Hi hawskstetter,

Most first timers to Switzerland really enjoy seeing the Berner Oberland. I recommend you go to one of the car-free towns up in the heights, either Mürren or Wengen, to get that entire "Heidi" experience and feeling.

It will take about eight hours to get there from München with about three changes. You can get all the details for the train trip at

www.rail.ch

You can get more information about the area at

www.myjungfrau.ch

Good luck -- I would want to spend two weeks in *each* of your spots!

s

Bring a book about your Europe with you and then make definite plans while you are attending your course in Italy. It is highly possible that you'll meet up with someone and travel together. Be flexible.

Enjoy Italy!

hey! i am currently studying abroad in switzerland. i would highly recommend seeing the matterhorn and zermatt. make sure you have a fondue dinner, and sample local wines from the valais (fantastic!). Interlaken is a great town for extreme sports, so if you are interested in canyon diving, paragliding, anything along those lines- stop in there.

I am planning on doing the venice/florence/rome thing in april- any suggestions?

Hmm...one of my favorite European cities is Vienna. Might be a bit of a train ride away and it is in the opposite direction from where you're headed...but still, something to think about...

I was thinking of heading to Vienna as one of my travel weekends during the program. I've kept one open to stay flexible and see where people in my program may be heading. So I'll def keep that in mind. Thanks

I definitely in Switzerland want to go somewhere in the Alps, and the traditional Swiss town. I love mountains and would find no better place to see them than in Switzerland. So Berner Oberland would be the place to go?

Yes, I think so. Though there are tons of mountain villages in Switzerland, lots of first-timers really enjoy the villages of the Berner Oberland. You can start your research here:

www.myjungfrau.ch

s

Hi Ha,

>I leaning towards seeing Munich, Paris, and of course London.<

With only 12 days, you have 6 nights in London and 5 nights in Paris.

At most, you have 3 nights in Munich, 4 nights in Paris and 4 nights in London.

As Swan points out, it will take you an entire day to get from Munich to the BO.

You can't see it all in one visit.

You have your whole life to keep returning.

Enjoy your stay.

If Switzerland is a priority in your short time, you could take the train to Lucerne, stay there a couple days, then train to the Zurich airport and fly to London. Or take the train to Paris and then the Eurostar to London.

Lucerne is Switzerland in a capsule. Save the Bernese Oberland for when you have more time.

How does this sound for an itinerary?

June 12th -- leave Venice, head to Munich
June 13th -- Day in Munich
June 14th -- Day in Munich
June 15th -- Day in Munich, leave in evening for Paris
June 16th -- Arrive in Paris, Day in Paris
June 17th -- Day in Paris
June 18th -- Day in Paris
June 19th -- Day in Paris, Leave in evening for London
June 20th -- Arrive in London, Day in London
June 21st -- Day in London
June 22nd -- Day in London
June 23rd -- Day in London
June 24th -- Morning in London, Leave for Chicago at 12:45

What do you guys think? What would be the best way from Munich to Paris?

Not a bad itinerary. I think it's best you skip Switzerland - as you can see, you'll be plenty busy as it is.

You could take a night train, if you think you will be able to sleep on the train. Many people don't - there's the motion, the sound, the occasional stops through the night, and the sounds of your compartment-mates. You might just doze and feel pretty wrung out by the time you reach Paris. But others manage fine. There's a train that leaves at 10:45 pm and gets in at 9:30 am (no train changes). Looks to be around 119 euros.

Alternatively, you could fly. Air Berlin flies that route. Their last flight appears to leave around 4:15 pm, and you'd have to be at the airport an hours before that. So a train will give you a significant amount more time in Munich. But the flight will cost more like 49 euros.

Unless the time in Munich is precious to you, flying is probably a better deal.

I just want to give a plug for Switzerland. I've been twice and it is breathtaking. I stayed in Wengen two years ago, and it was one of the highlights of all my travels in my lifetime. To wake up every morning with that view out your window is awe inspiring. I know Paris and London are great stops, but they are also the simplest and most likely ones to return to. Just my two cents.

yea if i had one to two more days of travel i would def try to get all four in. I still have one of my extended weekends of travel open which I could use for Switzerland. I've also considered Vienna, and Dublin and also just some other town in Italy after Rome, Venice, & Florance.

Hi again,

Yes, I was going to warn you about your plan to study in Italy: it will change your life, lol! Even now you can see how -- there is so much wonderful Europe to see, and so little time. For the rest of your life, you'll be moving heaven and earth to get back regularly. Ahhhh well, join the club!

s

Hi haw,

>How does this sound for an itinerary? <

It's good.

I would take one day from Munich and add it to Paris.

If you haven't taken an overnight train before, and you are young and fit, that will be a worthwhile experience.

You will learn why most people fly.

Enjoy your visit.

I agree with Ira - less time in Munich, more time in paris!

Many, many years ago, when I was a student travelling around on a Eurail pass, i always tried to take overnight trains - save on hotel cost, more time to tour the city. I had no trouble sleeping. But that was long before the advent of cheap airlines like ryanair and easyjet.

When in Paris you might skip some of the more touristy places and stay a night in Montmartre - most of the guidebooks have some great walking tours of that area and it is not crowded with the usual students and bus loads of tourists.

I stayed there in a lovely little hotel - Ermitage.

