The similarities in our trips is uncanny!

You may be able to do more than hang out at Lake Hovsgol if you have 5 days. You may be able to meet the reindeer herders across the lake. I met some not far from most of the gers and lodges, but there are others in more remote areas that take more time to get to.

You can do hiking in this area that is very enjoyable and as intense as you wish. I think you can even overnight in the mountains if you plan ahead. I hiked with a guide, but think you can go alone.

The area between Moron (where you might fly into if you don't drive all the way to Lake Hovsgol) and Lake Hovsgol was some of the most picturesque scenery. Lake Hovsgol had the mountains, forests and lakes, of course, but that area between consisted of what I had envisioned as the quintessential Mongolia...Rolling hills and steppes for miles with herds of goats, yaks, sheep, cattle, etc.

On a return trip that I had been planning for 2009, but then postponed, I wanted to spend some time in that region. There is nothing particular to do there. I figured I'd walk up and down the steppes/hills and look at the livestock and visit with anybody who wanted to visit with a guide interpreting. Maybe stay with a family or two if it worked out for all parties involved.

However, if you attend a small Naadam in Moron, which might be held a little before the July 11,12,13 main Naadam, I think that would be ideal.

If the Moron Naadam could be worked in, then I'd say Hovsgal.

If not, then Altai, even though the roads to Altai were incredibly bad to the point of bodies flying around the vehicle and landing on top of each other. It was some kind of Russian jeep-truck thing.

From my report:

"This region has quite a few Kazakh Mongols, whose gers are much larger and used only during the summer. We were invited into some of these for milk-tea and dried curds. They live in structures at their winter pastures during the cold months, so they are not truly nomadic.

Besides its remote beauty, a highlight of this area was the burial stones and sites that spanned thousands of years and various civilizations. These archeological wonders were just strewn throughout the countryside, sometimes with assorted herds grazing amongst them. We had an archeological expert who had worked on excavations in the area with us to help find and interpret these many treasures.

The reduction of a day due to the flight cancellation, meant we were unable to visit the Kazakh Eagle Hunters, who lived near Ulgii. We hoped we might find one nearby family that raised eagles, but the heat wave the area had been experiencing had sent the eagle handlers and their golden eagles into the mountains to escape the high temperatures. It was a disappointment, but at the end of September is an eagle hunter festival in this region where you can actually watch the eagles hunt. I think I’ll return someday at the end of September."

With 3 weeks, perhaps you could do both Altai and Hovsgol. There would not be repetition and overlap since these two areas are diverse.

The Naadam Festival, including the kickoff parade at the stadium are spectacular events. But at the big Naadam, you cannot get that close to the wresting, archery, or horse racing. Just like any huge sporting event, you are a removed spectator. The smaller Naadams allow closer interaction. There are even family/neighbor Naadams you can attend or even participate in if you wished. The problem with those is that they are not usually scheduled well in advance so you can plan an itinerary around them.

What drew me to Mongolia was wanting to see the Takhi horses, which are at Hustai Nuruu. That's 3 hours from UB and I'd recommend a night or two there. Seeing those herds was a hightlight of the trip for me.

If you are planning to go to the Gobi, remember July will be about as hot as it gets, so you may wish to curtail your time there. I did find the evenings very pleasant and cool.

If you can stay with family for any part of your trip, I'd try to do that and it would sway my decision for Altai vs. Hovsgol if one offered a homestay. But you don't have to go far for a nomadic homestay experience. An hour out of UB and you'll find nomadic families.

If you would rather not ride horses, I don't think you have to. Maybe to get to the remote area around Hovsgol where the distant reindeer herders live you'd have to ride, but not for the rest of the trip--unless you set it up to ride. However, riding is usually an activity that can be done throughout Mongolia, even on a moment's notice.

One other thing I'd recommend, since I believe you have to fly through Beijing, and probably overnight there--stay overnight on The Great Wall. I'd do it in the most remote location you can. I stayed at Jinshanling. Since overnights had started only a few months prior to my visit, Jinshanling was sufficiently untouristed in July of 2005. Don't know what it is like today.

