his meds! I'm thinking this is not going to be easily resolved, either while in Cernobbio or on the ship - thinking emails / faxes to doc., in US or visit to doc. in Italy. But we decide to first go to the local pharmacy.
First thing Monday morning we head to the little pharmacy in Cernobbio. We ask the woman pharmacist:
"Do you speak English"
"Uh-huh"
"We are on vacation, I did not bring my blood pressure medicine, Losartin"
"Uh-huh"
"I need a 14 day supply of this medicne"
"Uh-huh"
She disappears for several minutes, we are not sure she has understood or what we may need to do next. She returns with a pack of 20 Losartin pills.
"10 euros", she says.
We are nearly in a state of shock - I cannot imagine what hoops we would have had to jump thru here in the US OR how much it might have cost us. I believe 10E's is cheaper than we pay here for this prescription. Besides being extremely thankful, it also gave me pause for thought about our wonderful medical system here in the U.S.
First thing Monday morning we head to the little pharmacy in Cernobbio. We ask the woman pharmacist:
"Do you speak English"
"Uh-huh"
"We are on vacation, I did not bring my blood pressure medicine, Losartin"
"Uh-huh"
"I need a 14 day supply of this medicne"
"Uh-huh"
She disappears for several minutes, we are not sure she has understood or what we may need to do next. She returns with a pack of 20 Losartin pills.
"10 euros", she says.
We are nearly in a state of shock - I cannot imagine what hoops we would have had to jump thru here in the US OR how much it might have cost us. I believe 10E's is cheaper than we pay here for this prescription. Besides being extremely thankful, it also gave me pause for thought about our wonderful medical system here in the U.S.
Oct 28th, 2013, 06:59 AM
#5
Just a comment, one of the reasons I invest in the US health market is the crazy prices your closed market system generates, talk about restraint on trade the place seems to operate on the guild system...
Oct 28th, 2013, 07:40 AM
#6
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<i>the crazy prices your closed market system generates, talk about restraint on trade the place</i>
Prices are probably more heavily regulated in Europe. The basic question is: are we subsidizing European drug prices because otherwise the pharmaceuticals would operate at a loss, or are they just making unconscionable profits in the States?
Prices are probably more heavily regulated in Europe. The basic question is: are we subsidizing European drug prices because otherwise the pharmaceuticals would operate at a loss, or are they just making unconscionable profits in the States?
Oct 28th, 2013, 07:52 AM
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<<The basic question is: are we subsidizing European drug prices because otherwise the pharmaceuticals would operate at a loss, or are they just making unconscionable profits in the States?>>
The latter.
The latter.
Oct 28th, 2013, 08:52 AM
#9
We had our carry on luggage stolen in Chile and lost all of our meds. Just went to a pharmacy and replaced them! When we realized that we had paid less than our insurance co-pay for each of them, we returned and bought more, stocked up on them. Like you, we had anticipated needing to have our doctor fax new Rxs and it was a holiday in the US.
Oct 28th, 2013, 08:57 AM
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Prince George was born in the poshest most expensive hospital in the UK. I read that the average American mother pays more than the Duchess of Cambridge paid. An American friend of mine has been quoted $4,000 for a dental implant. Goodness knows how they can justify that.
Oct 28th, 2013, 09:17 AM
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Threads like this get me started on my medications rant. My oncologist told me that I should take Arimidex for five years after my breast cancer surgery. It suppresses estrogen, which feeds breast cancer.
The first year I paid $273 per month. The second year the cost rose to $350 per month. The third year the cost was $420 per month.
When the generic was available, the cost dropped to less than $50 a month. That was when I realized that the drug companies had been raising their price in order to clean up before the generic came out. The generic had been available from India for the whole time I was taking it, but I'd been reluctant to use an important drug that was made in India.
The first year I paid $273 per month. The second year the cost rose to $350 per month. The third year the cost was $420 per month.
When the generic was available, the cost dropped to less than $50 a month. That was when I realized that the drug companies had been raising their price in order to clean up before the generic came out. The generic had been available from India for the whole time I was taking it, but I'd been reluctant to use an important drug that was made in India.
Oct 28th, 2013, 09:22 AM
#12
It's not just childbirth, but see: http://www.nytimes.com/2013/07/01/he...the-world.html
Including: "When she became pregnant, Ms. Martin called her local hospital inquiring about the price of maternity care; the finance office at first said it did not know, and then gave her a range of $4,000 to $45,000. “It was unreal,” Ms. Martin said. “I was like, How could you not know this? You’re a hospital.”"
Personal anecdote: in 2005 I fell and broke my wrist (badly) in Murren. I wound up in the emergency room in the hospital in Interlaken. I was the only patient (inconceivable in the US!). It seemed like every available doctor spent quite a while trying to set my wrist under Xray. Then I had surgery, with anaesthesia, to insert two pins, spent the night in the hospital (six person ward) and saw the doctor the next morning. The bill for that WAS THE SAME as the bill in the US for a brief out-patient surgery to take the pins out. And Switzerland is not a cheap country....
