2-3 nights in HK, and 1-2 in Singapore will be fine. 8 nights in Bali should be adequate, but only you can decide if you want to spend more there.

What are the rules for your airline? Usually a two/three night stopover once is allowed on a ticket. Transits of less than 24 hours are usually unlimited. So check with the airline before you plan. A side trip to central Java would be a separate journey (in terms of airlines rules).

Personally, I wouldn't schedule less than a week in Bali. So see what the rules are for your airline. If you could make it work, I'd plan for one stopover and the trip to central Java, but I don't know if that works for your timeframe. I'd say that two stopovers and central Java are too much in a mere two weeks.

Actually just checked and found flyer mile seats back to LAX from Jakarta or Surabaya too. Would it make more sense to fly home from one of those cities in order to see Borobudur rather than going through Singapore? What is the best way to get to Yogyakarta from Bali? As far as flying goes, it seems like flying into Jakarta then to Yogyakarta is cheapest, but also a bit of a hassle.

LA, I'd concentrate on Bali/Java/Singapore and save Hong Kong for another trip. Depending on how your flights work out I think Singapore/Central Java/Bali is doable in two weeks time -- or you could choose two out of three.

First, be aware that the Islamic holidays that follow Ramadan will start around August 19, 2012, plus or minus a few days. This holiday period doesn't directly affect Bali or Singapore but many people in the region will be traveling which does affect flights and hotel/resort availabilty.

You definitely don't want to be in Central Java during the Islamic holiday period, which will extend more or less to the end of August.

There are frequent non-stop flights from Jakarta, Surabaya and Bali/Denpasar to Yogyakarta, so if you decide not to go to Singapore you won't have any problem getting to Central Java from any of these places.

Thanks for the quick replies. Gosh, I think I remember some of you from when I planned our Thailand/Cambodia trip almost five years ago!

Kathie, to answer your questions about flights, here is the deal. We have a bunch of BA miles to use up from a credit card promotion. They are changing their program dramatically on 11/16/11, but if I book before then I know the current rules. I can book one way with unlimited enroute stopovers on Cathay Pacific (although only HKG would technically be a stopover). There is availability from LAX>HKG>DPS but there is nothing (for months) on the DPS>HKG leg, which means we'll have to buy tickets to either Jakarta, Surabaya, or Singapore and then use our miles from their back to LAX via HKG. Looks like flights between DPS and Jakarta or Singapore are very cheap on Air Asia.

If we go to Yogyakarta, we'd have to buy that too. The flights DPS>JOG are a bit pricey compared to the Air Asia flights, so it seems like going through Jakarta would be the cheapest route, except maybe the train from DPS. Anyone ever try the train, just curious about that? I'm guessing it takes a while.

Marmot, thanks for the info on the islamic holiday. I had heard something about it being in August but wasn't sure. There is actually more flyer mile availability in late September, so we are leaning that direction right now.

One more thought... we've also been considering China rather than Bali/Java. They are both places we want to see eventually. My reasononing toward Bali is that I believe the weather is good that time of year and perhaps China needs more than two weeks (and is maybe more expensive?). Is that about right or should we still be considering China? Anyone prefer one over the other? If so, why?

Okay, enough questions for now!

weatther2travel.com

Bali Climate guides and Singapore

for me to maximize my time...but monsoon season will be rain

China in the north usually better weatherwise

Personally prefer Bali Hyatt Sanur for beach Komaneka.com

Monkey Forest around Ubud awesome...

Beware on that BA.com CC propmotion my wife an I had 200000

miles each sounded great but we had to pay HUNDREDS extra

in bogus "fuel surcharges" and seat charges our "free" flights

ended up costing us $800 or so almost $400 each.

So be careful and have fun!

China is a huge country. You can spend 2 years and not seen all of it, but two weeks is also okay. Just depends on what you want to see and how many sites you want to visit. Luxury stuff like 5* hotels are not cheap in China, but neither is Bali. Or you can have a meal for US$2. All depends on how you want to travel. Most of the country will be hot, but not all. Higher elevation places, like Shangri-La in Yunnan province isn't hot even in summer time.

Thanks again for the replies! Qwovadis, I'm aware of the fuel surcharges on BA. That's why it is best to use them on either LAN in South America (no fuel surcharges) or on Cathay Pacific (lower fuel surcharges). We got 200k miles with that promo too. We're using half to go to Machu Picchu and the Galapagos and are thinking Asia for the other half. Just need to book soon because the partner award chart is apparently going to be distance based starting with the new "Avios Miles" plan beginning 11/16/11.