"What drew me to Mongolia was wanting to see the Takhi horses, which are at Hustai Nuruu. That's 3 hours from UB and I'd recommend a night or two there. Seeing those herds was a hightlight of the trip for me."

Make that 2 or 3 nights.

Thanks, Lynn! Yeah, one of these days we might bump into each other on the road...

Sorry, I should have clarified what we already have in mind -- We are actually zeroing in on a group itinerary that includes a lot of sights in central Mongolia and the Gobi, as well as one of the smaller Naadams outside of UB. We definitely DO want to do some riding (just not a multi-day riding itinerary, per DH's request), and because this trip we're looking at involves riding horses to the festival, I loved that idea. I also really do want to see the takhi, so we're planning to add a 3-day extension (separate from the group trip) to Hustai Nuruu, too. (I was really interested in a volunteer research project based there, but we just can't swing the time commitment needed for that.)

The choice is then between adding an extension to the Altai mountains that includes home visits, camping and hiking, or staying in a ger camp at Lake Hovsgol for hiking and kayaking. I've read some mixed things about visiting the Tsaatan reindeer people (in the Bradt guidebook and also on the Boojum Expeditions website, one of the companies we were looking at), so I'm not sure how I feel about that. My sense is that to really have an authentic experience of Tsaatan culture, we would need more time than this extension allows. But perhaps I'm wrong about that.

Yes, we've been warned about the Gobi heat in July. We're used to 100+ temps, so I think I can deal with it (although I'm happier if it's not that hot!). I just need to plan this one as though it's our one-and-only trip to Mongolia, so July seems the time (for Naadam), and the Gobi is a place we really want to visit.

In fact, reading your awesome trip report really helped us start making our "wish list" for Mongolia, so thank you! I also LOVED your account of hiking and sleeping on the Great Wall... we're torn between doing something like that this time, or saving it for a longer China trip in a few years (at a less-sweltering time of year)and devoting more time to Mongolia.

Thanks again for your feedback!

Riding to a small Naadam, just lovely!

Your sense about experiencing the Tsaatan culture to its fullest is right. I weighed the time vs. experience myself. There is also the possibility that the herders will not be accessible when you make it across the lake. Their priority is survival, not meet and greet, which is completely understandable. I opted against a longer visit with the Tsaatan across the lake. If you spend several days in Hovsgol, seeing the herders that are nearby is easy and worthwhile.

Like you, I let Naadam dictate the timing, and just endured the Gobi heat. It's not like you have to do much while you are there, unless you have a trek through the desert. How long will you be in Gobi?

If you will be in China at a less sweltering time, a Great Wall overnight would be more enjoyable than July.

Some riding during midday at Hustai Nuruu would be nice. In fact, there is not much else to do there. You can have a private riding guide if you wish or join the group ride. I don't think you can just take off yonder by yourselves on horseback.

I'd love to see your itinerary, either posted here or email me.

Maybe we'll cross paths in the Antarctic, if you have not gone there. But not for several years.

Thanks again, Lynn. I've been off the board for a bit, swamped by holiday plans and work. I'll be happy to send you the itinerary -- or post it here if anyone else is interested -- once I get my head above water in January (and I'll get back to my Africa trip report then, too...)

But yes, it looks like Mongolia is a GO for July '10! And we ended up choosing the Altai and Hustain Nuruu extensions for our trip.

You have lots to look forward to in 2010 MyDogKyle!

Hey we are going to mongolia for 3 weeks in June. Still working on our intinerary. We like to self guide as much as possible. Then maybe take a few little guided tours as add ons. Definetly want a homestay experience. also some time in the gobi. how many days should I set aside for the Gobi portion. We want to play in the dunes and see the flaming cliffs. Also where is the best town to base out of for the Gobi. thanks.

