Trip Report: 17 days through China

How nice to see another TR from independent travelers to China! Glad that waiting to buy your tickets worked out, and pleased to hear that English-speaking locals are still so helpful! I remember enjoying your Portugal TR - looking forward to the rest of this.

It sounds like a wonderful trip.
My husband and I are planning our first trip to China in September. This is the first trip we'll be taking a trip without the comfort of a rented car to load with purchases along the way. I wnated to ask how you managed with luggage. Did you have any problems taking suitcases on the trin? It was very smart to stay in every place

I'm looking forward to hearing more. We will eventually get to China on our own as well so I will be taking notes on your experiences. Keep it coming!

So nice of you to begin your TR while still getting over your fatigue, sounds like a very good start and you found a nice hotel and enjoyable vegetarian food. Happy to hear people are helpful, Shanghai is hosting the World Expo next year, that's why you see so much construction, and there is a politeness campaign being rolled out.

Very interesting, please continue. I am more of a Japan travel person. I'd like to go to China but I'm worried about the air quality - how do you fare with that?

I stayed at the Hostal Acapulco when I went to Madrid in February after reading your Spain trip report, thanks.

thursdaysd, glad to know someone still remembers the Portugal TR ! Thanks.

miki, we did not travel on trains with our luggage in China, except the Maglev train ride into and out of Shanghai. So I cannot comment on that. We used trains only for making day trips to Hangzhou and Suzhou. Had we been traveling with luggage on those trains, I would imagine it would have been a big problem, as train stations are quite crowded in China.

dgunbug, Shanghainese, thanks for the encouragement. I need it to keep going !

Mara, nice to hear someone else having benefited from our Spain TR ! And you remembered it too ! As for air quality, we had heard so many bad things about pollution in China, that we were completely surprised. The air quality was excellent wherever we went. Perhaps it has to do with the time of the year. May is supposed to be a good time in China wrt pollution.

TRIP REPORT (Continued):
Day 2: Saturday, May 9th: SHANGHAI
We got up very late today, shaking off the fatigue of the journey to China. Had a late breakfast at the hotel (which was free with our room) at about 9:30 am. Breakfast was so-so.

Rode the metro one stop to People's Square. Walked through People's Park, which was attractive and free. It was a Saturday, and there were lots of locals there. In one corner of the park there was a lively "matchmaking" market in full swing. Everyone was holding signs about the vital statistics of their son or daughter (such as height, income level etc !!)and lots of brokers were milling around. Not surprisingly, we were completely ignored by everyone ! Very interesting.

Kept walking through the park, and we reached People's Square, which we found very pretty. People flying very colorful kites, lots of children chasing pigeons on the grass; a nice place to sit and watch the people.

Here we were approached by three young girls who spoke very good English. They talked very sweetly, and slowly brought up the subject of joining them for a tea ceremony ! We had been warned enough on this forum about these scamsters, so we quickly left.

We then went to the Shanghai Museum located nearby. Surprised to note that there was no entry fee. Just rented an audio guide, and toured all the 4 floors of the museum. A very well laid out museum, with a bronze gallery, sculpture gallery, pottery gallery, calligraphy, seals, paintings, furniture, coins etc. Definitely worthwhile to visit here.

By the time we exited the museum, it was 1:30pm, and time to hunt for lunch. We walked towards the French Concession area, in particular towards Xintiandi. We were searching a particular veg restaurant called "Vegetarian Lifestyle" of which we had read great reviews. We found it easily (located on 77 Songshan Road), and had a most wonderful meal. Good juice combos, radish soup, dumplings, eggplant hotpot, fried mushrooms. Really enjoyed our meal in an excellent ambiance, and vowed to return to this restaurant.

Walked another 5 minutes to reach Xintiandi, and immediately fell in love with the place. The architecture was so wonderful, and it seemed as if suddenly we were in a different country. Full of trendy restaurants, bars, shops, and lots of expats.

After strolling through Xintiandi to our heart's content, we took a taxi to the Old Town area, near Yuyuan Gardens. We were now in a totally different world, and closer to the "real" China that we were looking for ! All the buildings in traditional Chinese architecture, all humming with activity and full of people (notwithstanding the jarring sight of a Starbucks or a KFC). We sat down at the Huxingting Tea House, grabbing a good window seat. This is a famous tea house opposite the Yuyuan Gardens, and a great place to people watch. Just remember that the pricing on the upper floor is twice that of the ground floor ! We sat on the ground floor window table, and had a pot each of Jasmine tea. Loved the atmosphere of the place.

We then strolled around the numerous shops in the surrounding area. Full of very interesting shops, and worth buying. We decided not to buy much today, but just practice our bargaining skills ! You have to get a "feel" of where you should start your counter-offer !

By 6:30 pm or so we hopped on to a taxi and went to the Lyceum Theater (not far from Xintiandi), where we bought tickets for the 7:30pm Acrobatic show. Thankfully we had checked out the timings at our hotel front desk in the morning. Tickets were 150 Rmb each, and the hall was nice. The show was spectacular, and far far exceeded our expectations.

At 9pm we exited the theater, and went for dinner across the street from the theater, at a place called "Dishuidong" which had been highly recommended on the Lonely Planet guidebook. It is a very popular Hunan restaurant. It was not a veg restaurant, but we had no problem getting veg dishes here. The staff knew almost no English, but were quite helpful in trying to understand us. Had a fairly decent meal of shredded potatoes, mushrooms and flowering cabbages, with fried rice and beer.

From here it was a 10 minute walk back to our hotel, where we rested after a fairly exhausting day.

TRIP REPORT (Continued):
Day 3 : Sunday, May 10th: SUZHOU
We woke up early by about 5am, had breakfast at the hotel, and left by 7am via metro to the Shanghai Train Station. We had a 7:50am train to board for Suzhou.

We were initially quite confused on arriving at the train station. There were huge boards outside; we could see our train listed there, along with a Departure Lounge number. We had no clue what a "departure lounge" at a train station meant. And there were numerous lines to enter the train station, and we were not sure which line we ought to be in.

Finally met a young educated man who spoke good English, who told us to get into any line to enter the train station, then to go to our departure lounge, and wait. On entering the departure lounge (which was common to about 6-7 departing trains at that hour), we saw rows and rows of chairs, and a sea of humanity inside. It was very noisy and intimidating inside, as we had not been prepared for all this. We had to stand around, as there were no vacant seats anywhere. About 15 minutes prior to our train departure, they opened the gates to go to the platform to board the train. There was a huge surge of people who got up from the departure lounge and queued up for the exit gate leading to the platform. However, despite the crowds, I must say that there was no jostling or pushing, nor any sign of panic by anyone. Everything moved smoothly, and we managed to comfortably board our train with enough time to spare, without any inconvenience. Once you go through it, it seems easy and disciplined; first time can be initially a scare.

The 1st class coach on which we were booked was very comfortable. The train reached Suzhou at 8:30am (40 minute ride). There was no Tourist Office anywhere near the Train Station (what a pity !). The pedicabs were asking for too much money. Finally, we took a taxi to the Humble Administrator's Garden, which cost only 10 Rmb. Caution: do not get into a taxi unless you have your destination written somewhere in Chinese characters, as the drivers speak zero English.

The Humble Administrator's Garden in among the largest gardens of Suzhou, spread over 5 hectares. Overall, very well maintained, and quite beautiful in parts. It took quite a while to stroll through the entire garden, but we did it and quite enjoyed it. Each nook and cranny has a very fancy name (e.g. "With Whom Shall I Sit" pavilion). Enjoyed their bonzai garden the most, which had a fantastic collection.

After spending 3 hours inside the garden, we found that getting out was tricky. We kept going around in circles, before we finally found the exit route. It was about 12:30pm, and there is a very nice line of shops outside the entry gate, which we strolled through. Lots of boat-men approached us, offering to take us on a canal cruise. We decided to shelve all that for later in the day. In China, we noticed that all "attractions" with an entry fee seem to close by 4pm or 5pm; so you have to do your main sightseeing before that, and keep evenings for loitering about or shopping.

We took another taxi to the Master of Nets Garden on Shiquan Lie. Strange that such a famous garden has to be entered through side alleys. But the garden itself was very very pretty. Small, compact, and beautiful. The central portion of the garden, around the pond, was really excellent, with views changing totally as you move around from one point to another. Chinese landscaping at its best. A "must-see" in Suzhou.

Almost opposite the entry point of the garden on Shiquan Lie, is a restaurant called "Yangyang Shuijiaoguan" restaurant, highly recommended on Lonely Planet. Known to have a good collection of veg dishes too. We wend there for lunch, and had a nice meal. The helpings were really huge, and prices ridiculously low. We were served a very very large soup of coriander & tofu, excellent dumplings (a dozen for 5 Rmb), eggplant, fried rice, beer etc. Good food and very good prices.

Outside the restaurant we stopped for a cool drink of Litchi with Green tea ! We were looking for a taxi or a bus to take us to Tiger Hill. Here is where we faced our first major communication breakdown. Despite waiting for 30-45 minutes, could not find a vacant taxi. We obviously needed to be referred to a better place to catch a taxi, but no one could do that. We knew the number of the bus that we had to take, but no one could refer us to the nearest bus stop ! We must have tried asking a dozen different people, showed them maps, tried sign-language, but nothing worked. Everyone just shrugged their shoulders and claimed they knew no English. It was peak afternoon, hot and humid. We were getting exasperated, and wished that we had a guide with us, just for sorting out these small logistical problems.

With great difficulty, we managed to figure out where the bus stop was. The stop was marked with just a small tin-sign on the side of the street. Boarded the Tourist Bus No. 2. It was an old and rickety bus, that stalled at every bus stop ! Cost only 1 Rmb each for the ride, all the way to Tiger Hill. Took a pedicab from the bus stop to the entry of Tiger Hill. Somewhat expensive entry tickets (60 Rmb each), plus another 20 Rmb/each to take a ride to the top till the tilting Pagoda. From the Pagoda we slowly walked down towards the entry gate, and rested ourselves for a while at a cafe. Had wonderful "Passion Fruit Snow". Then slowly walked back to the bus station, and boarded the Tourist Bus # 2 to the Humble Administrator's Garden. It was too late to enter the "Garden to Linger In", which we had also marked out at Suzhou, as it was past 5pm. Hence we decided to return to our morning spot, and catch a cruise on the canals of Suzhou.

There was a very prolonged bargaining session before we could board the boat. Eventually settled for 30 Rmb per person, provided we shared the boat with a young Chinese couple who were paying a similar amount. When you talk to these boat people, or any shop owner, there seems to be no communication problem. Of course they know zero English, but they make an effort, and with sign language you manage to communicate easily. Not so on the streets when you are seeking directions, unless you happen to bump into someone who knows English.

It was a nice one-hour boat ride through the canals of Suzhou, which we enjoyed. The boatman sang lovely Chinese songs as he rowed the boat. We all tried our hand at the unusual oars. Good fun.

After the boat ride, we again took the Bus # 2 to the Train station, and boarded our 7:20pm train back to Shanghai, reaching at 8pm. We took a metro to Xintiandi. Almost had my camera stolen while buying the metro ticket - our only unpleasant experience in this entire trip. While I was pushing the buttons at the ticket vending machine at the metro station, there was a guy standing next to me almost pushing me. I commented to DW that this guy is almost pushing me, but I just thought he was in a hurry to use the vending machine after me. It is only when I had finished and was moving away, did I notice his hand on my camera case (which was strapped to my belt), and that he had almost succeeded in removing the camera from the case. When I shouted out, he quickly departed and melted away in the crowd.

Xintiandi was full of life on this Sunday night. Very lively and very crowded. Sat down at an outdoor table at the "Kabb" restaurant. Had margheritas, burritos and quesadillas. Fabulous views and good food. Then took the metro back to our hotel and crashed into bed.

Enjoying this! But I'm afraid that today's "real" China is much more Pizza Hut and KFC and lots of glass and concrete than the Yuyuan gardens and the Beijing hutongs.

You are right thursdayd. The number of KFC, McDonalds and Starbucks in China is mind boggling. I saw a map of Beijing, where all McDonalds outlets were marked on the map ! Must have been over a 100 outlets in Beijing alone.

Chinese have a very lean and thin frame, partly because they eat right; their cuisine is very wholesome and non-fattening. With Big Mac spoiling them big time, I think a new generation of obese Chinese is now growing up !

This is a great report, even though I know absolutely nothing about China.

Well, after reading this I know a whole lot more...

I also know what a slog it is to write - but I bet it's just pouring out of you. It's a great way to process your trip, eh?

You are really feeding some great information back into the board. Bravo guys - keep writing!

TRIP REPORT (Continued):
Day 4: Monday, May 11th: HANGZOU:
Woke up early again, at 5:30am, and reached Shanghai Railway station just in time to catch our 8am train to Hangzhou. This time we were confident of ourselves at the station ! Reached Hangzhou at 9:45am.

Located the Tourist Office just outside the Train Station. Did pick up a free English map, but the person manning the counter knew zero English. By now we were quite used to this.

Thanks to our research prior to this trip, we knew which bus to board from where, which came in handy. We boarded the K7 bus from the train station to West Lake. As we alighted, we were totally captivated by the beauty of the Lake. Could understand why Marco Polo had called this place as Paradise on Earth. So calm, peaceful and so well maintained. Sat for a while at the lakefront, soaking it in. Then we took a boat trip to the island in the middle of the lake.

The walk around the island was very pleasant indeed. Exquisite beauty everywhere; fabulous views wherever you look. The "Three Mirrors Reflecting the Moon" was a bit of a let-down, but walking around the causeways and paths of the small island was a treat. Numerous photo ops. Had some roadside snacks of black sticky rice. After we had our fill of the scenery, we took a boat back. A very playful Chinese toddler took a fancy for me on the return journey, gleefully came into my arms, and jumped with joy to the amazement of his parents !