Regarding weather, you mention monsoon season. I thought Bali was supposed to be dry in August and September, but not areas like Vietnam or the Phillipines, which I was we are not considering them. Is that not correct?

Okay, one more thought? What about Borneo? Cathay has availability into Kota Kinabalu. Anyone been there? How does it compare to Bali/Java or even China? How are the beaches compared to Bali? I know I'm all over the map.

Just considering all our options on Cathy Pacific and trying to stick with somewhere the weather won't be horrible. Also, only have enough miles to go to China or southeast Asia (India is too far).

By they way, qwovadis, the fees I'm seeing all in are about $385/pp to any of the destinations we're looking at. That is definitely more than we paid for South America, but I still think it's a really good deal from LAX to SEA considering we got those miles for only $95! We could use the rest on another SA trip like Easter Island, Santiago, Buenos Aires for less money, but think SA twice in one year might be a bit much. Okay, now I'm really all over the map (or globe)

a FEW THOUGHTS. wE HAVE BEEN TO sINGAPORE TWICE AND TO BE HONEST IF YOU PLAN WELL 1 FULL 9-10 HOUR TOURING DAY TO lITTLE iNDIA, MAYBE THE GLORIOUS BOTANICAL GARDENS AND IF YOUR SO INCLINED THE MEGA MALLS CARRYING THE LATEST IN FASHION. i THINK 2 FULL DAYS IN hk CAN DO IT WITH A VISIT TO THE bIRD mARKET, TAKE THE STAR FERRY AND FOR EXPEDIENCE SAKE TAKE A TOURING BUS FOR 4-5 HOURS FOR THE OTHER SIGHTS> SHOPPING IS NO LONGER A GRAW ON MOST FOLKS PPOCKET BOOKS> THE BARGAINS DIAPEARED 20 YEARS AGO, UNFORTUNATELY.THERE ARE MANY GREAT RESTAURANTS AT RESONABLE PRICES THOUGH.
I would spend 5 FULL DAYS/6 NIGHTS IN BALI> THE HYATT AT SANUR IS NICE BUT HUGE> WE STAYED THERE ONCE IN THE LAST BUILDING AND IT SEEMED LIKE A 1/4 MILE FROM OUR ROOM TO THE LOBBLY> IT WAS NO FUN WITH THE HEAT AND HUMIDITY> I THINK YOU KNOW THAT OCTOBER REALLY BEGINS THE RAINY SEASON SO IF YOU CAN GO THE LAST @ WEEKS OF SEPT> OR VERY EARLY OCT> THAT WOULD BE WISE. IF YOU WANT SUPER LUXURY AND CAN GET IN THE CHEDI CLUB IS HEAVEN AND IN OUR MINDS SURPASSES THE FOUR SEASONS AND AMAN RESORTS> A 1 BEDROOM SUITE LAST MONTH WAS $320 WITH BREAKFAST INCLUDING TAX ABND SERVICE. A very good but not excellent guide in Bali was Putu who also goes by Balifriend. and is about $65/day.
I WOULD NOT MISS GOING TO YOJGA AND VISITING BOBODURUR AND PREHANBAN TEMPLES AND SEVERAL UNIQUE VILLAGES MAKING TOFU< FLOUR AND POTTERY USING 80 YEAR OLD EQUIPMENT. YOU CAN ALSO GO OUT TO SEE THE MAGNIFICANT DIENG PLATEAU SO YOU NEED 2 DAYS IN CENTRAL JAVA. THE HYATT REGENCY THROUGH THE GUIDE I USED WAS $175 FOR A CLUB FLOOR ROOM WITH A FULL AMERICAN BREAKFAST AND APPITIZERS AND COCTAILS AT NIGHT. THE ONLY THING I DO NOT KNOW IS CAN YOU FLY FROM YOGJA TO SURBAYA TO CATCH THE LAX FLIGHT.
OUR GUIDE LAST MONTH WAS EXCELLENT AND WAS THE SECOND TIME WE USED HIM> HE IS A LAISON WITH UNESCO FOR BOBODURUR SO YOUR TOUR THERE IS REALLY THRILLING> HE DOES CHARGE $80 for a 10 hour day, A BIT HIGH BY $15-20 BUT HE REALLY IS WELL WORTH IT, IN MY OPINION. IF INTERESTED: bobodururtourandtravel.com or his home office wiedyantara@hotmail.com

I've been to Borneo. Click on my name and you'll find an old trip report on Borneo. A number of people have posted reports on Borneo in the last year or two. But Borneo is an entirely different kind of experience where you are going to see orangutans in the rainforest.