We are also planning to go to Mongolia for three to four weeks in July and want to start by gong to a small Naadam, probably Moron. Then central Mongolia. Can we carry on by jeep from Moron, if we fly in initially for the naadam and the lake?
Would anyone like to share their itinerarys with me? Also how many night do we need in UB?
We want to see the Takhi horses. Undescided about the Gobi, and no time for the Golden Eagles, unfortunately.
Also any help on projected daily budget. We are three so will share any jeep costs. We look for mid range.
Thanks

I was in Mongolia in July 2004 and loved most of it. The Lake is beautiful but it rained and was cold most of our time there. The mud was a problem for the Russian vehicles that we were driven around in but, if weather isn't an issue for you, it's fun to be in a ger in the rain. I loved the kids who worked at the camp -- we played Mongolian card games after dinner every night. The Gobi was my favorite -- 3 Camels lodge was terrific...and, within the Gobi, the Flaming Cliffs were spectacular. It's worth the trip just to see that area.

Thanks for the additions to this post. I will put our whole itinerary here soon (I don't have it with me at the moment), in case anyone is interested to see what we decided on. After we've done our trip in July I can post a report/further thoughts about it. We're not doing the self-guided thing, but I would be interested to know how that goes for people. The advice we got is that to do Mongolia on your own, "you have to have either lots of time or lots of money." I wonder how true that is. At any rate, we'll be going with a group tour for part of the trip, and then doing several short extensions on our own with a guide. This is all being arranged with Nomadic Expeditions, who have been very helpful so far.

We decided on the Altai mountains and Hustain Nuruu extensions rather than the Lake, smply because we don't have time (or money) to do everything, and we wanted to choose the bits that seemed least like what we can do at home. Plus, I just gotta try to see those takhi! We're really looking forward to the Gobi (where we'll be both camping and staying at 3 Camels Lodge)--in fact, we'll be camping in the Gobi on my birthday.

Here's our itinerary for July 2010 with Nomadic Expeditions. As of now, we are the only 2 people taking the Altai mountains extension, but others might join. The middle section of the trip is a small group tour, and the Hustain Nuruu days at the end are just the 2 of us.

Part 1 – Extension to the Altai Mountains (camping)

Day 1 Ulaanbaatar

Day 2 Ulaanbaatar / fly to Ulgii / Tolbo Lake (visiting Kazakh eagle hunters)

Days 3-4 Tolbo Lake / Tsengel Khairkhan Mountain (hiking and visiting Uriankhai and Kazakh families)

Day 5 Ulgii / Ulaanbaatar


Part 2 – Group Tour: "Adventure Mongolia" (overnights in gers and some camping)

Day 6 Kharakhorum / Erdene Zuu Monastery

Day 7 Tsenheriin Hot Spring

Day 8 Horse Trek to Tsetserleg

Day 9 Tsetserleg: Naadam Festival

Day 10 Naadam Festival / Taikhar Rock

Day 11 Orkhon River Valley

Day 12 Ongiin Hiid

Day 13 Flaming Cliffs and Moltsog Els sand dunes

Day 14 Yol Valley National Park / Hotol Bulag

Day 15 Camel Trek to Hongoryn Els

Day 16 Hongoryn Els (Singing Sands)

Day 17 Fly back to Ulaanbaatar


Part 3 – Private Extension: Mongolian Wild Horses (overnight in gers)

Day 18 Hustain Nuruu National Park/Hiking

Day 19 Spotting Wild Horses/Horseback Riding

Day 20 Drive back to Ulaanbaatar/late evening departure

Nomadic Expeditions arranged my 2004 trip...I was very pleased with the arrangements and with our guide, who was a teacher with an MA in English...she worked as a guide during the summer. Our 2 drivers (for 7 of us) spoke only Russian, no English but we were able to communicate basic needs. Nomadic Expeditions also had an arrangement with 3 Camels Lodge in the Gobi -- I assume they still do. The most important things I took with me were a flashlight, since the bathrooms are some distance from the gers and yaks/goats graze around the gers at night; and, reading material since we had a sandstorm on the Gobi -- no one went outside for a day or so. You will spend a lot of time involved in transportation around the country -- the rides across the steppes were the roughest I've every encountered and that includes African countries and Vietnam -- but it was an adventure. I hope you'll be as happy with Nomadic Expeditions as I was.