We were looking for an Indian restaurant called "Haveli" on Nanshan Road (which goes all around the lake). Turned out to be a long walk as it was located on the other end of the road. But walking along the West Lake is very nice, so no complaints. We finally found it, and had a sumptuous lunch of Kulchas, Parathas, Chhole and Dal. Decent Indian food.

At about 2:30pm, we caught the Y2 bus from outside the restaurant for the Lingyin Temple; a longish ride of about 30 minutes. For the Lingyin Temple, you have to pay the entry ticket twice : 35 Rmb to enter the "Lingyin Temple Area", and another 30 Rmb to enter the actual temple. However, the entire visit to the Lingyin Temple was most rewarding, and is a MUST-SEE on any Hangzhou visit. From the entry gate, we walked alongside the hillside to see all the stone carvings, including the largest carving in the world of the Laughing Buddha. The main temple complex was also fantastic, with exquisite halls and the jaw-dropping 20 mtr high statue of Buddha. Loved the side hall, full of almost 1000 sculptures of disciples. Wish we had more time at the Lingyin Temple. Would have liked to stay a little longer.

Reluctantly, we came back down, and took the Y1 bus, which dropped us near the Qinhefang Old Street, where we wanted to go next. This is a very interesting pedestrian street, with shops selling all kinds of knick-knacks. There was the famous teahouse, where the waiter pours the tea dramatically from a kettle having a very very long spout ! Did some stray shopping, and enjoyed walking on that street.

Tried getting directions on how to reach the train station. Once again the same communication problem. The tourist office was no help either. Showed them a Hangzhou map which had the train station clearly marked (with a picture of a train), but still could not communicate. Exasperating. Finally boarded a taxi, and showed him the words "Train Station" written in Chinese characters, and he took us there immediately. We were able to comfortably board our 6:25pm train back to Shanghai, reaching at 7:40pm (to the South Train Station this time).

At Shanghai, we took the metro to the French Concession area, and had a repeat meal at "Vegetarian Lifestyle" on Songshan Road, which we had enjoyed a few days earlier. Had a nice meal once again of juice combos, dumplings, fiery soup and rice noodles. The soup could have easily fed 6 people ! We were back at our hotel by 9:45pm. Checked our e-mails, packed for our departure the next morning, and slept.

We realized that we had not done justice to Hangzhou in a day trip. It certainly requires 2-3 days, and is perhaps preferable to Shanghai. Very pretty city. Could barely scratch its surface in a day trip. Anyway, I am glad we went, for it is certainly worth visiting.

Some stray observations as we were concluding the first leg of our journey:

1. Language does seem to be a problem at many places. Getting directions on the street can be difficult, unless you have the destination clearly written in Chinese characters. It is not that people do not want to help; I think the way we pronounce various things, and the way the Chinese pronounce it is so different, that they simply cannot fathom what we are saying. For some strange reason, even sign-language does not seem to work here. Miming out something, enacting it out, nothing seems to work. You just have to keep all destinations and key words in Chinese characters with you.

2. We had expected the weather to be pleasant in May. We had been blessed with excellent weather the past 4 days, but the afternoons were really hot and very humid, atleast in Shanghai and the neighborhoods.

3. People in China love posing for pictures, and strike very bizarre poses ! Their favorite seems to be holding up a "V" sign with their fingers, or otherwise keeping their arms spread out like an eagle (a Chinese told us that they were imitating the "Titanic" pose !).

4. The calculator is a major instrument of communication. Whenever you want to know any price, the same is typed on a calculator and shown to you. You are supposed to write your counter-offer on the same calculator and show it back ! If a calculator is not available, a cell phone is used in much the same way. I know that a cell phone is a genuine communication device, but perhaps not in this form !

5. It is impossible to walk 10 meters in China without being offered a Rolex watch for 100-200 Rmb. The brand ambassadors of Rolex (Roger Federer etc) must shiver at this phenomenon !

6. People in China seem to love fake brands. Carrying a fake Gucci bag, or a Burberry or a D&G seems to be socially very acceptable.

Thanks dogster. We work hard to please ! Hope someone finds it useful (someone always does).

lovig the report, thanks for posting it...

This is great. We're going to China in Septemeber and your report will help a lot. Especially the part about air and train tickets. Clearly a very timely report, no penalty. In fact, a bonus. A special invitation to the Boston GTG on October 10.

rhkkmk and Gpanda, thanks for your kudos. It will keep me going.

I can only imagine trying to be vegetarian in China AND with language issues! You guys are troopers. Thanks for posting.

Jaya, being vegetarian in China is really not that difficult, if you carry a listing of veg restaurants with you (which we did). We only had a problem on one day in Xian (coming up in the Trip Report).

As for language issues, it was exasperating on some occasions, but mostly a lot of fun and adventure. This is part of the joy of independent travel to unfamiliar destinations. After all, one should not strive to "feel at home" when traveling abroad !

Great trip report, I can't wait to read more! Thanks for taking the time to post report.

TRIP REPORT (Continued):
Day 5 : Tuesday, May 12th: XIAN :
We had an 11:40am flight from Pudong airport for Xian today. Woke up later than usual at 7am, and after a hearty breakfast, checked out of the hotel by 9am.

We had decided on taking the Maglev train back to the airport, instead of a taxi, as it saved time, money and was a lot of fun. The West Nanjing Road metro station was only a minute away from our hotel, but the difficult part was going down to the metro station with the heavy luggage, as there were only stairs to go down (no escalator). At both the staircases, someone emerged to offer assistance to DW with her suitcase, which was very nice to see. The rest was a breeze, and we were at Pudong in no time. Always remember to show your "same day air tickets" to get a 20% discount on the Maglev fare.

The departure terminal of Pudong Airport was even more impressive than the Arrival halls, and one of the most modern that I have ever seen. We were at our boarding gate at 11am, when we were told that there would be a delay due to some mechanical trouble with the aircraft. The delay kept getting longer and longer, and they could not predict when exactly things would be OK (understandable in the case of aircraft trouble). But all local passengers were extremely irate, and were giving the airline staff a hard time. We had no option but to wait patiently. We were told by fellow passengers that this was extremely rare in China. Just our bad luck !

Finally, after almost a 3 hour delay, the flight took off at 2:30pm, to reach Xian at 4:45pm. Surprisingly, veg food option was available on the flight (although we had forgotten to mention it at the time of booking our tickets). At Xian airport, baggage retrieval was swift (as always in China), and we boarded the Airport Shuttle Bus # 1, which takes you to Melody Hotel near the Bell Tower. Very good bus, goes non-stop, only 25 Rmb per person, a steal compared to 150-200 Rmb by taxi. Leaves every 20-30 minutes or so.

Our hotel, the Citadines Aparthotel, was about a 2 minute walk from Melody Hotel. By 6:15pm we were in our room, or should I say, our apartment. We had booked a studio apartment, which was quite spacious and comfortable. No complaints about the hotel here or at Shanghai. Both had been comfortable and very well located. And very reasonable.

By 6:45pm we were out of the hotel, on the streets. Xian had a wonderful and different feel to it - the real real China. Very quaint, majestic and lovely. Had a compact feel about it, as almost everything is within walking distance. The weather was excellent, cool and cloudy, and we loved it after the harsh sun of Shanghai.

We went to the Drum Tower, then the Bell Tower (where a free musical performance was in progress), and walked all over the wonderful Bell Tower Square. All very nice and impressive. We had no listing of any veg restaurant in Xian. Had heard a lot about a great dumpling place, called "De Fa Chang Dumpling Restaurant" which is supposed to be an institution at Xian. To our disappointment, they informed us that they have no vegetarian dumplings (a pity, since they make over a hundred varieties of dumplings). Tried a few other restaurants on Bell Tower Square, but everyone claimed to not have any veg items on their menu. This turned out to be the only day in our entire trip, where we encountered a food problem. Finally, we had to make do with onion rings and french fries and sundae ice-creams at the McDonalds ! What a shame.

After "dinner", we went strolling into the Muslim Quarters, which was packed with people. Lots of street food available. Had some kind of a spicy bread, which the guy promised was vegetarian. Tasted yummy. Roamed around all the shops, and saw what was on offer. Promised to return the next night. Had been told that this was the best place to buy souvenir Terracotta Warriors.

We then walked slowly towards the South Gate of the walled city, on Nan Dajie, which had a lot of glitzy malls, discos and bars. Popped into a large grocery store and bought some fruits, bread, butter etc. Just before the South Gate, we turned into an alley called "Defu Xiang", which is supposed to be the bar district of Xian. It was indeed a very cute small street, filled with cafes, bars and lots of tourists. Sat down somewhere with a beer and relaxed.

At about midnight, we decided to call it a day. Took a taxi back to the hotel and slept.

This was one city where we could never get hold of an English map. The Tourist Office on Bell Tower Square had only Chinese maps, and the hotel did not have one either. So we had to manage with our Lonely Planet map throughout. It amazes me, that a country like China which has made such tremendous progress in infrastructure, which has such a beautiful country to showcase, and which is keen to make its mark on the world as having "arrived", could be so careless on these soft issues (which are the easiest to fix). If only their Tourist offices could be manned by English-speaking personnel, they could make English maps more freely available, and do a few more tiny things, they would be an extremely tourist-friendly nation.

Thanks zverybestfamily. Please keep the accolades coming !

Great trip report. You've given me much info that will help in a future trip to China. I look forward to the rest of your report.

TRIP REPORT (Continued):
Day 6: Wednesday, May 13th: XIAN :
We woke up late, and breakfasted in our apartment, with all our grocery purchase of the previous evening. Left the hotel by about 9:30 am. It was cool and cloudy again, with intermittent drizzle throughout the day.

We first took a taxi to the "Temple of 8 Immortals", which is just outside the East Wall. Nothing notable about the Temple, but an antique market springs up there every Sunday and Wednesday. As today was Wednesday, we decided to stake it out. There were lots of shops and temporary stalls there. Probably nothing was genuine antique, but there was good stuff on offer at reasonable prices. We did our first serious shopping of the trip here, and bought a fair amount of decorative pieces at rock-bottom prices.

Over the last 5 days we had been practicing our bargaining skills, and getting a feel for how low the prices can be brought down to. Had realized that whenever you are offered a price, make a counter-offer of about 15-20% of the quoted price (I know this sounds ridiculous, but is quite accurate). The shopkeeper will pretend to look alarmed and will respond with a sneer, but stick to your guns. Suddenly a revised offer will emerge of 50% of the original offer. Each time they make a revised offer, you are expected to hike up your counter-offer. This is the etiquette of bargaining ! So if the original offer was 400 Rmb, and you counter-offered 60 Rmb, the now revised offer stands at 200 Rmb. Move your offer to atmost 70 Rmb. Keep up the game, until the shopkeeper has reached 130 Rmb, and you have climbed incrementally to 90 Rmb. At this point of time, it appears that you have reached a "breaking" point in the negotiation, and you should appear disinterested and walk away. The shopkeeper then runs after you, catches your arm, and consents to your price. Can be fun the first few times, but after a few days, this lengthy charade can be boring. The final price is rarely more than 25-30% of the initial offer, and it takes quite some time to reach that point.

From there we hopped into another taxi to go to the Xian Railway Station. Tried explaining "Train Station" to the taxi driver, but got a blank stare. Mimed a choo-choo train, with its hoot and whistle and the sound of its chugging wheels. By now the driver probably thought I was nuts ! Finally unearthed "Train Station" written in Chinese, and we were there in a flash. In the parking lot of the train station, we easily found the Bus # 306 that we were looking for, which goes to the Terracotta Warriors. Thanks Fodorites for recommending this very convenient and cheap option. It is a very comfortable bus, costs only 7 Rmb per person, and takes only 50 minutes to reach (with only one stop in between). Seems a waste to take a taxi for the journey.

When we alighted at the Warriors site, there was inadequate signage, and we wandered in the wrong direction. After walking for 15 minutes, we hit the Exit gate, and had to retrace our steps to reach the Entry gate. It was 12:45pm by the time we finally entered. At the entry point, there were a lot of uniformed guides of "China Tourism", offering to take you around for 100 Rmb (no bargaining). We liked the idea, as the premises are large, and finding your way around can be somewhat confusing. The guide was cheap, and she spoke decent English; her knowledge of the subject was also not bad.

We had been advised to first see the movie of the Warriors in the Theater, then visit Pit Nos 1, 2 and 3 in reverse order (as Pit # 1 is overwhelmingly the best, it should be visited last as otherwise everything else is anti-climactic). We told our guide of this plan, and she endorsed it. The movie gave a good background on the history of the Terracotta Warriors; unfortunately it was in Chinese, but impressive nonetheless (it is a 360 degree movie, well shot).

The premises are quite large, and you should budget on about 3 hours to tour the entire premises. Pit No. 1 was simply awesome. It is amazing to see how the warriors are being reconstructed from the ruins. And they have stopped excavating until they can come up with a technological solution to prevent the colors from evaporating in the sunlight. There is plenty more which is yet to be excavated, and the full size of this discovery is probably not yet known.

By the time we were leaving the site at about 3pm, it started raining somewhat heavily. Bought an umbrella to duck under. Tried having a coffee at one of the numerous cafes on the exit route. Their menu cards do not mention price, and when you enquire, a high price is quoted, and a willingness to bargain is indicated. I refused to bargain for my coffee, so we left sans refreshments.

Our guide informed us that to go back to the Xian train station, we could not only take the Bus # 306, but also the Bus # 914 or 915. As we exited, we saw a #914 ready to leave. Boarded it, but the decision was later regretted. It does go to the Xian train station, but by a different route, and for most of the way, the road was under construction. So the ride was a bit rough, and the time taken about 20 minutes longer. Advice: stick to Bus # 306 if possible.

From Xian train station, we took a taxi back to our hotel. Dumped our morning shopping, freshened up, and left. It was 5 pm, and we had not had lunch. Knowing the problems of finding veg food in the vicinity, we ducked into a Pizza Hut outlet, and gorged on some veg pizzas to fill us up. We then continued walking towards the South Gate. Just before the South Gate, we ducked into a shopping street called Shuyuan Xiang, which was very interesting. Then we climbed the City Wall and strolled all around. I would highly recommend a climb of the City Wall while in Xian; the sights are good.