Start by deciding what kind of experience you are looking for.

LA, Every country in Asia has its own appeal. It's like chosing between London and Florence: eventually you will get to both.

August/September is still the dry season in Bali. It's the tropics so you will get some rain, just not as much as during the rainy season.

The best way to get from Bali to Central Java is to fly on Garuda, Denpasar -- Yogyakarta. Flights should be about USD150+ roundtrip, maybe a little more or less.

These are two separate islands, so no train. Going through Jakarta means backtracking and a lot of unnecessary airport time. Don't do this.

If you choose to use your BA/CX miles then it makes sense to stop in Hong Kong for a day or two instead of Singapore

Malaysian Borneo and Kota Kinabalu is a completely different culture and environment from Bali. Borneo would a wild nature oriented experience. The beaches are quite nice, but the resorts choices are not as expansive as Bali.

Comparing China to Bali is also difficult. China is a huge country with 1 (or is it 2 now?) billion people and several large cities. Bali is a small island of 3 million people.

The allure of Bali is the combination of vibrant culture and arts plus a phenomenally beautiful natural environment. The beaches, themselves are not the most pristine, but the resorts, restaurants, spas, shops are world class. With a week you could spend some time at the beach and some time in the countryside around Ubud.

Thanks again for all the great feedback everyone! Looks like I need to read up a little more. We've been leaning toward Bali, but just want to make sure we're not overlooking some other opportunity too.

Marmot, the train I was referring to is actually a bus>ferry>train that was mentioned on the LP forum. I don't know how long it takes, but I'm guessing a while!

I'm sure I'll be back with more questions. At least we have lots of time to plan, just need to book the flyer mile seats by next week before they (likely) lose value.

LA: The Bus/Ferry/Bus combination is definitely not for you. It usually leaves Denpasar Ubung terminal at about 3 pm and arrives in various stops in Central Java at about 6 am the next day. The ferries are not that safe and definitely not comfortable...they are not like the Catalina ferries, for example. These ferries are used to load tons of people, motorbikes, cars, trucks full of stuff like rice, industrial stuff and container bound crates. The bus drivers weave in and out of the lanes like maniacs and you will not be able to get any sleep. I have written a lot on this and other forums on the un-advisbility of taking the ferries, especially if you have the resources to just fly, which will take you about 45 minutes to Central Java. The LP forum is mostly for backpackers who have lots of time and very little money, and so for them it's a badge of price to say they travelled overland and sea, etc etc. Central Java is wonderful and Borobudur and Prambanan are individually on a scale with anything in Siem Reap. Plus you will get insights into cultures other than Bali.

Balinese Hindu culture is of course, justifiably famous. Just do a youtube search for any of the dances and you will see what awaits...try Legong, Balinese Gamelan, Kecak, Calonarang, etc. Bali is beautiful but the beaches are just a part of the appeal...the wonderful people, culture and arts are what makes it special. August/September is a really good time to go because it's the cool dry season...my favorite time of the year in Bali!

Thanks Kuluk, you confirmed my suspicions about the overland route to central Java!

So how does an itinerary like this look:

LAX>HKG arrive HKG at 6:45PM spend 2 nights
HKG>DPS arrive DPS at 2:55PM spend 9 nights (3 Ubud/6 beach)
DPS>JOG arrive JOG at 3:55PM spend 2 nights
JOG>SIN arrive SIN at 10:45AM spend 1 night
SIN>LAX leave SIN at 8:05AM

I'm thinking it seems a tad hectic, but then again most of our two week trips are. Always trying to squeeze everything in! Is that enough time for a taste of Singapore or should we cut a day off Bali? I kinda hate to do that since the whole point of this trip started out as just Bali. Suggestions???

Of course, most of this doesn't have to be set in stone anytime soon. Mainly just need to finalize our flyer mile seets asap. Thanks again for everyone's help!

That should be "seats", not "seets". Dang I wish this had an edit button!

LA, That sounds like a great itinerary. If you don't intend to back in this part of the world soon, I would do 8 nights Bali, 2 nights Singapore, but having said that, after Bali, Singapore can seem jarringly "civilized."

