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2 weeks in Italy: Need views on Itinerary

2 weeks in Italy: Need views on Itinerary

Old Sep 30th, 2011, 02:55 AM
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2 weeks in Italy: Need views on Itinerary

Hi All,

We are from India and will be visiting Italy (for the 1st time) in April 2012.

Our objective is to enjoy the food and visit multiple places to soak Italy's rich heritage of Arts and history. We are planning to spend 15 nights in Italy and with current Itinerary plan to touch 10 places in Italy. We fly into Rome and fly out of Italy from Milan

Want to briefly share our plans and get answers to few specific questions:

Rome: 4 Days (3 days local sightseeing + 1 day trip to country side)
Florence: 6 Days (2 days local sightseeing+ 1X4 day trips to Pisa, Bologna, Perugia, Siena)
Venice: 3 Days (2 days local sightseeing + 1 day trip to Verona)
Milan: 2 Days (1 day local sightseeing + 1 day trip to Lake Como)

As per itinerary in addition to 4 most famous places (Rome, Florence, Venice, Milan) we are also touching 6 towns in day trips (Pisa, Bologna, Perugia, Siena, Verona, Como). We realize that so many trips will be hectic but we are ready for it if the places are worth not missing.

Question 1: We were also planning to cover Lucca but dropped it as it meant reducing Local sightseeing days in either Rome/Florence/Venice.
However want to check if one should prefer Lucca as a day trip destination over any of our 6 other day trips?

Question 2: We have currently accounted for 2 days for local sightseeing in Venice. We like the idea of spending 1 more day in Venice but this would mean removing 1 day drip destination - want advice if we should do 1 more day in Venice and if yes, which town to drop from day trip options

Question 3: Since we will be returning every night from day trips, any of these places which have limited connectivity back to Florence/Venice after 9 PM?

Question 4: How will you rank the following places (if one must)- Pisa, Lucca, Bologna, Verona, Perugia, Siena, Lake Como)

Will really appreciate your views!

Thanks for reading-Cheers!!
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Old Sep 30th, 2011, 03:31 AM
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Are you renting a car for part of the trip or just using public transport?

It doesn't appear you've allowed travel time between the cities you are staying in. I don't think you will have as much sightseeing as you think with all the travel. Your trip is also heavy on big cities. I think I would pick a hill town for a few days stay just to have a change of pace.

Siena/Florence is best by bus, but the last bus is around 9 (as is the train). I found Lucca dull, but it can easily be combined with Pisa (they are only 25 minutes apart by train).
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Old Sep 30th, 2011, 04:07 AM
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Do the "days" you list include your arrival and departure days to and from India? If yes, then you may be very tired from the time change and airline travel on your first (or more) day in Rome. The same is true for the end of the trip--your departure day will entail packing, checking out, getting to airports, and leave little or no time for sightseeing.

If you are traveling by train, you might eliminate one day trip by departing Florence by train in the early morning, stopping in Verona for a few hours (check luggage at luggage at baggage deposit in train station), and continuing on to Venice in the late afternoon. Or you might do the same with Bologna, stopping there on the way between Florence and Venice.

I have visit all the places you mention. Based on your choices, I would probably skip Bologna on this trip since it is another big city. I would choose Siena or Perugia. As mentioned, if you really want to include Lucca, combine it with Pisa.

Fortunately, day trips are optional, so once you are there, you can redesign your schedule based on how you feel then.
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Old Sep 30th, 2011, 04:16 AM
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I infer that you are traveling by train, since you ask about evening connections. Whether you are traveling by car or by train, you will spend a LOT of time in a vehicle.

Personally, I think you won't be "soaking" as much art and culture as you could if you traveled LESS -- because so much of your time will be spent in a car or on public transport.

I would definitely drop the day trip from Rome. There are marvels outside the city but none of them compares to the riches of Rome itself. Four days allows you just to scratch the surface.

Drop Perugia. It is hard to drive into -- even for me, and I spent three months there when younger. Alternatively, it will require a change of trains.

The other 3 places can be reached easily and quickly from Florence by train (or bus, in the case of Siena) -- if you are determined to make those trips.

If you want to visit Verona, it makes more sense to visit it when traveling between Venice and Milan.

Milan is my least favourite of the cities you mention. I like it because my oldest friend lives there and a visit to Italy is therefore incomplete without a visit to Milan. But much of the city is late 19th century and not all that pretty.