It was past 7pm. We had wanted to see both the Little Goose Pagoda and the Big Goose Pagoda from outside. But there was no time for both. So we took a taxi and went straight to the Big Wild Goose Pagoda. Alighted at the North Square of the Pagoda. The place was absolutely magical. The Pagoda looks so pristine, and it casts a spell on you. The Square in front is also well laid out, with benches, sculptures, gardens, lights etc. Sat there for a long time and could not get enough of the scenery.

The guidebook mentioned that the Musical Water Fountain show comes on at 8pm or 9pm, depending upon the time of the year. Tried asking numerous people about timing; the opinion was evenly split between 8pm and 9pm. Somehow, I found the votaries for 9pm sound more convincing. We decided to wait till 8pm. If the show did not start, we would quickly go for dinner and return by 9 pm.

However, at 7:45pm, it started to rain heavily, and we had to run for cover. Decided to take our chances, and proceed for dinner right away. Had researched on two Indian restaurants located on the same street, just west of the Big Pagoda. The street is called "Yantaxilu", and the restaurants we were looking for were "Delhi Durbar" and "Cacaja".

We found the street easily, and what a revelation it was. It is one of the prettiest streets in Xian, very wide, and lined with restaurants and bars on both sides. Virtually every international cuisine is represented here. No guide book or travel site had referred to this street, and we found it a wonderful place for any tourist to visit. We chose to dine at "Cacaja" which had better reviews than the other Indian restaurant, and had a wonderful meal of Kadaai Paneer, Alu Gobi, Missi Roti and Kulchas, with Mango Lassi. Good food and reasonably priced.

Left just before 9pm, and quickly walked back to the Big Pagoda. Reached just as the Musical Water Fountain show was starting at 9 pm. The show was well worth the wait, and very enjoyable. Lasted for 20 minutes. Thankfully, the rain had stopped, and everyone could enjoy it. After the show was over, I simply did not want to leave. I kept gazing at the Big Pagoda in its splendid night lighting, and found the sight too beautiful for words. Really liked this place.

Finally, we reluctantly pulled ourselves away. All the taxis were going full, and realized that it would be difficult to find a vacant one. So we walked to the nearest bus stop, and boarded Bus # 609, which dropped us at the Bell Tower. We went back to the Muslim Quarters, where we bought a set of moderate-sized Terracotta Warriors, and those wonderful Chinese kites. Reached our hotel at about 11pm, packed for our early morning departure, and slept.

We had really enjoyed Xian. It was magical. Too bad about our incoming flight delay, which knocked off 3 hours of sightseeing. Missed seeing the Small Pagoda and the Great Mosque as a result. But we were satisfied. The Warriors had lived up to their expectation, and the Big Pagoda was wonderful. The whole city was lovely, and worth spending two days (but perhaps not more).

"Mimed a choo-choo train, with its hoot and whistle and the sound of its chugging wheels" - lol! I remember trying that very technique on a rickshaw driver in Amritsar. It didn't work there either!

Glad that the buses worked out for you in Xi'an.

Just great. I think you two are very intrepid indeed, doing it the way you did. I'm not sure I'd last the distance. It can get VERY exhausting bargaining and having to stay on red alert ALL the time, let alone the problems with communication. But what an adventure, eh? The smallest things bring rewards, travelling the way you do.

I'm very impressed.

BTW, what part of India do you live in?

thursdayd,reassuring to know that others have tried similar stupid misadventures, and have failed like we did !

dogster, we live in Pune, which is quite close to Mumbai. I agree that this China trip by ourselves, at this age, was quite an adventure. Being seasoned travelers, we found the difficult times also amusing. This is the fun of travel. Basically people are nice, wherever you go. Getting through to them may require different techniques in different countries. But deep down below, all of humanity is nice and well intentioned.

I just saw your report & enjoyed reading it very much. We also are traveling on china independantly right now. Have been here since may 8 & return to the u.s. This weekend.

I had to laugh about bus 914 in xi'an. We also took it back from the warriors site! Big mistake, it travels on a horrible dirt road. We couldn't find the 306 for our return.

Our trip has been excellent with only minor problems. Quite a physical undertaking though for our 55 yr. Old feet!

I look very forward to more of your trip report! To bad we didn't meet in xi'an as we stayed in the same hotel!


We're in a hutong in Beijing now, a bit rough around the edges but very kind people.

Weather has been fantastic throughout china all month.

Chinese people are very happy people. They love their parks, dancing, singing, card playing etc. Etc. In the parks. This is a long 4 day holiday here and we've spent hours enjoying observing them at play.

Bathroom situation is horrible. Learn to squat!!

Thanks for your enjoyable report!

Well, I was not all that far from you, indiancouple, just a fortnight ago. When you've finished writing your report and feel inclined, just click on my name. My misadventures in YOUR culture might bring a smile.

But not yet - you have more writing to do!

I thoroughly enjoyed reading your report. i'm doing a 16 day trip to China in July alone at first for 4 days, then joined by 2 friends.I'm 54 yr old lady, being jioned by my 2 nieces in therir 20s. i planned this trip in July to see the solar eclipse. I wish I could you did but I don' thinh I can manage, cos I'm too scared of missing things like trains, flights etc. So i'm booking through a chinese agent, who will arrange my hotels, flights, trains.
I do want some advice. Is it OK to go to GT Wall in Beijing without a tour guide, just take a taxi, ask him to wait and bring us back. Can we do Hutong tour on our own?
Any suggestions about which hotel to dtak in Beijing and Shanghai? In shanghai I will be alone, but in Beijing I will be with my nieces.We are on a budget ,so want to do things economically.I believe it's best to stay in Wangfujing area in Beijing.
Thanks

Indiancouple, so glad to hear how much you enjoyed Xian! My husband and I are taking our 2 teenage sons to china in August and it looks like we are doing the same exact trip in a little different order.
धन्यवाद and can't wait to hear more.

More, more...I am thoroughly enjoying this and taking tons of notes. We will be traveling independently as you did. Our greatest stories are the misadventures, getting lost and finding things that were unexpected.

Images2 - Looking forward to seeing your trip report as well!

Thanks everyone for the overwhelming response to this travelogue.

Images2, this is really strange. Our China trip also started on 8th May, like you. And to think we were in the same Xian hotel at the same time, and we both made the same mistake of boarding Bus # 914, well that's real coincidence !

dogster, would love to hear about your Indian misadventures; I am sure there would be many in a country like ours.

faridabobat, I think it is totally unnecessary to take a guide to the Great Wall. What will a guide tell you, that you cannot pick up in a few minutes of internet research ? If you book a taxi to take you there and back, it is more than enough. As for Hutong tours, the moment you enter the Hutong area on foot, you will be approached by numerous pedicabs asking you to take a Hutong tour. We hopped on one and found it to be quite adequate. As for hotel recommendations, I need to know your budget etc. Suggest you look at tripadvisor.com for hotel ratings.

zverybestfamily, dgunbug : glad you are both enjoying the report. I hope you find something useful for your own journeys.

TRIP REPORT (Continued):
Day 7 : Thursday, May 14th: BEIJING :
Awoke early again at 5 am, and after breakfast in our apartment, we checked out of the hotel before 7am. We had a 9:30 am flight for Beijing that day.

It was just a 2 minute walk to the Melody Hotel, from where we had to board the Airport Shuttle Bus, but it was raining cats and dogs, and impossible to venture out in the rain with our luggage. We asked the lady at the hotel front desk to call a taxi to take us to Melody Hotel. She argued that it is only a 2-3 minute walk. I kept showing her the pounding rain, but she could not fathom why anyone would take a taxi for such a short distance. I spotted a taxi nearby, and called him over, and asked him to load our luggage. The reception lady came out running, and asked the taxi to stop loading our luggage ! This was getting out of hand. I said some stern words to her, and she explained that it will cost me 8 Rmb for the short journey. When she realized that I was fully aware of this, and prepared to pay the princely sum of 8 Rmb, she was shocked, and asked the taxi to resume loading our luggage !

Had a "wet" transfer to the Airport Shuttle Bus, and we were at the Xian airport by 7:45 am. Our flight was on time, and we reached Beijing Capital Airport by 11:30 am, where a taxi from our hotel was waiting for us. We reached the Bamboo Garden Hotel shortly after noon, and were very pleased with what we saw.Lovely room, well decorated, with a computer terminal and free internet connection thrown in. Nice large hotel grounds, with shady walkways (which we never found time to explore). Nice restaurant, and some English-speaking staff.

We had a nice Chinese lunch at the hotel restaurant. We needed to do our flight bookings for Guilin, and then on to Shenzhen. The hotel enquired from its travel agent, who quoted a rather high price. So I checked out "Ctrip" site on the computer, and found much lower rates. Called up Ctrip, and they offered to deliver the tickets to the hotel within an hour. This was good. Within the hour, the tickets were at our doorstep. My advice to all independent travelers to China is as follows : do not book your internal flight tickets in China until 3-4 days before the journey date, as that is when the best rates appear. Just call up Ctrip's toll free number from anywhere, and you can do the transaction on the phone itself, with them delivering the tickets to you.

Changed currency at the hotel desk (good rates), and left by 3:30 pm. The hotel was in the "prime Hutong area" of Beijing, near the Bell & Drom Towers, so we strolled into some Hutongs (i.e. alleys) nearby. We were finding the stroll interesting, when a pedicab approached us with a flyer for a Hutong Tour for 1 hour. We bargained him down to 30 Rmb for the full hour, and hopped on. Then followed a very interesting one-hour ride, into various hutongs, where we saw groups of people playing some checkers-like game in front of their houses, deeply engrossed along with an interested audience, totally oblivious to whatever else was going around. Took lovely photographs; always asked permission to click, and no one objected. They all appeared very friendly and happy. The pedicab also took us to some courtyards, where a young girl would emerge and ask for money in practiced English, to permit us to enter the compound for a peek. We avoided those tourist traps, and just focused on capturing daily Chinese life on our camera. Suddenly a long line of 20 pedicabs would emerge, all carrying tourists from some group tour, and provide a jarring edge to the hutong tour.

Our pedicab tour ended in front of the Drum & Bell Towers, where sat down on the terrace of the "Bell & Drum Bar" and had a coffee. Nice place, but overpriced. We then walked over to the Hua Hai lake area, and strolled on various roads lining the lake. Some of these streets were very touristy, with lots of bars, restaurants and interesting shops. Then a pedicab hauled us some further distance, and dropped us somewhere near the Qianhai Lake, which was prettier. We wanted to go to the Beihai park, but were told that it was closed.

After some long and rewarding walks by the lakefronts, we slowly started walking towards the veg restaurant where we planned to take dinner : "Wo Xing Wo Su", near the Zhanghzi Zhonglu metro stop. It had started drizzling by now, and the weather had suddenly turned very cold. We found the restaurant, and had a really nice dinner in this boutique establishment.

We had planned on going to Wangfujing Dajie after dinner, but the weather made us change our mind. The drizzle was getting heavier, and our hands were freezing. So we simply boarded the metro, got off at the Guloudajie stop, and went back to our hotel early for some much needed rest.

TRIP REPORT (Continued) :
Day 8 : Friday, May 15th : BEIJING :
This was to be a "big travel day", as we had planned on visiting Tiananmen Square and Forbidden City this day. For some reason, ever since the 1989 student uprising, Tiananmen Square had always intrigued me. The largest public square in the world, where riding a bicycle is forbidden, but tanks are OK, has to be someplace special !

We awoke at 6:30 am, and left the hotel by 8 am. Had a fruit breakfast at a roadside fruit shop, and boarded the metro from Guloudajie to Qianmen. Walked to Tiananmen Square. It took a while to get my bearings here. The place was huge, and there were understandably no signages in the middle of the Square. It took some time before I could understand which direction was North, and which monument was which.

Went past the "Front Gate" (which is a double-date), the Chairman Mao Memorial (where there was a huge huge line to enter), and the "Monument to People's Heroes", before entering the "Great Hall of People". The latter was quite opulent, specially the foyer, the smaller meeting rooms, the auditorium etc. After a satisfying tour of the "Great Hall of People", we returned to the Chairman Mao Memorial, where the crowds had considerably lessened by 11 am. As you enter the building, the first room which contains a large statue of Mao seated on a chair, hits you in the face with its splendor and life-like image. In the next room, as we walked past his embalmed body in a glass coffin, my hair stood up on ends - I was within handshaking distance of this legendary man !

Enjoyed strolling through the crowds on the huge Tiananmen Square ; couldn't really believe that I was actually standing on the Square. Then slowly walked south, towards the Front Gate. From the Front Gate, we walked further south on a newly revamped touristy road (very pretty architecture, though most shops have yet to start operations) called Qianmen Dajie. On reaching the end of the road after a long walk, we searched for a vegetarian restaurant called "Gongdelin", but could not locate it. A pedicab driver communicated to us through an English speaking lady that the restaurant had closed down, and offered to take us to another veg restaurant. I did not trust him, but decided to take the gamble. He took us through various alleys to a lovely looking restaurant and stopped. I stepped down and inquired if indeed it was vegetarian. To my surprise, it was a 100% veg restaurant. Further surprise. It was in fact the restaurant that we were searching for : Gongdelin, at its new changed location !

The restaurant was classy in ambiance, but the food was so-so. Asked them to write down their address in English, but they showed an inability to do so. Opened out a map, and asked them to point out where the restaurant was, and they again seemed unsure. All they could do was to hand out a business card written in Chinese. I wanted to fix the location of this place for a repeat visit (as I didn't know exactly where the pedicab had brought us), but gave up.

After lunch, we started walking back towards Tiananmen Square. A pedicab carried us most of the way. We got down at the corner of Qianmen, from where the tour buses leave for the Great Wall. Enquired about tours for the next day. Most tours are for Badaling. We wanted to go to Mutianyu. For Mutianyu, they said tours would leave subject to 20 passengers assimilating. We decided to skip these bus tours, and take a taxi for the Great Wall visit.