I understand what you mean marmot. I actually would rather have an extra day in Singapore rather than HK, but the two nights in HK is pretty much set due to current flyer mile availibility. I'll consider your suggestion of cutting one nt off Bali though. I was thinking just one nt in Singapore may be just a tease. Then again, I'm betting leaving Bali will be tough!

Why don't you spend just one night in Hong Kong then? You could stay at the airport and just consider it an overnight transit stop.

I love Hong Kong (more than Singapore actually), but you will be wiped out when you arrive and really only have one full day, which is, as you say, a tease.

The 2 nights in HKG is the result of flyer mile seat availability. They have flights LAX>HKG on the 22nd (arriving the 23rd) and then a flight HKG>DPS on the 25th, with nothing in between. There is a flight from HKG>DPS on the 23rd, but nothing LAX>HKG for several days before that!

Not a bad excuse for a short visit to HK, in my opinion.

Your trip looks like a pretty good plan to me.

When you get around to booking the hotels you might consider one more night in Ubud. But that depends on your personal likes. The beach areas are generally much more sophisticated, more beach tourism types, while Ubud is more traditional, culture tourism types. If you want to do most day trips, they are usually more convenient to get to from Ubud, which is more central. (like staying in Westwood, say, instead of Manhattan Beach...sorry for the analogy...couldn't resist.)

It's not to shabby to be "forced" to do 2 nights in HK, it's a good halfway start to Asia. Its worth the trip just to ride the Star Ferry across the Bay! Singapore is also fun, and both cities are really not so much asian as high tech global. Bali is unique in itself.

Have fun planning. Write again if you need more help! I live in Indonesia and am quite opinionated.

Thanks for the feedback Kuluk. We are considering more time in Ubud. Just need to figure out what we want to see/do then figure out the hotels and such. I'm sure I'll have lots more questions!

Okay, just booked our LAX>HKG>DPS and SIN>HKG>LAX flights. We've got lots of time to work out the rest

LA; I think your itinerary is quite good as well except if you are going to only spend 1 day in Java I might save it for another time. I am not a big fan of HK and it seems others are. Based on 3 trips to Bali over the years I do think 7 full days is sufficient on this trip so maybe you do add the day to HK. In hindsight I would say drop HK and add it to Central Jave so you have 2 full days/3nights. because there is a very real difference between VBali and Java and to experience the difference I think is very worthwhile. Much of HK is city oriented though there are interesting sights you do not get a feeling for the people and culture, IMO.

Hi StanKase, thanks for the suggestions! For HK, we really have no flexibility due to flyer mile seat availability. There were very few flights from HKG>DPS left, so we took what we could get which resulted in 2 nts HKg. That part is set and our flight home from Singapore is set (we had to do that because there were no flyer mile flights left leaving DPS at all). We need to spend at least one nt in Singapore so that we can catch our flight home in the morning.

The eleven nights we have from arriving in Bali until needing to get to Singapore for our flights home are wide open. We can really arrange those days however we want. If anyone has any suggestions for the best way to spend those days, that would be great. For example, should we maybe consider taking the early morning flight to Java (JOG) rather than the afternoon flight, giving us basically two full days?

LA_FadeAway; When you say 11 days you probably mean 11 nights and 10 full days. With that I in mind I would still suggest if you can afford it and get in, probably if it's second week of Sept. ypou would have a chance and you made reservations 5-6 months in advance (only because as I said earlier they only have 20 units) The Chedi Club for $320 with tax/service and full brakfast for 4 nighs would be like staying at the Aman for 1/3 the price but nicer, IMO. We have avoided the ocean areas since 1999 when we enjoyed the FS-Jimbaran Bay but I would expect that is ~$500+with tax/service. You have good shuttle service from the Chedi but I would suggest a guide foor 3-4 full days. The better ones are ~$60-$65/day for 10 hours. While near Ubud there are many good inexpensive ($25 USD) complete dinners with out wine but a beer in town.
marmot is correct the flight on Garuda Air is $150 RT to jogja and takes 1 hr.&15 min.but it is 1 hour earlier in Central Java than Bali. There is a 7AM flight so you really can even spend your arrival day going to Dieng Plateau and the next day seeing the sunrise, if you are interested at borobudur or just tour it with the guide I suggested or some one else and then Premanjian Temple, Sultan Palace, etc. I made this suggestion earlier. You could then fly on to Singapore if there is a night flight and stay at the airport. You can use the fast train the next day into town or a taxi which cost $25-$28 USD. We had the money and enticed a taxi for $125 to take us for 8+ hours to the places I mentioned in my forst post that I found in my several trips to Singapore (mostly on business) as the most interesting when we were on vacation.

