Flying's Fees: Is there one fee that irks you the most?

Ran into a lady who had to buy a last minute ticket New York to Jacksonville FL...Jet Blue...Air Fare $654.00..Extra LegRoom Seats $15 X 2, Doggie Fee $100.00.....Nap in a hammock under the swaying palm?..PRICELESS.......

Katie- I'm sure you have read Mambo's thread (from a few days ago) in the Lounge regarding the extra baggage charge her college-aged son faced? That thread got suspended.

I did... it got a little out of hand. It did perk my interest though; it seems many of these fees have just gone into effect in the last two months.

I'm not happy about the last increase in the fee for mileage upgrades on AA. It's still much less expensive that paying for biz class, though & IMO well worth it for trans-Atlantic flights.

Frankly, I'm surprised regular air fares aren't MORE expensive than they are since I can remember higher prices many years ago.

The airlines can change their programs and increase fees, etc; so in general I have no problem with them. These new fees are there to increase revenue for the airline in lieu of raising fares.

However, I can think of at least one type that I find quite unfair. Which is to charge the passenger a reservation fees for using the phone when that's the only way to issue that ticket, as it's not bookable online. Or some of Ryanair's fees of say using a credit card or having to use counter check-in because one's not an EU citizen.

And I can think of one extremely misleading fees, which is the fuel surcharge. Instead of raising fares and FF award redemption fees, they put in a fuel surchage.

The one that irks me is a procedural issue rather than the fee itself. So many countries handle their airport taxes by making you fork over cash at check-in. These are no different than the taxes that any other country (the U.S. included) levies, but those other countries just include the taxes in the price of the ticket. So many places in Latin America (that's where most of my travel is) require you to stand in one more line and fork out $26 or $31 or whatever the amount is. Are they afraid the airline won't turn the money over if they're allowed to collect it?

End of rant.

As long as the fee is spelled out and (preferably) charged at the time of ticketing, I'm okay with it. They can call it a fuel surcharge, a ticketing fee, or whatever they want, I only care about the bottom line price.

Most of the US airlines are pretty good about this, so I don't have too many complaints there. Some of the EU airlines are a little less forthcoming, particularly the "budget" carriers.

The only fees that really grind my gears, are not flight-related, but hotel-related. Charging extra for wifi is ridiculous. And $20 for a continental breakfast is basically extortion.

I agree with one of the previous posters that I also wish they would just raise the fares and forget all the little things. I do only care about the bottom line price, so I don't really care how many little pieces it is, but I would like to get miles for them...

Most U.S. airlines charge $5 for a tiny bottle of wine on International flights. On most foreign airlines, it is free. In France, wine is cheaper than Coke. U.S. airlines charge 3 pounds for a beer on U.S. flights to Europe. It really makes those Brits feel like their getting ripped off!

The fee that sticks in my memory is one I've paid more than once at RSW airport in Fort Myers FL: there ar no onsite rental cars, all the lots are a few miles away, so require the typical shuttle bus. Of course the rental company provides this free. But the airport (or Lee County or whatever) charges the renter a fee for allowing that bus to access the airport!! Used to be about $14.

I know that municipalities - and some states - like to sock the travelers, but this fee seems extortionary to me.

No the fees don't bother me. Whatever it is I will pay it, or not. Flying is a pretty good bargain. With airlines losing money it means that part of my travel is being subsidized by investors (as well as being subsidized by high-fare paying customers). Same product, less cost for me.

I am taking a flight in Malaysia today on Firely Air.
Prices in MYR (1 malaysian ringgit is about 30 cents US):

fare: 9.95
airport tax: 9.00
fuel surcharge: 16.00
insurance surcharge: 5.00
admin fee: 16.00

So the 9.95 MYR fare turns into a 55.95 MYR ticket price, but that is 17 USD and change. The admin fee is irksome, tho.

My biggest & one I forgot to mention is that tax charge when flying out of London. It's also based on the class of service & if you're using mileage upgrades you have to make sure they don't charge you the higher fee.

Air Tran Assigned seat charge

Fee of $6 per leg just to book a seat, any seat, otherwise you can not pay the fee and hope for the best. $20 if you want the emergency row seats. Sorry, but I think it's ridiculous to have to pay this fee, but if you don't will you be the only one who didn't and get the family all split up??

see my reply re Standy. rediculous to pay for a seat that may be empty anyway. To have to pay $25 US Airways for each leg with no guarantee!! Airline robbery.

Here is the story I mentioned in the OP:
http://www.fodors.com/news/story_3008.html

Beach--- I think of all the fees the standby one is really surprising for travelers already at the airport. Many of the airlines have switched their standby policies to "confirmed standby"---which then incur the cost. I'm sure there will come a time though that I will definitely cough up that money to fly standby. Sometimes it's really worth it obviously.

I mentioned a recent fee I paid on an earlier thread-- I arrived a minute shy of the mandatory 30 minutes before flight check-in. This was a very early morning flight at a small airport. The agent at check-in was able to put me on the next flight but didn't mention the $50 surcharge that would be placed on my credit card.

Rules are rules---I do understand that but I think I should have been told upfront about the charge; I would have accepted it because it was my own fault.