Continued walking across Tiananmen Square towards the northern end, the imposing "Gate of Heavenly Peace". A huge portrait of Mao hung outside. Went through the gate, past the Duan Gate, reaching the pretty Meridian Gate. Bought tickets for the Forbidden City, audio guides, and entered.

We had heard so much about the Forbidden City, but were not quite prepared for the onslaught of its beauty. The rooftops, with enameled stone tiles, looked so rich; the paintings on the Halls and the Pagodas were so vivid; it was being transported to a different world. DW kept imagining as to how the place must have appeared when all the inhabitants were around, and it was enthralling to visualize it all. One wanted to linger more, to see more, but the amount of walking we had done since the morning had caused our legs to become very weary by then. I don't know if visiting Tiananmen Square and Forbidden City on the same day makes sense, as it gets tiring. The distance you have to cover on foot is quite large, and there are no benches around to rest your body.

We reluctantly left at 4:30 pm, which was getting close to closure time. Exited from the Meridian Gate, and retraced our steps back to the Gate of Heavenly Peace. Then went to the Tiananmen East metro station, and rode the metro one stop to Wangfujing.

For some reason, I had imagined Wangfujing Dajie to be a flea market kind of shopping place. I was surprised to see a totally different scene before me - a nice shopping district, full of malls, and decent stores. We did do a fair amount of serious clothes shopping on Wanfujing Dajie: silk shawls, silk tops, Chinese-style shirts, hand-made cloth shoes etc. Good shops, with fair prices and good quality.

For dinner we went to "Sichuan Restaurant" just off Wangfujing Dajie. It is a very famous old restaurant of Beijing, and photographs on its walls testify to Zhou En Lai, Deng Xiao Ping etc all having dined here and hosted various banquets here. The restaurant appears a bit worn out, but the food was most excellent, and reasonably priced. We gorged on their fried eggplants with garlic & chilly, together with Dandan noodles.

We located a Foot massage place in a shopping mall, and treated ourselves to a lovely foot massage for 30 minutes each. The juices started flowing in the legs again, and suddenly we felt that we could walk again.

We then walked back to Tiananmen Square, near the Gate of Heavenly Peace, and saw the Square all lit up at night. People are not allowed on the main Square at night, but the sight is very pretty from anywhere nearby.

Just then we spotted a young man, wearing two gold medals, striking a very bizarre pose in the middle of a flower bed, getting himself photographed. The medals did not appear to be from the Beijing Olympics! The sight was hilarious, and when we could not control our laughter at the ludicrous scene, the subject in question saw us and started laughing too !

We boarded the metro at Tiananmen East, returned to our hotel by 10 pm, and crashed out after an exhausting but fulfilling day.

Your report continues to be wonderful. I am wondering though, why did you schedule your itinerary as you did? I would have thought you would have gone from Beijing to Xian and then to Guilan, but you seem to have flown back and forth. Was there a reason? Also, wondered if you had considered using the overnight trains and if so, why you chose flights instead. I look forward to the rest of your report. Thanks so much. - June

Hi thank you very much for your advice.The tour agent said it would be too difficult for us to go to GT wall without a guide as we won't know where to go and see everything-I guess he just wants to make money! Well, who Doesn't? I will just take a taxi -can I just get one from outside the hotel, or ask the hotel to arrange one for us. Language may be a problem to if we take one from outside. I noticed you stayed at BAMBOO garden hotel-would you recommend this hotel as one from where we could easily move around, with good facilities. I am rather fussy about bathrooms-I like having baths twice a day and want the bath to be clean, and toilet not too near bath-actually shower.We 3 will share a room and cost so we could get away with a hotel slightly above average in price.
Also the tour agent said that if we did Hutong tour on our own we will waste a lot of time since Beijing is a huge city with huge traffic jams. After what you said we will do it on our own. After reading your report I feel we shoud try and do things like you-it will out a lot cheaper! Only I wonder, will we manage to get our train and flight tickets easily according to our planned itenarary. Would it be OK for me to send you my itenarary and you could advice me furthur. I woud really appreciate this. I have paid a deposit to this agent, so I wonder what to do If we decide to do things ourselves?
Wolud you say it's best to stay in Wangfujing area or near Forbidden city?
Thanks again
I read that you are in Pune, how far is this from Mumbai?

dgunbug, perhaps it would have made more sense to fly from Shanghai to Beijing, then Xian and then Guilin. But if you add up the total travel time or the airfares, it does not really make much difference doing it in the order in which we did. I guess our motivation was to alternate between large cities and smaller ones, to give more variety. So we spaced out Shanghai, Beijing, and Hongkong, and put Xian and Yangshuo in between. We chose to fly rather than use overnight trains essentially to conserve time, as China is a large country, and we wanted to cover as much ground as possible in the limited time available. And if you purchase tickets 3-4 days before departure, the flight tickets are no different in cost to the train tickets (may even be cheaper).

faridabobat, it might be safer to book a taxi through your hotel. This is what we did. As for hotel location, I think it is more important that the hotel be within walking distance of a metro station, rather than the actual location within the city. If you are within a 5 minute walk to a metro station, you can pretty much get to anywhere in Beijing in a short time. The same would apply for a large city like Shanghai. We selected our Shanghai and Beijing hotels based on proximity to metro stations, and user reviews on tripadvisor.com ; I have no hesitation recommending Bamboo Garden Hotel to anyone.

I would not worry about getting train and flight tickets, unless you are traveling during one of the Chinese holiday periods. Otherwise, it is sufficient to book 3-4 days in advance, and much cheaper.

Doing the China trip yourself (without any agent) would be considerably cheaper, and more fun. But I hope you are a fairly experienced traveler, for otherwise it may also be a bit daunting.

Pune is only a two hour drive away from Mumbai.

How gracious our indiancouple is:

I would have noted that faridabobat joined Fodor's yesterday and tactfully suggested they do their OWN research and stop diverting this post to their own agenda.

Our heroes from Pune are only half-way through a huge task; one that will benefit countless others. This is becoming an encyclopedia of how to 'do it yourself in China'. It seems a shame to send it off in another direction.

This is not about YOU, faridobat, or your bathroom requirements, it's about THEM.

I would have noted that - but then, I'm a curmudgeonly sod. Our Indiancouple are far too cultured, too kind and too generous to suggest anything of the sort.

great report, i am loving the details

Dogster I don't know what you mean- All I'm trying is to get tips from our Indiancouple who are ,of course, extremely cultered,kind and generous. I have no intention of diverting this post -Since I'm new to Fodor's I don't know much, maybe there is another way of finding tips from Indiancouple without diversion!!

my only problem with buying plane tickets when you are there and just a few days in advance is:.....what do you do if the planes you want are all full....most planes i go on these days have little or no open seats....this could ruin a whole holiday...

Thanks again. Someone seems to think I'm diverting this report -I did not realise this. All I want is tips since I' m unsure about many things. I really must say I' m finding your report very interesting and will definitely find it useful-looking forward to reading rest of it.If I need more advice, which I'm sure I will, how can I do it?

Just open your own post, farida. Put your questions there. You'll get tons of advice.

Thanks dogster. Do I do this from START A NEW TOPIC? I agree with rhkkmk about plane tickets.

rhkkmk, you ask a valid question about flight tickets. I had the same question, and I had posted a thread specifically inquiring about the sagacity of booking flight tickets in China only 3-4 days in advance. I had been assured by Fodorites that this was perfectly safe, and that I would have no problems in getting seats. I trusted the words of experienced Fodorites (they have never been wrong), and I had no problems.

Please also notice that we were traveling on highly traveled routes, which were serviced by atleast 8-10 flights a day, if not more. Chances of all flights getting oversold 4 days before departure is quite remote. Of course, if you are traveling off the beaten track, on routes having 1 or 2 flights a day, I would certainly advise more caution.

I had done another preparation prior to departure. I had been doing "test checks" on the Ctrip site for all my travel sectors many weeks in advance. I had noted the standard fares for each route, noted that fares start dipping about 7 days before departure, and reach their lowest point about 3-4 days before departure, after which they start climbing up again. I had made a noting about the "lowest" fares that appeared on each route (which was usually 30-40% of the standard fare).

The moment we reached Shanghai, I decided to book my Shanghai-Xian tickets (4 days hence), and Xian-Beijing tickets (6 days hence). The quotes that I got were reasonably close to my noted "lowest fares", and I went ahead. Had I been adventurous, and waited a few more days for the Xian-Beijing sector, I would have probably got a slightly better deal, but I did not want to spend my vacation counting pennies. Even if the fare I got was 10-15% higher than the "lowest fare", it was OK.

When I reached Beijing, I checked out the fares for Beijing-Guilin sector (4 days hence), and Guilin-Shenzhen (7 days hence), and got a decent quote for both, which I booked immediately. I could have waited a little more for the Guilin-Shenzhen sector, but number of flights on that sector were few, so I did not take a chance.

I think the worst that could possibly happen, by following this strategy, is that you may not get the super-discounted fare, and may get the standard fare. I have not seen flights getting sold out until 1 day before departure, in my experiments. So, at worst, you will get the same fare as you would get if you booked several weeks in advance. Chances are, you will pay 50-65% less, sometimes 75% less.

Of course if your travel coincides with some Chinese holiday travel period, then it would be a different story.

This is great info Indiancouple. Thanks again and I look forward to the rest of your report.

You and your wife's energy is really impressive, packing in so much every day, I am equally impressed by your sharp senses and keen observations. Although I have been to the cities you visited many times, your attention to details is giving me a jolt not to take things for granted. By the way, The "V" sign means "great" or "cool", the chinese recently adopted the word "cool" into their language and say it as "ku" (4th sound like "koo").

faridabobat: Yes, start a new topic, please, what you are doing here is called "hijacking", not polite. Suggest even before you post a new topic is to do some research by reading the past 12 months China TRs (travel reports), then ask questions with background information, i.e. what kind of budget for hotels $50, $100, $200? How many beds for 3 people? How far the distance from toilet to bath/shower. Fodorites are very willing to help.

dgunbug, thanks for continuing to read my report, and for your continued positive feedback. Same for waterlilycao.

Shanghainese, I had seen several postings and responses by you on this forum when I was preparing for our trip (including responses to several of my own queries). Thanks for your appreciation. Didn't realize that the "V" sign meant "cool" to the Chinese; that is quite interesting. And can you explain their obsession with the "Titanic" pose (arms spread out) ?

TRIP REPORT (Continued) :
Day 9 : Saturday, May 16th : BEIJING :
This was the day we had waited for all these months, the "Great Wall" day. We breakfasted at the hotel. The previous night I had asked the hotel to book a taxi for us for the Great Wall journey, which they did. The taxi arrived promptly at 8:15 am, cost 600 Rmb (which I knew was slightly higher than the going rate, but felt safe doing it from the hotel), and the driver knew passable English. BIG benefit !

It was a pleasant drive to Mutianyu. I had posted threads on this forum earlier, seeking advice on whether to go to Badaling or Mutianyu, and the overwhelming advice had been for Mutianyu. So Mutianyu it was. We reached the site at 9:45 am. The driver escorted us to the ticket office. We bought entry tickets, and return journey ticket by cable-car (our driver insisted that coming down by tobaggon was too dangerous, enough for my DW to rule it out !). Then boarded the cable car, and reached the top by 10:15 am.

Nothing can prepare you for the feeling you get when you are on top of the Great Wall, and words would not do justice to the experience, so I will not even attempt it. Suffice to say, we were glad that we had selected Mutianyu; there was dense forest cover all around and a wonderfully rugged terrain, which made for a very pretty sight; also, there were a sufficient number of people on the wall, and not as many as to seem obnoxious. The weather was a little misty and cloudy, which cleared up as the day went along, which added to the beauty of the vista. We walked in both directions to our heart's content for several hours. Telephoned our children from our cellphone, to let them know where we were. It was a spectacular experience, and a long-standing dream come true for us.

We came down at about 12:45 pm. Had some coffee, bought some mandatory Great Wall souvenirs, and left by our waiting taxi. Reached Beijing by about 2:15 pm. We asked the taxi to drop us off at a veg restaurant called "Xu Xiang Zhai" near the Lama Temple (opposite the Confucius Temple). It was a lovely restaurant, with delicious Chinese food, and reasonable too. Loved their dumplings with mustard.

Had been noticing the last one week, that Chinese restaurants do not follow the normal practice of first serving your soup and appetizers, and then bringing on the main course. Had thought that they brought dishes at random, as and when they were ready. But a keener observation was revealing by now that there WAS a pattern to their service: first the main course, then the appetizer, and finally the Soup !! This happened every single time, without fail !

After lunch, we entered the Lama Temple, and were pleasantly surprised at what we saw. We found the temple simply fabulous. We entered virtually every hall, and admired the 26 mtr high statue of Buddha made from a single sandalwood tree-trunk ! The entire temple complex is quite large, very well shaded with trees, and very interesting. Try to include it in your itinerary, as it is well worth it.

Next we went to the Confucius Temple nearby, which turned out to be an utter disappointment. Not worth the entry fee.

We then boarded the metro from Yongehong Lama Temple station to Yonganli. The subway exit at Yonganli takes you straight into the Silk Street market, which is an odds-and-ends market spread over 6-7 floors of a mall. Bought 25 DVD's of Hollywood classics for 8 Rmb each ! (I have already viewed a few on my return to India, and the quality is fairly decent). DW purchased some sweaters, shawls and scarves. I bought several shirts for 35 Rmb each !

Finally departed from Silk Street market, and walked one metro stop to Guomao, where we spotted the Indian restaurant we wanted : "Taj Pavilion". Our daughter's room-mate in USA had recommended it, and it turned out to be a fine recommendation. It is on the ground floor of the West Wing of the World Trade Center; a classy place, with nice decor and really excellent Indian food. Highly recommended.

After dinner, we boarded the metro from Guomao back to our hotel and retired for the day.