Hi StanKase, thanks for all the great suggestions! I looked into the night flight to Singapore. Air Asia only has a morning flight and Lion Air (safety?) has a connecting flight via Jakarta that leaves early afternoon. Looks like Garuda has some evening flights but they are four times the price of Air Asia! I'll definitely look into the Chedi too. That's a little more than we usually spend on a hotel, but may be worth a splurge for our first few days in Bali. We've got lots of Hilton points so are considering the Conrad for our beach time. We're also using Hilton points for the Conrad in Hong Kong. Saving a bundle of cash on that one!

How is the beach around the Conrad Bali? Any good swimming beaches near there?

LA -- the Conrad is in Nusa Dua -- which is really a tourist enclave -- so you'll be spending your time mostly at the resort unless you book a car/take a cab -- I'm sure someone can chime in on walking down the beach in that area -- I'm not familiar with it myself.
As to Ubud -- I just checked and the Chedi is at 391 a night in September -- there are SO many gorgeous boutique hotels around Ubud -- I would let myself drool over all of them for a bit if I were you. You can look on jetsetter.com and type in Bali -- whether they have a current deal or not, you can still see all the Ubud area hotels. Most of the ones like the Chedi are out of town -- so you'll be taking a hotel shuttle in/out of Ubud.
The 4 Seasons at Jimbaran is up to 800 - 1000 which is insane -- we have company perks or I would probably stay somewhere in Seminyak/Legion to go to restaurants, etc.
We've all talked a lot about logistics, but what do you like to do? Because that will have something to do with where you will want to stay.
I am so excited we are going back this year -- and I'll be doing the Borobudur trip so can report back on that. One thing I've done on all my SE Asian trips is hire a guide/driver -- which I would never have done closer to home but I find invaluable for that part of the world.

The Conrad is at the extreme tip of Nusa Dua in Benoa. It's a fairly new resort and is well designed and attractive with swimming lagoons, several restaurants, good spa, the usual for Bali.

The downside is that the beach is not good. It's a manmade beach and it shows. I don't know about walking from the Conrad to the main Nusa Dua beach. I'm sure it can be done, but it may not be directly connected.

Nusa Dua itself has a nice sandy swimming beach, though it's a bit shallow at low tide. Nusa Dua was designed as a tourist enclave with resort after resort along the beach and on the cliffs. It doesn't have much Bali feeling but the it's a reliable international resort environment.

Personally, I prefer Seminyak beach. The places that are right on the water have become incredibly pricy, but there are dozens of villas and less expensive boutique resorts that are a short walk from the beach. I'd recommend the Colony for a charming environoment and a good value.

In the medium-high price range and right on Seminyak beach are the Resort Seminyak and the Grand Seminyak. I haven't stayed at either, but they are well located for restaurants, shops and spas.

Seminyak is a big wave sunset beach. It's fun for swimming and body boarding but you have to like getting bounced around.

In Ubud you'll have a lot of choices with atmosphere in the medium price range. I like the Alila, Uma Ubud and Alam Sari. There are also several new small villa complexes, like the Samaya. Kayumanis is a little more expensive but lovely.

On airlines between Yogyakarta and Singapore: the budget airlines are safe enough but they operate few flights and can often be delayed. Garuda has the most frequent flights which can be important if flights are delayed or cancelled, which frequently happens.

Try to avoid transiting in Jakarta as it just adds unnecessary airport time. You could also look at flying out of Solo (Surakarta) which is about an hour from Yogya.

Wow, thanks again for all the great info everyone. This sure gives me a lot to work with. I had a feeling the Conrad was a bit out of the way and possibly not on the best beach. At least we have pleanty of time to figure all this out

As far as what we are looking to do, a nice mix of culture, site seeing, and downtime at the beach pretty much sums it up.