Thanks, Tinsmom! Nice to hear from someone who had a good experience with Nomadic Expeditions. Yes, we'll be staying 2 nights at the 3 Camels Lodge (I think maybe they own it?), and the rest of the time will be a mix of camping and staying in gers. We've heard a lot about the rigors of road travel in Mongolia, so I think we're prepared. If it's worse than Uganda, that will really be something to write home about! Our last vacation was a wildlife volunteer project where we stayed in the same location for 12 days, so I am looking forward to something more road-trippy this time.

Thanks also for the tips about what to bring. We've already got our trusty headlamps set aside. I've never had a trip with any significant amount of time to read, except on the plane -- that might actually be a nice change of pace!

Thanks for posting your itinerary. I'll be looking forward to hearing about your trip when you get back.

Should be a fantastic trip!

You will soon be answering your own question. Safari njema??

pls post a trip report after your trip. We are going to Mongolia next year 16 - 31 Aug. Can anyone recommend any other website for travel info on Mongolia. Thanks!

Thanks for the nudge. I will definitely post a trip report as soon as I can. Since I don't have time to do it right now, I want to quickly say that we had an INCREDIBLE trip and I can give a glowing recommendation to Nomadic Expeditions and to our guide, Ider Batbayar. Our experience far exceeded out expectations (and our expectations were pretty high!).

A few quick comments about our itinerary choices:

The Altai Mountains were gorgeous and visiting the eagle hunter's family there was a real highlight. Well worth the expense and trouble to get out there. Hiking near Lake Tolbo was stunningly beautiful. The market in Olgii was fun.

We loved attending the Naadam Festival in a smaller town rather than in UB. We were able to get right onto the field with the wrestlers (they threw donuts to us when they won) and right up to the finish line at the horse races.

This trip had the best horseback riding I have done anywhere in the world. It helps a lot to have some experience and confidence, to really enjoy the freedom you get galloping across those wide open spaces! But even the beginners in our group had a ball.

The Gobi is so beautiful and has such a diversity of landscapes, you will be amazed. I sure was. Everything from red rock canyons (Flaming Cliffs) to verdant green valleys (Yolyn Am) to scrubby desert and gigantic sand dunes (Hongoyn Els). Hiking is great here. There is an incredible petroglyph site not far from 3 Camel Lodge (not the one at the lodge -- you have to drive to this one, and hike up a steep trail to get to it).

We had really great wild horse (takhi) sightings in Hustain Nuruu. We went out in the late afternoon/evening along with everyone else and saw the horses coming down from the hills for water. Then the next morning we got up early and did another game drive and had even BETTER sightings... while everyone else at the ger camp was still sleeping. Well worth going out at both times of day. We saw other wildlife here, as well -- red deer, marmots, eagles, vultures, snakes -- and it was worth making the long-ish drive from the ger camp out to the deer stones and Turkic stone men.

Ger camps are very comfortable and a lot of fun. By the end of the trip, my husband and I were ready to move into a ger for good... despite the fact that they don't have bathrooms. Our favorites were Altai Peaks (Olgii), Golden Native Land (Arkhangai) and Taikhar Rock (Tsetserleg). 3 Camel Lodge is in a class of its own, a really special place. If you get a chance to learn how to put up and take down a ger, it's lots of fun.

I was really happy to have such great drivers and an awesome guide. I am not really a group trip kind of girl, but Mongolia did not seem to be an easy place to travel totally on your own. Language and transportation could be a problem without a guide, and it would be particularly sad to miss out on visiting nomadic families (which is much more rewarding with someone who can speak the language!). Mongolia was the least "touristy" place I've ever been, and I really appreciated that. I think you could make your own way around... but you would need A LOT of time and patience.

Finally, as a musician I was thrilled by Mongolia's musical traditions -- I highly recommend taking every opportunity you can to hear live music here. The horsehead fiddle will break your heart. So beautiful. And all the vocal music -- throat singing, long song, short song -- is great.

Everyone should visit Mongolia!!

I agree MyDogKyle! Everyone should go.