Including: "When she became pregnant, Ms. Martin called her local hospital inquiring about the price of maternity care; the finance office at first said it did not know, and then gave her a range of $4,000 to $45,000. “It was unreal,” Ms. Martin said. “I was like, How could you not know this? You’re a hospital.”"
Personal anecdote: in 2005 I fell and broke my wrist (badly) in Murren. I wound up in the emergency room in the hospital in Interlaken. I was the only patient (inconceivable in the US!). It seemed like every available doctor spent quite a while trying to set my wrist under Xray. Then I had surgery, with anaesthesia, to insert two pins, spent the night in the hospital (six person ward) and saw the doctor the next morning. The bill for that WAS THE SAME as the bill in the US for a brief out-patient surgery to take the pins out. And Switzerland is not a cheap country....
Oct 28th, 2013, 09:33 AM
#13
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Prices for drugs are so low in europe because the governments demand it. They are much higher in the US since we have a free market economy.
For many major drugs unit sales about about similar in the US, the EU and developed Asis/Pac - but all the bulk of the profits are in the US. This is also where much of the basic research is done - or done in other areas but supported by money from US sales.
For many major drugs unit sales about about similar in the US, the EU and developed Asis/Pac - but all the bulk of the profits are in the US. This is also where much of the basic research is done - or done in other areas but supported by money from US sales.
Oct 28th, 2013, 09:53 AM
#14
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I get my dog meds for Heartworm from Australia. I buy it for them both and have bought just plain ivermectin tabs to give to people that I know can't afford heartguard or interceptor. Joe's pet meds and you don't need a vet prescription. It is crazy what they charge for something to prevent something deadly for pets in the USA.
Oct 28th, 2013, 10:02 AM
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<i>They are much higher in the US since we have a free market economy.</i>
Only because Congress refused to allow price negotiating for Medicare. In fact, not everyone pays the same price for drugs. There is no such thing as a free market when a few companies can dictate the price--that's why the U.S. had (now pretty much gutted) anti-trust legislation: "United States antitrust law is a collection of federal and state government laws, which regulates the conduct and organization of business corporations, generally to promote fair competition for the benefit of consumers. The main statutes are the Sherman Act 1890, the Clayton Act 1914 and the Federal Trade Commission Act 1914. These Acts, first, restrict the formation of cartels and prohibit other collusive practices regarded as being in restraint of trade. Second, they restrict the mergers and acquisitions of organizations which could substantially lessen competition. Third, they prohibit the creation of a monopoly and the abuse of monopoly power" (from Wikipedia). It is much cheaper to get a knee replacement in Belgium (airfare and hotel stay included) than in the States with the devices produced in Indiana--if my memory of the NY Times article on the subject serves me right.
Only because Congress refused to allow price negotiating for Medicare. In fact, not everyone pays the same price for drugs. There is no such thing as a free market when a few companies can dictate the price--that's why the U.S. had (now pretty much gutted) anti-trust legislation: "United States antitrust law is a collection of federal and state government laws, which regulates the conduct and organization of business corporations, generally to promote fair competition for the benefit of consumers. The main statutes are the Sherman Act 1890, the Clayton Act 1914 and the Federal Trade Commission Act 1914. These Acts, first, restrict the formation of cartels and prohibit other collusive practices regarded as being in restraint of trade. Second, they restrict the mergers and acquisitions of organizations which could substantially lessen competition. Third, they prohibit the creation of a monopoly and the abuse of monopoly power" (from Wikipedia). It is much cheaper to get a knee replacement in Belgium (airfare and hotel stay included) than in the States with the devices produced in Indiana--if my memory of the NY Times article on the subject serves me right.
Oct 28th, 2013, 10:57 AM
#19
I had to get some pain relief for a friend of mine at a Chemist in the Champagne district. After we had exchanged money and drugs my friend, who could not speak french, being a charmer, asked if the female chemist could let him have some water to take his pill. The chemist shook her head and walked out of view to return with a glass of champagne to take the tablet. Is that ok with this drug I asked? Only if it is good champagne she answered.
Now that is service.
Now that is service.
Oct 28th, 2013, 11:26 AM
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If the name of the drug is Losartan, it should be already out of patent protection in Italy and generics are available from different source. I see prices from 7,50 to 10,00 euro for 28 pills according to different brands. I do not think any of these brands is making a loss on those prices.
As for the Swiss health system, it is based on private insurance; prices are set up so that the system is still affordable while there is some leeway for insurance companies to actually make some money.
There is a single conclusion to draw: that the US system is rigged to extract every possible dollar from the citizen. I know several Americans that, after having worked in Italy for 20 or 25 years would like to go back home now that they are retired; but they won't as they cannot afford medical expenses that are quite affordable in Italy (for now, economists are already trying to dismantle the system).
As for the Swiss health system, it is based on private insurance; prices are set up so that the system is still affordable while there is some leeway for insurance companies to actually make some money.
There is a single conclusion to draw: that the US system is rigged to extract every possible dollar from the citizen. I know several Americans that, after having worked in Italy for 20 or 25 years would like to go back home now that they are retired; but they won't as they cannot afford medical expenses that are quite affordable in Italy (for now, economists are already trying to dismantle the system).