I am not sure where the $390+ figure came from. I booked my reservation last July for Sept/23-27 through Agoda.com and can assure you I paid $321 inclusive of all charges. I did check about a week afterwards and saw that on The Chedi Club website that the 1 bedroom suite were full, considering there are only 20 units and about 4-5 have plunge pool units and 2 two bedroom units so I checked dates 2 weeks later which is still high season and up popped $321 inclusive. I can understand they may adjust rates for next year by 4%-8% but not 30%. Agoda gets a small allocation but they get more than Asiarooms.com, I think, and over the years I have found often these internet sites do have rates 5%-10% below the hotels rates, but not always. All I can tell you is having stayed at both FS's in Bali,the new Kominika (this Sept. 3 nights and 4 at Chedi Club),the Viceroy (2006) as well as the Aman in Phuket,Thailand. The Chedi beats them all, even for 3 nights. Yes,it is outside Ubud but though they had a shuttle schedule as our butler told is we set the schedule. They left when we wanted them to and picked us up after dinner 2 hours after dropping us off as we requested.

I just chexked THE CHEDI CLUB for next late Sept. the rate as I thought on Agoda.com is $335 all inclusive.
La_FadeAway; It is worth taking advice from those who really have been to the hotels and are ardent travels.

Thanks for the tip on Agoda.com StanKase!

Hi guys, I'm back! Now that our Machu Picchu and Galapagos trip is over, it's time to get serious about planning this one. After looking at Java some more, I'm starting to think that we should include Mt. Bromo too if we can work it in or would that be too much??

The possible itineraries look like this:

Option A:
LAX>HKG arrive 18:45 spend 2 nights
HKG>DPS arrive 14:55 spend 8 nights (Ubud and Amed?)
DPS>SUB arrive afternoon(Garuda or Lion)private transfer to Bromo, spend 1 nt. for sunrise tour transfer back to SUB
SUB>JOG arrive 16:05(Sriwijaya Air?) or 20:02 (Eks Train) spend 2 nights, include sunrise tour at Borobudur
JOG>SIN arrive 10:45(Air Asia) spend 1 night
SIN>HKG>LAX leave SIN at 08:05

Option B:
LAX>HKG arrive 18:45 spend 2 nights
HKG>DPS arrive 14:55 spend 8 nights (Ubud and Amed?)
DPS>JOG arrive 06:10(Air Asia) or 15:55(Garuda)spend 1 nt., include sunrise tour at Borobudur
JOG>SUB arrive 16:10(Wings Air?) private transfer to Bromo, spend 1 nt. for sunrise tour transfer back to SUB
SUB>SIN arrive 19:10(Valuair?) spend 2 nights
SIN>HKG>LAX leave SIN at 08:05

Please keep in mind that the Hong Kong part cannot be changed. Due to lack of frequent flyer award seat availability, those 2 nights are required. The flight home from SIN>HKG>LAX is also not changeable. The rest is open for suggestions!

Would this be too much? Are those airlines safe? Should we skip java all together or just skip Bromo if we need to drop something?

I'll comment further, but would first like to ask:
Can you change your HKG-DPS flight to HKG-Java (still CX)? What's the date of your arrival in Indonesia?
Are you open to one or two fewer days in Bali so that you'd have more time in Java?

Hi Marmot,
There is a chance we could switch HKG-DPS to HKG-SUB, but it would be a day sooner only giving us about 15 hours in HKG including an overnight and they want over $200 in taxes/fees to change the tickets. Not totally out of the question though.

We would really prefer not to cut more time off Bali. The original idea was a "beach vacation", before I started doing my research and realized Bali is about a lot more than beaches. We still need to include some beach down time (snorkeling) and want to leave time to experience the island.

Still open to any suggestions though!

I could actually fly into Jakarta any day too, except that's hardly worth changing from DPS (and paying the fees) since we'd still have to take another flight to JOG or SUB.

I've also looked at flying back to HKG via SUB rather than SIN, which is also an option. Problem with that is that the flight leaves early in the morning requiring an overnight. If we need to spend that last night somewhere, we'd rather do it in Singapore than SUB (and again avoid the change fees).

I think you've crammed too much into this trip. I'd be inclined to cut Bromo - a lot of travel time and complexities for a sunrise there.

However, another option would be to cut Singapore, spend two nights at Bromo and one night in Surabaya. There is a wonderful old Sarkie Brothers hotel there - the Majapahit. We will be staying there in November. You can get a huge suite for the price of an ok hotel in Singapore.

Hi Kathie,
I hear you about possibly cutting Bromo. It does seem like a lot of travel time for one beautiful sunrise and of course it could be cloudy that morning. Then again, it looks awesome in the pictures!