Others adore Milan. Mine is just one opinion.
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Old Sep 30th, 2011, 04:34 AM
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Mm, I also think you are not counting travel. You need to think about nights as well as days - e.g. 3 nights in Venice means only 2 full days, not 3. What times are your flights and are you flying into Rome & out of Milan, so maybe giving you 1 or 2 part days as well ? Far too much to fit in, anyway. Sticking to the same overall shape of trip, even if you are young & energetic, I'd suggest what you actually have is something like this

Day 1 - arrive Rome
Day 2 - Rome
Day 3 - Rome
Day 4 - Rome
Day 5 - travel to Florence
Day 6 - Florence
Day 7 - Florence
Day 8 - Florence
Day 9 - travel to Venice
Day 10 - Venice
Day 11 - Venice
Day 12 - Venice
Day 13 - travel to Milan
Day 14 - Milan
Day 15 - Milan
Day 16 - depart Milan

Personally I wouldn't do any day trips in this timeframe - in fact I wouldn't bother with Milan, either.

I don't think it's sensible for anyone else to try to rank the places you list. They are very different - e.g. Bologna is quite a big city, Siena & Lucca are very small cities and Lake Como is countryside - and we all have different tastes. You need to rank them in the order they most appeal to *you*.

If you are only staying in the cities you don't want a car, it's much easier to travel by train and/or bus.

Btw who is "we" - I assume there are no children in the equation ?
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Old Sep 30th, 2011, 04:45 AM
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Yes, Verona is on a more direct route between Venice and Milan than between Florence and Milan. With your heavy allotment of time in Florence for day trips, I thought Florence could spare an early-morning departure. After you decide narrow your day trips you may shift nights a bit, allowing more time in Venice and/or Milan to ease a stop in Verona.

As kybourbon said, do investigate travel time between these destinations. And also include connecting time, the time you have to allow to get to the station to depart, purchase tickets, find your departure location, and then later stop sightseeing and head to the station for your return. In an unfamiliar place, I suspect you should allow at about 20-30 minutes each way. So if a train to Pisa takes 1 hour, add 20-30 minutes each way--about 3 hours travel out of your day in Siena.

Check train times here:
http://www.fsitaliane.it/homepage_en.html
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Old Sep 30th, 2011, 03:18 PM
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Just noticed a typo in my comment.

"So if a train to Pisa takes 1 hour, add 20-30 minutes each way--about 3 hours travel out of your day in PISA."
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Old Sep 30th, 2011, 03:55 PM
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I agree with the other recommendations to skip Milan. We were there July 2010 and loved it, but that was our 3rd trip to Italy and I would not try to fit it in on a first trip. Also, we stayed on Lake Como for 3 nights (Bellagio) and I would not recommend a daytrip. I really didn't enjoy it during the day because it was overrun by daytrippers - much more enjoyable in the late afternoon and evenings when the crowds are gone.

I also agree with the recommendations of trying to do some locations on the way from one large city to another rather than as a daytrip. We did Verona on our drive from Bellagio to Castelrotto (Dolomites) and absolutely loved it!! What a fabulous town, had an incredible lunch at Osteria il Bertoldo (http://www.osteriailbertoldo.com/index.en.html) off the main piazza.

We have also spent 5 nights in Bologna and loved it, but have to agree with others as a daytrip it will feel like another big city. I would stick with Lucca and Siena - they are great as daytrips from Florence.

Spend your full 4 days in Rome - you will barely scratch the surface there - save the countryside for your daytrips from Florence.
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Old Sep 30th, 2011, 04:23 PM
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Sorry - too many places and not allowing any time to get from one place to another. '

You are counting quite a few days twice - you cannot count the day you travel from Rome to florence for both cities - you really count it as either city. At most it is a 1/2 day late afternoon/evening in the arrival city.

This is one of the times when less is more. Visit more museums and sights and spend less time just sitting on a train looking out the window.

If it were me I would want 6 nights in Rome, 5 in Florence (assuming 2 day trips) and 4 at lest in Venice. I don;t rally care for Milan - not nearly Italian enough - but then I;m a history buff.
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Old Sep 30th, 2011, 08:30 PM
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All (kybourbon,ellenem,tedgale,caroline,jgg,nytraveler )- Thanks a lotttt for your feedback!! Really appreciate it and am glad we posted here.

Listening to you guys, many things are very clear- club lucca with pisa, account for more time in rome, drop milan (but looks unlikely for us as flying out of Milan),cover verona on the way to venice-milan.

Based on your experiences above, we will be reworking the trip (needless to say, will get itinerary reviewed again by you experts )

One question: I know that train stations in Italy have left luggage places to leave bags for few hours - Want to know how safe and reliable are they (e.g.in verona,perugia)??? Can i absolutely trust them with my clothing bags??(ill still keep valuables/docs with me personally!)

Thanks again!
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Old Sep 30th, 2011, 08:46 PM
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Will you be in Italy on Easter Sunday, April 8th?
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Old Sep 30th, 2011, 10:00 PM
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No. We plan to take 2 weeks between April 20-May 10.
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Old Oct 1st, 2011, 04:23 AM
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Those stations that have left luggage (Deposito Bagagli) rooms are very reliable, with guards at all times. My recent experience is that you must provide a photo ID which they photocopy and attach to the luggage. However, not every station has a left luggage room. The larger stations like Roma TE, Firenze SMN, Venezia SL, Milano CLE, Bologna CLE, and Verona PN definitely have them. I'm not sure about Perugia--passed through the station quickly and didn't notice the services.