TRIP REPORT (Continued) :
Day 10 : Sunday, May 17th : BEIJING :
Woke up early again, had breakfast at the hotel and were off. First stop for the day : Panjiayuan Market. This market is active only on weekends, is said to be at its best on a Sunday morning, and is the CHEAPEST place in China for shopping. We had specially planned this for a Sunday morning.

We reached the market by 9:15 am. We had a tight schedule for the day, and could devote only 90 minutes here, but it was well worth it to spend 3-4 hours here. It is an excellent flea market, selling just about everything, and the prices are really unbelievable (stuff is good too). DW bought some necklaces, earrings, and I also pocketed some souvenirs. Stuff that we bought for 15-20 Rmb here, we could not find anywhere else on this trip for even 100-150 Rmb. Whatever we did not purchase, we were to regret for the remainder of our trip (Why didn't we buy this at Panjiayuan ??!!).

From the Panjiayuan Market, we took a taxi to the Temple of Heaven. This was the only rip-off ride we had during the entire trip. It was a short journey, and should not have cost more than 15 Rmb, but the meter showed 35 Rmb. Something was certainly fishy. I had begun to trust the Chinese taxi-drivers by now, as so far no one had taken us "for a ride". The trust evaporated today.

We bought through tickets for the Temple of Heaven. The place was lovely from the moment we entered the complex. In the shady gardens, there were large groups of Chinese couples doing ballroom dancing. So sweet and relaxing to watch them go through such graceful movements. At another spot, equally large number of people were exercising, using a tennis-like racket and ball, an activity that required a lot of finesse and balance.

All the three main viewing halls/altars at the Temple of Heaven are fabulous in their own respective ways : the Temple for Good Harvest, the Imperial Vault of Heaven, and the Circular Altar. Lovely architecture, and very unusual colors (greens and blues, rather than the typical red color). The weather was sunny and crisp; the atmosphere was relaxed on a Sunday morning, and we had a great time here.

On exiting, we walked to the Pearl Market near the East Gate of the Temple of Heaven. Similar to Silk Street, but perhaps a notch higher in quality and prices. Had to rush through, as we were really short on time today.

At about 1:30 pm, we boarded a metro to Chongwenmen. I wanted to make a repeat visit to the Gongdelin restaurant, which was the only veg place I knew of in this part of town. I knew the rough area, and had their business card in Chinese. We showed the Chinese address to several people, who all pointed in different directions. Finally, one man who seemed to know what he was saying, pointed us firmly in the right direction, and we were there. This time the food turned out to be much better than the previous visit, and we enjoyed our meal. The drumstick mushroom, in particular, was delicious.

We had planned on visiting the Summer Palace in the afternoon, and unfortunately the entry gates close at 5pm. The Summer Palace is not the easiest of places to reach, as it is presently not serviced by metro, and is a bit far. I understand that the metro line leading to the Summer Palace gate will be up and running by October 2009. We boarded the metro to Xizhimen station, where we carefully scanned the exit maps to note the right exit to take for our onward bus journey. Stood in line for the #375 bus to the Summer Palace (as per Lonely Planet guidebook). Asked several educated people in the line, to confirm that this bus would in fact go to the Summer Palace, and they all told us NO very vehemently. Did not believe them, and waited for the bus to come. Hopped on and asked the bus driver, and he nodded YES.

It was a longish bus ride, and we reached the Summer Palace at 4:30 pm. They had stopped issuing through tickets, as most halls would close at 5 pm; they were only issuing tickets to enter the Summer Palace complex, where we could stay till 8 pm after entering. This was fine, as we basically wanted to walk around the vast complex, and were less interested in seeing any particular hall or building from inside.

We were approached by some guides. Bargained one of them down to 50 Rmb. Her English accent was terrible, but I figured she would be useful in navigating us through the huge complex. Did not particularly care for her "historical trivia", as we couldn't understand most of what she said.

We found the Palace complex really refreshing. The structures on Longevity Hill were wonderful, especially the main Fragrance Tower. The Kunming Lake was so so cool and the breeze was soothing. Would have enjoyed taking a boat ride on the lake, but we were too late for all that. Just walked all over the complex, and admired everything from outside. We heard a magpie sing; according to our guide, we would shortly hear some good news. Still waiting !

We left the Palace at about 7:30 pm. Took the bus #375 back to Xizhimen, and the metro back to the hotel. Were too too tired to go anywhere for dinner, so we decided to have dinner at the hotel itself. We bought some fruits near our hotel for an early breakfast the next day, as we were departing for Guilin. Finished packing up, and slept. It had been a very exhausting day.

We had thoroughly enjoyed Beijing. It is, quite understandably, the high point of any China visit. Perhaps we required one more day at Beijing. Had missed out on the Beihai Park, Prince Gong's residence, and watching a Beijing Opera. Beijing is a lovely city, and requires greater time.

This had been our best hotel so far (although I can find nothing to complain about for our Shanghai and Xian hotels either). It had Chinese decor, which was nice. Did not get time to explore the hotel compound fully. If interested, you will have to book this hotel well in advance, as it gets full very soon.

This report is just AMAZING.

So, quite obviously, are both of you. Wow.

dogster, WOW, that is some compliment. Thanks.

TRIP REPORT (Continued) :
Day 11 : Monday, May 18th : YANGSHUO :
We had to catch a 9:25am flight to Guilin. We had liked the driver who had taken us to the Great Wall, and had fixed up with him to take us to the airport this morning for 100 Rmb (much less than the hotel arranged charges of 150 Rmb). We had a fruit breakfast in our room, the taxi arrived promptly at 7 am, and we were at Beijing Capital Airport well before 8 am.

It was a long flight of 3 hours, going from the northern end of China to the southern side. Slept a lot on the flight. Reached Guilin airport at 12:15 in the afternoon. We were booked to stay in Yangshuo for the next 3 days, and had booked a guide for all three days. As we exited with our baggage, we spotted our guide Lilly Lu holding a sign with our name. She appeared to be a nice energetic young lady, with a decent English accent. I had been in correspondence with her for the last several months, and felt very comfortable with her from the outset.

We had been blessed with excellent weather so far on this trip. OK, we did have some minor drizzles in Xian and Beijing, but nothing that disrupted our programs. We had a feeling that our luck could run out soon, as the weather forecast for the next 2 days in Guilin was bad (heavy rains), and the forecast for the subsequent 4 days in Hongkong was not good either.

We had a car booked for us for the entire day, which had come with Lilly to the airport. As our luggage was loaded and we clambered in, Lilly confirmed the bad weather forecast for today and tomorrow. However, the saving grace was that the rain in Yangshuo was much less than Guilin. She also told us that our scheduled bamboo rafting on the Yulong river for the day was not disrupted, and very much ON !

We drove straight to a point on the Yulong river near the Dragon Bridge (near Yangshuo), where the two of us got aboard a bamboo raft. The raft could only accommodate the boatman and two passengers, so Lilly could not ride with us. She would go in the car with our luggage, and meet us at the disembarkation point two hours hence.

We started the raft trip at 1:45 pm, and it lasted for 2 hours. Fortunately, there was negligible rain, and anyway the raft had a large umbrella to protect us from any minor drizzles. It was cloudy and misty all around, which really added to the beauty of the wonderful karst mountain scenery. The next two hours were heavenly. A lovely gentle ride down the Yulong river, with breathtaking scenery on both sides. There were a series of small "rapids" along the way, which the boatman negotiated expertly, only asking us to lift our legs a few inches (to avoid the water wetting our feet) every time we negotiated a rapid. Stopped only once at the Dragon Bridge for photos. The boatman was really nice, and kept pointing out great scenery to us, exhorting me to click my camera. At one point, he pulled out his cigarette packet, and showed me that the photograph printed on the cigarette pack was exactly the vista before our eyes. Raw, unadulterated beauty, rendered even more divine with the misty atmosphere.

As we approached our destination point, other rafts crossed us, selling water, coke, beer etc. When we declined, they asked if we wanted to buy beer for our boatman. I enquired from our boatman if he was interested; he shyly indicated that he was ! So a large bottle of beer was purchased for our wonderful boatman.

We reached our disembarkation point at 3:45 pm, where Lilly was waiting with the car. She had decided to take us to Silver Caves that day, and said we must hurry to complete our lunch, as Silver Cave closes at 5 pm. We stopped at a roadside restaurant in the countryside, recommended by Lilly, and the lunch turned out to be delicious. Fried cabbages, shredded potatoes, and rice, all very spicy at our request; huge helpings and ridiculously cheap.

Noticed a few things within a few hours of being in this region. People understood English far better here than in Beijing or Xian. Now this is contrary to all logic. One would expect more English to be spoken in Beijing, specially with the recent Olympics, but the level of English literacy was far far higher in this far-away countryside. No communication problems anywhere at all. Next, the range of veg food available was a pleasant surprise. Anywhere we went the next 3 days, every restaurant would have atleast 10-15 dishes which were vegetarian (as opposed to 2-3 dishes elsewhere, unless we were in a veg restaurant). All this was a pleasant surprise, and totally contrary to expectations.

After lunch we rushed to Silver Cave (which is also on the outskirts of Yangshuo), and just made it before closing time. It is a large cave with stalactites and stalagmites, with fancy lighting everywhere. The one hour tour inside was rewarding. The reflection pool was particularly spectacular. Apparently, there are many such caves in the Guilin/Yangshuo neighborhood, with Reed Flute Cave of Guilin being most well known. According to Lilly, the Silver Caves are the best.

After exiting the Silver Caves at 6 pm, we drove to the Moon Hill, and clicked photos from some distance away (apparently the ground was slippery due to rain if we went closer). Cute hill, with a moon-shaped hole in the middle !

Finally, at about 7 pm, we reached Yangshuo. All day we had been sightseeing, straight from the airport, and our luggage was still in the car boot ! We told Lilly that we badly needed a laundry machine, as we had not been able to do any laundry for the last 10 days, and were totally out of fresh clothes. She took us straight to a laundry shop, which offered to do washing and drying @ 9 Rmb per kilo of clothes. This seemed like a good bargain, and we virtually emptied our suitcases at the shop !

We needed to while away about 90 minutes of time till our laundry was done, and we asked Lilly to take us to a massage place. She coyly checked with me what we meant by "massage", whether we wanted the real massage, or were looking for "entertainment" ! On being reassured that we only wanted the real stuff, she took us to the spa of a Dr Lilly Li (similarity in names coincidental), who had boards plastered all over her spa about being recommended on Lonely Planet. I opted for a male masseur, and DW went for a lady. We each had a 90 minute session, which was absolutely divine. Very professional, very relaxing, truly the hands of experts. At 100 Rmb each, it was also quite reasonable. And nice environs too.

Picked up our laundry at 9pm. Wanted to have dinner before we went to our hotel, but the taxi driver was getting impatient, as we had probably overstayed our allotted time. So we quickly picked up some pizza and bread on the way, and reached our hotel at about 9:15 pm : the Li River Retreat.

Had read a lot of good reviews about this hotel, and it did not disappoint. Has a lot of rustic charm on the outside, and comfortable furnishings inside, with a very good restaurant, and very friendly staff. We had booked a deluxe room, which came with a balcony, and the scenery outside was fab. We quickly finished our dinner, and went to bed. Fortunately, the rain had not interfered at all with our schedule for the day. We had done everything that we wanted, without any heavy rain coming in the way. However, Lilly was not as optimistic about tomorrow.

Still loving your report!

An update on summer palace we found out is to take metro line 10 to bagou, the end of the line, then tranfer to bus 374 or bus 74 for a less than 5 min. Drive to the summer palace!

Looking forward to hearing more of your time with lilly!

We're about to board our last flight for home sweet home!

Wonderful report, indiancouple, I am loving it. Your love of travel and writing comes through.

Your detailed report is eye opening. Will add China to my travel plans now.

I have only gone thru day 4 of your report so far...but keep it coming.

Your China report is as enjoyable as your Spainish one in which we learnt so much from.

I am surprised that you have problem with food, Chinese menus are usually loaded with veggie dishes.

looking forward to the rest of your report.

Brilliant report-you two really know how to have a fulfilling day, every day! Will keep on looking forward to rest.

I hate for this report to be over. I am enjoying it so much and look forward to each new edition!

Images2, I too had noticed the newly opened metro line 10 going to Bagou, but someone told me that the Bagou section was not yet operational. If you used the metro line all the way to Bagou, then obviously my information was incorrect.

Samuell, surprising to note that so many like you still remember our Spain & Portugal TR.

magical, faridabobat and dgunbug, thanks once again. Will hopefully finish the TR in 2-3 days more.

TRIP REPORT (Continued) :
Day 12 : Tuesday, May 19th : YANGSHUO :
We woke up late, after 7 am, and had a leisurely coffee in our balcony. The pitter-patter rain continued off and on, and it did not appear too menacing. Had a nice breakfast in the hotel restaurant, and made use of the free computer terminal with internet in the lobby.

Our guide Lilly Lu arrived at 9:30 am as agreed. We had wanted to witness the San Lujie light show in the evening, of which we had heard so much, and to watch the Cormorant fishing display. Lilly told us that because of the rain the last 3-4 days, the river level was too high, and the San Lujie light show had been getting canceled everyday, and was also canceled for that day. Ditto for the Cormorant fishing display. Chances of seeing either on the next day were also remote. The previous evening she had also expressed doubts about going on the Li River cruise today, as she said the authorities might just ban all boats if the river level becomes unsafe. However, she now announced that the Li River cruise was definitely ON, as it had not rained much during the night.

We took a taxi to Yangshuo town (the Li River Retreat hotel is a good 25 minute walk away from the main town, and it is convenient to take a taxi to go to town). Roamed around West Street, which is the "happening" street in Yangshuo, and very pretty. Saw a cafe called "The Best Coffee", which Lilly testified was in fact the best ! Sat down and had a nice cup of coffee.