Regarding spending that last night in SIN vs SUB, I think SIN makes more sense. We have free nights we can use at the Hilton or Conrad there and then we wouldn't have to pay the change fees to change our tix either. The flights to SIN are cheap (about $70pp) and actually come out less than the change fees. Although, flying out of SUB and skipping SIN makes more logistical sense if we still try to include Bromo.

Have you decided to travel in September instead of August? This is the most important point as travel in Java will be difficult in mid-to-late August.

If nothing else changes, it comes down to two -- or maybe three -- nights in Java which isn't enough for both Borobudur and Bromo. They are both great destinations, but very different.

Yogya/Borobudur for culture (amidst beautiful scenery) and Bromo for nature at its most phenomenal. The logistics of geting from Yogya to Borobudur are simpler than getting from Surabaya to Bromo and although I agree the Mahapajit is a terrific hotel, Yogya is a more interesting city than Surabaya.

Either way I'd suggest staying near Borobudur or Bromo (versus Yogya or Surabaya). The choice of accommodations is challenging, but experience of the monument (or mountain) improves exponentially.

The reason I would suggest flying from Hong Kong to Jakarta or Surabaya is that I would lean toward putting Java before Bali and getting the more demanding travel over before you totally relax in Bali. Not a critical distinction, though.

I'm not so sure about Amed for snorkling. For Scuba, there are some good sites, but for snorking I'd favor Menjangan.

Rather indecisive, eh?

Hi Marmot, thank you again for your replies! Our trip is late September/early October. I agree that we will stay at Manohara for 1 nt in JOG in order to be right at Borobudur and then if we spend a 2nd night it will be in JOG town. Same goes for Bromo, if we go there, we will spend the night at one of the lodges in Cemoro Lawang so that we would be close by for the sunrise tour.

I also agree about maybe doing Java at the beginning of the trip rather than at the end. I have looked into connecting directly into JOG or SUB from DPS when we first get there and both are possible (and still cheaper than the airline change fees to go direct to SUB and it doesn't mess up HKG that way either, just ads an extra flight). My hesitation of going DPS - SUB is that we would get there at 6:45PM and I'm not sure how safe it would be to have a driver take us up to Cemoro Lawang after dark. Flying DPS to JOG we would arrive at 7:35PM and could drive straight to the Manohara from there. That is something to really consider. When looking at my option A above, that involves being up well before dawn four mornings in a row, ouch. Switching Java to the beginning and dealing with the extra flight could be worth it.

I've read a lot of good reviews on snorkeling in Amed and Mengangan. I am leaning toward Amed just because it seems to have a nice chill beach town vibe about it too; whereas, Pemuteran sounds pretty isolated. I think Amed is better located for day trips too, but I don't really know.

Lol, jobin, yes, I am very indecisive!! If I had unlimited time, I could just do everything, but it's so hard to narrow down with so few days to work with.

I wouldn't want to drive up Bromo after dark either but I don't think it would necessarily unsafe. All of the tours arrive from Surabaya and Malang pre-dawn so the drivers are used to it. The disadvantage is that you'd miss the scenic aspect of the drive.

By the way, it's chilly in the mountains. You'll need a sweater or a jacket etc.

As for the serial early early wakeups, that's fairly common on Java too. If it's any consolation about 180 million souls are getting up every morning at 4:30 for prayers so you'll have plenty of company.

You seem to have a good handle on the ramifications of the various logistics. Java is not a particularly easy place to move around in, but I think either plan would work.

I like to use Jakarta as a hub as you have more choices when flights are cancelled or delayed and I try to fly Garuda wherever possible inside Indonesia. I can understand, however, that you don't want to incur additional fees, so if the connections are good through Denpasar, then that should work too..

[If you forego Central Java you could also consider driving from North Bali to Bromo, perhaps stopping in Ijen. This involves taking a local car ferry so may be on a more basic level of travel than you'd like.]

I haven't been to Amed recently. There's been a lot of development there in the past two to three years, which may or may not be a positive. I would agree that East Bali has more to offer culturally than North Bali, but neither has especially good beaches.

Hi again Marmot. It's good to know that driving up to Bromo at night is not considered unsafe, that does open up some additional options. We could still see the nice scenery on the way back down to Surabaya

If we try to connect from DPS straight to SUB or JOG, how long should we allow for the connection at DPS to clear immigration/customs and check in for the domestic flight?