You can search for hours of operation and fees for storage for the stations I mentioned here:
http://www.grandistazioni.it/cms/v/i...0080a3e90aRCRD
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Old Oct 1st, 2011, 05:26 PM
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These posts are wonderful! While in Rome, check out www.romeconnections.com ask for Max! A wonderful tour company and amazing tour directior! Can't say enough about this memorable tour!
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Old Oct 1st, 2011, 07:32 PM
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I think if one of your major objectives is to enjoy the food, then you won't regret your visit to Milano, which has the best restaurants of all the places on your itinerary.

If you react negatively to Milano, it is a very easy city from which to take day trips. Bologna is 50 minutes away, Mantova is close, Torino is 90 minutes. All have great food and interesting sights.

I enjoy Milano -- especially at the end of trip that is all about antique Italy. The wide streets, the 24 hour modern city, the great food, the ethnic mix -- it's an important side of today's Italy, with many interesting things to see from many eras.
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Old Oct 1st, 2011, 07:34 PM
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PS: I should add that if you have pretty weather, it's not hard to get to the prettiest views on Lago di Como for lunch. Food may not be great but it is still a very, very beautiful sight.
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Old Oct 2nd, 2011, 03:54 AM
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Hi All, after going through all the suggestions, we have made few changes to the plan. Here is revised Itinerary- a big change is that now we leaving from Venice as it has better connectivity for India and therefore need help in finalizing 3 days (day 10,11,12)

Day 1 - arrive Rome
Day 2 - Rome
Day 3 - Rome
Day 4 - Rome
Day 5 - travel to Florence
Day 6 - Florence
Day 7 - Florence
Day 8 - Florence
Day 9 - Florence
Day 10 - Travel to Bologna/Milan/directly to lake como
Day 11 - sightseeing in Bologna/Lake Como
Day 12 - travel to Venice
Day 13 - Venice
Day 14 - Venice
Day 15 - Venice
Day 16 - Travel to India

We are confused what to do after florence:
Q1: Should we go to Bologna and spend 2 nights there or should be go to lake como? (me and my wife would like to go to Como but logistics looks difficult from Florence---2 Hr train to milan + 1-2 hrs wait + 1 hr train to como)-- we are not sure if traveling 5 hrs for 2 days will justify spending 1 day at the lake?

Q2: If you suggest Lake Como instead of Bologna then should one directly go to Lake Como (Skip Milan) and stay overnight in Como or stay at Milan and do lake como as day trip? In all cases, we will travel to venice on day 12.

Thanks a lot! My wife and me really appreciate your help!
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Old Oct 2nd, 2011, 08:38 AM
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Lake Como and Bologna are such different destinations that it would be hard for a stranger to tell you which place you should choose. IMO, time on a lake would be a nice break from all the time you're spending in cities.

I'm guessing you searched the train journey from Florence to Lake Como with the destination being the city of Como. Instead, search Florence to Varenna Esino, and you'll find the journey is 3.5 hours with about a 30-minute connection in Milan. From Varenna, you can easily ferry to other mid-lake towns which are a much longer ferry ride from Como. You'll still have a 4-5 hour journey to Venice from Varenna Esino.

Or, you could go to Lake Garda instead and save a few hours on the train.

Logistics aside, if I had to choose between Lake Como and Lake Garda for very short stay, I'd pick mid-Lake Como.
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Old Oct 2nd, 2011, 09:50 AM
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I was afraid to read your itinerary when I saw your user name. But this last iteration looks very good. Excellent choice to fly out of Venice.

Regarding the choice of Lake Como vs. Bologna, they are very different places. Bologna a biggish city with good food, Lake Como very beautiful with views of the lake and the Alps.

Let me throw in a third option, a couple days in Siena. It's between Rome and Florence so fits well with your itinerary. It's a small town in lovely countryside so more relaxing than another big city. We took a very memorable bus ride from the train station in Chiusi to Siena which introduced us to the beauty of rural Tuscany. Google images of Tuscany; southern Tuscany is what you'll see.
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Old Oct 2nd, 2011, 11:35 AM
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Your itinerary is looking great!! I have to agree with Mimar's recommendation of staying in Siena or somewhere in the Tuscan countryside. Being in the country (or the lakes) would be a nice break from all the cities, but Siena will be so much simpler to get to, and give you more time to relax. If you do decide to stay in Siena and one of your days in florence was meant to be a daytrip to Siena than I would take that day from Florence and add it to Rome - that would give you 4 full days in Rome which will be needed!
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