I will definitely make sure I check in from home next time!

Tom---I think I've been hit with something similar somewhere else in regards to that shuttle charge. Miami maybe?

Most, if not all of the extra charges (for certain seats, baggage, etc) are avoidable.

Katie_H, you certainly should have been informed of the charge then you would have had a chance to not pay it.

United charges $25 per ticket ($30 at the airport) to ticket when you book travel by phone. If you have a travel certificate which is unable to be ticketed online, you must pay this fee which reduces the value of the certificate. (I think the fee is waived for $25 certs. duh)

Ryanair charge a CC fee per person per flight - so if a family of 4 go to Malaga for the week that's 8 CC charges.

Most other companies impose a fixed fee for the whole booking

Ryanair have free online check-in - but if you have checked luggage you can't use it and have to pay a fee in order to check-in (and that's on top of the fee for your checked luggage)

-- I'm puzzled by the fees Ryanair charges for the use of credit cards. Puzzled, because CC companies generally take a dim view of any merchant who takes action to discourage use of their CC even as the merchant at one and the same time wants to transact business using the CC. Why, I wonder, don't the CC companies object to fees which arguably could be seen as discouraging the use of the CC?

-- In general, and provided I am clearly notified at the time of booking, I do not object to fees for services over which I have control, i.e. services that I have the option to use or not use. I do object to things like 'administration fees' when these are charged - as if passengers have the option to decline the 'administration' of the service they're buying.

I also think a certain amount of checked baggage is almost inevitable given the ever increasing number of items that cannot be placed in carry-on luggage - for security reasons that of course are not within the control of passengers. So for any airline (e.g. Ryanair) to assess a charge to a passenger for checking ANY amount of luggage at all is unreasonable, given that more and more, not to check any luggage at all isn't an option for passengers.

-- Finally, I note you asked for what I think is 'fair.' Fairness conjures up for many people things like progressive tax policies, which are based on a person's individual circumstances - their ability to pay, their ability to predict the consequences of their actions, etc. But the world to which airlines belong is (supposedly) not the world of government but the business world which obeys no such policy: businesses assess a price/fee based on what the market as a whole (and not just oneself as an individual) will BEAR. "Bear" does not mean "like" or " think is reasonable." So I don't expect standards of fairness based on the buyer's ability to pay, their reasons for missing a flight etc., to enter the equation. I don't say I necessarily like this arrangement (notwithstanding I have several times been accused of being an 'apologist' for the airlines) but it is understandable to me. In short, to me, "fair" doesn't necessarily mean "nice".

The curbside baggage-check fee is top of my irk list. The fee to use miles to upgrage is next.

The fee for upgrade doesn't bother me. Since it's so easy to get miles these days (credit cards, dining etc), I'm sure almost everyone on the flight have enough miles to upgrade! Since a lot of these miles are "free" to the customers, why shouldn't the airline charge a fee for the upgrade?

I'm telling you it irks me. You're telling me I'm not entitled to be irked. The thread isn't about whether we're entitled to be irked, it's about what irks us.

I don't particularly feel required to defend being irked although you will note others are also irked, whether you think they're entitled to be irked or not.

But I WILL say that when the fees first started to be imposed, I found a business-class ticket fare that was LESS than the cost of an upgradable coach fare plus the $600 fee to use the miles that way. Had I gone the upgrade route, I would have given the airline back all their miles PLUS my $600 and not gotten any mileage for the trip.

Cassandra - it wasn't a personal attack. You're entitled to be irked by whatever fees that irk you. I'm just stating my point that the upgrade fees don't irk me. That doesn't mean I'm happy to pay the fees. Of course I would rather the airlines don't charge any upgrade fees, but they do now and some pax are willing to pay.

In my case, I'm irked by phone fees that AA charge when it's something I cannot book online. This includes open-jaw award tickets, or award tickets involving partner airlines.

yk - mileage programs are tough to assess. Are the miles ever really 'free' as you suggest?

You note - and I agree - that the miles are inflated in value by their being so easy to get.

However, your other point seems to be that the fees airlines charge in conjunction with miles programs could not be helped, given the inflation.

The difficulty I see with your argument is that airlines and other vendors associated with mileage programs are the ones 'printing the money' so to speak; they control the handing out of miles and the 'cost' of the acquisition of those miles. So if the value of miles is inflated, it is the fault of the airlines and their partners in the mileage programs, not that of miles holders. It could have been 'helped' - i.e, the extra fees could have been avoided, had the airlines and their partners managed the miles programs appropriately and competently.

A second difficulty with your argument is that the imposition of such fees does not make the miles more valuable, i.e. counterbalance their inflated value. Rather the opposite is true: the need to pay fees in order to exchange the miles for some service in essence inflates the miles further.

None of which is to say that the fees do not act to solve the problem of how to set the 'prices' for this or that reward (including an upgrade reward) given that the 'currency' has become so inflated. (This is usually what happens when a currency inflates: prices rise.) I only object to the implication that the airlines somehow do not bear any responsibility for the situation.

That phone fee irks the heck out of me too. Put it on my list.