I suppose trying to go to the Gilis rather than Amed is a bad idea (too much more travel time)?

One more thought, if we were to go to Pemuteran, how long would it take from there to Bromo overland/sea?

I haven't transferred between international and domestic in Bali so I can't give you advice based on personal experience, but I'd allow three hours.

Some things to consider: First, I assume you'd have to get your visa in Bali. the visa on arrival process can be unpredictable so you either have to get your visa before you leave the States or plan some extra time. Second, Bali airport is undergoing renovation and expansion and is difficult to navigate. Third, I'm not sure that you can check your bag through to your final destination. It depends on your connecting airline.

I'd give Jakarta airport the edge for all of these reasons.

I also haven't made the land/sea journey from Bromo to Pemuteran, but my son has. It takes most of a day but if you leave early you can get to Pemuteran late afternoon. If you do this, I'd encourage you to look into stopping at Ijen. It's meant to be spectacular.

I'm going to defer comments on Lombok and the Gilis as it's been some time since I've been there. Travel time from door to door Ubud to Gili Trawangan should be about half a day. The Gili Cat leaves from Padang Bai and goes directly to Trawangan and then to Lombok.

Oh no, don't add Ijen into the mix, then I'll never make up my mind, lol!

Besides the transport time, I think the biggest issue I have with the Gilis is that we would have less time to day trips around Bali, but they don't look nice and relaxing.

Oops, meant to say they DO look nice and relaxing.

Just thought I'd post an update on what we've decided on for our itinerary:

2 nts Hong Kong - Conrad Hotel Hong Kong
1 nt Bromo - Yoschi's guest house
1 nt Yogyakarta (Borobudur) - Monohara Hotel
2 nts Tanjung Benoa - Conrad Bali
3 nts Ubud - Komaneka at Monkey Forest
3 nts Amed - Kembali Beach Bungalows
2 nts Singapore - Conrad Hotel Singapore

We'll be flying between HKG-DPS-SUB, SUB-JOG, and JOG-DPS to save a little bit of time vs. train or bus. Still hectic I know, but I think it will work. We'll have plenty of downtime after Java at least.

In Singapore the S$1 billion Gardens By the Bay has opened. Should be worth a visit. I'll be visiting soon.

http://www.gardensbythebay.org.sg/

Are you fixed or still looking for comments? Mine: I'm afraid you're really shortchanging yourself on your time in Bromo & Yogya. Too much transit and not enough time on the ground. I'd pick one or the other or cut a day out of Bali.

I also think you could do better than the Bali Conrad. Lovely resort but disappointing beach.

Hi Marmot,
We've already got our plane tix so we're pretty set on the Java part. I know it's not enough time, but maybe we'll get back at some point and spend longer. At least this way, we get to see Bromo and Borobudur if we don't make it back though. We're not dead set on our Bali itinerary yet, but I think what we have will give us a good mix. The reason for the Conrad hotels is that we've got lots of points so they are basically free. Given the two crazy days on Java, I figured it would be a nice place to chill out once we get to Bali. We don't land until almost 7PM so it seems like staying near the airport would be good and then a second night for some relaxation time and maybe a little site seeing in the southern beach areas before moving on to Ubud.

KMLoke, thanks for the tip on the new Gardens by the Bay. Looks awesome!

LA, I'm not opposed to "best of" trips. (The first time my husband & traveled in Asia we went to 8 places in 10 days.) I just hope the airlines cooperate. Can you use your points at the Bali W? Similar resort-y ambience but a lot nicer beach and more interesting neighborhood.

Fade_a_way; With only 1 day in Yogjakarta that is all the more reason to use the services of a highly knowlegeable guide/driver to see the 3 temples, the little quaint willages and if time permits a 1/2 stop at the Sultons Palace. Our guide is great thoug a little expensive by $20 but you might find another hightly qualified guide. The guides at the temples for hire of little help as are are the very limited English skills of the taxi drivers.

Hi Marmot, we don't have points for the W, unfortunately. Only Hilton and Conrad hotels right now. I do look at the first part of the trip as sort of a "best of". Did the same recently with Machu Picchu before heading to the Galapagos and it worked out great. Hopefully, we'll get just as lucky with the flights this time too!

StanKase, thanks for the info on your guide. We have a driver already lined up, but i think we have your guide's info further back in this thread if we change our mind and decide to use someone who is both a guide and driver.