While in Italy you have to go to San Giammignano near Florence. It is a perfectly preserved very old walled town and so completely different from the big cities that you'll see. You'd have to go by car though, but driving through Tuscany is just beautiful. Have fun!

We did a similar trip last year. Instead of Paris, we worked our way up through Germany, starting in Freiburg and heading up to Berlin after traveling east across Baviaria with a stop at the castles in Schwangau. I had planned for 2 days in Munich, but when we got there, we stumbled upon the city's 850th anniversary celebration. What a party! So we stayed an extra day. It was a highlight of the trip. Really a lot of fun, yet family-friendly, too...we had our 2 teen daughters with us and at no time were we concerned for their safety or what they might see or hear. You wil be there the same weekend if you follow the itinerary above, so there may be a party waiting for you, too. We took a bike tour to get an overview of the city, then went back to the sites we wanted to see in more detail. My kids have been begging for an "automatic do-over" all year...you'll have a teriffic time!

Lucerne is absolutely wonderful. We are going back there in May.

Your updated itinerary is fine. I would offer that Paris and London have more "sights" than Munich, and you might steal from Munich and give to Paris or London.

I would not take time away from any of those cities for Switzerland, which I find boring and overly expensive. It is pretty, but all a bit twee for my tastes. No real soul.

Thanks this has been a lot of help. I sure hope that Munich is having a party that weekend cuz it sounds like it would be an amazing time.

Hi

I actually love the Fodors Italy 2009. I've been using it to plan my trip to Italy for the summer. It actually does have a lot of good information on different things to do, eat and go in Venice, Rome and Florence as well as surrounding smaller cities.

One good website to check out especially if you plan on visiting other countries like France, London and Switzerland is www.eurocheapo.com. It does talk alot about the different railpasses you can take (http://www.eurocheapo.com/train/types.php).

I will assume you are in your early 20s if you are going on a study abroad trip.

You are wise to have a "wish list" for your weekends, ready to make suggestions to the others you will meet in the program but ready to go along if someone else has a fun idea or knows of a special event.

If we know a little more about your interests and travel style, we can probably give more personalized advice. What I enjoyed on my first trip to Europe at age 21 was quite different than my nephew who also just went at 21 because our interests are so different. Also, traveling alone can be a little different than traveling with a companion, who you might pick up in Italy as well.

If it were me in my early 20s (love mountains, wanted to see what I thought of as iconic images of Europe, like train travel) and traveling from Venice to London, I would have the following as my outline, but not commit until I was in Italy and knew I didn't want to travel with someone else after the program:

June 12th
Train from Venice to Salzburg/western Austria rather than Switzerland (B.O. is great but out of the way) for a day or two on trails and lakes. Other option is the Garmisch-Partenkirchen area.

June 13th -- Day in mountains, possibly castles

June 14th -- Train to Munich
(I did go there on my first trip, but not my choice as I don't like beer so the beerhalls didn't mean that much to me) for beerhalls, nightlife, day trip to castles if not visited from Garmisch.

June 15th -- Day in Munich, leave in evening for Paris
Night train to Paris to have the experience.

June 16th -- Arrive in Paris, Day in Paris
June 17th -- Day in Paris
June 18th -- Day trip to Versailles

June 19th -- Day or evening to London
June 20th -- Day in London
June 21st -- Day in London
June 22nd -- Day trip to Cotswolds or Oxford or...
June 23rd -- Day in London
June 24th -- Morning in London, Leave for Chicago at 12:45

My nephew, on the other hand, spent a couple of days in London and flew to northern Italy (you'd have that part covered) for his first trip and wandered the cities without specifically seeing sights or museums. Next trip he did the same from Prague to Budapest--fly in, wander around, listen to some music, go to a football game, eat some local food, then fly out. Very different travel style from me in my 20s. He would probably plan a trip of budget air flights from Venice to Munich to Berlin to Paris to Amsterdam to London (or wherever is cheapest) and not stay more than 2 nights in one city.

that def sounds like a great plan. I never thought about going to Salzburg/western Austria area to see the Mountains. I def love seeing mountains. Colorado is my favorite place for me to go to in the states. I def am a beer drinker, I love trying new beers and def want to go to Germany since I'm of German Decent. So the beer Halls interest me.

My Travel style is I want to see interesting things but I don't want to be traveling constantly. I want to be able to aimlessly walk around Munich or Paris or London and see something cool and stop or leisurely eat dinner at a restaurant and not rush through it to get to another place. I would like to be able to enjoy the places im in.

I'm pretty sure im going to be going back to Europe after I graduate in may 2010 for three weeks to celebrate that im finished in College. so if i don't see it now, i can see it in about a year.

Hi hawk,

>I want to be able to aimlessly walk around ......<

If you do a little planning ahead of time, you can aimlessly walk AND see the more interesting sights.

Enjoy your visit.

There is a place in the Dolomites where you are evidently able to take the ski gondola up to a high alpine meadow for great hiking--a weekend for you while in Italy. I've seen it described by Rick Steves and it looks great, but I haven't been.

If Colorado is your favorite then absolutely plan to go to Salzburg or Garmisch or Innsbruck on your way north. I haven't been to Innsbruck so not sure of the views/access to the mountains there. Last trip to Germany I went to little Mittenwald from Munich for a couple of days of mountain hiking recharge, but Mittenwald is just a quiet village while Garmisch or Salzburg or Innsbruck would give you larger cities with more nightlife.

You will enjoy the beers of Germany.