I think all of us have been "spoiled" (so to speak) by airlines for decades when we get all these perks for free, eg, free schedule changes, free 2nd checked bag, free this and free that.

We forget that those were the days when crude oil prices were a fraction of what they are now.

We forget that airline tickets have barely gone up in prices in years.

In order for the airlines to stay in business without raising airfares by 100% or even more, they have no choice but to take away the free perks that we all got used to.

So to answer Katie's OP, I do find majority of these fees understandable and I will pay them.

For example, in July 1999 I flew from Philadelphia to London. I paid $800 r/t for economy.

Next week, I'm flying Boston to London for $600.

If the airlines continue to give out freebies like they used to, they'll have to charge me way more than $600 for my ticket!

There are always some people who defend airlines' business practices, no matter how passenger-unfriendly they are, because "business is business" and they should be able to do anything they want to. But you have to ask what it is the consumer is purchasing -- just passage? Surely, a passenger is more than a shipment in a box, no?

Just because the airlines have decided to charge for something that used to be free doesn't mean that the something was a "perk." It just means that the airlines have been looking around for new ways to add dimes, nickels, and dollars to revenue. Hence this thread.

The airlines would have the absolute right to put a coin-lock on the restrooms, impose an "cabin-air-treatment" fee, add extra fees for providing jetway access, and start charging to check ANY baggage. But most of us consider such things part of what we pay for when we buy passage, not "free perks." I don't think that's being spoiled -- and I didn't think it was being spoiled to be given food and drink on long-haul flights (although I might have thought providing alcohol was more in the way of an amenity than a necessity).

I happen to think paying to book by phone comes close to being outrageous, just for the record. The internet allowed the airlines to put a lot of travel agents out of business and now the airlines have decided to step in and become their own fee-basis agents.

The phone fee doesn't irk me when I could do it myself on line, but it sure as heck does when I have no other option but to call. A couple weeks ago I booked FF travel. The agent made an error and charged the incorrect number of miles. When I called to ask them to correct he mistake they did - and charged a fee. GRRRRrrri

I suspect all that yk meant was that people dislike change, and certainly things have changed.

That said, in days of yore, when the airlines included various things automatically rather than pricing those things as options, that was also just doing business. It was not an indulgence, or a free handout, since of course one way or another, the passengers paid for the included services - regardless of the degree to which they used those services.

I know we tend to think of it as 'them' the airlines versus 'us' the passengers, but does this really accurately describe the situation?

-- Our fellow passengers sometimes run up costs that the rest of us would just as soon not pay for (like changing itineraries - in the days when changes weren't restricted - or above-average baggage weight.) Nobody in other words wants to go back to the days of a 'one-size-fits -all' economy class ticket.

-- Governments and airports are often just as 'villainous' as the airlines when it comes to travel fees. Example: the Auditor-General of Canada recently found that the portion of the Canadian passport fee allegedly charged to cover Canadian diplomatic missions and services abroad couldn't be justified. In short, they found the Canadian government has been overcharging their citizens for passports!

In light of this, just think of the opportunity for abuse in the lengthy list of airport fees, security fees, and 'air navigation fees.' (My question: how many people must a passenger pay to change a light bulb in the air traffic control room?)

My point is

Airfares have barely increased over the past many, many years; certainly have not increased inline with inflation and fuel prices.

Airlines simply cannot stay in business without changing the way they operate, so what can they do?

1. They cut costs. Lay-offs, cut schedules, make each flight fly with higher load factor, get rid of pillows/blankets etc.

But cutting costs alone wasn't enough to keep them in business.

2. They tried raising airfares. The public, in response, flocked to budget airlines. This shows that the public would rather sacrifice comfort/service in order to get the cheapest airfare. But of course, many budget airlines couldn't stay alive in this climate either, hence the recent bankruptcies.

What's an airline to do? They cut costs, they couldn't raise prices...

So they decided they have to raise revenue somewhere, somehow, without significantly raising airfares. Hence the fee for curb side check-in, phone fees, upgrade fees, extra/oveweight luggage fees etc.

Do I like paying these fees? No. But if I were given a choice of:
High airfares w/o extra fees
vs
Cheap airfares w/extra fees (where many are avoidable if one is careful)

I will always take the cheap airfares.

Just my 2 cents.

In light of this discussion, this morning's Raleigh News and Observer has the PERFECT column:

http://www.newsobserver.com/2766/story/1076672.html

It's more of a practice than a fee, except it does involve that dangblasted phone-agent fee:

Peeved at the airlines that don't let you see free seats until after you've paid for passage. Only way to know if you can avoid middle-seats or other horrorshows before you plunk down the credit card number is to call and ask before you book -- but some airlines now will charge you for that info if you eventually book that flight, or so I'm told. I tend not to fly airlines I can't see seating charts for before I pay the fare.

Dear me... did anyone here about American's new fee starting June 15? The first checked bag will cost $15.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080521/ap_on_bi_ge/american_airlines_reductions

Glad to see American isn't charging that $15 for overseas flights. Hope the person who checks in my bag in August knows that!

"Glad to see American isn't charging that $15 for overseas flights" -- they will. Lord knows why they exclude it now.