We had not booked a car for the day, as we usually like to use public transportation on atleast one day in every place we visit (to interact more with the local people, and get a feel for their culture). So we asked Lilly to take us to the bus station, where we boarded a bus for Yangdi at about 11 am. Interesting rural passengers on the way. Reached Yangdi at about 12:30 pm.

We boarded a small boat at Yangdi for a two-hour cruise on the Li River from Yangdi to Xingping. This was a small boat, which could accommodate atmost 4 passengers, plus the boatman. They charged 250 Rmb for the entire boat, for this two-hour cruise. Most people visiting this area stay at Guilin, and take a large cruise boat down the Li River from Guilin to Yangshuo, paying about 475 Rmb per person. That cruise takes 4-5 hours, and the good scenery comes only between Yangdi and Xingping, where the large ship spends less than 45 minutes. Our guide had insisted (during our planning stages) that we should preferably take this small boat down the Li River. It takes longer on the scenic portion of the journey, saves considerable cost and time overall, and is much more enjoyable. Sound advice in retrospect, and glad that we heeded her.

So we boarded our small cruise boat (with Lilly, as the boat was large enough for 4) and began our fabulous Li River cruise. As the day before, there was negligible rain, and misty environment all around. There were no rapids to be negotiated on this river, just a gentle cruise. The scenery was some of the best I have ever seen, and even topped what we had witnessed the previous day on the Yulong River. The best part comes as you near Xingping. The picture used on a 20 Rmb Chinese currency note is the exact vista which you encounter on this portion of the Li River. I would say that this journey was one of the high points of our entire trip, and something that will remain etched in our minds forever.

Reached Xingping around 3 pm, and went for lunch to a cute little restaurant near the waterfront (cannot remember its name). Had Hot & Sour Soup, Fried Rice, and Mushrooms with Green Peppers. Everything was fiery, as per our specifications. As before, food in the countryside tasted so much fresher and tastier than in the cities.

Roamed around Xingping village, which we found fascinating. Lilly had warned us that we should take people's permission before clicking photos in a village, as the psyche is quite different here, and people may not like being photographed. It was interesting to see the simple houses (in many cases the interiors of the houses were visible). At some places many people had assembled to play cards or other games. People appeared very friendly, but whenever we sought permission to take a picture, it was swiftly denied. Strange how the cultural patterns change so fast from cities to villages.

It was a market day at Xingping, and we visited the market also, frequented by farmers. Saw the stuff that farmers bought on a market day

At about 4 pm, we boarded a bus from Xingping back to Yangshuo, which reached Yangshuo in 45 minutes. Again, we strolled on West Street, and finally seated ourselves on the top floor of a cafe ("Cafe del Moon"), sipped coffee, and watched people go by.

At 6:30 pm, we went for dinner at a veg restaurant at Yangshuo, called "Pure Lotus", of which we had heard rave reviews. The place lived up to its reputation, and the food was excellent. Then we took a taxi back to our hotel, and went to bed early. It had been our second successive relaxing day, after the hectic schedules earlier.

The weather forecast for the next day was very good. However, it was unlikely that we would see the San Lujie light show, as the river would take a few days to recede. That was our only regret. Otherwise, the weather had been kind to us the last 2 days, despite the grim forecasts.

What a fabulous trip! I can't wait to hear more and I am hoping that we find out that the river receded faster then expected and you were able to see the light show...

Thanks for your good wishes zverybestfamily; but unfortunately it was not to be, as you shall soon see in the TR. Thanks all the same !

TRIP REPORT (Continued):
Day 13 : Wednesday, May 20th : YANGSHUO :
This was our last day in Yangshuo, and we had planned on visiting the Dragon's Backbone Rice Terraces near Longsheng today. Woke up very leisurely at 8 am, and breakfasted in the hotel at 9 am. Lilly arrived at 9am, confirming the good weather forecast: no rains, and bright sunshine after 11 am. Excellent. However, there was confirmation from the Light Show people that there would be no Light Shows for atleast two more days, as river level was too high. Same applied to the Cormorant fishing display. This was a big disappointment, but what could be done ?

Lilly had been a very good guide, and we had grown fond of her. She was uncomplicated, easy English accent, very reasonable in her fees, and never appeared to be pushing us towards any shop or any establishment to earn some commission. Whenever we asked to be referred to any restaurant, or massage place, or laundry, she had always referred us to the best with most economical rates. We had asked her as to why she doesn't start a website of her own, to get more clients; she was under the impression that creating and hosting a website was very very expensive.

That morning, at the hotel, I showed Lilly some websites of private guides in Yangshuo, so that she could get an idea of what matter to provide on a website. Then I googled and located some website designers in the Guilin area, and she noted down their contact numbers. And finally I showed her the Fodors threads, and how someone had referred her name to us. She was thrilled to see all this, and promised to create her website soon. I have no intentions of advertising for her, but to assist others who may seek a good guide in Yangshuo, I can recommend her name without hesitation. Her contact id is: lulilly12@hotmail.com .

We had booked a car for the day, as the rice terraces are a good 3-4 hour drive from Yangshuo. We set off from the hotel at 9:30am, and by 10:30am the sun was shining bright in the sky. It remained sunny throughout the day after that.

Stopped at some Tea gardens on the way at 11 am. We were taken for a short tour of the tea gardens, and then witnessed a tea ceremony, where we got to taste various exotic teas. Loved the Litchi-flavored tea. All this was free, and thereafter we were invited to purchase some of the teas for sale. Everything was priced very high, so we passed and moved on.

Reached the Longji Dragonbone Rice Terraces at about 1pm. Had to walk up from the carpark to the Ping'an village, which took another half-hour. Went to some "Countryside Inn" for some average lunch of Mushrooms with bamboo shoots and rice.

At about 2 pm we started the circular hike/walk around the Rice Terraces, and finished at 4:30 pm. There are palanquins available to carry the feeble ones, but I would strongly advise against any of that. The walk is not strenuous at all, and easily doable by anyone. You can rest whenever you want along the way.

At first, I was somewhat disappointed at the views, and wondered if it was worth the long journey. But as we moved further ahead and further towards the top, the views just got better and better. The best vistas unfolded towards the end of the hike, so my advice to everyone is: please be patient. You will be justly rewarded. And by the time we finished, I had absolutely no regrets about having made the long journey to come here. Absolutely divine views. The only drawback was that the rice planting had not yet been done; the "baby rice" was being prepared, and the fields were being flooded in preparation for the planting. I am sure this place looks very different at different times of the year, depending upon the state of the rice crops.

There is always a trade-off when visiting places of such natural beauty. A clear sunny day makes for great pictures, but the actual scenery is not as dramatic before your eyes. These places look very pretty with some mist and clouds thrown in, but then the pictures in your camera don't come out so great ! The last two days had been unsurpassed beauty on the Yulong River and the Li River, although my pictures do not do justice to what we saw. As for the Dragonbone rice terraces, the reverse is true . The views were fab, but the pictures have turned out unbelievably good !

We encountered women of the "Yao" tribe (with very long hair), with whom we clicked some pictures, and then women of the "Miao" tribe (very pretty ladies in colorful attire), with whom we also clicked pictures. I am sure I have the spelling of the tribes wrong. Someone may kindly correct them for me.

We returned to the car park by 4:45 pm, and commenced our return journey, reaching Yangshuo by about 7:30 pm. We went for a repeat massage at Dr Lilly Li's spa. Time was short, so we only had a foot massage each of 30 minutes, which rejuvenated us. Then we returned to the hotel, and bid goodbye to our guide Lilly Lu.

Had a nice dinner at the hotel. The weather was lovely, so they had moved their restaurant out to the patio, which was very romantic. Had a lovely spicy dinner of noodles with fried green beans. Then settled our bills (as we were checking out very early in the morning), packed and slept.

Yangshuo had been a magical R&R place for us in this trip. We never had to do much walking, there was divine beauty everywhere, and we just chilled out.

Now you have a reason to return!
I think I will contact Lilly, thank you!

I've just begun to read and will return to this excellent report later today. Many thanks for taking the time to write!

I have a question about the matchmaking in the park: Were the prospective mates on hand?
Does this take place daily? (I would love to see this when I visit Shanghai next winter!)

Indiancouple - did you make your own arrangements for a driver or did Lilli do that for you? Thanks again for this wonderful report.

ekscrunchy, I don't think the prospective brides and grooms were around in the park; perhaps only their parents, as we did not see any young people around. I have no idea if this goes on everyday, or only on weekends. We visited on a Saturday, and it was on in full swing. Searching for a mate ? Just teasing.

dgunbug, we had asked Lilly to do all the arrangements for car and driver. She had quoted prices in advance, we had cross-checked the prices and approved them. There were no hidden costs or surprises.

wonderful report..

TRIP REPORT (Continued) :
Day 14 : Thursday, May 21st : HONG KONG :
Got up at the ungodly hour of 4 am, and left the hotel by 5 am. The taxi to drop us at the Guilin airport arrived on schedule. Our flight to Shenzhen was at 8am (the only flight in the morning, so we didn't have any option). We were at the airport by 6:20 am, and surprisingly airborne by 7:45 am (15 mins ahead of schedule !).

For some strange reason, flights from mainland China to Shenzhen are about half the price of flights to Hong Kong. Since the distance from Shenzhen airport to downtown Hongkong is almost the same as from Hongkong Intl airport, it made sense to book flights to Shenzhen.

We reached Shenzhen Airport at 8:40 am. Went to the counter of the Airport Shuttle bus, where our hotel had promised our tickets would be waiting for us. They seemed to have no message for the same, and we were forced to buy the tickets. Called up our hotel to let them know. A few minutes later, the lady at the counter came running to us, and refunded our money. Obviously the message from our hotel must have come through. Didn't matter in any case, as what our hotel was charging for the pickup was the same as if we had purchased the tickets directly.

Just then DW realized that she had left her reading glasses on the aircraft. It was a nice pair of reading glasses that she was quite fond of. I dashed back to the office of China Southern airlines, and informed them about it, requesting them to check our seats. They did their best, but could not find it. DW felt miserable !

We boarded the Airport Shuttle at 10 am (we had missed the 9:30 am bus due to the reading glasses confusion). Had to go through the border crossing, which was quite smooth and efficient. A bus was waiting for us at the other end, and we drove into Hongkong. At about noon, the bus dropped us off near the Jordan MTR station in Kowloon, from where our hotel was supposed to be walking distance. However, after walking some distance, we realized that our hotel was a few blocks away, and we were with heavy luggage. So we hailed a taxi, and reached our hotel comfortably.

The Evergreen Hotel in Kowloon, where we were booked, turned out to be a disappointment. The location was decent, about an 8 minute walk to Jordan MTR, and barely 2 minutes from the Temple Street Night Market. But rooms were tiny, with no windows at all. The quality of linen, towels etc was shoddy. The free breakfast was of average quality. Yes there were free computer terminals with internet. The saving grace was that we had booked several months in advance at 540 HK $/night, and had noted a drop in the quoted price a week before our departure. On informing the front desk, they graciously reduced our charges to 500 HK $/night, which was fine.

We were out of the hotel by 1 pm. The forecast for the next 4 days was cattered Thundershowers. However, there seemed to be no rain in sight, atleast today. We walked to Jordan MTR, and bought Octopus Cards (a must for every visitor; saves hassles, acceptable on metros, bus, taxis, ferries, peak-trams, even at shops; unused amount is refunded; can be topped up any time). Rode the MTR one stop to Tsim Sha Tsui, and walked to Ashley Road. Easily located the Indian restaurant called "Gaylord", where we had a sumptuous buffet lunch, which was good and filling.

From there, we strolled over to Harbor City Mall. This was a very large glitzy mall, with designer shops. Nice to look around, but too expensive to purchase anything. Went over to the Clock Tower, and sat outside the HK Cultural Center for a while, staring across the harbor at Hongkong Island. Then took the Star Ferry to Wan Chai across the harbor. Short, lovely cruise. Reminded me of my last visit to this place 32 years ago, when I had also taken a ride on the Star Ferry.

At Wan Chai, we walked around the HK Convention Center, then wandered inside and went up as far as they would let us go. Then out again and over to the Golden Bouhimia Square. And finally the Star Ferry back to Kowloon.

It was approaching 6:30 pm. We strolled through Avenue of the Stars, and sat down on a bench, taking in the cool air and gazing at Hongkong Island across. Very pretty as the lights slowly came on.

At the stroke of 8pm, the "Symphony of Lights" show started, which is best viewed from the Avenue of Stars. It is a nice outdoor light show with music, with laser beams projecting in the sky from most of the skyscrapers on HK Island. Quite impressive.

After the show was over, we walked back to Nathan Road, and walked the "Golden Mile" stretch. Checked out shops, which were open till very late. Finally bought DW a nice pair of reading glasses, which made her feel better !

We walked to Knutsford Terrace, of which we had read a lot about. Turned out to be a great lively place. Sat in a pub for some time, and then had a wonderful dinner at an Italian restaurant there. After dinner, we continued walking on Nathan Road, doing window shopping, till we reached Jordan Street, where we turned and entered the Temple Street Night Market.

This is a wonderful market, selling everything. Good prices (although we still sorely missed the lost opportunities at Panjiayuan Market in Beijing !), and a wide variety of stuff on offer. Spent a lot of time here, exploring the market from end to end. Bought DVD's, ladies handbags etc. Finally returned to our hotel well after midnight, and crashed out past 1 am.

Wow! You both seem to have endless energy. You must need a vacation now that you are home.
Looking back what would you have purchased at the Panjiayuan Market?

Fantastic report-look forward to reading rest! Given me very good tips to add onto my trip.

zverybestfamily, I think we would have liked to purchase many more Chinese decorative items like brass turtles, tea-pots of all shapes and sizes, scroll paintings, calligraphy, junk jewellery etc, and lots more souvenirs for gifts back home.

TRIP REPORT (Continued):
Day 15 : Friday, May 22nd : HONG KONG :
Woke up very late today, and finished breakfast at 10 am. Left the hotel by 10:30 am. Despite the bad forecast, the weather appeared quite decent.

Yesterday we had confined ourselves largely to Kowloon (except for a brief foray to Wan Chai), and today was earmarked for Hong Kong Island. Started off by taking the MTR from Jordan to Central, and walked to the Peak Tram station. The tram ride to the top was fun at a 45-degree incline, which made all the nearby skyscrapers appear tilted as we went up.

At the peak, we went to the Sky Terrace. Lovely views from all around, especially of the South side of the island, which has so much forest cover, and lots of beaches. Clicked photos, shopped around at the shops up there, and then went on their scenic walking trail. After walking for 20 minutes, we reached the Lugard Street lookout point, from where the views were fabulous. Wanted to go the full distance on the scenic trail, but lack of signages held us back. Walked back to the Peak station, and relaxed with some coffee. Then took the tram back down.

We walked slowly to Soho, towards Shelley Street, where we rode the Mid-level escalators for some distance : very unique form of transportation. Then we entered a wonderful veg restaurant on Shelley Street called "Life", which turned out to be an organic restaurant - very chic. Excellent food, most unusual. But mainland China had spoiled us - food in Hongkong was appearing expensive compared to the mainland, and we were still adjusting to it !

In the afternoon, after lunch, we walked to Hollywood Street nearby. First entered the Man Mo Temple, which was as good as the various Buddhist temples we had been seeing in China. The unique sight here was the coiled incense sticks burning everywhere, something which I have never seen anywhere else.

Next, we strolled on Hollywood Street, which was reputed to be the place to pick up decorative artifacts from. However, everything on this street is "genuine antique" (or at least claims to be), and not quite our cup of tea. When all shops have the sign "American Express cards are welcome", you know that it is not exactly the place to look for bargain shopping !

The nearby Cat Street turned out to be what we were looking for, and found great stuff on display here. Shopped for a large brass "Laughing Buddha" (which the locals call "Happy Buddha"), soup bowls, and a ton of other stuff. Good quality at reasonable prices. Who cares if they are 600 years old or 2 weeks old !

We had planned on spending the rest of the day roaming around Honk Kong Island, but our berserk shopping expedition had weighed us down, and it was difficult to walk around with all that stuff. So we decided to waste an hour in catching the metro back to our hotel, to dump everything in our room. Also slipped into the Temple Street Night Market for a repeat visit, and picked up whatever souvenirs we had missed out on the previous night, and dumped all those also in our hotel room. Then took the metro back to Hong Kong Island, with our hands free.

Headed straight to Lan Kwai Fong, as it was getting dark now. The place surprised us on reaching there. It was one of the liveliest spots we had seen anywhere, and even topped Knutsford Terrace which we had visited the previous evening. Sat in several bars, one after the other, sipping great cocktails. First one was "Agave", with super duper cocktails; then "Dolce Vita", where drinks were so-so, but music and ambiance was great. Strolled all over the place, and went for dinner at a Mexican restaurant called "Izote" (not sure of spelling). Super super place. A very jovial owner, who kept circulating, and ensuring that everyone was having a great time. Great food. Great atmosphere. Everyone was having a great time.

Finally, we took the MTR back to Jordan, and reached our hotel. Once again, the weather had behaved itself throughout the day.

TRIP REPORT (Continued) :
Day 16 : Saturday, May 23rd : HONG KONG :
This was the penultimate day of our trip, and we treated ourselves to yet another late wake-up. Today we had planned to visit Lantau Island. However, our good luck with the weather had to end today. As we were departing the hotel at 9:30 am, the front desk warned us to carry umbrellas, for they assured us of heavy rain during the day.

Took the MTR to Central, and changed to the Tung Chung line, which we rode till the end. As we were boarding the Ngong Ping 360 Ropeway, the lady at the ticket counter warned us of heavy rain at the monastery. The ropeway ride was great for 50% of the journey, after which we were slowly enveloped in clouds. As we alighted, torrential rains and winds greeted us. This was to continue throughout the day.

Strolled around the souvenir shops and sat at coffee shops, waiting for the rain to subside. But realized that this was not to be. So we bought raincoats (umbrellas were useless in that wind), and braved the rain to climb the steps to the Big Buddha. The statue was simply awesome, and I am sure it would have appeared a lot better if the rain was less. Spent time in the viewing gallery at the top, and came back down in the pouring rain.

The Po Lin monastery provided some rain shelter, and it was genuinely worth viewing. Their restaurant serves vegetarian lunch, and the food is wholesome and good. We opted for their General Meal for HK $ 60 each, and what is served cannot possibly be consumed in entirety (portions are very large).

After lunch we walked over to the bus station, and waited for the Bus # 21 to Tai O village. Had to wait about 30 minutes for the bus, and everyone waiting there was soaked completely in the harsh pelting rain. We had struck an acquaintance with an Australian couple traveling the same route, and our miseries were shared.

We reached the Tai O village, but the rain was too too strong to wander anywhere. We did go past the stilt houses, but there was no time to "stand and stare". Somehow we all ducked into a cafe, where we had several cups of coffee, and tried drying ourselves. A fireplace would have been divine at such a moment ! No one had the courage to walk anywhere. This was a pity, as the village looked full of promise, and we had read something about riding the "rope tow" ferry or something. Never got to find out what it was. This expedition had been a complete washout.

We took the 4:30pm bus from Tai O to Mui Wo, reaching there at 5:15 pm. Found that the next boat to Central was about to leave in 15 minutes (and the one after that was two hours later !). Clambered on the next sailing, and we reached Central Pier on Hong Kong Island at 6:20 pm.

The rain on HK Island was considerably less, and we were able to comfortably walk to the nearby bus terminal at Exchange Square, where we boarded the Bus # 70 to Aberdeen. From there, a short walk on the pier, and you get free boats leaving for the "JUMBO" floating restaurant. This turned out to be a unique and enjoyable experience. Had a nice Chinese dinner on their top floor restaurant. The decor inside was quite ritzy, but prices were sensible.

After dinner, we rode their boats back to Aberdeen, then Bus #70 to Central, and the MTR back to our hotel. Spent time packing up for our final departure the next afternoon, and slept.

TRIP REPORT (Continued) :
Day 17 : Sunday, May 24th : HONG KONG & RETURN:
Our flight to India was at 7 pm, so we had the whole day to ourselves. Got up by 7 am, and checked out of the hotel by 9:15am, leaving our luggage in the lobby. Weather forecast for the day was bad, but presently it was holding out.

We started by riding the MTR to Prince Edward Station, and walked out towards the Flower Market. Absolutely wonderful, and must be seen on any Hong Kong visit. I understand that it is specially good on Sunday mornings, which is what it was today. Loved the fresh orchids, chrysanthemums, roses of every hue, tulips, gerberas etc.

After strolling there for over an hour, we walked over to the nearby Bird Market. Did not enjoy that as much, as we found the large number of birds crammed into small cages to be too cruel. Came back to the Flower market, and strolled some more. Then found a large shop which sold artificial flowers of very good quality, and bought a huge collection.

Walked over to the Goldfish Market nearby, which had an interesting collection of aquariums and fancy fish. Nearby is the famed Mong Kok Ladies' Market. DW had wanted to do a lot of shopping here, but it was early. At noon, it was still being set up, and I guess the market gets going only in the afternoon. It had started to rain again, so we took the MTR back to our hotel, stashed the shopping in the lobby with our remaining luggage, and left again.

We walked towards Knutsford Terrace, where we intended to have our last meal on this trip. Also, on Nathan Road near Knutsford Terrace, we had spotted a very large number of shops selling ladies' handbags. We reached this row of shops, and spent a lot of time here. I permitted DW to burn a nice hole in my pocket, by purchasing a large number of handbags. This made her very happy.

The rain halted briefly, and we dashed over to Knutsford Terrace. Sat down at "Spice" restaurant, where we had excellent Thai food. The Tum Yum soup was excellent, as was the Papaya salad and the Green Curry. The rain continued to stay away, and we comfortably reached our hotel without getting wet. Took our luggage, walked two minutes round the corner to the bus stop, where we boarded the A21 bus which goes straight to the Hongkong Intl Airport (for only HK $ 33 each). We were there at the airport by 4 pm.

Checked in, continued shopping at the airport shops, and boarded our flight at 7 pm back to India.

We had thoroughly enjoyed Hong Kong. It had "character and soul", unlike a similar city in this region, namely Singapore. Seemed like a very enjoyable place to live in, as it has a lot to offer. Would be better if someone is loaded with money, as the high life seems to be great in this city. No communication problems anywhere. A potpourri of cultures and cuisines, and a mecca for shopping.

In retrospect, the entire China trip had been super. Someone had said that Shanghai and Hongkong should be visited as a prologue or epilogue to a China visit, as they are not the "real China". So true, and glad that our trip had started at Shanghai, then immersed itself into the heart of China, and ended at Hong Kong.

This completes the somewhat detailed Trip Report. Sorry if it was too detailed and labored; that is simply the way I write. Would be happy to answer any questions, or offer any suggestions.

The more detail the better, indiancouple! Thanks for another great report, and more proof that you don't have to take a tour to travel well in China. Glad you had a good trip.

Yes thursdayd, would never consider doing it with a tour group. So much more fun doing it on your own. Yes, there are problems, but nothing that one cannot deal with. And that is part of the fun.

Thanks to many Fodorites who also steered us away from using guides. Totally unnecessary at most places, and we were glad we hardly used them.

Thanks for a wonderful report.I wonder how you make time for such a detailed report.
I' ve posted my itenarary, the way I plan to do things, but would really appreciate any suggestions(posted thrice by mistake, since this was my first post)

faridabobat, saw your itinerary. Most of the places that you plan to visit were not visited by us, so I am really not in a position to offer suggestions. But there are plenty of China experts on this forum, who will undoubtedly give you good advice.

My only suggestion is : first buy a good guide book on China and do some serious background research. A lot of your questions will be answered there, and you will be able to narrow down the options better. Then read through the various Trip Reports posted here during the last year or so, which will impart even more knowledge. Once you have a fairly clear "doable" itinerary prepared, then start posting specific questions on this forum, and you will get more meaningful answers.

There is nothing wrong with what you have asked; I just feel that perhaps you have not researched China enough, before posting your questions. Fodorites tend to provide good answers when they feel that the questioner had invested a reasonable time in researching the topic independently. This is just my humble suggestion. Others may disagree.

i really enjoyed the entire report....how did you get all your purchases home---loaded up all those purses??

This was a fabulous report and certainly not too detailed. As Thurdaysd said, the more detail the better. Last year I would have said China was impossible to do on our own, but after reading this report and others, I am fully confident that one should go on their own. My only dilemma is where in China to go - visiting the highlights of China or concentrating on one region at a time. We will likely have 3-3 1/2 weeks to travel. Thanks again for this most helpful and interesting report.

By the way, in your opinion, which guide books did you find most helpful?

rhkkmk, dgunbug, thanks for the appreciation.

We always use the Lonely Planet guidebook, as they are easily available in India, and we are used to its format. I know people in the US prefer Rick Steve or others which are available. For hotel bookings, we always use tripadvisor.com .

Getting back to you on the "Titanic" pose, the movie was super popular in China, and Leo (pronounced Li Oh in chinese) became an instant heartthrob to old and young alike, guys all want to copy him.

We have just decided to visit China next year and started researching when I came across your wonderful report - congratulations. I think you should rename it "Indiancouples Bible of DIY China". So much great information, it really is a credit to you so thank you for spending your time to write this.

Now I have a question, I would love to see a beautiful garden/park so if you had to choose between Suzhou and Hangzhou which would it be? I am hoping we can spend a day or two at Mt Huang (Yellow Mountain)so we may only have time to visit one of these parks.

Thank you

Shanghainese, thanks for solving the Titanic mystery !

Maudie, thanks for your appreciation. Hangzhou in my opinion is a much more beautiful place to visit than Suzhou, but it is not exactly a garden city like Suzhou is. So if a garden is what you are looking for, then Suzhou is definitely the place to go. There are a large number of excellent gardens to choose from; we managed to cover the "Humble Administrator's Garden" and the "Master of the Nets Garden". I understand that the "Garden to Linger In" is also great.

Hangzhou has a beautiful lake, the Lingyin Temple, and various other interesting places around the West Lake (like the various causeways, the Solitary Hill, some pagodas etc); all in all a very attractive city, that we could not do justice to in a day. So it all depends on what your preferences are, when selecting between Hangzhou and Suzhou.

Excellent report!! An instant classic!

When you have a moment, can you answer my question (June 1) about the marriage market in People's Park? (Are the prospective mates on hand? Is this a daily thing, or weekends only? )

Many thanks!

Never mind! You already answered my question, right after I asked!

I just want to say again how much pleasure I am having from reading this report and how helpful it is for me, too, in planning my next China trip!

Where are you off to next?

Glad you found the reply ekscrunchy; I also remembered answering it.

Where to next ? Yet to decide, but probably New Zealand in late October.

Thanks again for a really wonderful report!

Thanks so much for your insight - I think we might just have to make time for both!

zverybestfamily, are you from India ? (as you once mentioned "Dhanyavaad" in your post, that too in Indian script).

Maudie, you are most welcome. Nothing is more rewarding than when someone finds one's TR useful in their tour planning - it makes the whole process of writing the TR so worthwhile.

No, I am just a nice girl from New York, but we do love Indian food! We love going to ethnic restaurants and we always try to learn how to say thank you in the particular language, so I just googled Pune, India to see how you would say thank you. I hope it was right, when you didn't say anything I got nervous that I may have said something inappropriate.

That was very nice of you. No, there was nothing inappropriate about what you said. It was a very proper "thankyou" in Hindi language.

Dear Indian Couple,

Your trips are amazing and you are a very good story-teller, which keeps people wanting to read more.
We are an Indian couple, Architects from Mumbai 43 & DW 42 yrs.
Just realised that we have some things in common. i.e I am a vegetarian, love photography, independent travel and Fodors.

We are palnning a Spain, Portugal and Italy ( Amalfi, Cinique Terre and Como) for our 20th wedding anniversary.
Your tips on veg. food are invaluable. Thanks a million.
I have travelled to almost all the countries in Europe( except Spain, portugal and Balkan) with the help of of Fodorites but could never write a Trip report. May be after thsi trip, is what I keep telling myself.
We are planning a trip to Turkey and Russia next year or later. Would love to travel with you some time, may be to Newzealand. Thanks again.

Thanks Paragkash. Why don't we meet up sometime and discuss this interesting idea ? Please give me a call on 98220-15562, and lets take this further.

i am not indian and i am not vegetarian, but i would love to come along too...any chance?

bob

Ditto - I want in on the trip! By the way Paragkash - We did Turkey last year and it was very interesting. Don't be afraid to do it on your own and if you are not afraid of driving winding mountain roads, it is quite manageable. June

rhkkmk and dgunbug, thanks, I take your comments as a compliment. BTW, what part of the world are you two from ? We could atleast meet whenever we pass by your country.

Thoroughly enjoyed your report.
We hope to do China , July 2010 for 16 days, and except
for Shangai, we intend visiting the same places.
I have learnt alot from you so thank you.
LuLilly does have a website now, I found it on the TA China Forum. One of the posters there apparently helped set it up.

Dock - what is the TA China Forum and could you please provide me with LuLilly's website? Thanks - June

Before you consider hiring a guide in China, use the search box above to find threads that explain why this is almost always a bad idea, e.g.

http://www.fodors.com/community/asia/share-a-guide-in-beijing-in-january.cfm

And for a more mixed account of the guide in question, with comments on the almost infinite amount of conning of foreign tourists that takes place around Yangshuo, see:

http://www.fodors.com/community/asia/china-our-way-a-23-day-trip-report-of-independent-travelers-in-may-2009.cfm

Peter N-H

Thanks DOCK, glad that the TR was useful. Surprised that Lilly Lu has set up a website so soon. Good for her.

Indiancouple:Fantastic trip report. I enjoyed each and every segment. Your details are done magnificently and your tips are very valuable. I have traveled to India a few times and have visited Beijing too.
But I was interesting in finding more about your shopping experience in China.
From my shopping experience in India I found that the prices were low and if you shopped at good stores, the quality was good too.
Thus, wondering how would you compare shopping between India and China. What do you think about the prices of some common items such as pearl necklaces that maybe your wife bought or even the shawls.
Do you think the prices and quality of items in China is better than in India?
Of course, some items such as Chinese antiques or other souvenirs that are special to each country are indeed a great buy at any price.
On my trip to Beijing, I, too, enjoyed the litchee tea. I, infact bought back a couple of containers of that to enjoy later.
I found their teapots and cups to be beautifully designed and very reasonably priced and thus I bought several of those too.
So, I hope you will share some shopping advice/tips comparing the experience of both countries, since you seem to be quite an avid traveler and maybe somewhat an expert.
If you remember any more little stories about your China travel, do write more.
Have a great day.

dgunbug, TA refers to Tripadvisor. Go to the China forum and serach for Lu Lilly.her web address is http://lillylu.webs.com
If you have difficulty accessing it do so thro the TA forums.

I am not advocating for a guide and most of our trip will be done independently, however for Yangshou we are considering her.
Travelling with 2 teens , there are times when I want someone else to do the prep. work for me.

Thank you very much for all your tips. It's only after reading your report I decided to do our China trip independently. I feel it was perfectly timed for me(of course many others too)and almost Heaven Sent! I'm also considering Lilly for Yangshou bit. Maybe I could also meet you somewhere in future along with other Fodorites!

Just be sure if you book with Lilly she upholds her end of the contract. Just days before indancouple used Lilly, we also had Lilly guide us. We booked four days with her and after 2 days she decided to not fulfill the rest of our plans. She even changed what we had agreed to. When she wants to do a good job, she will. But if you book to much activity, she'll find an excuse to cancel. I'm not the only person she's done this to. Just be informed please.

ileen, sorry for the delay in replying. Tough to compare shopping in China versus India, as I guess the stuff that one would buy would be different at each place. Admit that both countries are very cheap compared to Europe, but one has to be careful about quality at both places.

I think the stuff that DW bought in China were items specific to China, and could not be compared to Indian prices.

Images2 Thanks for letting me know. So should we have a back up? As we need to be picked from airport , if things go wrong it will be difficult, if we are left stranded.

> As we need to be picked from airport

What's wrong with using a bus or a cab like everyone else?

PeterN-H Because we have luggage with us, it would be easier if we have a pre arranged pick-up and go with same car to Yulong river and Silver Cave.I was told the river is on the way to Yangshou, so it's better to go there first,then to Silver cave and then to hotel. Thanks.

Your hotel can arrange a driver for you also, at reasonable rates. I know a bus is available, but that won't work for faridabobat. Watch out for drivers that want to take advantage of you financially. I think it's a good idea to have a driver lined up. Lilly will be at the airport for you if she says she will. She may just change your agreed upon schedule once you arrive though, as she did with us.

Faridabobat, I agree with Images2 that Lilly is not likely to ditch you at the airport. If she agrees to come, she will come. I carried a printout of whatever she had agreed with us. Whenever there was the slightest rumbling of change (there wasn't much with us), I showed her the agreed itinerary, and we had no problems.

Faridabobat: I know you're probably going to want to this with a guide and car booked in advance because you have set yourself such a tight schedule and have no time to spare, but for the record there are taxis there (as everywhere else in China) quite happy to be chartered to do precisely what you want and for probably less than half the prices that have been quoted for the unreliable guide and her vehicle.

The thing is, as you were advised right at the beginning by a few voices, you'd be best advised not to try to do so much and on a timetable that leaves you only minutes to spare.
Independent travel in that way, which compels you to pay through the nose for guides and tours, loses you the benefits it usually offers in cost-savings and flexibility, and unfortunately, while you may be lucky and everything goes like clockwork, you do need to be prepared for unexpected circumstances, and have some spare time in your schedule. Only consider the flight delays Images2 reported experiencing, and ask yourself where that would leave you if the same thing happened.

An old trip report from has just resurfaced from a couple with no Chinese experience who organised practically everything for themselves as they went along, and had a great time doing it, including in Yangshuo:

http://www.fodors.com/community/asia/part-3-guilin-to-yangshuo.cfm

I wouldn't recommend anyone to go to Yangshuo anymore (as opposed to 20 years ago when it started to earn the reputation for the hassle-free remoteness and tranquility it has now lost), but Lyn Clarke and husband took things at the right pace for China, and clearly had a wonderful time there. Note her comments on delays escaping Guilin, though, but how she's allowed time for that.

Peter N-H

Peter N-H, If not Yangshou, then where else would you suggest?

> Peter N-H, If not Yangshou, then where else would you suggest?

Could you elaborate on that request? Do you mean general countryside? The peace and quiet Yangshuo (note spelling--makes a completely different sound in Mandarin) used to have? Or are you particularly after karst scenery?

Would suggest you answer by starting a new thread to discuss this.

Peter N-H

PeterN-H thanks for the link to Lyn Clarke report. Are you saying that we go to Guilin without arranging anything, and we will easily manage to get a taxi that will take us for Yulong bamboo rafting, wait till we finish, then drive us to Silver cave, wait again and take us to our hotel and for half the price?
I do agree we have a tight schedule, and I am thinking about it. I'll have to read Images2 report to see where his flights were delayed.

faridabobat, we paid 400 Rmb for a pre-arranged car, which picked us up at Guilin airport at about noon, took us to Yulong river where we boarded the bamboo raft, met us at the downstream point where we boarded the taxi again for Silver Caves, then from Silver Caves to Yangshuo town (where we halted for 2 hours), and finally to our hotel (Li River Retreat) by around 9:30pm.

We had checked, and our hotel was charging the same to arrange a car for the same journey. So it appears that 400 Rmb is the going rate for this trip, if you arrange through your hotel or a guide. If you can get a taxi at half this price on the spot, it would certainly be worthwhile. I have no idea if it is possible. I would also worry about leaving my luggage in an unfamiliar taxi. If you don't want to use a guide, I would suggest you ask your hotel to send you a car for this trip. Might be safer.

indian couple, thanks. I note you - Yangshuo town (where we halted for 2 hours), and finally to our hotel (Li River Retreat) by around 9:30pm. Does this mean the hotel is outside Yangshuo town . Lilly is asking for 450 RMB plus 100 RMB for her services.

I just checked Li river Retreat is on bank of the river 2 Km outside Yangshou.This most be a peaceful location.

She charged us 400 Rmb for the same, just a month ago. Her charges were 100 Rmb, same as what she has quoted to you.

I think you can bargain her down to 400 Rmb for the car.

> PeterN-H thanks for the link to Lyn Clarke report. Are you saying that we go to Guilin without arranging anything, and we will easily manage to get a taxi that will take us for Yulong bamboo rafting, wait till we finish, then drive us to Silver cave, wait again and take us to our hotel and for half the price?

Not exactly. I'm saying that if you're travelling independently this is how things are done, and you'll get the proper rate rather than the inflated tourist rate you get by inserting hotels or tour guides into your transaction: typically at least twice what you need to pay if you bargain yourself. If 'easily' means it's 100% guaranteed that you'll rush straight from the carousel into a willing taxi who'll instantly accept the first offered fair price, and shoot off, then no.

Here's an account by someone tackling Beijing independently, which it might also help to read. He wanted to get out to the Great Wall, and hotels all say at least ¥600, and more usually ¥800 to ¥1200 or even more. Following advice, he easily got a taxi to do what he wanted for ¥350. That's the actual going rate (although I've known someone do the same trip for as little as ¥250).

http://www.fodors.com/community/asia/beijing-for-beginners.cfm

But you're travelling at such a helter-skelter pace that you probably won't feel you have time to deal with this.

If you slowed down, you wouldn't put yourself in the position of having only one option on arrival (to go immediately to A, and then to B, and all before sunset), which would give you a lot more options with transport, with changing the order in which you do things to suit circumstances, etc. If you want to rattle along at high speed with guaranteed connections to the minute, or at least increase your chances of success, you may well have little option but to pay a lot more and cross your fingers.

Peter N-H

PeterN-H Thanks for above link, very interesting read! I know my schedule is tight, but hopefully it will work out.
Indiancouple, I asked Li River Retreat for same things as I asked Lilly. They quoted 270 for airport pick up ,then 400 for rest of tour, totalling 670. Also additional 60 if we wanted to go to light show.

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Indiancouple - what a lovely report!!

Thanks so much for sharing!

I'm going to China with a friend in less than 3 weeks, for almost the same places and were are very excited about it!

I must confess I was surprised by some of your comments about queues and the crowds. I'm already getting prepared for my first experience in a chinese train station! If you, coming from India, found it scary in the first day, I cannot even imagine how it is like!

I was in Pune for 3 months in 2008 in business - nice city!

cgromann, glad you liked the report. Yes, the Chinese train stations can be daunting the first time, but they are also organized and disciplined. Not like the "pushing and shoving" you encounter in India.

Interesting to note that you were in Pune recently. Small world !

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What does bmarking mean? Bookmarking? For who? Why? The purpose of coming in here and bringing up old posts is... what?

Dear indiancouple,

Just another note of thanks for your fantastic trip report. I had been struggling with our plans to do China on our own this spring, and your report was heaven sent! Can't tell you how much I appreciate your detailed account. Thank you for taking the time to share all this helpful information!

My apologies Indiancouple for the below rant

Dogster: Yes, BOOKMARKING for ME!! Why does it matter to you? People bookmark all the time! It's not like the report is from 2005, it's from May. I started reading it at 3am, got tired and I bookmarked it so I could find the report later (which is now)to download it for info.for a trip if you must know. The snarkiness here is unbelievable.It's no wonder so many have left. It's a public forum, not an exclusive club where you Dogster set the rules and are the acting Asia forum bookmark police.

Thank you Magster2005 for the compliments. Glad to know you found the TR useful.

laartista, no apologies required ! People can rant to their heart's content on this thread !!

I agree laartista, a trip report is a TR, I just commented on your Spain trip from some years ago as I still ref Dogster tales around India....

Indiancouple, great report btw.

Well, I'm duly reprimanded. Me? I thought it was a rather hurtful over-reaction - but what does that matter? laartista, you might care to check my responses to your other posts. I'll take care not to be so generous in future.

The best thing is that it helps bring this wonderful report back into play - Hi indiancouple! I was very near you just a week ago.

Thanks landineen and dogster. And dogster, the next time you come near to Pune in India, do let me know in advance. Perhaps we can set up a meeting.

I'd love that. I was heading for Pune but had to flee the foul smog of Mumbai; last Tuesday they even shut the airport down for fear of killing the planes. Where was I? Gasping for life in the middle of it. Suddenly I just had to go. Next time.

I read your great post and am going to use a lot of the information.

Regarding internal flights - can you share with us the prices of them, before and after discount?

Hi Indian couple!
Thanks so much for the great report . I just came across it today, and we're leaving for China in 10 days!

I loved reading your accounts, and took a lot of notes.

So I assume you left your hotel every morning with all your locations printed out in Chinese (by your concierge?) that you could hand to taxi drivers and pedicab drivers?

I may have missed this, but do you speak some Mandarin or not at all...
Thanks again!
dina

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Hi eranlevin, glad you found the TR useful. I am sorry I don't have the prices of air-tickets noted somewhere, so I will not be able to give those details to you. But I suggest you go to the Ctrip website, and check out the airfares from any location in China to any location. If you check for fares 15 days from now, you will get the standard rack rates. If you check for fares 2-3 days from now, you will get the lowest discounted fares. You can do this exercise for free for all your sectors, and you will get a good idea of "regular fares" and "cheap fares" for all your sectors. This is what we had done.

dina4, no we do not know any Mandarin whatsoever. We did not use too much of cabs and pedicabs anyway, but we did have all essential locations written down in Chinese with us every day. Whenever we did not have the same, and had to use a taxi, we had a very hard time (as you can read from the TR) !